simple Hi-Tek coating

[HI-TEK]

Yep,looks right. My green says Zombie but I recall Trevor said it is Kryptonite green. After seein my bullet pics. Gold,Purple and Bronze behave differently,they can take more overbaking before turning dark.

It's fine,I may look at my oven / temp. But all is good,my alloy finally works after I discovered HCL wash and I'm a happy camper.

But no pics for now,I wonder why I can't upload any?

Petander,
I had same problem uploading pictures. I have uploaded same size pictures previously, but now, the same pictures wont load. I think that something has been done to site with data upload matters.
With Zombie and Kryptonite greens, Zombie is darker green. If either is over baked, they darken.
I have suspicions, that your oven may be swinging with temperatures well above set area.
It would be interesting to know what is alloy temperature when taking them out after baking?

[glockfan]

joe,i've made the test: if i follow the same baking recipe i apply to my old gold,my zombie green are turning black....but to me there's no drama with this fact; this specific color react as is, we live with it, the easy cure is a shorter baking time....

[benellinut]

So I see you guys got a new prime minister, is that a good or bad thing?

[glockfan]

So I see you guys got a new prime minister, is that a good or bad thing?

he's a major ***** united nation rear end licker ,an arrogant globalist only living to sell canada to multiculturacrapp ;he's a terrorist hugger, who handed 10 millions to omar khader
who killed us soldiers in astan.his hate for north america and americans-canadians born is so obvious,he don't even hide it.if ever he gets second term,which i highly doubts,i seriously consider to elect our VT cabin as my new home.wife is american,been married 30 years,so it would be 0 problems to call our cabin home for good. won't say more about politics, this turd just makes me wishing very horrible things his way.

[glockfan]

as you can see,it is easy for me to pitch myself into swear filter's troubles: you only have to pronounce the word ''trudeau'',and there i go LOLOL

[Ausglock]

Kryptonite green
https://i.imgur.com/Sp4HGQb.jpg

Zombie Green
https://i.imgur.com/Ae4VdR7.jpg

[Petander]

Yep,I think mine is Zombie after all. Like it says in the container.

Oven overkill somehow a bit. Anyway,all works good now, really good bullets.

Hmm,let's see about pic upload thing. I have donated but it's not showing anywhere.

Found it in FAQ: " In the attachment window you will find a list of the allowed file types and their maximum sizes. Files that are larger than these sizes will be rejected. There may also be an overall quota limit to the number of attachments you can post to the board."

I must have reached a data limit. Now what? I hate those "free pic hosting" adbomber things. Can I buy more storage data here? On do I have to delete old pics? That is irritating read, this thread is full of deleted pics. That makes posts useless.


EDIT: got it figured out. To donate is not the same as to contribute. :)

226024

[Ausglock]

I use imgur to host my pictures. Fast, easy and free.

[Ausglock]

Just to clarify...
https://i.imgur.com/yo27dQA.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/Vmrqtc9.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/Zx3Myfe.jpg

[Ausglock]

Kryptonite green...
https://i.imgur.com/AgTxHAw.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/zM7BHkf.jpg

[HI-TEK]

Yep,I think mine is Zombie after all. Like it says in the container.

Oven overkill somehow a bit. Anyway,all works good now, really good bullets.

Hmm,let's see about pic upload thing. I have donated but it's not showing anywhere.

Found it in FAQ: " In the attachment window you will find a list of the allowed file types and their maximum sizes. Files that are larger than these sizes will be rejected. There may also be an overall quota limit to the number of attachments you can post to the board."

I must have reached a data limit. Now what? I hate those "free pic hosting" adbomber things. Can I buy more storage data here? On do I have to delete old pics? That is irritating read, this thread is full of deleted pics. That makes posts useless.


EDIT: got it figured out. To donate is not the same as to contribute. :)

226024



Petander

all I can say is.... WOW... it certainly looks like you really cook those suckers. They are now brown. I got suspicions that what temperature you are measuring is not what is actually happening.
With the colour ending up more brown than Green, in 11 minutes, and you get failure after 8 minutes with wipe off, I cant explain reasons for this colour after 11 minutes..

[benellinut]

as you can see,it is easy for me to pitch myself into swear filter's troubles: you only have to pronounce the word ''trudeau'',and there i go LOLOL

Sorry to hear that, I was hoping it would be positive. I don't follow our politics any more then I need to let alone another country's, (none of my business anyways), it's too depressing most of the time. I'd just like the see the world heal and be a better place for all our kids, things here in the states are so different then when I was a kid, yes that was long, long ago. We were brought up to say Please, Thank You, Sir, Ma'am, hold the door for a lady and admit when we were wrong and apologize. We were taught to have pride in our country and respect those who served the community on all levels from local to national. We had entertainment that was THE funniest and all without swearing or sexual tones and our kids cartoons didn't have poopie and fart jokes in them. I'm simple country folk, they called us red necks, we played hard and were on the wild side but we also had manners and knew how to behave at appropriate times, now it's anything goes and I mean anything. I know, silly views from an old guy. Anyways, I pray for better days for all of us, back to coating boolits, didn't think I would but I really like those greens, would be perfect for the .22 Hornet, if you get my drift :)

[Petander]

Petander

all I can say is.... WOW... it certainly looks like you really cook those suckers. They are now brown. I got suspicions that what temperature you are measuring is not what is actually happening.
With the colour ending up more brown than Green, in 11 minutes, and you get failure after 8 minutes with wipe off, I cant explain reasons for this colour after 11 minutes..

The brown ones to the left are bronze though. All those are excellent bullets for full house 45-70.

But yes,my temps have been higher than my probe says, just confirmed with IR meter that my boolits hit 215°C when my probe (inside a bullet,permanently in the oven) says 195°C. I have followed that 195°C max manually,never got over that. But the coated bullets get over that,I need to figure out why that is.

I just picked up a green bullet at ten minutes, underbaked it was. Hmm...? I do suspect my alloy now,the porous very dark surface sucks the first coat deep inside, as opposed to those steel-looking ones in the pic here.

Here are some of my green ones from some months ago,done with my first oven that undercooked badly quite soon after I had everything checked and set up. It lost power without me paying enough attention.

226064

I didn't HCL wash my bullets at that time,not yet. The shiny surface gives brighter color even after a couple of coatings.

[Petander]

It's the radiant heat thing.

I just tried to overload my (2000 Watt) oven, put in two five pound trays instead of the usual single tray. I turned the heat up to compensate for the initial temp drop. I turned it back after I hit 190°C.

When my probe hit 195°C I opened the door a little and measured the bullets with IR meter. Around 220-225°C every bullet.

Those trays are gold and green. They look pretty much the same,as if I had been using gold only.

Very good bullets,smash with zero flaking. I'll do a third coat with green only. Good news is ten pounds per batch!

Black cherry looks good the way I overbake:

226075

[HI-TEK]

It's the radiant heat thing.

I just tried to overload my (2000 Watt) oven, put in two five pound trays instead of the usual single tray. I turned the heat up to compensate for the initial temp drop. I turned it back after I hit 190°C.

When my probe hit 195°C I opened the door a little and measured the bullets with IR meter. Around 220-225°C every bullet.

Those trays are gold and green. They look pretty much the same,as if I had been using gold only.

Very good bullets,smash with zero flaking. I'll do a third coat with green only. Good news is ten pounds per batch!



Petander,
Main reasons for uneven temperature of oven versus alloy is directly associated with poor air circulation.
I refer back to a guy who built a flow through conveyor oven. Temperature probe showed 200C directly above tray. When tray went through, the centre of tray was uncooked,
and edges had melted alloy.
So there was a 100 degree plus temperature difference across same tray of alloy.
High speed fans were installed, and presto, like magic, all projectiles were same colour and well baked in much shorter time.
If your oven is showing 195 and alloy is at 220, you are measuring temperature at wrong spot with your probe and is not representative of what is going on. It is obvious that more heat is being concentrated onto your alloy, and is being over heated.
In short, install a high speed fan, and may be two. Obviously you have enough heating capacity , but poor uneven heat transfer distribution from hot air to product.

[Petander]

In short, install a high speed fan, and may be two. Obviously you have enough heating capacity , but poor uneven heat transfer distribution from hot air to product.

Yep,I'm happy with the power. And I'm happy with the bullet quality. More circulation and maybe a PID might make this a good oven.

Here are ten pounds baked, gold and green. Tough coating,very tough,no flake,amazingly clean 45-70 barrel.

226096

[HI-TEK]

Yep,I'm happy with the power. And I'm happy with the bullet quality. More circulation and maybe a PID might make this a good oven.

Here are ten pounds baked, gold and green. Tough coating,very tough,no flake,amazingly clean 45-70 barrel.

226096

Petander,
I am glad that you have had success. If you are happy with final colour and it is working for you, that is all that is required.
We had commercial casters cook the coating for many days at 200C. It was Black when they took it out of the oven.
They worked perfectly, but were not original colour any more, but no smoke, no Leading and accurate.
Sooooo, it looks all well at your end...

[Petander]

Yep,all is good here. This whole big boolit rifle thing is just fantastic with Hi-Tek. I hardly ever touch bare lead anymore and the savings are substantial with big bore amno.

Being what I am,I analysed my baking a bit more:

I put my cold "bullet-probe" in the oven on top of the bullets when I loaded them in. My bullets are 40-50°C when I put them in the oven,they get that warm from drying on top of another oven,in front of a fan.

226118.

I then waited for the probe to read 195°C. It says "beep" at 195,I then open the door to keep it 195.

226119

When I opened the door an took an IR- reading on the bullets it was way higher:

226120

Here are the results. Excellent bullets,gold is a little dark,green is very dark.

226121.

I found an extra fan for the oven already, the funny thing is it comes with an oven so I may try another oven next week. Used ,working ovens cost less than new spare parts. There is a huge second hand oven market, ladies follow fashion and renew kitchens every couple of years.

EDIT: Add smash pic. Perfect.

226130

[Petander]

Just sayin it's possible to make great bullets using contaminated mystery WW-alloy and a less than perfect oven.

[HI-TEK]

Just sayin it's possible to make great bullets using contaminated mystery WW-alloy and a less than perfect oven.


Petander,
Right on the mark.
The difficulty is, as you know, the scrap Lead industry products are highly sought by home casters for cheap source of metal.
Proper alloy is much too expensive for people who do a lot of shooting.
Difficulty is, that it is very hard to try to help and diagnose what is going wrong, when the full story is not known.
Just curious, do you know, what was hardness of your mystery metal that worked with your guns?

[glockfan]

The difficulty is, as you know, the scrap Lead industry products are highly sought by home casters for cheap source of metal.
Proper alloy is much too expensive for people who do a lot of shooting.



i'm trying to link most tire shops around me, inside the 150KM radius. i'm explaining to them that the lead i'm collecting isn't then spread out in the wild , that my business is green because the lead is then recycled again and again because it can be collected after use in the berms backstops of the shooting ranges people shoot at......it works for some extent,some don't sell to the scrap yards anymore ,waiting for me to pick the used WW up.

on my side of things i'm gonna have to take some hardness measurements and might have to add super hard to my commercial boolits because even COWW is somehow ''mystery'' as you never know how hard it'll be once turned into boolits.

the best prices i've found for 92-6-2 is around 3 CDN a pound. it kind of reduce the profit margin quite some,but product consistency is a little better , it allows loading at the top of the loading charts without risking leading and soso accuracy.

i'd rather be able to produce my commercial boolits with COWW only, but the demand VS COWW supply might drives me toward the foundry . IIRC,trevor walked into the whole process and ended at the foundry too.

[Petander]

Petander,

Just curious, do you know, what was hardness of your mystery metal that worked with your guns?

It is 14-16 BHN. I can mix it harder with more monotype but there is no need.

Now I found out that my "bullet-probe" is not reliable. It shows much less than IR and/or the oven dial itself. Here I'm drying some washed boolits,next I'll bake them at oven dial 200. Because IR reads 200 on the bullets while the other probe says 182.

I got a bit too scientific on this,again. Now I may have an 40$ "KISS"- oven. Dial 200 and watch the time. Forget all extra probes. I noticed temp didn't drop much when I loaded five kilos of cold bullets in,only to 170.

I picked up this s/h dual-blower oven today,it's really windy in there. It feels like a high-wattage thing.

226158

[Ausglock]

I started with mining the berm and collecting wheelweights. But as things got bigger and demand grew, it was costing far more time and money to sort and clean the WW and the range reclaim. The 2,6,92 is currently $6.60 Aud per KG. even at this price, it is still cheaper than the cost of propane. And my time is 100% bullet making, not wasted cleaning scrap. The only thing I clean now is the dross removed from the top of the pots. I melt it down with propane burner, flux like a madman and reclain the alloy out of it. and this gets fed back into the melt.

[Tazza]

I mined the berm at my range earlier this year, i got about 300kg, took my dad and I 4-6 hours of digging and sifting, then the next few weekends melting it all down. Thankfully i was able to use a wood fired melting pot to clean it or else the amount of gas i'd have used would have cost more than the lead i got.

I don't know just how much dirt/lead i took home, but my dad thought it was around 1t, so not bad return from that much raw material. The biggest issue are FMJ ammo that did not split open, they have a nice lead core, but the amount of work to gain access to it is just silly for large scale work.

[Petander]

Commercial is completely different of course but I happened to weigh my propane bottle while cleaning 30 kg of range lead from traps last month.

It took exactly three kilos of propane. I can make 1000 pcs 45-70 bullets out of it ,except that I won't, I mix it with my old tin-rich WW / monotype alloy to get 2000 bullets. :)

For a hobbyist this is good economy,a box of 20 45-70 rounds costs 80 € and up.

[Tazza]

Commercial is completely different of course but I happened to weigh my propane bottle while cleaning 30 kg of range lead from traps last month.

It took exactly three kilos of propane. I can make 1000 pcs 45-70 bullets out of it ,except that I won't, I mix it with my old tin-rich WW / monotype alloy to get 2000 bullets. :)

For a hobbyist this is good economy,a box of 20 45-70 rounds costs 80 € and up.

You are spot on, for non commercial it makes sense if you have the time and gear, but commercial, time is money. The hours you spend cleaning lead can be spent casting making you money, even though the raw material costs you more to buy.

I like the fact people ask me about ammo and ask what projectiles i use, i say they are mine, many people were surprised.

Some times i wish i could do more, but then i'd spend so much more time in the shed casting, thw wife complains enough now that i spend too much tome doing it now...... Yet she does like spending the money from it, go figure.

[Petander]

Some times i wish i could do more, but then i'd spend so much more time in the shed casting, thw wife complains enough now that i spend too much tome doing it now...... Yet she does like spending the money from it, go figure.

Luckily thre's more time coming all the time.

Talking about time,It's 3.48 AM and I'm working on green,to get the colour right and pass wipe test without overbaking. :)

226174

[Petander]

Well I got a major underbaking failure with the new ,supposedly good oven.

Six kilos of 45-70 bullets back to melt.

226249.

They fail the acetone wipe test,green was baked to this much bronze,still green on towel:

226250.

Looks like my readings (same meters,same times) dob't apply to the new oven with very good air circulation. It won't overbake enough,my Mystery Alloy needs overbake. Nice colours always fail,that I already know.

226251.

Luckily made some 20 kilos of 458s during the weekend before I got the new oven. These are very good.

226252.


It's been quite a journey to figure out what my alloy needs. Proper baking instructions don't apply,I really need to roast them boolits.

Underbaking is a little frustrating experience,been here so many times and still did it again.

[Ausglock]

the ones that fail the wipe test just need to go back in the oven for a second bake. problem fixed.

[Tazza]

That is what i was thinking too, but i wasn't sure, so i kept my mouth shut :)

Good to hear that extra baking should fix it.

[HI-TEK]

Petander,
I think that you are having problems with your temperatures or control and air circulation..
What is most important is, that the dry coated alloy needs to get to 180C and then stay there at 180C or above for about another 3 minutes after reaching 180C. That should be enough to cure coating.
If your cast is already at 50C, it will take less time inside oven to get alloy to the 180C.
The important detail with temperatures and time in oven, is that if you increase load into oven, unless you have a mini cyclone inside your oven, and also have adequate heating capacity, the time inside oven will vary with load weights to get load up to the 180C area..
If you change things, just change one thing at a time, and examine results of that single change. If you change two or more things, you wont know which change caused problems.

[Ausglock]

Re: Oven load.
I can bake 2 trays with 2.5KG on each at once in 7 1/2 minutes.
If I add another tray with another 2.5KG to make 3 trays, I have to increase time to 8 minutes.
But, I leave the PID temp setting the same.

[Gremlin460]

How many elements do you have in your "new" oven?
Do you have anything to "Bank" the heat while opening/closing the door, or to aid in temp restoration after new batch of cold casts have been inserted to oven.

Yes I just added other possible items into the mix.

[glockfan]

^^^^^
all i know is BBQ brickets help tremendously ; it shorten the recovery time a lot,and the oven temp gets much more stable . 1 or 2 firebrick would do the trick as well.

[Petander]

It's all about my alloy,I can get good bullets in the "old" oven & HCL wash.

Now did a test: I fluxed like a behemoth to see what I get while making small ingots from the big ones.

The bullets do not react with HCL! But they react with bleach,bleach is to the right:

226359

I'm drying those right now to see what happens.

I understand the toxicity of these liquids and dispose them properly. I also understand that more baking hekps with underbake - BUT when an underbaked first coat goes unnoticed like I did again... Then you can't fix it after putting another coat on.

I also understand oven overload,I have tried many,many different versions and taken measurements in many ways, almost too many. Measuring actual bullet temps is good,my contaminated alloy likes a quick warming up to baking temp.

It's my alloy. The "new" oven has a cyclone inside and holds temps real good and even. No PID but dual blowers, my bullet probe temp stays surprisingly steady.

To be continued.

[Grmps]

Re: Oven load.
I can bake 2 trays with 2.5KG on each at once in 7 1/2 minutes.
If I add another tray with another 2.5KG to make 3 trays, I have to increase the time to 8 minutes.
But, I leave the PID temp setting the same.

2.5 KG = 5.51156 pounds

Now Don't you guys try 7.5 min bake times in a normal oven!, Trevor's oven is on steroids. Your boolits will fail

Trevor's oven ==
Full-size kitchen 220V Convection oven
Multiple PID controllers
Bottom of oven lined with heat retaining firebrick that brings the oven back up to temperature faster
Convection fans are on a separate power supply so they stay on all the time
My memory is not so good but I think he added another convection fan.
He pre-warms the boolits before baking


I can bake 2 - 8-pound trays in a large Oster countertop convection oven (Lined with ceramic BBQ briquettes for heat retention/recovery) in 12 min.
I haven't tried a shorter bake time because the colors turn out good, they pass the tests and I prefer to have a little margin for error since I've found that most countertop convection ovens temperatures vary with the surrounding temperature unless you have a PID controling them.
I have the PIDS but just haven't gotten around to installing them, it's easy for me to check the temperature setting with 2 thermometers on the baking shelf and adjust the oven to the proper temp if needed.

[Petander]

My temp drops to 190°C when I load five pounds. Colour starts to darken after seven minutes, old or new oven,all the same. The new one keeps temp in 194-198 by itself and gets there in a minute and a half.

I just baked five pounds perfectly good gold bullets. Slight overbake in ten minutes. HCL -wash is my saviour.

[Petander]

the ones that fail the wipe test just need to go back in the oven for a second bake. problem fixed.

Contaminated alloy doesn't work like that. I tried Bleach soak,it turned the bullets brownish as usual. Sort of rusty,oxidized looking. I may have iron in there,and who knows what else.

I washed the bullets,still not very pretty.

I then overbaked Zombie green to bronze,ten minutes. Fail wipe. Another 15 minutes. Fail. Another half hour. Fail. Then one hour. Still fail. But it passed the smash test after all that baking.

Left to right after each bake:

226406.

HCL wash cleans my WW bullets good and they bake normally. Well,still working on green to stay green but others are doing fine.

[Avenger442]

Petander
Are you calling it a failed wipe test because a small amount of color came off on the paper towel?

I've had this happen with the color dark blue(that is actually a dark green)and a little with one of the blacks. The reply I got back when I asked about it was that the mix I received may have more color in it than was necessary.

I wish I could go back and look up the photos of a failed wipe test. The coating comes all the way off down to the metal. There is none left just bare lead.

I'll let Treavor and Joe correct me if I'm wrong but, unless it removes the coating it's not a failed test to me.

I've shot many that left a little color on the paper towel with no problems.

[Petander]

Petander
Are you calling it a failed wipe test because a small amount of color came off on the paper towel?



Yes that's what I have had as a standard. No colour. I thought there should be no colour from the acetone test. For example Gold 1035 leaves zero colour. Or Black Cherry. Or Bronze.

I may be wrong but my early failures were partly because of underbaked bullets. You know the smell when you shoot them, it's the same you get when baking them and they start to "ripen up". I only have this problem with Zombie green. Never glossy, wipes off no matter how I bake. Even FMJ:s wipe off.

I just coated these good (overbaked gold) bullets with green.

226421.

Got these nice camo bullets:

226422

Same bake. But the green wipes off big time. So I bake them for an hour until they are very dark. Still green comes off.

I then gave them another gold coat and no more wipe fail. Smash passed,too. Sort of confusing because the new gold coat is only masking a problem underneath.

I'd like to try a different green.

[Petander]

Now I lost sleep over the Wipe Test thing. Please educate me.

I found a slightly better pic of Camo Boolits. Our deer season starts today, camo boolits would be nice to have.

226426

[Ausglock]

If you can Juuuuuuuussssssttttttt (faintly) see colour on the white paper towel, then you are good to go.
But if you have easy to see colour , then, fail.

[Petander]

If you can Juuuuuuuussssssttttttt (faintly) see colour on the white paper towel, then you are good to go.
But if you have easy to see colour , then, fail.

Okay,thanks.

No wipe with gold, the new oven just gave me six pounds of these. I might group these one day with Marlin, it's just that I'm completely bored with shooting groups these days. Bench rest for a couple of decades got boring.

I hit clays with these @ 75 m just fine,standing. I can hit sugarcubes with my br rifles @ 75 m as well. Clays @ 300. But so what?

226446

[HI-TEK]

[QUOTE=Petander;4445183]It's all about my alloy,I can get good bullets in the "old" oven & HCL wash.

Now did a test: I fluxed like a behemoth to see what I get while making small ingots from the big ones.

The bullets do not react with HCL! But they react with bleach,bleach is to the right:

226359


Petander
The Bleach contains about 2-4% Sodium Hydroxide, (Caustic Soda). The Caustic will start to dissolve the Lead, and the resulting Lead salt produced will stay water soluble. Then, almost instantly, any other metals trapped in alloy, that is more reactive than Lead will start to displace solubilised Lead from solution. It is possible, that the murky liquid contains very fine Lead particles, plus, the metals that displaced the Lead from solution also may become insoluble, and also may add to sludge suspension in the liquid..
With Hydrochloric Acid, any metals being solubilised, or react with the acid, will not show up as such sludge, liquid may stay clear, as all metals that is dissolved/solubilised in the acidic liquid will stay in solution.. That is why acid cleaning solution remains clear. It does not mean, that the Acid has not reacted with the alloy. Magnification and examination of surface before and after will reveal if there is any etching by the acid.

[Rich22]

[QUOTE=Petander;4445183]It's all about my alloy,I can get good bullets in the "old" oven & HCL wash.

Now did a test: I fluxed like a behemoth to see what I get while making small ingots from the big ones.

The bullets do not react with HCL! But they react with bleach,bleach is to the right:

226359


Petander
The Bleach contains about 2-4% Sodium Hydroxide, (Caustic Soda). The Caustic will start to dissolve the Lead, and the resulting Lead salt produced will stay water soluble. Then, almost instantly, any other metals trapped in alloy, that is more reactive than Lead will start to displace solubilised Lead from solution. It is possible, that the murky liquid contains very fine Lead particles, plus, the metals that displaced the Lead from solution also may become insoluble, and also may add to sludge suspension in the liquid..
With Hydrochloric Acid, any metals being solubilised, or react with the acid, will not show up as such sludge, liquid may stay clear, as all metals that is dissolved/solubilised in the acidic liquid will stay in solution.. That is why acid cleaning solution remains clear. It does not mean, that the Acid has not reacted with the alloy. Magnification and examination of surface before and after will reveal if there is any etching by the acid.

I really should have paid more attention to the professor then to the women in college chem

[HI-TEK]

[QUOTE=HI-TEK;4448412]

I really should have paid more attention to the professor then to the women in college chem


Rich22,
I also agree. When I was in school, I was very interested with chemistry and such, but I often did not listed to the teacher. However, when it was time to think about my future and work, I decided to pursue industrial Chemical trade. Going to college to get qualifications, soon revealed what I missed out by not learning/listening in high school. I had to do twice as much work just to catch up. I then went into all sorts of different areas of manufacturing chemistry, metallurgy, water treatment, Pharmaceutical manufacturing, detergent manufacturing, quality control in a brewery, road construction asphalt manufacture, solvent recovery, chemical engineering and manufacturing. I probably have forgotten more that I can remember. For a while, I became disenchanted with the industry, and pursued Welding/fabricating as a trade. I soon realised that this was not for me, and returned back to my trade.

[Petander]

[QUOTE=Petander;4445183]


Petander
With Hydrochloric Acid, any metals being solubilised, or react with the acid, will not show up as such sludge, liquid may stay clear, as all metals that is dissolved/solubilised in the acidic liquid will stay in solution.. That is why acid cleaning solution remains clear. It does not mean, that the Acid has not reacted with the alloy. Magnification and examination of surface before and after will reveal if there is any etching by the acid.

I see,thanks.

I'm just wondering because I have HCL soaked many,many batches now. All my bullets have turned dark grey or almost black, the liquid has stayed clear though. Now these looked different,like nothing was happening.

All those soaked bullets have coated fine - Keep On Soaking In the Free World!

[Petander]

I'm just about to mix abrasives with Hi-Tek for firelapping.

Got my hands on a nice 458 Socom but the new barrel is ridiculously rough. With jacketed bullets it is fouling 50 times more than my Marlin,also new. Five shots and you can paint a house green with the stuff that comes out the barrel with Bore Tech copper removal.

I tried some 480 grainers @ 1480 fps. Great fun but the barrel can't take cast or coatings (hardly can take a jacket without continuous cleaning) as it is,being like sandpaper.

Reading is in m/s.

226682

[benellinut]

I bought a new Beretta 92FS that has a barrel like that, looked like a rolled up piece of 320 grit sand paper. I sent it back to Beretta sure they would replace it but it came back with a note it was "acceptable". Can't shoot cast through it yet but it has smoothed out a lot with just 4-5 hundred rounds of jacketed, I was happily surprised. I snagged a deal on a box of 2000 jacketed Rem bullets for $45 a few years ago so I'm not to worried yet, by the time I get through all of them it should smooth out enough that casts will be OK.

[HI-TEK]

[QUOTE=Petander;4449637][QUOTE=HI-TEK;4448412]

I see,thanks.

I'm just wondering because I have HCL soaked many,many batches now. All my bullets have turned dark grey or almost black, the liquid has stayed clear though. Now these looked different,like nothing was happening.

Petander
It is possible, that you have used up majority of the acid, so that is why (may be) you are not getting as much or quick reaction. There may be some acid left, but not as much to allow you to see a fast result.
What amount of surface etching is achieved, may be adequate for good bonding. It may be an interesting test to try and use a fresh acid water mix, and see if you get different etching rates.

[HI-TEK]

[QUOTE=Petander;4449663]I'm just about to mix abrasives with Hi-Tek for firelapping.

Petander,
What are you thinking of using as an abrasive?
It may be difficult to size to correct diameter, with any abrasive agent being mixed with coating.
Abrasive may damage your sizing die unless it is a Nitride hardened Carbide type.

[Petander]

Just thinking firelapping. I know I shouldn't. :)

I always use fresh acid mix for soaking.

[HI-TEK]

Just thinking firelapping. I know I shouldn't. :)

I always use fresh acid mix for soaking.


OK. It is probably best way and consistent.

[Petander]

I bought a new Beretta 92FS that has a barrel like that, looked like a rolled up piece of 320 grit sand paper. I sent it back to Beretta sure they would replace it but it came back with a note it was "acceptable". Can't shoot cast through it yet but it has smoothed out a lot with just 4-5 hundred rounds of jacketed, I was happily surprised. I snagged a deal on a box of 2000 jacketed Rem bullets for $45 a few years ago so I'm not to worried yet, by the time I get through all of them it should smooth out enough that casts will be OK.

Acceptable is a funny word. :)

Shooting a bucketful of jacketed is an option. I understand this is "only an AR" so the standards are not up to match barrels. But I'd like to shoot cast now because I have it,got no feeding issues whatsoever.

[Avenger442]

Acceptable is an opinion. Beretta used to be one of the better manufacturers. I haven't shot any of their guns in years but I'm a little surprised they would use that word with an obviously unsatisfied customer. It lacks a customer first attitude.

Have been shooting the Marlin Cowboy with Hi Tek bullets for a few weeks trying to find a load with some powder I got in a deal. It's probably not the best powder for my application. But I don't have another rifle to use it in. No Leading, but this powder sure is dirty. And the Marlin barrel doen't help. Petander I might look at something to smooth it out. Have you done fire lap with a Marlin barrel?

[benellinut]

Acceptable is an opinion. Beretta used to be one of the better manufacturers. I haven't shot any of their guns in years but I'm a little surprised they would use that word with an obviously unsatisfied customer. It lacks a customer first attitude.


Agreed, I was taken back. It will be the last Beretta I'll ever buy, new or used. Too bad because other then the barrel I do like the gun but they lost a customer by not standing behind their product, could have been just a bad call on one day by one employee but I can't trust them now.

[Petander]

Petander I might look at something to smooth it out. Have you done fire lap with a Marlin barrel?

No I haven't. I have not firelapped anything . But I hand lapped my first 1895 with cast slugs and it made a huge difference. Leading stopped .That was almost 20 years ago, now my new SBL is working fine right out of the box. It is clean with Hi-Tek bullets. Surprisingly nice barrel really.

I'm seriously planning firelapping the Socom,I want to shoot,I want to shoot a lot,not clean.

[Avenger442]

I certainly understand the desire of cleaning less frequently. No one I know likes spending an hour cleaning every time they go to the range. I can shoot many more rounds in the Weatherby barrel than the Marlin without cleaning. Sometimes the Weatherby will look almost as clean, with a couple of passes with a patch, after a trip to the range as it did before I went. Sometimes I don't even do the patch before the next range trip. The 1035 Gold, what I use most in the Weatherby barrel, just doesn't leave any fouling. Which I see as one of the selling points of Hi Tek. Once it is properly applied and some applied knowledge is done with the round then there is no fouling. Of course there is always some powder fouling. I'm not sure that they will ever figure out how to burn a powder and not leave a residue. Some are cleaner than others. The SW 4350 that I have been using in the Marlin is not one of the clean ones but it can give me 2" groups at 100 yards. Which may be all this gun is capable of. We will see.

[glockfan]

No I haven't. I have not firelapped anything . But I hand lapped my first 1895 with cast slugs and it made a huge difference. Leading stopped .That was almost 20 years ago, now my new SBL is working fine right out of the box. It is clean with Hi-Tek bullets. Surprisingly nice barrel really.

I'm seriously planning firelapping the Socom,I want to shoot,I want to shoot a lot,not clean.

interesting reading about the bearthoots boolits .seems to work very good on such rough barrels like your 450 socom. would certainly give it a try .if i had to find a solution for such problem like yours.

https://www.longrangehunting.com/threads/fire-lapping-bullets-yes-or-no.12670/

[Petander]

All guns are different. I need 20 fouling shots for my 300 WM to shoot tightest groups. I then clean it ( remove all copper) at 50 or so with Forrest foam. That's jacketed of course. In between I only wipe with oil.

Marlin can take many boxes of cast Hi-Tek, I don't need to clean lead because there's no lead.

Now enter 458 Socom,one Hornady 350 bullet fired from an absolutely clean barrel.

226798

This is rough.

EDIT: The rifle is excellent by all other means than fouling - and a careful shoot one/clean /shoot one - break-in will most probably help. I didn't expect that but well, live and learn. I started it with five rounds but then I ran out of patches.And a few hundred J-bullets after break-in may be needed to try cast again. I'm just rushing with cast bullets , a basic AR is not a precision,hand lapped instrument.

But I will feed this with cast sooner or later.

[Petander]

Firelapping experiment looks good. Now I'm getting this after one J-bullet:

226853

[Tazza]

I FINALLY got time to put some red 122 on some round lead things. The first bake wasn't long enough, but a second round made them pass the wipe test. I hoped that leaving them in for 12 minutes at 180c that the oven was set to for the coating i was using before, but it wasn't. I left them in longer and no issues. I then went up to 200c so i knew it would work as it should.

I don't like the fact that the lube grooves are not all covered, i know it's not an issue for performance, but i just know people that buy them off me will say something, even though that part does not touch the barrel. This is where Ausglock has the right idea, moulds without lube groves, so they have a perfect looking coating.

I did find putting a little more Hi-Tek on then shaking, did help with coverage, it may just be one of those things to fiddle with to get the lube grooves filled in. They sure are nice and shiny too, darker than i thought it would be, but it's a fine colour none the less.

226860

[Stephen Cohen]

I found that by using a coating with a little more acetone added it was easy to cover lube grooves. Regards Stephen

[Tazza]

The first coat was done with a ratio of 120ml acetone to 20grams of hi-tek. I didn't use much for the first coat though, so that may have been my issue. I started with 1ml for a gloved hand full of projectiles, the second and third coats, i did 2ml of 100ml:20grams, so i think i just need to fiddle and weigh out the projectiles so i have some consistency.

This was a test to make sure i could get it to stick, now to size, load and flick them down range to see how they perform.

[Gremlin460]

The first coat was done with a ratio of 120ml acetone to 20grams of hi-tek. I didn't use much for the first coat though, so that may have been my issue. I started with 1ml for a gloved hand full of projectiles, the second and third coats, i did 2ml of 100ml:20grams, so i think i just need to fiddle and weigh out the projectiles so i have some consistency.

This was a test to make sure i could get it to stick, now to size, load and flick them down range to see how they perform.

Tazza try one batch in a container with a lid, will give you a bit longer time wise to allow the coating to reach everywhere. Dont change anything else, just add a lid.. might cure your problem.

[Tazza]

Ha, i never thought about that, very good idea.

I want to make sort of a small concrete mixer so i can tumble them to coat and get good consistency, adding a lid may help keep it coat then take the lid off after some time for it to coat and allow it to start to dry out.

Thanks for the tip!

[kevin c]

I use the Costco nut containers to coat, with the lid, perforated with a few small ventilation holes, screwed on at the beginning until I have shaken enough to get even coating, then off at the end to flash off the rest of the acetone. First part is to a mental count of fifty (maybe twelve seconds or so) and the second for a count of twenty (another five or six seconds). This is using 20 g in 120 ml, a bit less than a ml per pound, in moderate ambient temperature and relative humidity.

[Ausglock]

Ha, i never thought about that, very good idea.

I want to make sort of a small concrete mixer so i can tumble them to coat and get good consistency, adding a lid may help keep it coat then take the lid off after some time for it to coat and allow it to start to dry out.

Thanks for the tip!
https://i.imgur.com/ioK6tGs.jpg

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pivGTOPi_CU

[popper]

Petander - been following your alloy 'problem' for a while. Suggestion - try some sulfur or copper sulfate in your alloy to clean. Sulfur is smelly but cleans alloy of 'junk' very well - one of the ore cleaning methods of long ago. I found the CuSO4 to clean alloy (and reduce tin - you say your alloy is tin rich - and I've had trouble coating Sn/Pb & Zn/Pb boolits too). Both will give you harder alloy but I found the CuSO4 (Zep root killer over here) cleans the alloy so I hardly flux anymore. I use a Lee bottom dripper that doesn't drip much anymore but the top of the melt stays shiny through a complete pot full of pouring. I had a pot full and added a bunch of dross to it, what a mess. Added the CuSO4 and SHINY, stayed that way. I don't even clean the pot very often anymore. It makes really good boolits too. Bout all I shoot anymore is AR with cast - it's a blast.

[Tazza]

Ausglock - That is the style of what i wanted to make, but my design idea was more complicated.... I like the simplicity of regular buckets to tumble in. I may have to re-think my idea and get my paws on another motor and gearbox.

[OldBearHair]

Hey Ausglock Trevor, Hope someone doesn't ask "What color are you using ?" That is one fine looking rig you have there. Yeah I suppose you have several other colored buckets too.

[Tazza]

That is his signature colour, yet i'd assume he has something for his test batches that Joe sends him.

[Ausglock]

this size bucket is available at Bunnings. and is a perfect fit in the waste paper basket.
All the test samples get swirled by hand. I have 10 buckets so I can do a lot of different colours on one test day.

[benellinut]

Go to a chain restaurant, they get prepped foods in all kinds of nice buckets with lids, in all sizes, they throw them away. Make friends (pad hands, cook's or managers) and ask them to save them for you, quickly you'll have more then you can ever use! Luckily my wife is a manager of a few hotels and restaurants all owned by the same guy, I don't have to pad any hands, I tell her what I want, she tells them to save them for her and she brings them home all nicely cleaned, dry and sorted. I like the short fat ones, about 2 gallon size, the muffin dough comes in them for the Denny's Restaurant's, they have nice resealable lids, seal air tight, nice detachable carry handles and they stack nicely.

[Tazza]

Woohoo, an excuse to go to bunnings! The store for big kids.

[Avenger442]

I use a lid to tumble for all three coats. Keeps me from spilling8-). One caution on using the lid to tumble. It can give you a coat that is too thick. Instead of listening for the change in sound while tumbling use a timed tumble. I use 30 seconds. Still use the thinner mix. It works best for this.

[Petander]

Petander - been following your alloy 'problem' for a while. Suggestion - try some sulfur or copper sulfate in your alloy to clean. Sulfur is smelly but cleans alloy of 'junk' very well - one of the ore cleaning methods of long ago. I found the CuSO4 to clean alloy (and reduce tin - you say your alloy is tin rich - and I've had trouble coating Sn/Pb & Zn/Pb boolits too). Both will give you harder alloy but I found the CuSO4 (Zep root killer over here) cleans the alloy so I hardly flux anymore. I use a Lee bottom dripper that doesn't drip much anymore but the top of the melt stays shiny through a complete pot full of pouring. I had a pot full and added a bunch of dross to it, what a mess. Added the CuSO4 and SHINY, stayed that way. I don't even clean the pot very often anymore. It makes really good boolits too. Bout all I shoot anymore is AR with cast - it's a blast.

Thanks,I may try copper sulphate one day.

But I'm getting excellent results with gold,bronze and black cherry. Zombie Green doesn't like my alloy, I can't get it "ripe". But can live with that for now,just let it be.

Dang busy trying to shoot that rough 458 Socom barrel smooth enough for cast. Chrome lined...

[popper]

Bit off topic but years ago I ran across several articles of the Fin, Swede and Danes and their training loads for the resistance. seems like they used wood imitations for training and pipsqeak loads for practice as they couldn't let the invaders hear any shots. They had some really neat ideas making ammo & such.

[Petander]

The wooden blanks are still in use.

A blank firing adaptor (a muzzle device) is being used, it makes the wooden bullets explode so they become harmless.

[glockfan]

i tried 3 layers yesterday for the first time on my new accurate mold 35-130M...and i like how it turned out. i like how it seals the boolit,and the added thiickness is welcome since my mold drops at 357 flush,so i can pass them trough my resizer at 357 to make the boolits perfectly round. the added 3rd layer run my boolits at .358 which is the perfect situation for me.

227134227135227136

[benellinut]

i tried 3 layers yesterday for the first time on my new accurate mold 35-130M...and i like how it turned out. i like how it seals the boolit,and the added thiickness is welcome since my mold drops at 357 flush,so i can pass them trough my resizer at 357 to make the boolits perfectly round. the added 3rd layer run my boolits at .358 which is the perfect situation for me.

227134227135227136

Those are money!!

[Ausglock]

Nice work, GF.

[glockfan]

Nice work, GF.

honestly Trevor, i think this specific one (35-130M) is goin to mass production. bullseye shooting worthy...super accurate,sub moa benched to 25 meters with a steady aim. will ask tom to cut me another one for the mastercaster. the smaller meplat allows a longer coal than my previous (35-145M) desigN.



i think by now i'm gonna stick with the 3 layers approach. it doesn't add much time,and i really like how it enclose the boolit .

[HI-TEK]

i tried 3 layers yesterday for the first time on my new accurate mold 35-130M...and i like how it turned out. i like how it seals the boolit,and the added thiickness is welcome since my mold drops at 357 flush,so i can pass them trough my resizer at 357 to make the boolits perfectly round. the added 3rd layer run my boolits at .358 which is the perfect situation for me.

227134227135227136

glockfan

They are absolutely beautiful and accurate, what else does one need?
I have had similar reports with the Dark Green Metallic as well.
The dark Green metallic, is somewhat like the Zombie Green, but a darker Green and pearlescent.
They glitter in sunlight and also very accurate.

[glockfan]

glockfan

They are absolutely beautiful and accurate, what else does one need?
I have had similar reports with the Dark Green Metallic as well.
The dark Green metallic, is somewhat like the Zombie Green, but a darker Green and pearlescent.
They glitter in sunlight and also very accurate.



Joe. i really got my act together with old gold. i now use a little more product : i shoot 10ml for each 8 pounds worth of boolits. my mix is a little more diluted.i use 56ml of acetone for 10 grams of the product. i also make a point of not letting the acetone to flash completely,i dump the boolits still wet on the baking tray.

i also really think that each oven type will work best with a certain amount of boolits.my black n decker convection gets me a perfect bake with 16pound of boolits to cook . having a shield over the oven's elements is also very importatnt to me ; i want a radiant heat,not direct. as well, the BBQ brickets is of tremendous help. the recovery time is way faster,and the oven's temp don't drop down as low ,like without the briquets.

i've been able to do 3 layers inside the 1 hour mark. i'm now walking into rifle load developpement ; i've ordered a 140grs boolit for my 6.5 creedmore tikka T3X TAC 1 rifle,and i plan to work a full power load coated with 3 layers of hi tek. of course i'm gonna use a harder alloy 92-6-2 .

i have all my pistol boolits spec'ed for mass production. now, i'm gonna work some .308 and 6.5 CM . i want my commercial production the be PERFECT.PERFECT,nothing less. i want to be able to tell my customers that,they can load at the higher end of the loading chart without even thinking. the boolits i will sell will be perfect,because we know how demanding customers acan be lol.

also, i hope to be able to make the old gold color the brand mark color for all my production

[HI-TEK]

[QUOTE=glockfan;4456429]Joe. i really got my act together with old gold. i now use a little more product : i shoot 10ml for each 8 pounds worth of boolits. my mix is a little more diluted.i use 56ml of acetone for 10 grams of the product. i also make a point of not letting the acetone to flash completely,i dump the boolits still wet on the baking tray.

glockfan,
Many have realised, that using product made up with more Acetone actually produces best results.
If then you consider what is used with 3 coats, it works our about the same as using two of more concentrated mix coats..

If you look at the lube grooved projectiles, they are really for all the waxy greasy type applications.
Here, most commercial casters are producing non-grooved casts, coat the alloy, dry & bake, and it works in all calibres.
The Hi-Tek coating really eliminates complicated alloy single or multi-grooved configurations, that required other lubricants to stop Lead becoming in contact with the bore.
These multi-grooved casts, do not have a great deal of bearing surface, and using coatings on these, can only protect the sections that would directly come in contact with the bore.
Much of the coating simply ends up inside the lube grooves where it serves no purpose and is a waste.

A project, that has been in the back of my mind for some time, is to look at comparing accuracy of hard cast with soft alloys, when there are no lube grooves, and when they are sized the same.
Then compare results using hard and soft alloy with lube grooved casts, coated same way, and see what effects are realised comparing the lube groove versus non lube groove with accuracy and speed.

I am guessing that casts both hard and soft without lube grooves, sized correctly should work. But up to what speed it can be shot, is another question.

[Ausglock]

honestly Trevor, i think this specific one (35-130M) is goin to mass production. bullseye shooting worthy...super accurate,sub moa benched to 25 meters with a steady aim. will ask tom to cut me another one for the mastercaster. the smaller meplat allows a longer coal than my previous (35-145M) desigN.



i think by now i'm gonna stick with the 3 layers approach. it doesn't add much time,and i really like how it enclose the boolit .
My favourite 9mm bullet is the 35-150Z. sized .3565 for 38 Super. Amazingly accurate in my Kimber STII 1911

[Avenger442]

Ausglock; Sounds like a good test mule for Joe's project.

Got a new gun last week
227198

A pistol caliber AR in 45. Got it for the Grandkids to shoot :bigsmyl2:. Already have about 10 pounds of 45s cast but not coated. And about 50 rounds of loaded Hi Tek for it.

[wlkjr]

Ausglock; Sounds like a good test mule for Joe's project.

Got a new gun last week
227198

A pistol caliber AR in 45. Got it for the Grandkids to shoot :bigsmyl2:. Already have about 10 pounds of 45s cast but not coated. And about 50 rounds of loaded Hi Tek for it.
I wasn't aware of a Glock magazine in .45 that held that many rounds.

[Avenger442]

It came with a 13 round Glock mag. The one in the photo is a KCI Magazine for Glock 21,30,41 .45 ACP 26Rds. Not the quality of a Magpul or factory mag, but will work acceptable for range play. I bought it on GrabaGun.com

[wlkjr]

It came with a 13 round Glock mag. The one in the photo is a KCI Magazine for Glock 21,30,41 .45 ACP 26Rds. Not the quality of a Magpul or factory mag, but will work acceptable for range play. I bought it on GrabaGun.com

Cool. Nice setup.

[dikman]

Ausglock; Sounds like a good test mule for Joe's project.

Got a new gun last week
227198

A pistol caliber AR in 45. Got it for the Grandkids to shoot :bigsmyl2:. Already have about 10 pounds of 45s cast but not coated. And about 50 rounds of loaded Hi Tek for it.

Down here one can only dream of such a thing...........

[Avenger442]

There are some here that would like it that way. But, so far, our Constitution has held them at bay.

[benellinut]

Unfortunately not in NY, we use to be free then Cuomo stepped in. Those of us who live upstate in the country are out voted and ruled by that small island called NYC. I keep praying for better days, I to old to just uproot, leave my family and move away.

[Avenger442]

We are taking a trip through the Virginia's, Pennsylvania and will pass through Maryland. We had talked about going through New York but nixed the idea. They do not honor my CCP and confiscate weapons if we are stopped. You don't get them back. I don't travel without a gun on me. Never know if you might need it in these days. So we will have to be careful in Maryland. They don't honor it either. But are not as ignorant as the Government in New York in their reaction.

There was an incident that happen recently which actually got reported on the news. An officer had been shot four times by a person he had stopped in a car and other officers were being fired upon when a citizen with a concealed weapon shot the suspect and ended the conflict. CCP holders are involved probably once a month in ending active shooter conflicts here in the US. But you rarely see it reported on the news. Of course it was FOX news.

[benellinut]

Having a problem here in NY would all depend on the officer, while not having a valid NYS permit would up the ante and likely result in an arrest, some officers are pro 2nd Amendment and more lenient and some are hard core anti-gun for citizens, I've run into both kinds.

Part of the "Safe Act" now includes, loose your pistol permit and you loose your right to own long guns as well, they'll come and take both, it's already happen to some here. They also allow ANYONE in health care to anonymously report you as potential danger to yourself or others, they come for your guns then a judge determines if you are fit to own a firearm, you get one shot to plead your case to the judge and you have no right to face or know who your accuser was.

Shortly after the Safe Act was passed the NY State Police were caught data mining health records of permit holders, they were looking for anyone who had ever been prescribed anti-depressants or had seen a head shrinker and looking for matching names. They found one poor sap and seized his guns, unfortunately they had the right name, David Lewis but the wrong David Lewis, it made the news, the firearms were eventually returned to the gentleman. It was exposed they had been digging through citizens medical records which is a violation of the HIPAA Act, it was leaked and confirmed to be true from an anonymous source inside the dept but of course nothing ever came of it. https://nyfirearms.com/forums/firearms-news/51632-nys-police-wrongly-pulled-mans-gun-permit.html

BTW, In NY you can only have ten round mags and you can only load seven rounds in the mag (plus one in the pipe) unless your at a range target shooting or shooting a sanctioned match, then you can load ten. So ten rounds for plinking or matches but only seven for self defense, even while in your home. Get caught with a mag that holds more then ten and it's five years for each mag, plus loosing your permit and all your guns.

I won't even go into "assault rifles", not enough time or room to try and begin to explain it all here...... Good luck trying to figure it out, even the State Police said they can't make sense of a lot of it.

Welcome to NY, Cuomo land....

[glockfan]

Having a problem here in NY would all depend on the officer, while not having a valid NYS permit would up the ante and likely result in an arrest, some officers are pro 2nd Amendment and more lenient and some are hard core anti-gun for citizens, I've run into both kinds.

Part of the "Safe Act" now includes, loose your pistol permit and you loose your right to own long guns as well, they'll come and take both, it's already happen to some here. They also allow ANYONE in health care to anonymously report you as potential danger to yourself or others, they come for your guns then a judge determines if you are fit to own a firearm, you get one shot to plead your case to the judge and you have no right to face or know who your accuser was.

Shortly after the Safe Act was passed the NY State Police were caught data mining health records of permit holders, they were looking for anyone who had ever been prescribed anti-depressants or had seen a head shrinker and looking for matching names. They found one poor sap and seized his guns, unfortunately they had the right name, David Lewis but the wrong David Lewis, it made the news, the firearms were eventually returned to the gentleman. It was exposed they had been digging through citizens medical records which is a violation of the HIPAA Act, it was leaked and confirmed to be true from an anonymous source inside the dept but of course nothing ever came of it. https://nyfirearms.com/forums/firearms-news/51632-nys-police-wrongly-pulled-mans-gun-permit.html

BTW, In NY you can only have ten round mags and you can only load seven rounds in the mag (plus one in the pipe) unless your at a range target shooting or shooting a sanctioned match, then you can load ten. So ten rounds for plinking or matches but only seven for self defense, even while in your home. Get caught with a mag that holds more then ten and it's five years for each mag, plus loosing your permit and all your guns.

I won't even go into "assault rifles", not enough time or room to try and begin to explain it all here...... Good luck trying to figure it out, even the State Police said they can't make sense of a lot of it.

Welcome to NY, Cuomo land....

amazing how it can be different from states to states. like,another completely out of our solar system planet.

sure enough new york isn't gun friendly anymore,but so are most of the major cities liberal driven. i wonder how it is possible, with the 2A being a constitutional amendement , for a city to be able to over rule 2A to such point where it looks like law abiding gun owners are treated like criminals. .

[HI-TEK]

amazing how it can be different from states to states. like,another completely out of our solar system planet.

sure enough new york isn't gun friendly anymore,but so are most of the major cities liberal driven. i wonder how it is possible, with the 2A being a constitutional amendement , for a city to be able to over rule 2A to such point where it looks like law abiding gun owners are treated like criminals. .

Glockfan
The difficulty comes from gradual sneaking in of small changes, that eventually end up preventing any one owning any guns.
It has happened here. Criminal activity has caused Knee Jerk reactions by politicians, and a signing of a paper, suddenly, proper law abiding citizens became criminals for owning a gun.
There seems a world wide combined activity to ban all guns.
What is not able to be done is to stop guns being owned by criminals . Proper licensed gun owners are always targeted as the pollies know where these guns are located.
So all are patting each other on the backs as having done a public service, but the problem areas are not fixed at all.

[Avenger442]

Our Constitution actually guarantees the right of a citizen to keep and bear arms. That means you can not only own but carry with you a weapon. That particular part of the Constitution stems from the Colonist experiences with British rule and the realization that at some time the people, which are clearly stated in the document as the ruling class in this country, might need to take action to protect their liberty.

That freedom has been eroded over the years by people that do not agree with our founding laws and documents and wish to take our freedom from us. Making us wards of the State or Socialist. When they have been able to be voted into office, as in New York state and New York itself California etc., they have passed ordinances that have made it very difficult or, in some cases, impossible to exercise freedoms. They have sometimes been sued and have had to remove or modify those ordinances. But quite frankly some citizens of the United States have this done to them and are too ignorant of their founding documents because of our public education system or just too lazy to do anything about it. That course I had to go through in American History years ago that included study of the Constitution is absent or is modified to exclude it's history and true meaning in most schools today. We need to take another route other than public education which has helped cause the severe erosion of our rights. And that is coming from a former public education employee. There was a time when even New York State and California were a place of freedom. Don't vote for any Democrat!

You usually see more crime in the areas where the Socialists are strong and those rights are strongly restricted. It is much easier for me to rob, rape and pillage if I have a gun and there is almost no chance of the person being attacked will have one. Criminals will always have a weapon. But that is not the only reason our Constitution guarantees the right to own and carry a gun. If your interested there is a free course offered online by Hillsdale College.

Sorry to high jack the thread. They have a thread to discuss this stuff on castboolits.

[Dieselhorses]

Look at crime stats for Maine and Vermont. Lowest in nation. Why? Hardly any sanctions on the 2nd amendment. (Moving this discussion to another Forum maybe)

[Petander]

Glockfan
The difficulty comes from gradual sneaking in of small changes, that eventually end up preventing any one owning any guns.
It has happened here. Criminal activity has caused Knee Jerk reactions by politicians, and a signing of a paper, suddenly, proper law abiding citizens became criminals for owning a gun.
There seems a world wide combined activity to ban all guns.
What is not able to be done is to stop guns being owned by criminals . Proper licensed gun owners are always targeted as the pollies know where these guns are located.
So all are patting each other on the backs as having done a public service, but the problem areas are not fixed at all.

Exactly,that is happening little by little up here as well. We are facing the "ten round magazine" thing now. Even though we have limits for hunting already,have had those for decades already. Now we will have a million illegal magazines all over the country. People lose guns for driving a car too fast etc. Hunters have to hide their hobby. I may be in trouble for using my own name over here and some other gun boards one day.

The worst thing is,young people do not bother with all the paperwork,control,they don't like being treated as potential criminals. They don't get into hunting or shooting sports,they do easier things... soon people can't shoot or handle firearms. I'm 55 and I'm on the young side in the hunting and shooting clubs that I'm a member of.

[glockfan]

Look at crime stats for Maine and Vermont. Lowest in nation. Why? Hardly any sanctions on the 2nd amendment. (Moving this discussion to another Forum maybe)

..yep,and what amaze me the most is,democrats predominate the state since the late 60's.....before that, the state was all about republicans. and it is still THE state where you don't want to start to talk about messing with 2A!!!

[Dieselhorses]

..yep,and what amaze me the most is,democrats predominate the state since the late 60's.....before that, the state was all about republicans. and it is still THE state where you don't want to start to talk about messing with 2A!!!

You would think that this would set an example for the rest of nation, I'll never understand politics I guess.

[Avenger442]

You would think that this would set an example for the rest of nation, I'll never understand politics I guess.

Or the ignorance of the voting public in some areas.

[Tazza]

So far so good with the 122 red, i just need to fine tune the application. After cooking, it is more of a lighter cherry colour, but looks great all the same.

From my rough maths, i'm getting about 1,000 projectiles coated for every 10 grams of powder. So approximatly 100,000 per kg of powder. That is one coat of 120ml acetone to 20g of powder for the first coat, the second and third coats are 100ml:20grams.

I might be using a little more coating than i need, but i'm trying to get the lube groves coated, just for aesthetics, as i know this section does not touch the barrel, but people are fussy.... Ideally no lube grove moulds would be great, like Ausglock uses, his look awesome.

I'm considering trying to use a 120:20 for the second and third coats, but use more product, the acetone will evaporate and leave a thicker coating. Just means it will need tumbling longer to give it time to evaporate off.

I'm using a standard household oven with old steel trays.

If an idiot like me can get Hi-Tek to stick, anyone can!

[Ausglock]

Is it 122K or 122L???

[Tazza]

That is a good question.... Pretty sure it just had 122 on the container.

It looked red/slightly purple in powder and liquid form, I was hoping for bright red like the american eagle 9mm that are floating around, but i'm not disappointed with this colour. Nice and shiny and very slippery.

[Ausglock]

The red closest to the Synteck Eagle stuff is the Canine Pecker Red (DDR) or Red 254
There was an old liquid red 2FR2K (2013 I think) years ago that was also close. Still have the sample of it up in the shed.
Black Widow used to use 122, but he changed to red 254.

[Tazza]

I may have to hit Joe up for 254 or DDR for the next lot to have a play with. Yet everyone i have shown samples of the 122 coated ones, they really like the colour.

I was old fashioned, i wanted plain boring black but got talked into trying a colour, that i really do like.

It's nice to have "your" colour, then people see your ammo and go i know who made those projectiles!

[HI-TEK]

I may have to hit Joe up for 254 or DDR for the next lot to have a play with. Yet everyone i have shown samples of the 122 coated ones, they really like the colour.

I was old fashioned, i wanted plain boring black but got talked into trying a colour, that i really do like.

It's nice to have "your" colour, then people see your ammo and go i know who made those projectiles!

Tazza,
Generally, you can use 120mls Acetone with 20g Hi-Tek powdered coating. Use same volume/quantity as you would use with 20/100g ratio.
The more Acetone mix will get into lube grooves, and also leave better drying finish. What you must keep in mind, that More Acetone, evaporating, can chill the casts much more, so moisture pick up can become a problem if you don't dry first coat very well.
Generally two coats should be just fine.

If you like 122, you may also like Candy Apple which is similar too the Red 122 but has Gold Flecks through coating.
We also have a 122 version which has Pearlescent appearance, (it is not produced in any quantity)
The DDR Red is a pinkish red (flesh type colour, named by Ausglock. Just ask him about that colour) This is not used in Aus.
The 254, is used by another commercial caster here and is not available.

[Ausglock]

I love the Candy Apple red

[Grmps]

:)

https://i.imgur.com/37dY6uR.png

[Ausglock]

Hahahaha... Drop bears and Wombats love you yank tourists.... keeps their belly's full. they love the taste.

[Avenger442]

Look at it this way Ausglock. You guys walk on the up side[smilie=w:

[Petander]

Here you can find your exact Other Side Location:

http://www.antipodr.com/

227527.

227528

[Dieselhorses]

Here you can find your exact Other Side Location:

http://www.antipodr.com/

227527.

227528Interesting. Id be in the middle of the Indian Ocean.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G870A using Tapatalk

[Avenger442]

Guys the KCI Magazine for Glock .45 ACP 26Rds that I mentioned in the earlier post I would not recommend for a pistol caliber rifle. They seem to work for some who have used them in Glocks but.....

Shot about 200 rounds of .38 special, 100 rounds of .45 ACP and about 100 rounds of .308 coated with 1035 Gold today with the grandkids and my daughter. No issues what so ever. They loved it.

[Petander]

100 meters yesterday.

Good bullets,bad shooting.

227624

[glockfan]

100 meters yesterday.

Good bullets,bad shooting.

227624



we all goes trough such ''bad days''' . some days,it's trigger control,other days,it's the sight picture who move around. i can feel before i hit the range if it's goin to be a '''ragged hole ''' day or a ''''12 gauge session''' with my pistols.....i'm mainly a pistol shooter,and it takes so little to mess a target.i started to practice my bullseye shooting recently instead of the ipsc double taps....wheeew. i must re-train my strenght clamping the gun just enough so the sights freeze on the target. first few targets were ugly.

honestly,i don't see a difference in accuracy between my casts and the zeros jacketed i was using before i started casting my own. i can extract a 1 moa at 25meters solidly benched from my hi tek'ed boolits. in fact, i feel i'm getting more consistency from my own casts because the quality control is applied by ME. i only keep the perfect ones, so that means i'm getting a very good consistency though out an X batch i've loaded. that means i have NO flyers,and my targets confirm that.

[Petander]

This horizontal thing happens to me with AR:s /sandbags.

I'm pretty good with bolt rifles with bipods/bags/whatever. I have shot them for decades "free recoil" so that I'm holding the rear bag with my left hand. Shoulder/cheek pressure only,the right hand merely "surrounds" the grip, only the trigger finger is really touching. Very consistent,I try to disturb the gun as little as possible.

Transition from that form to support an AR that's jumping around seems to take some time to figure out. I might get three in one hole,then the next one goes 2" to the left or right for no reason I can tell. There must be some unnoticed variables in my form.

[Avenger442]

Guys QVC has a Kitchen Aid convection oven on sale for $89.95. Regular price $165.

[popper]

Got to get casting ang HiTek gold again. Got some new acetone.

[glockfan]

This horizontal thing happens to me with AR:s /sandbags.

I'm pretty good with bolt rifles with bipods/bags/whatever. I have shot them for decades "free recoil" so that I'm holding the rear bag with my left hand. Shoulder/cheek pressure only,the right hand merely "surrounds" the grip, only the trigger finger is really touching. Very consistent,I try to disturb the gun as little as possible.

Transition from that form to support an AR that's jumping around seems to take some time to figure out. I might get three in one hole,then the next one goes 2" to the left or right for no reason I can tell. There must be some unnoticed variables in my form.


back in the day ,when i was range manager during the hunting season,i could zero 30 to 50 rifles everyday during 2-3 months at 20$ each. i must point out that over here,hunters are getting 1 practice session before their hunting trip,then it's '''in the case,see you next year '''lol. that means most of them are not even able to zero their own rifle themself.......but to get to the point, i always used the same technique as yours. sand bags on the rear,my trusty rock'n'br on the fromt,my left arm circling the bags. if you put some attention on the way you rest the stock on the front rest,it doesn't even jump when the shot break. i still use this technique,i don't hold the front of the rifle at all ,and it works great for me.

[Ausglock]

Ditto. Left hand squeezes the rear bag for fine sight adjustment.

[HI-TEK]

Glockfan I sent you a PM. Please reply

[HI-TEK]

Got to get casting ang HiTek gold again. Got some new acetone.



Popper, you would love the new Gold TMG. It is brilliant. Unfortunately it is very expensive to produce, some 50% more that normal 1035 Gold.
There is a local guy who already wanted it despite price. It is only available in small quantities at this stage.

[HI-TEK]

I have had great feed back on Aqualube sizing lubes. All that had used it, noticed a great improvement with sizing even with hard alloys and improved bore cleanliness.. I know it is expensive to buy, but it goes such a long way, that end use cost is extremely low. A 300g bottle of highly concentrated version will lube many hundreds of thousands. Donnie has the hobby sized packs and also commercial packs for larger producers.

[Avenger442]

I have had great feed back on Aqualube sizing lubes. All that had used it, noticed a great improvement with sizing even with hard alloys and improved bore cleanliness.. I know it is expensive to buy, but it goes such a long way, that end use cost is extremely low. A 300g bottle of highly concentrated version will lube many hundreds of thousands. Donnie has the hobby sized packs and also commercial packs for larger producers.


Has anyone used this to resize the cartridge cases? I know there are spray lubes to do this. Just wondering if someone has experimented with Aqualube for that particular use.

[wlkjr]

I have had great success with Aqualube sizing the coated bullets, and even recoating bullets after sizing. I have not tried it as a case lube as I use Hornady's One Shot. I'm really still on my first bottle of Aqualube after sizing at least 10,000 pieces.

[Ausglock]

Has anyone used this to resize the cartridge cases? I know there are spray lubes to do this. Just wondering if someone has experimented with Aqualube for that particular use.

Hmmm... I have a handful of 25-06 that need FLSing.. will try it and see.

[Avenger442]

Pulling stuck cases is probably the worst thing for a handloader. I usually use the Hornady and a lube pad. Forgot once.

[HI-TEK]

I have had great success with Aqualube sizing the coated bullets, and even recoating bullets after sizing. I have not tried it as a case lube as I use Hornady's One Shot. I'm really still on my first bottle of Aqualube after sizing at least 10,000 pieces.


wlkjr,
The Aqualube has been used for many years as a dry lube and release agent. It can be virtually be used in every application where binding, sticking is occurring between metal to metal, and all synthetic materials, and it is great for lubricating squeaky hinges, wooden drawer runners where there is binding, on metal cutting saws, especially when cutting Aluminium, and drilling applications to help with removing swarf.
One large company made it into a spray can as a dry film lube, with low VOC.
I have seen it used for garage roll a door runners, Aluminium windows to stop binding, conveyor belting to help with slip and reduce wear of belts.
It is used in boring tool lubrication when making gun barrels.
Main thing is, that once applied to surfaces, it is clean, dry, and will not attract dust and dirt as surfaces repel all.
This is important as other liquid/oily types of lubricants leave residues that will attract dust that has to be constantly cleaned from surfaces.
If you have tight fitting parts, after applying the Aqualube, it moves like silk.
Remember, use very sparingly as it does not take a lot to work, and for a long time.
Warning, once applied to a surface, and dried, it is almost impossible to remove, as it becomes insoluble in all cleaners and solvents.
DO NOT SPILL ONTO THE FLOOR, it is very slippery, and removal can be achieved with grit blasting.

[shanep]

I've bought zombie green and new toaster oven. Cast me some bullets tonight. But will paint thinner work, or should I wait until I get acetone? I'm just getting started with this process, have always just lubed on my lubrasizer. Hate that till won't be used as much now. Lol thanks that's my new oven. What do ya'll think? guyshttps://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20180929/660a0899b08da6f6405dc584d8eca963.jpg

Sent from my SM-G965U1 using Tapatalk
https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20180929/c4e8436a7d8615f50a82cf598b1476b5.jpg

[HI-TEK]

[QUOTE=shanep;4466779]I've bought zombie green and new toaster oven. Cast me some bullets tonight. But will paint thinner work, or should I wait until I get acetone?

shanep,

under no circumstances should you use any solvent that is not pure Acetone.

I had a local commercial caster guy, telling me that the coating was no good, and having to re melt 250,000. Investigations after exhaustive efforts revealed, he purchased a solvent labelled Acetone UN 2205 to make up coating mixture.
But what in fact he purchased was a Acetone Reducer as used by car painters.
This solvent contains 60% Acetone but the rest 40%, is chemicals to slow down drying, oily solvents, and this wrecks coating drying and prevents adhesion during baking.

Pure Acetone should be UN 1090.

Some retailers don't know the difference between them, and sell you solvent which has Acetone, but this end up causing you lots of head aches, as you wont realise why coating simply wont bond to freshly cast alloy.
Use the correct stuff, and all should be OK.

[shanep]

[QUOTE=shanep;4466779]I've bought zombie green and new toaster oven. Cast me some bullets tonight. But will paint thinner work, or should I wait until I get acetone?

shanep,

under no circumstances should you use any solvent that is not pure Acetone.

I had a local commercial caster guy, telling me that the coating was no good, and having to re melt 250,000. Investigations after exhaustive efforts revealed, he purchased a solvent labelled Acetone UN 2205 to make up coating mixture.
But what in fact he purchased was a Acetone Reducer as used by car painters.
This solvent contains 60% Acetone but the rest 40%, is chemicals to slow down drying, oily solvents, and this wrecks coating drying and prevents adhesion during baking.

Pure Acetone should be UN 1090.

Some retailers don't know the difference between them, and sell you solvent which has Acetone, but this end up causing you lots of head aches, as you wont realise why coating simply wont bond to freshly cast alloy.
Use the correct stuff, and all should be OK.That's good information sir, thank you. I was thinking that it contained oil base.

Sent from my SM-G965U1 using Tapatalk

[shanep]

[QUOTE=shanep;4466779]I've bought zombie green and new toaster oven. Cast me some bullets tonight. But will paint thinner work, or should I wait until I get acetone?

shanep,

under no circumstances should you use any solvent that is not pure Acetone.

I had a local commercial caster guy, telling me that the coating was no good, and having to re melt 250,000. Investigations after exhaustive efforts revealed, he purchased a solvent labelled Acetone UN 2205 to make up coating mixture.
But what in fact he purchased was a Acetone Reducer as used by car painters.
This solvent contains 60% Acetone but the rest 40%, is chemicals to slow down drying, oily solvents, and this wrecks coating drying and prevents adhesion during baking.

Pure Acetone should be UN 1090.

Some retailers don't know the difference between them, and sell you solvent which has Acetone, but this end up causing you lots of head aches, as you wont realise why coating simply wont bond to freshly cast alloy.
Use the correct stuff, and all should be OK.Where can I find it.

Sent from my SM-G965U1 using Tapatalk

[HI-TEK]

Where can I find it.

Sent from my SM-G965U1 using Tapatalk[/QUOTE]

Acetone can be purchased from Paint stores, Hardware stores, and if you have a Fiberglass supplier, or fiberglass manufacturer, they will also have Acetone as they use it for clean up work.
I don't know your location so it is difficult to offer specific details.
Generally, hardware stores do have small tins of it but is very expensive that way.
It is best to find people who have 200 litre drum lot, and have them decant some into a Steel can of yours.
It should work out much cheaper that way.

[Petander]

Popper, you would love the new Gold TMG. It is brilliant. Unfortunately it is very expensive to produce, some 50% more that normal 1035 Gold.
There is a local guy who already wanted it despite price. It is only available in small quantities at this stage.

This remote guy here would like to get some TMG,too.

I'm also ready for my first grooveless mould, to feed 458S.

[Ausglock]

Honestly... The Sunny Gold is just as good as the TMG gold.
The Gold 1035 and Old Gold also are just as good.
If I was buying it, I couldn't justify the extra cost of the TMG...

[ioon44]

One Problem with looking for UN 1090 number is that small containers don't have the UN 1090 number on the can and was probably on the case the small cans were shipped in.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/UN_number

[Michael J. Spangler]

Hi Guys

I have been following this thread for a long time and have been big supporter of Hi-Tek Joe with Donnie as a vendor here in the states and use their product for about 90% of my bullets.
I just wanted to say what a awesome companies those guys run and to let it be known how dedicated they are to their product and customers.
Every year I host a bullet casting seminar in MA (http://castboolits.gunloads.com/showthread.php?366389-Southeastern-MA-Cast-Bullet-Seminar) and These guys have donated samples every time.
I walk the attendees through the preparation and use of the product and pass out the handouts Donnie provides. I feel like the ease of use and the very low investment cost to get started teamed up with the fool proof results have really helped to get people to take the plunge into casting. Without having to figure out what lube works best or flows just right, without having to spend the money on a lube sizer or deal with pan lubing and knowing that this coating will perform every time gives them the confidence to start right away.
Thank you both for the continued support and giving casters a no nonsense way to coat bullets. Keep up the great work

[Stephen Cohen]

I cant help but think of the early days when Joe first introduced this coating to the USA, there was so much doubt in the ability of the product, my we have come a long way since those days. What a great product and site to share its use in. regards Stephen

[shanep]

One Problem with looking for UN 1090 number is that small containers don't have the UN 1090 number on the can and was probably on the case the small cans were shipped in.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/UN_numberEverywhere I've been, they have no idea what un1090 means. I believe I got the right stuff. Headed to get another mixing container, it ate through the hard plastic one I was trying to use lol. Glad I was standing there.

Sent from my SM-G965U1 using Tapatalk

[HI-TEK]

Everywhere I've been, they have no idea what un1090 means. I believe I got the right stuff. Headed to get another mixing container, it ate through the hard plastic one I was trying to use lol. Glad I was standing there.

Sent from my SM-G965U1 using Tapatalk

In US there must be different label requirements for dangerous goods.
I would be very cautious about buying solvents from people who simply do not know, as results can be not so good.

Here, all Acetone Labels have Class 3 DG Hazchem IIYE UN 1090.

The UN number is an internationally recognised assignment for Acetone and is recognised as having number identity of UN1090.
If you look up in Google, or other search engines, if you type in UN1090, it will immediately should come up with Acetone.

Solvent blends, can come under a general category of paint , additives and coatings area, the UN 1263 related materials including paint, lacquer, enamel, stain, shellac solutions, varnish, polish, liquid filler, and liquid lacquer base, or paint related material including paint thinning, drying, removing, or reducing compound.


If you have Acetone, and it is drying much too fast whilst coating, simply add and premix, about 200mls of denatured Alcohol per one litre of Acetone, and used this solvent mix to make up coating mixture.
This wont interfere with the Hi-Tek powdered coatings and wont interfere with bonding and drying. If coating then is drying a little slower that required, simply warm air dry to about 45-50C for 15-30 minutes before baking.

[HI-TEK]

I cant help but think of the early days when Joe first introduced this coating to the USA, there was so much doubt in the ability of the product, my we have come a long way since those days. What a great product and site to share its use in. regards Stephen

Stephen & Michael,
Thank you for kind words.
It is coming up to the Hi-Tek coating being in the US for 6 years. It really has been well adopted, and was found to actually work. There were a few hiccups, but all sorted.


I have looked at a survey, and the Hi-Tek is now used in over 30 countries. I am amazed.

Funny thing is, that locals here, after coating being on the market for 25 years in Aus, I am constantly surprised, that many don't know that it is made in Australia, and they try to buy from US.

[glockfan]

Honestly... The Sunny Gold is just as good as the TMG gold.
The Gold 1035 and Old Gold also are just as good.
If I was buying it, I couldn't justify the extra cost of the TMG...

hmmm...gold...gold...gooold!!!

[shanep]

Stephen & Michael,
Thank you for kind words.
It is coming up to the Hi-Tek coating being in the US for 6 years. It really has been well adopted, and was found to actually work. There were a few hiccups, but all sorted.


I have looked at a survey, and the Hi-Tek is now used in over 30 countries. I am amazed.

Funny thing is, that locals here, after coating being on the market for 25 years in Aus, I am constantly surprised, that many don't know that it is made in Australia, and they try to buy from US.Hi tek what am I doing wrong? I mixed 20 grams of zombie green to 3.4 oz of pure acetone. Second coat and they don't have the faintest green color. Is there a different ratio for this color? Thanks

Sent from my SM-G965U1 using Tapatalk

[HI-TEK]

hmmm...gold...gold...gooold!!!

There are other Golds as well Aztec Gold, Gold 305, Satin Gold, Solar Gold, Glitter Gold, as you say GOLD GOLD GOLD.

[shanep]

Hi tek what am I doing wrong? I mixed 20 grams of zombie green to 3.4 oz of pure acetone. Second coat and they don't have the faintest green color. Is there a different ratio for this color? Thanks

Sent from my SM-G965U1 using TapatalkHere's a picturehttps://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20180930/6f99268c260ca7a9337d587f0a723879.jpg

Sent from my SM-G965U1 using Tapatalk

[HI-TEK]

Hi tek what am I doing wrong? I mixed 20 grams of zombie green to 3.4 oz of pure acetone. Second coat and they don't have the faintest green color. Is there a different ratio for this color? Thanks

Sent from my SM-G965U1 using Tapatalk


How long after mixing did you try and use mixture?
I suspect, that the stuff was not mixed in enough. Most make it up, and leave it for half an hour, mixing occasionally, and afterwards then take aliquots to coat.

[HI-TEK]

Here's a picturehttps://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20180930/6f99268c260ca7a9337d587f0a723879.jpg

Sent from my SM-G965U1 using Tapatalk



Looks like you only got some resin into the solution mix and not all was dissolved.
Put one cast into mixing bottle and use it as a rattle to mix, as used in aerosol cans.
Mix it several times during the half hour.

The coating advices states, don't rush it, take your time.

I suggest, that you dry this first well, and bake it. By the time you dry and bake, the mixture used for coating should be mostly mixed in.

[shanep]

How long after mixing did you try and use mixture?
I suspect, that the stuff was not mixed in enough. Most make it up, and leave it for half an hour, mixing occasionally, and afterwards then take aliquots to coat.I waited over 45 minutes, baking my second coat now. Maybe I'm just overly excited and never done it. I'll do 4 coats and we'll see what they look like. I'm putting 5 ml on 5 pounds is that right? Again thanks for helping me.

Sent from my SM-G965U1 using Tapatalk

[glockfan]

you must use 1ml of mixture for 1 pound of boolits. mixture ratio should be a diluted mix like in 120 ml of acetone for 20 grams of powder,or ,like i do ,55 ml of acetone for 10 grams of powder .

then you must want to swirl the whole batch to make sure all the boolits went in contact with the jiice,but you also must make sure you dump the boolits in the tray still WET....don't wait for the acetone to flash entirely.....when you hear the tumbling sound changing for a muffled sound,it,s too late. i swirl for like 8 to 10 seconds max.

then,the boolits must be entirely drydrydry before the baking part.boolits shouldn't stick to your fingers at all. i'm using a fan ,then i leave the tray on the oven top to preheat them ; the drying process isn't very long...10 minutes with the fan and the oven top is all it takes for getting the boolits compoletely dry .then, wit MY oven,i bake for 13 minutes at 400f.

the way i'm doin it,it can't fail.

it is normal for the 1st layer to be kind of pale during the cooking time.but then,when you pull tem off the oven,you can see the color .

[shanep]

you must use 1ml of mixture for 1 pound of boolits. mixture ratio should be a diluted mix like in 120 ml of acetone for 20 grams of powder,or ,like i do ,55 ml of acetone for 10 grams of powder .

then you must want to swirl the whole batch to make sure all the boolits went in contact with the jiice,but you also must make sure you dump the boolits in the tray still WET....don't wait for the acetone to flash entirely.....when you hear the tumbling sound changing for a muffled sound,it,s too late. i swirl for like 8 to 10 seconds max.

then,the boolits must be entirely drydrydry before the baking part.boolits shouldn't stick to your fingers at all. i'm using a fan ,then i leave the tray on the oven top to preheat them ; the drying process isn't very long...10 minutes with the fan and the oven top is all it takes for getting the boolits compoletely dry .then, wit MY oven,i bake for 13 minutes at 400f.

the way i'm doin it,it can't fail.

it is normal for the 1st layer to be kind of pale during the cooking time.but then,when you pull tem off the oven,you can see the color .I did exactly that except I think they dried while shaking them. I left them in the oven for twelve minutes. I think it wad to much. They're good, but they look good too me. It'll take some practice, I'm not giving up. I've got more bullets and 500 pounds of lead lol. https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20180930/c010301a6db21f5da7692f984c27a495.jpg

Sent from my SM-G965U1 using Tapatalk

[shanep]

I did exactly that except I think they dried while shaking them. I left them in the oven for twelve minutes. I think it wad to much. They're good, but they look good too me. It'll take some practice, I'm not giving up. I've got more bullets and 500 pounds of lead lol. https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20180930/c010301a6db21f5da7692f984c27a495.jpg

Sent from my SM-G965U1 using Tapatalk4 coats, they past all the tests. And are smooth. So I'm just going to keep at it. What do ya'll think?https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20180930/f35458bd3f6078ae44c6061e31a00311.jpghttps://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20180930/5703c0587e1883b0a5dc3acaffc2fe22.jpghttps://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20180930/171faf58ada80292d624510a65b9d9c1.jpg

Sent from my SM-G965U1 using Tapatalk

[Ausglock]

Zombie green can be slightly "difficult". even slight overbake can cause colour shift.

[shanep]

Zombie green can be slightly "difficult". even slight overbake can cause colour shift.Yessir trail and error, I'll get it. They still look cool. I'm going to bake at a lower temperature and shorter intervals. That greagrey won't know the difference. Lol

Sent from my SM-G965U1 using Tapatalk

[Stephen Cohen]

shanep I would suggest one thing you should change, I suggest you wear closed footwear as a hot baked bullet between the toes is no joke. Ask how I know. Regards Stephen

[shanep]

shanep I would suggest one thing you should change, I suggest you wear closed footwear as a hot baked bullet between the toes is no joke. Ask how I know. Regards StephenYessir I have that bad habit, have to make myself when I cast. I wear boots all week and you're right. Never thought about a bullet falling. Lol that would suck.

Sent from my SM-G965U1 using Tapatalk

[Ausglock]

Only change one thing at a time. Keep your current temp, but reduce the bake time by 1 minute and see how it goes. if still a bit brown, reduce it by 30 seconds.

[shanep]

Only change one thing at a time. Keep your current temp, but reduce the bake time by 1 minute and see how it goes. if still a bit brown, reduce it by 30 seconds.Ok

Sent from my SM-G965U1 using Tapatalk

[glockfan]

I did exactly that except I think they dried while shaking them. I left them in the oven for twelve minutes. I think it wad to much. They're good, but they look good too me. It'll take some practice, I'm not giving up. I've got more bullets and 500 pounds of lead lol. https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20180930/c010301a6db21f5da7692f984c27a495.jpg

Sent from my SM-G965U1 using Tapatalk

something to consider is covering the elements with the crumb catcher that comes with the oven. that way, you're getting a radiant heat which is what is needed with hi tek. i've seen that the direct heat on the boolits can ''burn''' the color after less that the recommanded cooking time.

[shanep]

something to consider is covering the elements with the crumb catcher that comes with the oven. that way, you're getting a radiant heat which is what is needed with hi tek. i've seen that the direct heat on the boolits can ''burn''' the color after less that the recommanded cooking time.That's a good idea

Sent from my SM-G965U1 using Tapatalk

[dikman]

You sure you've got Zombie Green? They look like a good match for Bronze.;)
Where are you placing the tray in the oven? Do not put it too close to the heating element as too high a temp will cause the colour to darken. How sure are you that the temp is correct?

[shanep]

You sure you've got Zombie Green? They look like a good match for Bronze.;)
Where are you placing the tray in the oven? Do not put it too close to the heating element as too high a temp will cause the colour to darken. How sure are you that the temp is correct?It's a small oven, I did what glockfan told me and covered them this time. They come out pretty good. https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20180930/4361819fdad1eef310d2fdde7d73e192.jpg

Sent from my SM-G965U1 using Tapatalk

[Ausglock]

That's better....

[eljefeoz]

Has anyone used this to resize the cartridge cases? I know there are spray lubes to do this. Just wondering if someone has experimented with Aqualube for that particular use.


I did about 200 .223 cases. had one stuck.
have also done a couple of kgs of .223 RCBS 55 gr at a BHN of 14-16. No hitches in sizing and GC seating

[HI-TEK]

It's a small oven, I did what glockfan told me and covered them this time. They come out pretty good. https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20180930/4361819fdad1eef310d2fdde7d73e192.jpg

Sent from my SM-G965U1 using Tapatalk

shanep
They look much better and closer to correct colour.
Finish seems a little granular, that is normally caused by over shake coating for too long.
Once you add coating mixture, shake coat quickly and for just long enough to use up coating, (10-15 seconds).
If coating becomes tacky, it will start to start sticking and produces such finish.
During drying and baking, these type of surfaces will not flow out smooth.

The other way a rough finish may occur is the coated alloy was just not quite baked long enough.
When re-coating an under cured coating, the solvent starts to dissolve/strip off previously under cured coating, and this will form a rough finish.
If this all is finally baked the coating can produce such a granular finish.

Next step is simply to size one or two, this will take off surface lumps and should leave a glassy finish without the body of the coating being removed.

Do not be concerned if you over bake, and if colour changes. The coating has been baked for days at 200C, it turns out Black but coating performs well.

[glockfan]

It's a small oven, I did what glockfan told me and covered them this time. They come out pretty good. https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20180930/4361819fdad1eef310d2fdde7d73e192.jpg

Sent from my SM-G965U1 using Tapatalk

that is much better shanep! the color is poping good.

[shanep]

shanep
They look much better and closer to correct colour.
Finish seems a little granular, that is normally caused by over shake coating for too long.
Once you add coating mixture, shake coat quickly and for just long enough to use up coating, (10-15 seconds).
If coating becomes tacky, it will start to start sticking and produces such finish.
During drying and baking, these type of surfaces will not flow out smooth.

The other way a rough finish may occur is the coated alloy was just not quite baked long enough.
When re-coating an under cured coating, the solvent starts to dissolve/strip off previously under cured coating, and this will form a rough finish.
If this all is finally baked the coating can produce such a granular finish.

Next step is simply to size one or two, this will take off surface lumps and should leave a glassy finish without the body of the coating being removed.

Do not be concerned if you over bake, and if colour changes. The coating has been baked for days at 200C, it turns out Black but coating performs well.Thanks they were patchy, in going to cast some this week and give it another run. Im getting closer,

Sent from my SM-G965U1 using Tapatalk

[shanep]

that is much better shanep! the color is poping good.Thank you for all your help

Sent from my SM-G965U1 using Tapatalk

[Petander]

something to consider is covering the elements with the crumb catcher that comes with the oven. that way, you're getting a radiant heat which is what is needed with hi tek. i've seen that the direct heat on the boolits can ''burn''' the color after less that the recommanded cooking time.

I have been using IR thermometers (yes plural) to measure actual boolits. When the oven thermometers (yes,plural) read 200C,the bullets actually hit 220C. That must be because of direct heat.

I'm on my third oven now,the same is still happening. So I have adjusted to 190C. The latest big household oven has strong fans and there really is a cyclone in there. Still the bullets get hotter than the oven.

[Ausglock]

My converted Wall oven is set at 200Deg C. The bullets (after 71/2 minutes) are 204 Deg C as shot by an IR Therm.
The oven has a heating element around the internal fan and the over head element working. 2 trays. one on the bottom shelf and another on the middle shelf. If I use the top shelf, I get darkened bullets.

[Petander]

If I use the top shelf, I get darkened bullets.

This makes sense and it's definitely worth trying a lower shelf. My slightly overbaked bullets are perfectly good,though. I messed up pretty good with underbaking when I started this (not doing the acetone test properly),now I rather overbake a little.

[HI-TEK]

I have been using IR thermometers (yes plural) to measure actual boolits. When the oven thermometers (yes,plural) read 200C,the bullets actually hit 220C. That must be because of direct heat.

I'm on my third oven now,the same is still happening. So I have adjusted to 190C. The latest big household oven has strong fans and there really is a cyclone in there. Still the bullets get hotter than the oven.

Petander,
If your bullets are coming out hotter that oven temperature it may be due to cycling effect of thermostats.
Some thermostats are able to cycle plus or minus 50C. They turn on 50 below set temperature and turn off 50 above set temperature. Essentially this is supposedly averaging at 200C.
If your thermostat is working OK, if the heating elements are not directly fanned to remove heat from them, than I suspect infra Red heat may be causing over heating of the metal.
It is not logical that oven air is at 200C but bullets are hotter.
If it is not the thermostat losing control, then it must be Infra Red energy causing over heating.

[rcslotcar]

Hi, I have a question. I have used HI TEC for 9mm,40 and 45acp with great results. I just starting casting 165 gr 7mm bullets with a gas check design. Can I,Should I use the gas check after coating the bullets or forget the gas check. Thanks!

[eljefeoz]

I coat 145 gr RCBS SIL and 160 gr SAECO for the 7x57. 2 coats of HITEK, check with actone rub and smash test , then seat GC and size.
HTH

[HI-TEK]

Hi, I have a question. I have used HI TEC for 9mm,40 and 45acp with great results. I just starting casting 165 gr 7mm bullets with a gas check design. Can I,Should I use the gas check after coating the bullets or forget the gas check. Thanks!



rcslotcar
That is a great question. There are many variables. First, what alloy are you using?
Second, what velocity are you expecting to achieve?
Gas checks are normally used to prevent Gas cutting of Lead especially with hot powders.
Coating before or after gas check will work.
Can you supply more details please.

[rcslotcar]

i'm using coww's with a very little tin added, brindle hardness around 19-20. Powder I've been using for Sierra 168gr bt hp is 68 gr of Hodgon 4831sc. This has been my max load from my Remington 700 which is very accurate. I was thinking to load down to about 60-63 gr for cast coated bullets maybe around 2500-2600fps. Again I haven't shot any cast 7mm yet, just trying to get knowledge before I put components together. I haven't shot "any" cast bullets thru my rifles (223-270-308-338win).

[Stephen Cohen]

Hi, I have a question. I have used HI TEC for 9mm,40 and 45acp with great results. I just starting casting 165 gr 7mm bullets with a gas check design. Can I,Should I use the gas check after coating the bullets or forget the gas check. Thanks!

I would try with and without gas checks just to see how each perform, There are a few variables as others have said but velocity nearly always plays a part. I use gas checks on all my rifle loads except for my 357 max Martini which will not shoot as well with checks and prefers plain base. I would check that the checks fit after coating and fit them after coating especially if you use Aluminium checks as the coating does not stick well them but sticks well to copper. Regards Stephen

[HI-TEK]

i'm using coww's with a very little tin, brindle hardness around 19-20. Powder I've been using for Sierra 168gr bt hp is 68 gr of Hodgen 4831sc. This has been my max load from my Remington 700 which is very accurate. I was thinking to load down to about 60-63 gr for cast coated bullets maybe around 2600fps. Again I haven't shot any cast 7mm yet, just trying to get knowledge before I put components together. I haven shot any cast bullets thru my rifles (223-270-308-338win).

rcslotcar
coww's can present problems. Hardness for the speeds you are shooting may be also a problem. I am not sure, but some already shot hard alloys but I think they may have been harder than yours. May be others can advise on these matters.

Also, some wheel weights have impurities, that can cause adhesion problems with coating.
I don't know if you have been following this thread long, but another guy has all sorts of coating problems using mystery alloys.
He solved coating problems by casting, then soaking casts in Hydrochloric acid/water mix, to remove reactive surface metals. The coating then bonds extremely well after washing with water and drying first.
It is not the coating that fails, it is the alloy that may fail if not correct things are done first. Keep in mind, the coatings are a way of separating bore and alloy.
Coating cannot fix engineering problems. It cannot be compared to Jacketed ammo requirements.

[rcslotcar]

I did read for several hours and remember the pictures. I have several 22 pound ingots of lyman #2 do you think this would work out better? Thanks guys for the replies. I also have tin to add if necessary.

[glockfan]

My converted Wall oven is set at 200Deg C. The bullets (after 71/2 minutes) are 204 Deg C as shot by an IR Therm.
The oven has a heating element around the internal fan and the over head element working. 2 trays. one on the bottom shelf and another on the middle shelf. If I use the top shelf, I get darkened bullets.

on this specific topic,i must add that i don't use the the oven top element.only the one on the bottom. yours being larger and of higher quality,having dual fans working is probably helping at not getting a direct heat on the boolits,even if the elements aren't covered . on my black'n 'decker , there's only one fan,and if i use the top element, i'm getting burnt color...now,i could cover the top element with some foil or else, but i can fit only one tray in anyways.....those little ovens......you can't really bake more than 16 to 20 pounds of boolits at once,because it would be overloaded .

[pkchwy]

Does anyone have Photos of how large Pullet company do there coating

[Spaceball]

This is the best video so far of a commercial company doing coating. So good trick and hints in the video.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RnBVfGzwyuM

[pkchwy]

This is the best video so far of a commercial company doing coating. So good trick and hints in the video.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RnBVfGzwyuM

thanks heaps

[Ausglock]

This is the best video so far of a commercial company doing coating. So good trick and hints in the video.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RnBVfGzwyuM

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA ..... Best??? HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA.
Yeah.... right....

[glockfan]

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA ..... Best??? HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA.
Yeah.... right....

trevor...these guys are cutting their own moulds.....seems likke they get a -+ 2 grains differential in their boolit production......the tall guy is the machinist, and he cuts the molds.....i heard about'em couple months ago. i even think about contacting them to see if i could get some of their magic molds. will see because you know what .....otherwise,their hi tek process is pretty much what we're all doin ,nothing special there.......but their moulds.....wheeew.they nailed this part of the whole process of boolit making.

[Ausglock]

The mold maker is Mike Sand. His old man is (was) Ballisti-cast.
Mike Was 1/2 of Hardline molds. I have a few of his molds and they are top notch.
Hardline fell apart due to internal friction between the partners (from what I gather)
The dude doing the coating is mixing the powder (and spilling more than he uses) and appears to use it to coat instantly after mixing the powder with the acetone. A huge NO NO!!!!!!!
The only thing I like in the video is his oven.

[glockfan]

The mold maker is Mike Sand. His old man is (was) Ballisti-cast.
Mike Was 1/2 of Hardline molds. I have a few of his molds and they are top notch.
Hardline fell apart due to internal friction between the partners (from what I gather)
The dude doing the coating is mixing the powder (and spilling more than he uses) and appears to use it to coat instantly after mixing the powder with the acetone. A huge NO NO!!!!!!!
The only thing I like in the video is his oven.

ok then.......it explains the fact they're using ballisticast machinery lol.

i tried to find their company,but the name is now for sale....seems like their start up fell apart.

i'm slowly learning that the key for good boolits is the molds.having a machinist well focused on cutting the best possible molds is a huge +.

[wlkjr]

The mold maker is Mike Sand. His old man is (was) Ballisti-cast.
Mike Was 1/2 of Hardline molds. I have a few of his molds and they are top notch.
Hardline fell apart due to internal friction between the partners (from what I gather)
The dude doing the coating is mixing the powder (and spilling more than he uses) and appears to use it to coat instantly after mixing the powder with the acetone. A huge NO NO!!!!!!!
The only thing I like in the video is his oven.

I tried to go to their website and it is for sale. Apparently out of business.

[Tazza]

I'm happy with my magma moulds. I don't do loads of casting, but they work great when i dust them off for use

[HI-TEK]

I tried to go to their website and it is for sale. Apparently out of business.


I may be wrong, but I think Mike Sand may be at Prairie Firearms.

[Petander]

I don't know if you have been following this thread long, but another guy has all sorts of coating problems using mystery alloys.
He solved coating problems by casting, then soaking casts in Hydrochloric acid/water mix, to remove reactive surface metals. The coating then bonds extremely well after washing with water and drying first.
It is not the coating that fails, it is the alloy that may fail if not correct things are done first.

That "Another Guy" would be me. :)

HCL works great with my alloy,it cleans impurities from the bullet surface. Soaking is not a big job at all. I have a ton of alloy from the past and now I can use it.

228272

[glockfan]

That "Another Guy" would be me. :)



228272


maaan....the 45-70 must be eating a lot of your lead . i'm guessing 350 grain boolits rip off one pound of lead in 4-5 pours....

ui'm still trying to figure out a lead catcher without having to mine berms ,so i can get my lead back to me LOL.

[Ausglock]

maaan....the 45-70 must be eating a lot of your lead . i'm guessing 350 grain boolits rip off one pound of lead in 4-5 pours....

ui'm still trying to figure out a lead catcher without having to mine berms ,so i can get my lead back to me LOL.

You need to build a bullet trap that uses an empty Oxy bottle and some steel plate. I have an empty beer gas bottle to make one when I get around to it.

[ioon44]

For bullet traps I use plastic 5 gal buckets with ground up rubber placed on as stand and shoot into the lid of the bucket. I catch 30 lbs to 40 lbs of bullets before the buckets need to be repaired and the lid replaced.

After cleaning out the traps I find the Hi-Tek coated bullets still have the coating intact if they didn't hit another bullet.

[pkchwy]

is there a trick to fill up the lube groves with hi teck coating

[Ausglock]

is there a trick to fill up the lube groves with hi teck coating

If you have full coverage in the groove, you are using too much coating.

[Petander]

maaan....the 45-70 must be eating a lot of your lead . i'm guessing 350 grain boolits rip off one pound of lead in 4-5 pours....

ui'm still trying to figure out a lead catcher without having to mine berms ,so i can get my lead back to me LOL.

I'm still mining,too. Except a pistol range where we have catchers.

And those are 480 grain 458 Socom rounds in the pic...

[Flintlockrecord]

228301228302228303228304This my first foray into Hitek coating.I have followed this thread for a long time and read every posting. Thanks to everyone who has contributed.
My oven is a domestic wall oven but the bottom element doesn't work. I tried doing 2.5kg at a time but the temperature drop was too much so next batch I reduced to 2kg per time. and it seems to be good.
If you follow the instruction exactly you will have success.

[Flintlockrecord]

I put the 2 fire bricks in the bottom of the oven to act as a heat sink. Seems to help with heat loss. Temperature still drops from 200deg to about 175 when a new tray of boolits is put in but recovers at about 5min.
I am measuring temp with a BBQ thermometer that has a boolit fitted over the probe.

[Tazza]

I too am trying to coat my lube groves, it's only for looks, as they dont touch the barrel so don't need covering.

I did find using a thinner mixture did get into the grooves better. I possibly am using more than i need, but the end results look pretty nice. From my rough calculations, ill get a little over 100,000 projectiles coated with 1kg of powder. If i use more than is needed, but get good results, so be it. Best to spend a little extra and get a good product

[DDriller]

maaan....the 45-70 must be eating a lot of your lead . i'm guessing 350 grain boolits rip off one pound of lead in 4-5 pours....

ui'm still trying to figure out a lead catcher without having to mine berms ,so i can get my lead back to me LOL.

Looks like a 458 SOCOM to me. Great round!

[Ausglock]

I put the 2 fire bricks in the bottom of the oven to act as a heat sink. Seems to help with heat loss. Temperature still drops from 200deg to about 175 when a new tray of boolits is put in but recovers at about 5min.
I am measuring temp with a BBQ thermometer that has a boolit fitted over the probe.

Your oven is similar to mine. Do you have an element around the fan at the back? Is there an element at the top? I run both these elements and do 2 trays of 2.5kg each tray in 7 1/2 minutes. Those large brich will interfere with air flow under the tray. use thinner paver blocks and turn them so the run longways front to back with a gap between them.
https://i.imgur.com/tjbDsGE.jpg

[Flintlockrecord]

Not sure where the elements are. I'll try the bricks the other way.

[Petander]

You need to build a bullet trap that uses an empty Oxy bottle and some steel plate. I have an empty beer gas bottle to make one when I get around to it.

228324

[shanep]

What yall think, back at it again. 4 coats, still not shimmery or glossy. What can I do? The bucket I'm missing in is a pickle jug. I feel like the closing that stuck previously is coming off like little flakes. Could that be it? I'm a perfectionist, sooo lol thanks guys

Sent from my SM-G965U1 using Tapatalk

[shanep]

What yall think, back at it again. 4 coats, still not shimmery or glossy. What can I do? The bucket I'm missing in is a pickle jug. I feel like the closing that stuck previously is coming off like little flakes. Could that be it? I'm a perfectionist, sooo lol thanks guys

Sent from my SM-G965U1 using TapatalkHere's the picture. https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20181006/1f5721b1567564545344c161d4adfb5b.jpg

Sent from my SM-G965U1 using Tapatalk

[Ausglock]

I think you r swirling for too long. it looks "grainy"
Add coating and swirl for like 12 seconds only, then dump them onto the tray to dry.

[shanep]

I think you r swirling for too long. it looks "grainy"
Add coating and swirl for like 12 seconds only, then dump them onto the tray to dry.Yessir, also they're not paying the acetone test.

Sent from my SM-G965U1 using Tapatalk

[HI-TEK]

Here's the picture. https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20181006/1f5721b1567564545344c161d4adfb5b.jpg

Sent from my SM-G965U1 using Tapatalk

shanep
Aside from possibly shake coating for too long, you may be using too much coating mixture.
I say this, as you are having coating flakes that are drying in your coating bucket flaking off, a excess residue remaining, that was not used up coating your projectiles.

When you add coating mixture, this should dissolve the dry stuff that is in your bucket .


If you have a build up of coating in your bucket, you can simply add only a little Acetone to your coating bucket with your next lot, then, mix/coat, and this should use up residues left in your coating bucket and be regarded as a first coat/primer.
Don't worry if it is blotchy and uneven. Simply mix/shake coat to use up solvent and residue, then dump it to dry before it gets tacky.

If you get it to a tacky stage, don't worry, just add a small amount of Acetone in again, swirl coat, and this time don't swirl coat for as long so that it does not become tacky.


Some, simply wash out their coating container, and use that for making up coating mixture.

Please consider, that the coating can be recycled back into use after it has dried. The coating cannot be recycled after it is heat set.

[shanep]

shanep
Aside from possibly shake coating for too long, you may be using too much coating mixture.
I say this, as you are having coating flakes that are drying in your coating bucket flaking off, a excess residue remaining, that was not used up coating your projectiles.

When you add coating mixture, this should dissolve the dry stuff that is in your bucket .


If you have a build up of coating in your bucket, you can simply add only a little Acetone to your coating bucket with your next lot, then, mix/coat, and this should use up residues left in your coating bucket and be regarded as a first coat/primer.
Don't worry if it is blotchy and uneven. Simply mix/shake coat to use up solvent and residue, then dump it to dry before it gets tacky.

If you get it to a tacky stage, don't worry, just add a small amount of Acetone in again, swirl coat, and this time don't swirl coat for as long so that it does not become tacky.


Some, simply wash out their coating container, and use that for making up coating mixture.

Please consider, that the coating can be recycled back into use after it has dried. The coating cannot be recycled after it is heat set.I started cleaning my bucket, but will do your method instead of just dumping left over residue. I think it was a few different of each, the residue which was just an oversite on my part. Noticed in videos I've watch a dozen time a day their bucket was clean each time. Then I was covering my tray like you had said and I don't believe I was doing a thorough bake, so I uncovered and baby say it every 2 1/2 minutes i'd shake and turn and now they're passing both tests again. So tomorrow I'll cast some more after I shoot some of these to reward myself for my labors. Lol can I size these in my lyman lubrasizer, which will probably get live on them? I don't have a single stage sizer for this bullet other than on my lubrasizer. It might not get any lube on them but if it does will it hurry. Thanks for all your help!!

Sent from my SM-G965U1 using Tapatalk

[shanep]

Getting lube on a bullet your going to reload and shoot is no big deal. It's just going to smoke a little. Getting lube on a bullet you intend to re-coat is a problem as it will cause adhesion issues.Thank you, I figured it would be ok.

Sent from my SM-G965U1 using Tapatalk

[Ausglock]

You might find that the Lyman Sizer die will tear off some coating. Mine did. The holes where the lube comes out were the problem. That is why I went to Lee sizer dies.
You should see the coating buildup in my hand swirling bucket. Huge!!!! It is like 1/8" thick around the sides. The machine swirler buckets get cleaned every 10,000 bullets.

[shanep]

You might find that the Lyman Sizer die will tear off some coating. Mine did. The holes where the lube comes out were the problem. That is why I went to Lee sizer dies.
You should see the coating buildup in my hand swirling bucket. Huge!!!! It is like 1/8" thick around the sides. The machine swirler buckets get cleaned every 10,000 bullets.I ordered one last night for the lee sizer. I didn't have one for the lubrasizer.

Sent from my SM-G965U1 using Tapatalk

[Grmps]

You might find that the Lyman Sizer die will tear off some coating. Mine did. The holes where the lube comes out were the problem. That is why I went to Lee sizer dies.
You should see the coating buildup in my hand swirling bucket. Huge!!!! It is like 1/8" thick around the sides. The machine swirler buckets get cleaned every 10,000 bullets.

But you're not running un-cooked boolits through the sizer are you?

I prefer NOE sizers, after the initial outlay for the Push Through Size Die Body ($39.95 ) the sizing bushings are $9.75 and the pushrods are $7.50 (only need one per caliber and you can use Lee's. Much larger size selection

http://noebulletmolds.com/NV/index.php?cPath=104

[Petander]

What does the jury say,is this acetone wipe test fail or not?

Seriously overbaked Zombie green,I even gave it another 30 min. My tin rich WW/Monotype Mystery Alloy does this with ZG.

228414

[shanep]

What does the jury say,is this acetone wipe test fail or not?

Seriously overbaked Zombie green,I even gave it another 30 min. My tin rich WW/Monotype Mystery Alloy does this with ZG.

228414I'm new to this but am also using zombie green. I'd say yes but not bad, and they overcooked. They say zg is hard to get. I'm still trying cause either they're burnt or grainy. https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20181007/50c905fb51732d2d7ee80e69fc7472a4.jpghttps://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20181007/a1af1021f072bdb323f002b413f871d8.jpghttps://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20181007/bbc16bca1e204cc26e8c7ff97ea79f0b.jpg

Sent from my SM-G965U1 using Tapatalk

[pkchwy]

I currently use a Magma Star Lube-sizer to do my lubbing and now that i have just used the high tec coating on a heap of projectiles. i wanted to now if i can use my Magma Star Lube-sizer with out lube to side the projectiles or do i need to buy other equipmnt

[Grmps]

shanep -- I think you need to re-start at the beginning

burnt is from over baking, grainy is from tumbling to long.

Have a couple boolits in the bottle you mix the solution in
after you mix the solution, let it rest/incorporate for at least 30 min
rule of thumb, use 1 mil solution to 1 pound of boolits, less in the first time around, - this helps with adhesion (make sure you adjitate the solution well immediately prior to measureing and adding to the boolits (the solution settles fast)


1) confirm oven temperature: Place a tested oven thermometer in the middle of the shelf you bake on and adjust the oven until the thermometer reads 400°
2) they look grainy to me, -- you are tumbling too long -- Shake/swirl 15 – 20 seconds MAX if the sound changes, you've gone to long. it/s OK to dump them damp
3) make sure they are COMPLETELY dry before baking dry in front of a fan (it helps to warm them on a grate on top of your oven for 12 min before baking)
https://i.imgur.com/crLXuxC.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/tPRKAFZ.png

4) bake for a full 12 min (cover the bottom of your oven with something that retains heat I use ceramic BBQ briquettes, some use firebrick or chunks of metal -- this helps the oven get back to temperature faster.

[dikman]

Shanep, do they pass the smash test?

[shanep]

Shanep, do they pass the smash test?At first no, but I bake them longer and that fixed that. I'm probably going to start completely over, remix everything.

Sent from my SM-G965U1 using Tapatalk

[dikman]

I think that's a good idea. Remember, thin coats! My last failure (some time ago) was due to making the coats too thick. They looked good but flaked badly when flattened, I had to remelt the lot.

I hadn't coated any for quite a while as I have several thousand coated projectiles stored, but the other day I just felt like doing some casting. I figured I might as well coat them too, so the next day away I went. Two coats of Texas Tea, one batch I did three coats just to see what they looked like but two coats is perfectly functional. Because I experimented with very thin coats they came out slightly splotchy looking but passed the smash test (most important). Another 1120 to add to the collection.

[razorfish]

I currently use a Magma Star Lube-sizer to do my lubbing and now that i have just used the high tec coating on a heap of projectiles. i wanted to now if i can use my Magma Star Lube-sizer with out lube to side the projectiles or do i need to buy other equipmnt

I use my Star Lubri-Sizer to size my coated bullets. Works great. Mine hasn’t seen lube in years.

[rcslotcar]

My reloading shop has an old RCBS sizer for $30 that is all greased up but in complete condition. I'm going to pick it up just to size coated bullets.

[ioon44]

The lube holes in the Lyman & RCBS lube sizer's tend to cut the coating on cast bullets. Maybe some one can add more info on this, I size all my coated bullets on a Star sizer with the lube arm removed.

[Jatz357]

The lube holes in the Lyman & RCBS lube sizer's tend to cut the coating on cast bullets. Maybe some one can add more info on this, I size all my coated bullets on a Star sizer with the lube arm removed.

I’ve come across this issue with another brand of sizing die, the lube holes were removing thin lines of coating. I used a small cotton wad with some metal / chrome polish, same stuff you use to shine mag wheels. Used a drill and polished the die similar to honing out a bore but only polishing. Also ran drill in reverse. Didn’t need much at all just enough to remove any burrs or sharp edges. The finish on the projectiles was so much better and no more scratches

[Gremlin460]

<--- Walks in, looks around, smiles, walks back out.

[Ausglock]

The best sizing dies available anywhere in the world are made by Lathesmith, A member here on this forum. The short dies are what I use in the magma Sizemaster.
Also used by commercial manufacturers.
Contact him for pricing.

[Michael J. Spangler]

The results of our seminar.
As one member put it. Hi Tek stole the stage on this event

https://www.northeastshooters.com/xen/threads/2018-cast-bullet-seminar-sign-up-thread.358267/

[HI-TEK]

[QUOTE=Michael J. Spangler;4478213]The results of our seminar.
As one member put it. Hi Tek stole the stage on this event


Well done Michael,
May be you should do more such seminars, that will also empower hobbyists with being confident with casting their own.
Hi-Tek

[Michael J. Spangler]

[QUOTE=Michael J. Spangler;4478213]The results of our seminar.
As one member put it. Hi Tek stole the stage on this event


Well done Michael,
May be you should do more such seminars, that will also empower hobbyists with being confident with casting their own.
H-Tek

Thanks Joe

Thats the whole reason for this. Some guys just don't have the confidence. Casting like reloading can be pretty intimidating when you read about it. We all know it's not rocket surgery.
As we went through the day and guys worked their way to the furnaces to cast, I would watch over their shoulders and once they poured their first mould full I would say "there you go, now you're officially a bullet caster" It's that simple.
The best part is guys walking away with confidence and with bullets ready to shoot. Everyone walked away with samples of bullet lube from white label lubes and a 100 ML container of mixed up hi-tek 1035 gold to start coating on their own.
I think we have a bunch of converts today.

Thank you again Joe for the support and the great product. It really instils confidence in new casters to make the jump knowing they won't have issues with leading

[Tazza]

At first i was unsure with how it would work for me too, as i already had my process that worked for me. After this thread and a few chats with Joe, i was all set to give it a go.

I started off with a coating i got off an industrial coating joint. I was unsure how THAT would work as first, i finally got the courage to give it a go then got my application sorted out and never looked back, well, until i needed to buy more at an outrageous cost.

Changing to a different method has taken some doing, but it works and works well, i just need to up the scale as putting them in a plastic bottle and shaking the poop out of it does wear my arms out a bit with doing large batches, there is no real consistency with me doing it this way vs others that tumble them to coat, easy and repeatable results.

So far the results are really good, i haven't been able to test it in an open gun yet, as after 3 years, i still don't have a replacement barrel for it to give it a really good test with my allow mixture to see how it holds up to the extra speed.

I am and have always been a huge supporter of coated lead.

[OldBearHair]

Hey Joe (Mr HiTek) How about this ? Another use for Hi tek coating. This knife is hand forged from 5160 steel which will rust very easily. This Hi-Tek coating has stopped the rusting issue. Only time and actual usage will tell. Did it with my heat gun.
As you can tell it is Old Gold.

[Ausglock]

i haven't been able to test it in an open gun yet, as after 3 years, i still don't have a replacement barrel for it to give it a really good test with my allow mixture to see how it holds up to the extra speed.

Tazza. What sort of barrel you after? Trubor?

[Tazza]

It's a victor precision gun, he used a sheumann hybricomp. He can't get them anymore, but easily bought in the usa, the dood that makes them has no export license.

I got tied up in the aussie copper projectile thingo. I paid him to get me one.... 2 years ago

[HI-TEK]

Hey Joe (Mr HiTek) How about this ? Another use for Hi tek coating. This knife is hand forged from 5160 steel which will rust very easily. This Hi-Tek coating has stopped the rusting issue. Only time and actual usage will tell. Did it with my heat gun.
As you can tell it is Old Gold.



Hello OldBearHair,
That is a good test also. You would have had to heat the blade and coating very hot to set coating.
Before I was making coatings for cast, I was making a coating that would be used by industry. Some of these, required to have quite extensive and some nasty anti-corrosive additives, that guaranteed salt spray test results against corrosion.
It is a cut throat market where competitors constantly tried to out do each other for limited sales.
I did make some heat bonded coatings, that were used by mines for underground work, where all assembly components not only were protected against rusting, but coatings had to be electrically conductive to eliminate static build up that could cause a spark and a possible explosion.
Again, this was a very competitive area, and all products had to meet/ & pass many tests, which cost a bomb, and for very low returns.
Essentially, if you coat steel, and with coatings that prevent Water and Oxygen contact to Steel, it should certainly reduce rusting.
None of the Hi-Tek coatings now contain these anti corrosive agents. They are simply not needed.

[OldBearHair]

"Hello OldBearHair,
That is a good test also. You would have had to heat the blade and coating very hot to set coating." Thanks for the information.... ... While heating the knife it got up to 400 to 450 degrees F. which is about where it was tempered at. So now the knife has been tempered the third time. The coating looks a tad bit over baked and has interesting patterns that do not show in the picture. Conjured up in my mind how the process could be done by taping a pattern for the old Gold coating and do it again covering the old Gold with tape and using Zombie Green, and then it would be camoflage. Like opening up another "can of worms". LOL

[Grmps]

You could "paint" a pattern on it with hi-temp grease or? so the hitek wouldn't stick there.

[Ausglock]

It's a victor precision gun, he used a sheumann hybricomp. He can't get them anymore, but easily bought in the usa, the dood that makes them has no export license.

I got tied up in the aussie copper projectile thingo. I paid him to get me one.... 2 years ago

ACP was a pox on the shooting community.
Why not get Vic to fit a Pulver barrel with one of his new VP comps he is now making?

[Tazza]

It may have to come to that eventually :( it already has a titanium comp that worked really well.

The slide was cut for the 4 ports before the comp, i ideally wanted the same to go back in it to keep it looking fancy. There is something said for keeping major components stock, so if anything was to happen, you can get another drop in replacement. If it didn't have that rib on the top, any other barrel would do the trick.
http://www.schuemann.com/Portals/0/CVStoreImages/GP-even-ports_400.png

Yeah, it's one way to get your name known isn't it? I thought i got it bad, but there was another guy that got done for a dillon 1050 plus accessories, about 2.5k. He keeps saying that it's gonna happen, but i'm not holding my breath. A dood i shoot with, his wife is a customs broker, she is hopefully going to see if she can do something.

[dansedgli]

Send Brian at goodbuymate.com an email and see if he can post you a barrel.

He is a freight forwarder I have been using with good success.

[Tazza]

Thanks for the lead, i'll send him an email, see if he can help out or not.

[Ausglock]

Dan. He wouldn't get me a Delta Point pro. Said the customs were cracking down.

[Tazza]

Sounds like i might be out of luck, we'll see what had says i guess

[Tazza]

As expected, Brian was unable to assist :(

[Ausglock]

Bugger...

[dansedgli]

****, he must be backing off. He got me a deltapoint pro about 6 months ago.

[Tazza]

A red dot is a little less restricted than a barrel though, so it does make sense, as sad as it makes me :(