simple Hi-Tek coating

[jmort]

It the end, now matter how much arm chair "activity," I eventually pull the trigger and get "... my hands to play with (it) to get full scoop for me." No substitute for action.

[Love Life]

<-----beating his chest, grunting, and looking for something to smash.

[Liberty'sSon]

My wife has a convection oven she uses to bake polymer clay, a synthetic crafting clay. She wants to know if baking this stuff leaves any lingering odors in the oven. Janet told me I could use her oven if the coating won't stink up the oven and the smell get on her polymer clay.


Anybody have any feedback on that?




Did y'all notice the thread now has 'Sticky' status? Thanks, Willy!![smilie=w:

Jim, I just went and did a sniff test on my converction oven that has only been used for this process. My sniffer aint great but I did detect a kinda burnt hair smell. Probably not what you wanted to hear, but I bet its better than an unhappy wife. Everybody know if momma ain't happy, ain't nobody happy.

[Jim]

Jim, I just went and did a sniff test on my converction oven that has only been used for this process. My sniffer aint great but I did detect a kinda burnt hair smell. Probably not what you wanted to hear, but I bet its better than an unhappy wife. Everybody know if momma ain't happy, ain't nobody happy.

I'd much rather err on the side of caution. If there's any, even remote, chance that the smell from this process is going to linger, I sure don't want that imparted into Janet's polymer clay jewelry. Ladies don't like stinky jewelry.

Thanks, LS, do 'preciate the feed back!

Now, the search for an economical convection oven will commence.

[kweidner]

5-5-1 refers to 5 parts poly, 5 parts acetone and one part catalyst. some are thinning to even 6 and 7 parts acetone but they are running harder bullets than I am. I have had no luck thinning with softer bullets. With 45 acp pressures I could probably get away with 2 coats, with higher pressure stuff and soft lead it takes more product. Just FYI. I found the gold much easier to read and dial in heat wise. The black is not as telling. In the very beginning I was over baking. Had I started woth the gold that prbably wouldn't have happened. The gold will tell you really quick if you put too much time or heat on them. They turn more brown instead of gold. Hard to see that as easily on the black.
Once I got my times dialed in with the amount of alloy my oven could handle all is well. I have two small oster convections. They too use forced air heat but can only heat and hold about 5 lbs of alloy to prper temp at a time. In other words I am baking 4-500 boolits at a time with both running. I can do roughly 1000 coated 3 times and sized in little over an hour.

[kcinnick]

The standard formula is 5 parts color, 5 parts solvent (I use denatured alcohol), 1 part catalyst. Directions are provided with purchase of the coating. Some trial and error is involved since each oven is different. I have the directions in PDF somewhere... but I learned more on the phone talking to end users in Australia. If you have any questions let us know. I have been using the coating for about a year, some of the first bullets were loaded on Donnie's press and tested with my M&P.

[gunoil]

i dont smell it either jim, but iam skeeered for ya. Odors may appear, even though we cant smell,, chemistry is strange.

We are a HTS sticky, yay! Thanks.

"its shake and bake mama"

Leadman, one member had sized and gas checked after HTS.
jmortimer: its easy and tons of fun, no smoke, straight shot, clean dies,etc..

Buy the 36$+fedex (1/2) kit donnie sales. Convection toaster oven/mine at kmart.
Watch 1 & 2 below;
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NU7PbbtbAtE&feature=related

[Love Life]

A trip to the local wally world produced what I need. I will need to heat the measuring glass and a bend a pour spout into it, but other than that I'm set. I still have my metal mesh frames from prospecting and plenty of mesh and wood to make more drying and baking racks.

The oven was on sale for $34.99 and for $4.00 more I got me a 2 year replacement warranty.

Success!!!

[Love Life]

[QUOTE=gunoil;2302421]i dont smell it either jim, but iam skeeered for ya. Odors may appear, even though we cant smell,, chemistry is strange.

You can say chemistry is strange, but I say women have a better sense of smell...

[jmort]

Good on you guys for clarifying some of this. It makes more sense. I like the simplicity. No more questions until I am ready to spool-up. I'll just keep watching and learning. Thanks again.

[kdiver58]

All of these .. $35 ovens are toaster ovens I'm guessing? What kind of luck are people having using toaster ovens as opposed to convection ovens? BTW Donnie rocks , he's open to just about anything sale wise, 1/2 liter here , some of this , some of that ..

[Love Life]

It is counter top convection oven. I should have been more clear on that.

[jmort]

I was thinking "Easy Bake" but glad you clarified that. Looks like you are set for launch.

[Jim]

Black & Decker convection toaster oven (http://www.walmart.com/ip/Black-Decker-Convection-Toaster-Oven/15806194)at Wally World.

It's not huge, but I can afford it and it'll get me started.

[kweidner]

Her are the ones I use. Little bit more expensive but very accurate after first warm up. In other words on both of mine 375 is + or - 5 degrees. 76089

[SpotHound]

No FPS as have no chronograph, sorry (for the soup can load)

If you shake until tacky you will get a rough coat, I am shaking until covered and them dumping without going tacky.

The finish is mirror smooth then!

Also, initially I was shaking til very tacky to scoop up the colour from the mixing bowl, this just put nasty scrunge in the lube grooves.

I bake in the wifes oven, the smell goes away :)

[Love Life]

That's the one I got Jim.

[kweidner]

No FPS as have no chronograph, sorry (for the soup can load)

If you shake until tacky you will get a rough coat, I am shaking until covered and them dumping without going tacky.

The finish is mirror smooth then!

Also, initially I was shaking til very tacky to scoop up the colour from the mixing bowl, this just put nasty scrunge in the lube grooves.

I bake in the wifes oven, the smell goes away :)

Mine I use specifically for coating. Beware stainless will turn slightly brown from chemicals baking doing it a bunch. I have coated 8000 or so in my little ones and both have a slight brown tint on the stainless. My wife would beat the brakes off of me if I used hers. She does let me anneal my brass for swaging in hers as It gets cleaned in the process but The brass has to be spotless. My little ovens don't get that hot.

[Love Life]

WHEW! Finally done for the day. I got my racks built and cast up 40 pounds of 230 gr RN bullets. Tomorrow will be 358429 day.

[Ausglock]

G'day.
My stainless oven is now a brown colour around the door and the controls on the right side. The oven does smell of burnt snot. I would not do it in an oven used for food prep.

Make sure your coating mix bottles are PET plastic, or the mix could eat your plastic bottle. This is why I use 600ml coke bottles. The poptop caps on bottled water will screw on to Coke bottles. 10ml syringe with a long blunt needle is great for decanting the components. one syringe for each part keeps the housekeeping up to par.

Always put 2 bullets in the bottles of catalyst and colour resin to ensure they are mixed fully.

If you think the coating looks too good when you first apply the coating, then it is way too thick. Add 50% more acetone.

I have some photos to put up later of todays range shoot. Grouping at 25 yards is fantastic. 38 Super racegun at major power factor 125gr RN at 1350 FPS shot tight group from a sandbag.
I fired red, blue, green, Maroon, black, red/copper in all different loads and all different guns. This coating is bloody fantastic. There is no way in hell I will ever go back to messy lubes.
I even have 4 people today ask me to supply them with coated bullets.
Time to get serious about production.

Photos will be up later tonight. I have to process the RAW files.

[gunoil]

i know i feel better, away from handling all those lead bullets and alox. I have 800$ magma star coming next week. It has a heater and blue lube, i want be using ! Waited over 90 days. Dang discover card.

[Love Life]

Gunoil-Sell the star and put it towards your Super 1050!!

After loading today and not having to wipe out my dies or wipe off the loaded rds with mineral spirits I am happy. I will be shooting them tomorrow.

I think about all the wiping I did using traditional lube. Wipe the base after it comes out of the sizer, wipe the loaded rds off, clean the dies, waxy residue on my firearms after shooting, smoke, etc. Soon I shall be happier than a fat kid with a cupcake!!

[Ausglock]

The testing today went great.
All bullets were sized to .356.
All testing done at 25 yards on an IPSC Classic Target (all "A" Zone hits).
Note that the target patches are 1" in dia.
All testing done in a Kimber Stainless Target II in 38 Super.
And an SVI single stack Racegun with 4 port compensator in 38 Supercomp.

I also pumped the remaining rounds through a Para P (something) in 38 Super.
All up, over 200 rounds were fired with Zero leading in any gun.
I love this supercoat.

The New Black: Lee 125gr RNFP .358 sized down to .356

Black with normal catalyst shot well. Barrel clean and reasonably accurate. See pic 1. Average Velocity was 1150 FPS
76126
Black with extreme catalyst shot better. Barrel clean and accurate. See pic 2. Average Velocity was 1145 FPS
76127
Black with 2-Extreme catalyst shot great. Barrel clean and very accurate. See pic 3 Average Velocity was 1155 FPS
76128
The dog dick red shot great and very accurate. Barrel clean. Lee 120gr Con
The red/maroon was the same very good accuracy and clean. See pic 4 Average Velocity was 1147 FPS Lee 120gr Con
76129
The blue also shot great and was clean. See pic 5 Average Velocity was 1152 FPS Lee 120gr Con
76130
The blue/green was coated on a Lee 125gr Round nose bullet and fired from an SVI racegun at 1350FPS at major power factor.
These grouped bloody fantastic. See pic 6
76131
All the loads had 10 shots fired from a rest at the target and another 10 fired off hand to check for smoke.
All loads gave very little smoke. I was going to take photos of the smoke, but it wasn't worth it. Tried a few times, but the smoke would not show up on the photo. All you could see was sky.The only fouling in the barrels was powder fouling.
The 4 port compensator on the Racegun was clean with no lead buildup at all.

[leadman]

There is no way I would cure this coating in an oven used for food also. Don't know what is in the coating but just the acetone alone is a problem. I'll ask Donnie for an MSDS to see what the chemicals and precautions are, something I should have done earlier. I was a certified OSHA hazardous waste worker and was in a safety position with the city I worked for for awhile. Guess I have been retired too long (not) and forgot to ask for the MSDS.

For those looking to get on board with this product check out Goodwill, thrift stores, garage sales, etc. for your oven. I paid $3.99 at Goodwill for my convection oven. I already had a small toaster oven I had used for powder coating. The toaster oven works ok, just have to watch the cook time closer since it will start to darken the boolits under and over the heating elements quicker.

I tested some water quenched from the mold boolits today that had been coated 3 times. They came out the same 18BHN as some of the same batch that had not been coated. Nice to have a hardness tester that reads correctly now.

[jmort]

"I'll ask Donnie for an MSDS to see what the chemicals and precautions are, something I should have done earlier."

Good idea as users will breath and absorb it.

[MrWolf]

I know there was talk of using this on the .224 - has anyone actually tried it and what were the results? Interested to see how high fps's would go.

[kweidner]

I tested some water quenched from the mold boolits today that had been coated 3 times. They came out the same 18BHN as some of the same batch that had not been coated. Nice to have a hardness tester that reads correctly now.

They didn't soften? Nice to know we can waterdrop. Thats what I get for assuming! Thanks leadman. I will run a little experiment tomorrow. ........er today......In a couple hours

[Jim]

Thank, fellas, for the reports on the oven smell. Now we know a dedicated oven is part of the equipment.

[kdiver58]

I just saw Wally World had a convection oven for $39+. Before that all I saw was toaster ovens in the price range with the convection ovens running $60 +/-
Thanks .. K

It is counter top convection oven. I should have been more clear on that.

[gunoil]

love life , (Its real that some molds drop so good that people dont have to size, i like to size)
1)i agree & what sizer are you using? I hate sticky, smelly bullet lube too.
2) Still have to size, (Lee sizers are a pain and slow) but just need a sizer.
3) I like the nose-down with bullet tube feeds for small and large pistol on Magma.

4)Believe me, i have tossed and turned. I thought bought just go to my bank for 1050.
5) I had called M Star and cancelled the lube,heater,air then called back and told em to put back on.
6)I like this: with some changes.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BJOkb3RxrZE
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n8NdY15RstE
7) give me some ideas, like just using a used star sizer?
8) We are all in the same boat.

Back to 4 day work week at ft bragg. Iam beat, kinda glad!

[prickett]

I tested some water quenched from the mold boolits today that had been coated 3 times. They came out the same 18BHN as some of the same batch that had not been coated. Nice to have a hardness tester that reads correctly now.

If I'm understanding you, you water dropped after casting, but then stuck those same boolits in the oven to bake the coating (3 times)?

If so, I wonder why the baking didn't "undo" the water hardening.

I've been wondering whether water dropping from the final baking would make a difference.

[Love Life]

Gunoil- How are the lee sizers slow? Does it take a ridiculous amount of force to push the coated bullets through the lee sizers? I can really churn through some bullets on lee sizing dies!!

I'll have my coating soon...

[kweidner]

Gunoil- How are the lee sizers slow? Does it take a ridiculous amount of force to push the coated bullets through the lee sizers? I can really churn through some bullets on less sizing dies!!

I'll have my coating soon...

I can run 100 through a lee in under 4 minutes. Slick as snot.

[Jim]

I've got a metric ton of brand new plastic syringes in three sizes, 10 Ml., 20 Ml.-3/4 oz. & 30 Ml.-1 oz. Can these be used for measuring small amounts of the coating for small batches?

If so, I've got more than enough to share with everybody. I could get two of each size in a small FRB. All I would ask is reimbursement on the shipping cost.

I have no intention or desire to make a penny's profit on this. I'm just thinkin' if these would work for small batch applications, I got a gracious plenty to go around.

76146

[Love Life]

If they work Jim I would like some. I bought some condiment bottles (see my previous posted picture), and Ausglock said they have to be PET plastic or the mix will eat them. I bout a glass measuring cup that measures in ounces and TBS to get my ratios right and then pour them into the squeeze bottles.

I need to google my squeeze bottles to make sure they are good to go.

[kweidner]

I use lawrys marinade bottles and small dawn bottles with no ill effect. I also use tsp measuring from local pharmacy. Comes with pepto etc.

[Ausglock]

The plastic bottles I tried first went soft and sort of melted. That is why I now use plastic Coke bottles. Thet are easy to get and cost nothing.
Those syringes are exactly what I have and work great. With the long blunt needle, you can suckup 5ml and this is enough to coat 300 9mm bullets. 10ml will coat 300 45 bullets. this allows you to accurately coat and get consistant coating colour when using the 5-1-7 mix.

The experimental blue was way too thick and baked very dark (almost black). I have thinned it to 5-1-10 and have coated 200 9mm bullets to be baked tonight.
It still looks too thick. Might even thin to 5-1-15 and try another lot.

[Jim]

I forgot to mention, the red plastic tubes that come with spray cans like WD-40 and brake cleaner will fit inside the nozzles of the syringes I have. It's a tight fit, but that's good, they don't fall out.

[gunoil]

Dang u guys must sell a lot or shoot alot. 1000 of each will last me a few weeks. (9,45,380)

lovelife; after 2 years of lee sizer, its time to move on.
I have rod ends,rod,cam ends. Gonna have to shop catalog for motor and counter. Someone else posted counter.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wXbLxgJnBnI

Cant get 1050 til i sell scooter.

Everyone should watch all youtubes and vids on here. Comment, thats how we learn. Or put some of your pics up ir your videos.

[leadman]

I had water dropped a batch of boolits, then coated part of them 3 times and put them in a marked plastic bag. I also took some of the same batch that were uncoated and put them in another marked plastic bag. Wrote the date on both and tested twice, about one week in-between. The final result was both plastic bags of boolits tested at 18 BHN. This alloy is 11 BHN air cooled.
So with at least that batch the baking 3 times did not anneal or slow down the hardening.
I am going to heat treat a batch of boolits and use the same process to test them and see what happens. I will post the results later.

[Mike Hughes]

I've got a metric ton of brand new plastic syringes in three sizes, 10 Ml., 20 Ml.-3/4 oz. & 30 Ml.-1 oz. Can these be used for measuring small amounts of the coating for small batches?

If so, I've got more than enough to share with everybody. I could get two of each size in a small FRB. All I would ask is reimbursement on the shipping cost.

I have no intention or desire to make a penny's profit on this. I'm just thinkin' if these would work for small batch applications, I got a gracious plenty to go around.

76146

Hi Jim, that is a generous offer. I am planning on doing a lot of this coating and the syringes should be helpful for getting consistent results. If you have a paypal account, I can instant transfer shipping cost to you or I can send it in the mail
Thanks
Mike

[Copper75]

Jim
I'd love to get a set of those from ya.
Just let me know how you'd like me to send $ for shipping.
I can do Paypal or ill mail it to ya.
Thanks for the generous offer.
Copper

[Copper75]

I got a few hundred .452 RN done this afternoon. With range lead out of a lee 6 banger they're dropping 224 gr.
I've gotta pick up a new oven tomorrow and them I'm just waiting for FedEx to deliver my coating from Donnie.
It's gonna be an eventful week in northeast Tx. Hopefully I will be able to shoot the 45s and some 300 blackout 230 gr I've got waiting to be coated next weekend.

[Jim]

I don't use Paypal, fellas. I apologize if that's an inconvenience for ya'. Send me a PM and I'll send you all the information you need.

No need to get in a rush an' dogpile me. I got scads of these things an' I ain't likely to run out tomorrow.

[Jim]

In going through the bags of syringes, I discovered I have four sizes, not three. Syringe kits will have two of each: 5 Ml., 10 Ml., 20 Ml. & 30 Ml. I'm not finding near as many of the 5 Ml. as the other sizes. I'll include this size until I run out.

I'll be leaving for the post office about 10 AM tomorrow (Tuesday) morning. If you want in on this, please send me a PM, preferably by this evening, with your name and address so I can get your box packed and labeled. My next trip into town will be Friday.

Thanks, fellas.

[Hebegebes]

PM sent.
thank you so much.

Hebegebes

[MrWolf]

Same here with the pm - thanks

[Ausglock]

HI-TEK sent some very bright Yellow to try and a few different reds.
I'm cooking tonight. So I'll have a few photos up tomorrow.

I hope it stays yellow and doesn't go gold when cooked.

[leadman]

I cast some boolits yesterday, heat treated them last night, and coated them today. The original alloy is 11 BHN that heat treated to 22. After coating the BHN returned to 11! I will continue to check them in a week and see if any hardness returned to them.

I took some different boolits that were air cooled and coated and heated them to about 450 degrees for one hour. Then I quenched them in about 90 degree water. I knew this was bad as they were not the red copper color but had turned black. Some of the coating came off in the water. When I hit one on the nose with a hammer the coating flaked off big time.

I will run a test like the first one where the boolits maintained the water quenched hardness and see if I can duplicate it. These boolits were water quenched from the mold, coated and then tested. The original BHN of the alloy was 11, and WQ'd to 18.

[kweidner]

I cast some boolits yesterday, heat treated them last night, and coated them today. The original alloy is 11 BHN that heat treated to 22. After coating the BHN returned to 11! I will continue to check them in a week and see if any hardness returned to them.

I took some different boolits that were air cooled and coated and heated them to about 450 degrees for one hour. Then I quenched them in about 90 degree water. I knew this was bad as they were not the red copper color but had turned black. Some of the coating came off in the water. When I hit one on the nose with a hammer the coating flaked off big time.

I will run a test like the first one where the boolits maintained the water quenched hardness and see if I can duplicate it. These boolits were water quenched from the mold, coated and then tested. The original BHN of the alloy was 11, and WQ'd to 18.

I did the same thing yesterday and had identical results. 375 does seem to anneal them back.

[Thompsoncustom]

Anyone tired coating Pure lead and seeing how fast you could push it before it starts to lead?

[Ausglock]

the yellow went a medium tan when 2 coats were cooked. Looks good.
76269

[Jumbopanda]

I did the same thing yesterday and had identical results. 375 does seem to anneal them back.

My test indicates the same.

[kweidner]

Anyone tired coating Pure lead and seeing how fast you could push it before it starts to lead?

I think with very low pressure stuff it is feasible. I highly doubt it with 9mm and 40. 45 acp does fine with 9-11 bhn. 9mm and 40 take alot more coating to keep it from leading at an 11.

[prickett]

I think with very low pressure stuff it is feasible. I highly doubt it with 9mm and 40. 45 acp does fine with 9-11 bhn. 9mm and 40 take alot more coating to keep it from leading at an 11.

I tried that test with Piglet Coat and 9mm's and it resulted in a total failure. My impression was that the coating didn't matter as much as the softness of the boolit did. It seems like the soft boolits were being deformed in the bore, resulting in keyholing and horrible accuracy down range.

I'd be interested to see if Hi-Tek makes a difference, but I'm betting not.

[prickett]

I cast some boolits yesterday, heat treated them last night, and coated them today. The original alloy is 11 BHN that heat treated to 22. After coating the BHN returned to 11! I will continue to check them in a week and see if any hardness returned to them.

I took some different boolits that were air cooled and coated and heated them to about 450 degrees for one hour. Then I quenched them in about 90 degree water. I knew this was bad as they were not the red copper color but had turned black. Some of the coating came off in the water. When I hit one on the nose with a hammer the coating flaked off big time.

I will run a test like the first one where the boolits maintained the water quenched hardness and see if I can duplicate it. These boolits were water quenched from the mold, coated and then tested. The original BHN of the alloy was 11, and WQ'd to 18.

How about a test where you water quench when removing the boolits from the oven following their second baking? That test is on my to-do list, but if you beat me to it, I won't complain :-)

[HI-TEK]

I think with very low pressure stuff it is feasible. I highly doubt it with 9mm and 40. 45 acp does fine with 9-11 bhn. 9mm and 40 take alot more coating to keep it from leading at an 11.

I dont know, but Ausglock did test soft alloys with Hi-Tek coating. The only problem he experienced that he sized the projectile incorrectly. Thereafter all was well.

[Jim]

How about a test where you water quench when removing the boolits from the oven following their second baking? That test is on my to-do list, but if you beat me to it, I won't complain :-)

You might be onto somethin' there, bud! Checkin' into this thread several times a day now.

[kweidner]

Anyone tired coating Pure lead and seeing how fast you could push it before it starts to lead?

I think with very low pressure stuff it is feasible. I highly doubt it with 9mm and 40. 45 acp does fine with 9-11 bhn. 9mm and 40 take alot more coating to keep it from leading at an 11.

[kweidner]

You might be onto somethin' there, bud! Checkin' into this thread several times a day now.

Been there done that. No discernable difference. I dont think it gets hot enough. Now quenching after every bake is not something I have tried. Seems like a bunch of work waiting to dry etc. Tell you what I have found.....Coating a very soft bullet and then traditionally lubing as well lets you run some really upper end stuff fast with no leading. Hot 41 mag or 44 so far. Still experimenting in this realm. Got some 41 mag 220 grain and some .308 ready to go right now. might be a day or so until I get to testing this some more. Would be nice to push these softer .308 above 2400 or so. We will see. Yes the .308 are gas checked as well. Triple redundancy I guess.

[Love Life]

Very interesting there Kweidner. That could be an option if you don't have any "hard" lead alloy. I would think sticking to COWW or Hardball alloy, and then coatinig it, would cover just about anything handgun related you would need. I used to run hardball full throttle in the 454 casull using speed green or Lotak Hard with no leading. Took a bit of work to get there, but I got it done!!

The advantage I am looking forward to is a cleaner reloading process. No matter how carfully I lube my boolits I still end up wiping bases off after lubing, and then wiping the loaded cartridge with mineral spirits after loading. This will get rid of that.

My coating should be here this week, and after I get past the learning curve I can experiment with rifle stuff.

[Jim]

The postal service has in their possession syringe kits for the following members:

Love Life
Prickett
Copper75
Mike Hughes
Kbstenberg
JD43

I'll have to wait until next week before I can ship anymore kits prior to receiving compensation for shipping cost. I'm on a (very!) limited income and I used up about a third of my weekly allowance to ship these six this morning.

I appreciate your patience, fellas. I'm doin' my best to get these syringe kits out to y'all so you can get started on this.

[bigfelipe]

Oi, I can't wait to get started on this. I have everything I need short of a few sizing dies. Need to get my shop setup finished tomorrow...

[gunoil]

lovelife,leadman. discover card burnt around the edge. It will be here in 4 days, Star mails tomorrow. $775.00 TTD. hehehehe, cant take it with ya. Can ya? You people are pushers. hehehe.

3month waite.

[Love Life]

Gunoil- While your at it with the plastic, how about throwing a set of Detsch swage dies in 308 and 6mm on there for me? :bigsmyl2:

[gunoil]

they dont sell those.

[Love Life]

I figured it was worth a try...

[Ausglock]

I dont know, but Ausglock did test soft alloys with Hi-Tek coating. The only problem he experienced that he sized the projectile incorrectly. Thereafter all was well.

I didn't try pure (5BHN) lead. It is a bugger to get to fillout the mold correctly. I tried 10BHN in 9mm,40 and 45.
The 45 is fine. no worries. The 9mm and the 40 had no leading, but were not accurate. The 40 was the worst.

I have since moved to 15 BHN 92,6,2 alloy. 5 Lino and 5 Pure lead.
Going to do some waterdropping of WW/lead alloy 5 WW to 3 Purelead and see what happens. then coat them all for the 40S&W.

[leadman]

I have some pure lead Lee 93gr RN coated up to try in my little H&R 32 S&W and my Nagant revolvers. Might shoot some of them thru my Contender 300 Whisper carbine barrel to see what happens at higher than 1,000 fps velocity.

I did water quench a 11 bhn alloy between coating and it had no effect on the hardness.

[gunoil]

I sure do not miss the alox smoke at the range. Hell, i can see.

No choking, people leaving, no headaches, no alox throat cancer, etc..

[gundownunder]

OK, so who do I have to speak to to get some of this stuff in Perth and what will it cost me in Ozzy dollars.

Did the question get missed or am I on the wrong side of the country?

[Jumbopanda]

Hey Trevor, I don't know if this has been covered before, but how much do you pay for Hi-Tek locally in Australia?

[Ausglock]

At this point in time, It isn't actually being sold in OZ to home casters.

Maybe a PM to HI-TEK will answer your questions.

[Ausglock]

Well. the Bright Yellow did darken a bit when cooked.

It is now a Desert Tan colour (Light Caramel)
Any desert dwellers want a desert camo bullet coating???
76400

[goblism]

Has anyone tried using this coating on gas check bullets without a gas check? Have a few molds that are gas check but don't have a lot of time to experiment right now.

[prickett]

I have some pure lead Lee 93gr RN coated up to try in my little H&R 32 S&W and my Nagant revolvers. Might shoot some of them thru my Contender 300 Whisper carbine barrel to see what happens at higher than 1,000 fps velocity.

I did water quench between coating and it had no effect on the hardness.

Leadman,
Can you clarify? Did you water quench the pure lead? Or an alloy? If pure lead, quenching wouldn't have any effect. If alloy, then darn it!

[hawaii five-0]

Is it O.K to let them dry for a long while before baking? Like, can I just leave them out till I have 3 or 4 batches ready for the oven? Or is it better to bake as I go?

[HI-TEK]

Is it O.K to let them dry for a long while before baking? Like, can I just leave them out till I have 3 or 4 batches ready for the oven? Or is it better to bake as I go?

You can leave them after coating and drying until you have adequate to bake at one time.
Coating will not be damaged by storage if dry.
Generally, mots cast as much as they can, then, coat and dry well even if they leave drying over night, and then bake tray after tray until all is done.
When cool, re do exactly as previously.
It should all be fine.
HI-TEK

[HI-TEK]

The testing today went great.
All bullets were sized to .356.
All testing done at 25 yards on an IPSC Classic Target (all "A" Zone hits).
Note that the target patches are 1" in dia.
All testing done in a Kimber Stainless Target II in 38 Super.
And an SVI single stack Racegun with 4 port compensator in 38 Supercomp.

I also pumped the remaining rounds through a Para P (something) in 38 Super.
All up, over 200 rounds were fired with Zero leading in any gun.
I love this supercoat.

The New Black: Lee 125gr RNFP .358 sized down to .356

Black with normal catalyst shot well. Barrel clean and reasonably accurate. See pic 1. Average Velocity was 1150 FPS
76126
Black with extreme catalyst shot better. Barrel clean and accurate. See pic 2. Average Velocity was 1145 FPS
76127
Black with 2-Extreme catalyst shot great. Barrel clean and very accurate. See pic 3 Average Velocity was 1155 FPS
76128
The dog dick red shot great and very accurate. Barrel clean. Lee 120gr Con
The red/maroon was the same very good accuracy and clean. See pic 4 Average Velocity was 1147 FPS Lee 120gr Con
76129
The blue also shot great and was clean. See pic 5 Average Velocity was 1152 FPS Lee 120gr Con
76130
The blue/green was coated on a Lee 125gr Round nose bullet and fired from an SVI racegun at 1350FPS at major power factor.
These grouped bloody fantastic. See pic 6
76131
All the loads had 10 shots fired from a rest at the target and another 10 fired off hand to check for smoke.
All loads gave very little smoke. I was going to take photos of the smoke, but it wasn't worth it. Tried a few times, but the smoke would not show up on the photo. All you could see was sky.The only fouling in the barrels was powder fouling.
The 4 port compensator on the Racegun was clean with no lead buildup at all.

Great result.
Just to add some data, I had a reply from another test on the 2_extreme catalyst from a manufacturer.
Coated projectiles 158 grain, 360 diameter were sized down to 354 diameter.
Report was that this severe sizing did not damage the coating, left no marks at rear or projectiles, and sizing machinery was noticeably less stressed during punch operation.
Coating on long surfaces was perfect with no marks at all with severe deformations.
HI-TEK

[leadman]

prickett, I water quenched and 11 BHn alloy that will normally wq from the mold to at least 18. There was no change between coatings when water quenched.

When I posted about the pure lead boolits I am going to try I did not water quench them. I did the same 11 bhn alloy that I normally use.

I did discover one nice thing about the coating. If you have a mold that drops a seriously out of round boolit you can coat it and then size with no distortion to the driving bands. The alloy just moves around to where it should be. I did some boolits that were about .310" by .316" in a .311" push thru die and they came out .311" and round.

The coated boolits I heated to 375 degrees for one hour and then water quenched were originally 11 BHN yesterday, today they are 14 bhn and no change in the color of the coating and they passed the hammer test!

[Ausglock]

Leadman.
I have a heap of COWW and Pure lead. What mixture should I use to be able to WQ with this alloy mixture?
Thanks.

[prs]

Why specify #7 shot? Chilled and magnum shots of all sizes I have known supposedly have arsenic trace and some small antimony content. The arsenic trace is just that and all it takes, it sort of sets off a cascade effect of crystallization; or some such rot as I have been told.

prs

[BBQJOE]

Hey guys I need some help here. I'm doing my first hi-tek bullets in gold. They're coming out kinda rough and gritty. Any ideas what I'm doing wrong?

[bstone5]

Try using a little more acetone, my first try resulted in rough bullets with the gold color, the coating needs to very thin for the first coat. The first try resulted in bullets with a grainy surface and not very smooth with deep brown grains and a gold surface.
The rough finished bullets still shot fine but looked a little funny.


I found two very thin coats resulted in a much smoother surface of the coating. Two coatings worked fine in 9 mm and 38 caliber bullets.

The small 9 mm, 95 grain bullet for the 380 auto was harder to get a smooth finish on the 158 SWC for the 38 Special.

The two thin coatings resulted in no lead in the barrel of 4 different guns the the loaded ammo was shot with.

[BBQJOE]

Try using a little more acetone, my first try resulted in rough bullets with the gold color, the coating needs to very thin for the first coat. The first try resulted in bullets with a grainy surface and not very smooth with deep brown grains and a gold surface.
The rough finished bullets still shot fine but looked a little funny.


I found two very thin coats resulted in a much smoother surface of the coating. Two coatings worked fine in 9 mm and 38 caliber bullets.

The small 9 mm, 95 grain bullet for the 380 auto was harder to get a smooth finish on the 158 SWC for the 38 Special.

The two thin coatings resulted in no lead in the barrel of 4 different guns the the loaded ammo was shot with.
Thanks, I'll try that right now.

[Ausglock]

BBQJOE.
If you are mixing 5-1-5 then yes, it will be a bit blotchy.
to the 5-1-5-mix. Add another 2 parts of acetone to take it to 5-1-7.
You will find that this will coat better.
I am currently mixing 5-1-10.
this allows you to use a lot more mixed coating into the bucket to swirl and get the colour into the grooves and gives better full coating, but you are still only using the exact same amount of resin and catalyst.
The bullets come out of the oven a shiny smooth finish.
Have a look at the desert tan bullets I put a photo of, they are smooth and shiny. that is the 5-1-10 mix.

Remember. it is far better to use too much acetone than not enough.
I have even mixed to 5-1-20 trying to get a blue to stop going dark green when cooked. the coating was perfect at this mix. just a shame the blue colour didn't want to play the game......

Popper. Thanks for the info.
If I was to add 6 COWW. 4 Pure and 1/2 pewter. Would this add enough copper (from the pewter) chilled shot is very expensive here. I have a shotmaster shot maker that has not been used for 20 years. I'm thinking of kicking it in the guts and making shot again.

[BBQJOE]

I tried three thinned out coats. hardly left any color, but you could tell there was a coating on them. I loaded up a mag of 9mm, and proceed to lead the daylights out of my barrel. :-(
I think part of my trouble is the baking time. I'm going at 375° for 8-10 minutes. I'm also seeing them get all grainy if left in much longer, but come out gooey if left in much less.

[BBQJOE]

Another question. When they come out of the oven are they dry or still tacky?

[BBQJOE]

I guess today will be filed under miserable failure. What am I doing wrong guys???
This was three not real heavy coats.

76494

[leadman]

The acetone evaporates very fast so keep it in a closed container before use and cap it up immediately after dispensing. You also may not be shaking the color enough. The solids tend to go to the bottom and want to stay there.
Have you tested the coating of your boolits with a rag an acetone to see if any color comes off. This is how you tell if you have baked them long enough. Preheat your oven so it is already at temperature. If you get no color to rub off smack the top of one with a hammer and see if the coating flakes. It should stay in place on the boolit.
Also when tumbling the boolits it only takes like 20 seconds. If you can feel them start to clump together you may be tumbling them too long.

[Thompsoncustom]

My guess is your not cooking them long enough so the 2nd coat is removing the first and then resticking in a messy way. My first try yielded about the same results as your and was due to uncooking. Like posted above make sure after you coat them the first time to see if you can take some acetone and rub any color off.

[SpotHound]

I guess today will be filed under miserable failure. What am I doing wrong guys???
This was three not real heavy coats.

76494

That's exactly how my first batch came out, they melt easy and bees wax fluxes the coating out well.

1) Shake colour container longer with 2 marbles in it to get sludge up from bottom. At least 10 minutes.
2) Immediately after shaking measure out 5 parts colour and drop into pre measured acetone. 7 parts
3) Add catalyst. 1 part.
4) Shake new mixture for at least 5 minutes in a sealed container.
5) Add a tiny amount of freshly shaken mix to bullets in a sealed container. ie a tub with a lid.
6) Tumble with lid on, do not let it get tacky or try to scrape colour of tub walls by over tumbling.
or what happens is globules of semi dry product clumps together like in your photo.
7) Really let the acetone dry off prior to oven or the coating can boil also creating lumps.
8) I have to use 3 micro thin coatings to get the results I want.

[HI-TEK]

Hi BBQJOE
Just wondering if you had seen the U-Tube video that shows and describes home kit coating application.
Attached is the details.
Main things to remember is, that mix things well, take paint, add catalyst and solvent.
Adding more solvent, only allows to coating to go over more projectiles. Do not tumble for too long, and dont try to tumble dry to coat as it leaves lumpy irregular surfaces which does not flatten smooth when baking.
Coating, should be done just long enough to coat surfaces, then dump onto drying mesh, and dont disturb.

Dry thoroughly before baking.

After baking, if not baked long enough, next coat will start to strip off previous coat and this also causes lumpy uneven finish which cannot be fixed easily, as you need to remove or wash off with Acetone, the uncured mess to start re-coating again.
After you bake first coat, test with solvent and smash test to see if coating has stuck.
If tests fail, then put back into oven for another 3-4 minutes. It is no use if first coat does not stick to reapply a second coat. Recoating wont fix first coat problems.
(From placing newly dried coated projectile in pre-heated oven, it should take about 10 minutes to get to right temperature to finish cure and bond coating)
HI-TEK

YouTube videos:
Part1
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VevKJgHseWc
Part2
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NU7PbbtbAtE

[HI-TEK]

When properly cured, they should come out of the oven hard and slippery, (HOT).
Heat will not soften coating.

[BBQJOE]

Thanks folks. Things I did. I took advice from a previous post and added a couple bullets to the coating bottle when shaking. I shook it well.
I tried baking at 375° for 8 mins, didn't seem to be enough. Tried 10, 15, and 20, no better results. I tried tumbling less. Tried using less, tried using more, tried drying longer.
It can't be this difficult, and I'm not that dumb, I know how to operate an oven. I've watched the videos. I'll watch them again. I so want this to work.
I saw a pic or a video of someone smelting down bullets coated with this, and there's no way if I smelted mine that there would be a thick jacket floating on top.
The bullets in the pic feel like they're baked with sugar with a crispy sort of feel to them.
I don't know if I'm baking to long, or not long enough. What do they look like when they're done in the oven?
One second they look like they're doing fine, the next they look bubbly.
I figured my first batch I might have put them into the oven too early. This last batch in the pic, felt dry and had no tacky feeling when put into the oven.

Standing by....tomorrow is another day.

[HI-TEK]

Hi BBQJOE,
I think that you have just given me the clue, why things may not be working for you.
You referred to bubbling effect on coating.
This is telling me that there may be two possibilities going on,
1. Too much coating on first application. (possibly not)
2. You did not dry coating well enough before putting them into oven.

When considering item 2, solvent drying will chill projectile. This will attract moisture, and during the drying, coating also forms a skin, which does not let moisture/solvent dry adequately.
Placing them into oven at that point, will cause super heated steam vapours, which will prevent correct cure and bonding during bake and cause such bubbling effect as you describe.

First coat, only has to stain, and colour with fist coat is not important.

If possible, after first coat, raise temperature of projectiles about 2-3 degrees above ambient to reduce moisture pick up due to chilling occurring due to solvent drying.
(using a small fan forced heater will do the job but be very careful about flammable solvents and heaters)
Or simply, let it dry for much longer than you have previously.
Very thin stain first coat dries much quicker, and solvent/moisture entrapment is minimal.
Once you get correct bond of first coat, subsequent coatings should work fine.
HI-TEK

[BBQJOE]

Hi BBQJOE,
I think that you have just given me the clue, why things may not be working for you.
You referred to bubbling effect on coating.
This is telling me that there may be two possibilities going on,
1. Too much coating on first application. (possibly not)
2. You did not dry coating well enough before putting them into oven.

When considering item 2, solvent drying will chill projectile. This will attract moisture, and during the drying, coating also forms a skin, which does not let moisture/solvent dry adequately.
Placing them into oven at that point, will cause super heated steam vapours, which will prevent correct cure and bonding during bake and cause such bubbling effect as you describe.

First coat, only has to stain, and colour with fist coat is not important.

If possible, after first coat, raise temperature of projectiles about 2-3 degrees above ambient to reduce moisture pick up due to chilling occurring due to solvent drying.
(using a small fan forced heater will do the job but be very careful about flammable solvents and heaters)
Or simply, let it dry for much longer than you have previously.
Very thin stain first coat dries much quicker, and solvent/moisture entrapment is minimal.
Once you get correct bond of first coat, subsequent coatings should work fine.
HI-TEK
Thanks for the reply. Someone pm'd me and said they were using about a teaspoon and a half for each coat on 350 9mm's.
I was probably using like 2 teaspoons (or better) on 50. I guess I'm using way too much. I'll cut back tomorrow, and try drying much longer.

Of course this chatty Cathy will post results.

Thanks all.

[Ausglock]

BBQJoe..

1. add 2 bullets to your colour resin and shake for a good 5 minutes.
2. shake the catalyst.
3. empty bottle ready. Add 5 parts colour immediately...IMMEDIATELY... after shaking.
4. Add 7 parts Acetone and then the 1 part catalyst.
5. Put lid on the mixture and shake the schit out of it for 5 minutes. I use 600ml coke bottles with pop-tops on them. easy to add coating to the bullets.
6. Add about 200 bullets to the plastic bucket. lid is NOT needed.
7. Shake the 5-1-7-mix and Immediately add a dribble to the bucket of bullets. Replace mixture lid Immediately.
8. Shake the bucket of bullets and coating. Remember... you have to have the bullets and coating mixing around just like a cement mixer does. The bottom of the bucket should be wet with coating.
9. Keep shaking, swirling until the rattle of the bullets changes to a dull thumping. you will hear the change really easy.
10. dump the coated bullets onto your drying tray and shake the tray side to side until the bullets have leveled out on the tray. don't worry about them touching. it doesn't matter.
11. If you think there isn't enough colour on the bullet, then you have the coating just right. Leave them alone for at least 10 minutes. then warm them with a hair dryer.
12. turn on your oven and pre-heat to 200deg C.
13. place you bullets on the baking tray and spread them around to be even on the tray and place tray in the oven.
14. set the oven timer for 12 minutes. not 6 or 8. But a full 12 minutes.
15. when the oven turns off, remove the tray of bullets and let them cool. do not touch them until cool.
16. when cool. take 1 bullet. lay it in it's side on a steel base and smash it with a hammer. the coating should not flake off.
17. Take another bullet and get some acetone on a white cloth and wipe the coated bullet for 30 seconds and see if the colour comes off. if it does. place back into oven and bake for another 5 minutes. ( I have found 12 minutes per bake is enough).
18. When the bullets are cool, place back in the bucket and repeat steps 6 to 17.
19. when 2nd coat has cooled and has tested OK, Size and shoot.
20. Smile to yourself that you are now up to the same level of technology as we Aussies.
This is really piss easy to do. the biggest mistake is not shaking immediately before coating or not baking long enough or at a too low temperature.

[redrockant]

To all the Newbies to coatIng I have had all the stuff ups possible the best tips I can give are follow Trev's instructs to the letter. Take your time and just like paintIng 2 thin coats are better than one clumpy coat

[BBQJOE]

Looks like I found my problem.
1st I was using too much. Then I put a thermometer in the oven.
But secondly I had too much current loss using an extension cord on the oven. It wasn't getting much over 300°. Got rid of the extension cord, got it up to temp, and my bullets are looking beautiful!!!

Thanks everybody!!! Might have some pics later.

[Thompsoncustom]

I have a question has anyone found a way to remove cured HI TEK coating? The reason I ask is the other day I turned down my expander die and got so terrible leading. Which I thought was going to be no big deal as it's happened before just not with coated bullets.

So I wrap copper around my old bore bore and knocked 90% of the leading out, the problem is I can't get the rest and what does come out seems to be really gold in color like the coating cooked to my barrel tho nothing comes out now but with a light it's easy to see. Tired shooter choice with no effect, Shooter choice with PB blaster, acetone, Ed's red, and 50/50 Hydrogen/vinegar but nothing but a pick seems to remove it so I'm thinking it's more coating then lead.

Any ideas on how to remove it?

[Mike Hughes]

I have a question has anyone found a way to remove cured HI TEK coating? The reason I ask is the other day I turned down my expander die and got so terrible leading. Which I thought was going to be no big deal as it's happened before just not with coated bullets.

So I wrap copper around my old bore bore and knocked 90% of the leading out, the problem is I can't get the rest and what does come out seems to be really gold in color like the coating cooked to my barrel tho nothing comes out now but with a light it's easy to see. Tired shooter choice with no effect, Shooter choice with PB blaster, acetone, Ed's red, and 50/50 Hydrogen/vinegar but nothing but a pick seems to remove it so I'm thinking it's more coating then lead.

Any ideas on how to remove it?

Pistol or rifle? You may need to use paint stripper (might damage barrel, test in a inconspicuous place) lol. I am new with this product and I am curios to find out what caused the build up and how to get rid of it. I have only used Hi Tek with 9mm and it worked great, no build up or residue. I wouldn't think turning down the expander die would cause leading (too far with expander should only cause shaved brass from case when crimping)

[Mike Hughes]

Maybe coating was not fully cured?

[Thompsoncustom]

Pistol or rifle? You may need to use paint stripper (might damage barrel, test in a inconspicuous place) lol. I am new with this product and I am curios to find out what caused the build up and how to get rid of it. I have only used Hi Tek with 9mm and it worked great, no build up or residue. I wouldn't think turning down the expander die would cause leading (too far with expander should only cause shaved brass from case when crimping)

To much neck tension undersized the bullets. I turned it down as in removed material from it. Not sure if it was fully cure but I still have some in the house I can test. But if it wasn't you would think acetone would take it out of the barrel unless it baked to the barrel. I haven't found anything yet that removes it.

[Ausglock]

I have a question has anyone found a way to remove cured HI TEK coating? The reason I ask is the other day I turned down my expander die and got so terrible leading. Which I thought was going to be no big deal as it's happened before just not with coated bullets.

So I wrap copper around my old bore bore and knocked 90% of the leading out, the problem is I can't get the rest and what does come out seems to be really gold in color like the coating cooked to my barrel tho nothing comes out now but with a light it's easy to see. Tired shooter choice with no effect, Shooter choice with PB blaster, acetone, Ed's red, and 50/50 Hydrogen/vinegar but nothing but a pick seems to remove it so I'm thinking it's more coating then lead.

Any ideas on how to remove it?


Never heard of this before. I have has undersize 40 cal in a Glock 35 barrel leaded to the Schithouse. I used a Lewis lead remover to clean it out. the lead and the coating all came out with no problems. If the coating is in the barrel, do the choreboy on a brush trick. have it really tight in the bore, or get a lewis lead remover. I'd be inclined to fire a handfull of jacketed bullets down it and see what happens.

Let us know how you get on.

[kbstenberg]

Does anyone use 99% alcohol instead of acetone

[Thompsoncustom]

Fired 23 jacket bullets and all that did was give me copper fouling, not sure if it removed any or not. Also tired soaking it in hopes #9 for 10 mins and got a little black out and now it's sitting in acetone probably for a hour to see if that helps at all.

Can't say if it's coating or not at this point I was just surprised the amount of gold I got out on patches after the first round of cleaning.

Shining a LED flash light down the bore I can't see any color just gray/whiteish smears. Also there are no Copper Chores boys around here the best I have been able to do is take fine copper wire and wrap in around my old bore brush, that how I removed the leading so far. Any normal solvent based cleaners and the strong 50/50 haven't done anything except get some gold out.

[garym1a2]

I suggest trying to fire some gas check boolits. Its seems to help me sometimes when I mess up.

Fired 23 jacket bullets and all that did was give me copper fouling, not sure if it removed any or not. Also tired soaking it in hopes #9 for 10 mins and got a little black out and now it's sitting in acetone probably for a hour to see if that helps at all.

Can't say if it's coating or not at this point I was just surprised the amount of gold I got out on patches after the first round of cleaning.

Shining a LED flash light down the bore I can't see any color just gray/whiteish smears. Also there are no Copper Chores boys around here the best I have been able to do is take fine copper wire and wrap in around my old bore brush, that how I removed the leading so far. Any normal solvent based cleaners and the strong 50/50 haven't done anything except get some gold out.

[prickett]

BBQJoe..

1. add 2 bullets to your colour resin and shake for a good 5 minutes.
2. shake the catalyst.
3. empty bottle ready. Add 5 parts colour immediately...IMMEDIATELY... after shaking.
4. Add 7 parts Acetone and then the 1 part catalyst.
5. Put lid on the mixture and shake the schit out of it for 5 minutes. I use 600ml coke bottles with pop-tops on them. easy to add coating to the bullets.
6. Add about 200 bullets to the plastic bucket. lid is NOT needed.
7. Shake the 5-1-7-mix and Immediately add a dribble to the bucket of bullets. Replace mixture lid Immediately.
8. Shake the bucket of bullets and coating. Remember... you have to have the bullets and coating mixing around just like a cement mixer does. The bottom of the bucket should be wet with coating.
9. Keep shaking, swirling until the rattle of the bullets changes to a dull thumping. you will hear the change really easy.
10. dump the coated bullets onto your drying tray and shake the tray side to side until the bullets have leveled out on the tray. don't worry about them touching. it doesn't matter.
11. If you think there isn't enough colour on the bullet, then you have the coating just right. Leave them alone for at least 10 minutes. then warm them with a hair dryer.
12. turn on your oven and pre-heat to 190deg C.
13. place you bullets on the baking tray and spread them around to be even on the tray and place tray in the oven.
14. set the oven timer for 10 minutes. not 6 or 8. But a full 10 minutes.
15. when the oven turns off, remove the tray of bullets and let them cool. do not touch them until cool.
16. when cool. take 1 bullet. lay it in it's side on a steel base and smash it with a hammer. the coating should not flake off.
17. Take another bullet and get some acetone on a white cloth and wipe the coated bullet for 30 seconds and see if the colour comes off. if it does. place back into oven and bake for another 5 minutes. ( I have found 10 minutes per bake is enough).
18. When the bullets are cool, place back in the bucket and repeat steps 6 to 17.
19. when 2nd coat has cooled and has tested OK, Size and shoot.
20. Smile to yourself that you are now up to the same level of technology as we Aussies.
This is really piss easy to do. the biggest mistake is not shaking immediately before coating or not baking long enough or at a too low temperature.

Thanks for the detailed instructions! Do you have measurements of ingredients per 100 9mm and/or .45 boolits?

[gunoil]

Take it to gunsmith and let him clean your barrel Then pay up sucker! Then if you shoot hi-tek-supercoat you can have no more problemos.

[Thompsoncustom]

Take it to gunsmith and let him clean your barrel Then pay up sucker! Then if you shoot hi-tek-supercoat you can have no more problemos.

This is with HI TEK supercoat. I think the coating is protecting the lead in my barrel. I would take it to a gunsmith if I though they had a way of cleaning it that I don't.

Let it sit in acetone for a hour and ran the brush through a couple time and got about half black (probably lead) and half color (supercoat) on two patches. Gonna let it sit in vinegar over night that way I can wipe off any oxidation that might be on the lead and try the 50/50 mix again. Also need to email Hi Tek and see if there is a way to dissolve this stuff.

[BBQJOE]

Today's results.
1st *****,used too much coating.
Oven didn't reach prescribed temp.
Also I wasn't letting it dry long enough before baking.

I remedied all three errors, and here's what I came up with today.
here's yesterdays disaster.

76585
Here's today's results:

76586

76587


I fired about 10 of them in my M&P 9. I think I noticed some streaking in the barrel, but pretty much lost my light for the day. These bullets in the pics got three coats: 5-1-5, 1/2 tsp per 100 each time. You can see a smashed bullet in the pics. It took two hits, not sure if I'm seeing flaking. I believe maybe my final result could be a bit thin. With some effort I am able to get to the lead with a thumbnail. But, hell, what do I know?
At least today was better than yesterday.

And thanks ausglock for dialing me in. :-)

[HI-TEK]

I have a question has anyone found a way to remove cured HI TEK coating? The reason I ask is the other day I turned down my expander die and got so terrible leading. Which I thought was going to be no big deal as it's happened before just not with coated bullets.

So I wrap copper around my old bore bore and knocked 90% of the leading out, the problem is I can't get the rest and what does come out seems to be really gold in color like the coating cooked to my barrel tho nothing comes out now but with a light it's easy to see. Tired shooter choice with no effect, Shooter choice with PB blaster, acetone, Ed's red, and 50/50 Hydrogen/vinegar but nothing but a pick seems to remove it so I'm thinking it's more coating then lead.

Any ideas on how to remove it?

Hi,
To remove the coating from metal surfaces you need to get a product called N-Methyl Pyrrollidone.
It is a very safe solvent water soluble.
IMPORTANT.
This material needs to be applied to dry surfaces. (No moisture as it deactivates solvency)
Do not contaminate plastics or synthetic surfaces as this solvent will damage them.
However, despite its ability to dissolve most materials, (sometimes slowly) in is safe to use.
Use it neat, without any other solvents or diluents.
Just wet a soft cotton rag or something like that, (not Acrylic or synthetic cloth) with N-Pyrrole, and pull it through barrel to wet any coating residue.
You can externally warm barrel with hair drier which will increase solvents activity.
Leave for a while, and, do another pull through with same solvent (N-Pyrrole) wet rag. Warming barrel will enhance removal of residues.
This solvent is slow acting and activity increases with warming.
It will liquify resin bonded to metal, without doing any damage.
When all residue is dissolved, simply rinse balance out with water or wet rag washes.
Then, reapply some sort of WD40 type of spray inside barrel to protect steel.
It seems to me that you did not cure the coating, as the deposits are a typical result of heat curing of coating by hot barrel which then bonded to inside barrel.
This result, although unwanted, really demonstrates how tenaciously the coating will bond when heated to curing stage, and, how resistant it is to heat and abrasion after heat cure.
Please let me know how you went.
HI-TEK

[HI-TEK]

Today's results.
1st *****,used too much coating.
Oven didn't reach prescribed temp.
Also I wasn't letting it dry long enough before baking.

I remedied all three errors, and here's what I came up with today.
here's yesterdays disaster.

76585
Here's today's results:

76586

76587


I fired about 10 of them in my M&P 9. I think I noticed some streaking in the barrel, but pretty much lost my light for the day. These bullets in the pics got three coats: 5-1-5, 1/2 tsp per 100 each time. You can see a smashed bullet in the pics. It took two hits, not sure if I'm seeing flaking. I believe maybe my final result could be a bit thin. With some effort I am able to get to the lead with a thumbnail. But, hell, what do I know?
At least today was better than yesterday.

And thanks ausglock for dialing me in. :-)

You did great.
From colour of coating, It indicates to me , that you may have not quite cured enough or long enough at set temperature.
The gold coatings, tend to become a deeper Golden to Tan gold colour after bake, looks almost as the gold is "aged". Your Gold is really yellow without showing the tanning or aging appearance.
Just a few suggestions, when coating, and after first coat, and before you coat any additional coats, you need to ensure that first coat has really stuck well.
Colour with first coat is not important, but good strong bond to alloy is needed.
Any other coats will then stick to first coat which is bonded well to alloy.
You dont need thick coatings for coating to work well. Two thin and well cooked films will easily do the job. The rest is more cosmetic to make the finish pretty. but with extra coats, you really dont get any more benefits.
HI-TEK

[HI-TEK]

Does anyone use 99% alcohol instead of acetone

From previous blogs, Ferrara Leather advised that he uses commercial Methylated Spirits.
This is about 95%, But I do not know details.
99% may work also, it is a matter of trying it.
It will slow drying somewhat and coating may absorb moisture but if you dry coatings well, with a little warming, any moisture/solvents should evaporate.

[BBQJOE]

You did great.
From colour of coating, It indicates to me , that you may have not quite cured enough or long enough at set temperature.
The gold coatings, tend to become a deeper Holden colour after bake, looks almost as the gold is "aged". Your Gold is really yellow without showing the tanning or aging appearance.
Just a few suggestions, when coating, and after first coat, and before you coat any additional coats, you need to ensure that first coat has really stuck well.
Colour with first coat is not important, but good strong bond to alloy is needed.
Any other coats will then stick to first coat which is bonded well to alloy.
You dont need thick coatings for coating to work well. Two thin and well cooked films will easily do the job. The rest is more cosmetic to make the finish pretty. but with extra coats, you really dont get any more benefits.
HI-TEK
After the the first coat and baking, I followed ausglocks advice and wiped with a white cloth and acetone, and nothing came off. Do you believe I need to bake longer? I let the coats dry in front of a fan for at least half an hour before baking. I did do a bake right before I lost the the days light, and I believe it has more of a "tanned" hue, but I won't know until morning.

I'm totally open for more direction.
Thanks.

[HI-TEK]

After the the first coat and baking, I followed ausglocks advice and wiped with a white cloth and acetone, and nothing came off. Do you believe I need to bake longer? I let the coats dry in front of a fan for at least half an hour before baking.

I'm totally open for more direction.
Thanks.

As general rule, baking times are dependent on how much metal you place into the oven, how good is air circulation around the projectiles.
Generally loads should allow some gaps between projectiles to allow hot air to circulate around projectiles.
At about 190C to 195C your cooking time should be around 10 minutes from placing projectiles into preheated oven.
If coating has started to cure, it would start at outside film, and this can cause some uncertainties with the Acetone tests as outside film will resist solvent removal.
First coat should be dried very thoroughly. Time will depend on ambient conditions, hot, dry, humid raining etc.
I generally suggest that coated projectiles need to be warmed about 2-3 degrees above ambient temperatures to help drying, especially when it is cold.
It is important that you get very good adhesion with first coat before applying any other coats.
If first coat does not stick, don't apply any other coats as it wont fix first coat adhesion problems after cure.

[redrockant]

Stick with it BBQJOE results are good. I think you may have just needed a few minutes more, as HI-Tek said it depends on the metal in your oven. The ovens we are using are cheap and aren't industrial quality. Just keep trying, follow Ausglock and HI-TEK's help. My oven on 215 for 8 minutes gives great results. The secret is the first coat and its adhesion. Just keep trying your on the right track. Worst comes to worst throw them in the melt and recast, its all quality time in the man cave

[leadman]

Went to the range Thursday and had some good results but had "one of them days"! Had loaded some 223 ammo to take, forgot it but remembered to take the barrel. Also had a scope loosen up while shooting my 22 K-Hornet. Must not have tightened it all the way when I changed scopes awhile back.
Did shoot the Savage 30-06 with the 314299 sized to .311" and weighed just over 190grs cast of lino, powder was IMR4350. Had just over one inch groups at 100 yards to 2,344 fps, then the next load at 2,376 fps opened up to 2.3". Had very slight leading on a dry patch. The next load at 2,420 fps started to emitt some grey smoke from the muzzle and the group was 3.547". The next load at 2,471 fps was 4.597" with slight leading on the dry patch, the last load was 2,482 fps, group was 5.302", no leading and case expansion was .0015" larger than factory loads and primers were flattening. Temperature was around 100 degrees.
I was reading Richard Lee's second book and used the info on bhn and pressure to determine approximately where I exceeded the strength on the lino. Probably right about the 2,420fps load. I also looked in the Lyman 47th edition manual and found a load for a 210gr boolit with my max load of 50grs IMR4350 and the pressure is listed as 47,800 CUP. Lino is good for approx 22,000. The Lyman manual has a load for 50grs of IMR4350 and a 190gr jacketed bullet at 2,586 fps and 50,000CUP.
So my results I would say that the coating holds up very good with no leading until you exceed the strength of the alloy. Even then there was only a trace of leading in front of the chamber that was easily removed with a dry patch. The velocity is almost the equal of jacketed listed in the Lyman manual.
In order to get full jacketed velocity with the 30-06 I am going to heat treat some boolits tomorrow and load then in a week so they are at full hardness hopefully.

I did shoot my 22 k-hornet with the Lyman 44gr RN and WC680 powder. Unfortunatley the wind started gusting to around 30mph and the scope loosened up during shooting but I did not know it. Still had decent results and got the little boolit up to 2,677 fps with no leading. Did see the grey smoke on the 2,616fps load though. The best load was .659" and the worst 4.5", the best was the second load fired, the worst second to the last. I hadn't loaded this too hot as I was going to use the 223 for the higher velocities.

[redrockant]

Some of today's casting, coating and loading. "The Christmas Mix" HI-TEK maroon, desert tan and zombie stopper green. Ignore the arrowhead in the centre my grandaughter wanted it there
76593
Shoot results tomorrow

[Ausglock]

My coloured Bullet stash.
76594

The new Gold and Red are sweet.

[Ausglock]

After the the first coat and baking, I followed ausglocks advice and wiped with a white cloth and acetone, and nothing came off. Do you believe I need to bake longer? I let the coats dry in front of a fan for at least half an hour before baking. I did do a bake right before I lost the the days light, and I believe it has more of a "tanned" hue, but I won't know until morning.

I'm totally open for more direction.
Thanks.

It sounds as though you are doing fine. what hardness is your lead, and what load are you using to fire the bullets?

Don't be tempted to put on too much coating with the second coat. it is far better to apply a 3rd thin coating.

Popper:
for 300 9mm bullets, I use 7mls of 5-1-10, 5mls of 5-1-7. 5-1-5 I do not use anymore
for 200 45 bullets, I use the same as above. My trays will hold this amount of bullets comfortably.
With this loading of the trays, My oven is pre-heated and set at 190deg C and held for 10 minutes. one tray at a time.
I tried doing 2 trays at a time, but the top tray of bullets was too close to the heating element and the coating darkened badly. The oven as set for 12 minutes.

[BBQJOE]

Ok, so I fired a handful into a dirt berm, and recovered the bullets. The coating was completely removed except for on the bases.
So is this a sign of poor adhesion?

[Ausglock]

Ok, so I fired a handful into a dirt berm, and recovered the bullets. The coating was completely removed except for on the bases.
So is this a sign of poor adhesion?

I don't think so. This is what happened to my 40 S&W when they were undersize for the bore. on firing, the coating and the lead was stripped from the bullet and was left in the barrel.

What is the calibre you are loading them in? What is your load? Do you use a Lee Carbide Factory crimp Die?
What is your lead alloy? What are you sizing them to?

I know it is asking a heap of questions, But it all helps.

[Ausglock]

Double post.....

[BBQJOE]

I don't think so. This is what happened to my 40 S&W when they were undersize for the bore. on firing, the coating and the lead was stripped from the bullet and was left in the barrel.

What is the calibre you are loading them in? What is your load? Do you use a Lee Carbide Factory crimp Die?
What is your lead alloy? What are you sizing them to?

I know it is asking a heap of questions, But it all helps.
Alloy is 50-50 coww and lead. Shooting out of M&P 9mm. sized to .357. powder is 3.5gr 700x. I'm only crimping enough to remove the bell and maybe just a fraction more.
I didn't see any coating in the barrel.

[Ausglock]

Alloy is 50-50 coww and lead. Shooting out of M&P 9mm. sized to .357. powder is 3.5gr 700x. I'm only crimping enough to remove the bell and maybe just a fraction more.
I didn't see any coating in the barrel.

Try water quenching those bullets and them try coating them again after a week or so.
But for now, try a few straight COWW.
Have you slugged the barrel? you might need to size down to .356

If the first coat bakes and can't be rubbed off with acetone, Then you have good baking.

[gunoil]

you should seat in seperate sta. & crimp (i use dillon crimps) in seperate sta.. And also, i never bell, i use RCBS step dies (i call the rcbs 800 # & order one caliber, very affordable and quality). Then i drop rnds in cartridge gage from midway.
http://i1113.photobucket.com/albums/k511/putt2012/5FA91F54-4F3C-4AE1-A414-DFEBFFF9553A-12889-00000D2CF9ABA766_zpsf24c37eb.jpg

My barrels stay (380/9/45) super clean. I am novice caster (self taught/2yrs) and i bet if i bought some lead boolits from store they would coat better maybe, maybe it has something to do with mix,, i dont know! Iam just sayin.

I just sized a bunch of 9's last nite, the 2 coats look fine in the lil' plinkers,, Ive shot a ton of em at indoor range. The 5-1-7 mix and shake it good and try to put super thin coats on while cooking. Oh well, we'll all get it, it aint that big a thing. THIN COATS.

[Thompsoncustom]

Hi,
To remove the coating from metal surfaces you need to get a product called N-Methyl Pyrrollidone.
It is a very safe solvent water soluble.
IMPORTANT.
This material needs to be applied to dry surfaces. (No moisture as it deactivates solvency)

Is this something you can buy in the USA? I've been looking this morning and haven't found anyone that carries it.

[HI-TEK]

Is this something you can buy in the USA? I've been looking this morning and haven't found anyone that carries it.

Most paint companies should have it or at least know about it. Some paint & or solvent supply companies can advise who has this solvent.
It is a widely used but not well advertised material.
It is best slow drying paint stripper that will remove two-pack automotive paints and dissolve many synthetic materials and then can be washed off with water.
As it is safe to use and very low toxicity, and reasonably expensive, it is used mainly in specialised systems where nothing else works.
It is used for insecticidal pest control solubilising chemicals as used on dogs and cats.
Just google it on web for suppliers/manufacturers in US.
You should find many suppliers.
HI-TEK

[Thompsoncustom]

Hmmm I wonder if I have some, I know there a Meth something paint thinner at the shop or there was I'll have to check it out otherwise if it's a paint thinner I'm sure I can get ahold of it. Thanks.

[leadman]

BBQJOE, you may have to size larger. I have checked a few 9mm bores with about half needing a .358" boolit. Definitely water drop your boolits as the 9 is a high pressure cartridge, unlike the 45acp.
Check the inside case mouth diameter to make sure it is at least .359" to allow the boolit to release freely upon firing if you go to .358"

[BBQJOE]

Size, don't size, 356, 358, water drop, air cool, hardness doesn't matter, hardness does matter, go bigger, go smaller, beeswax, jpw, pan lube, tumble lube...
I need an aspirin.
This shooting game is getting awfully complicated.
I'm gonna keep after this hi-tek thing though.

[gunoil]

get some laquer thinner to get paint off of what ever you painted. Just rub it off.

[mauser1959]

blue helmets ?

[gunoil]

Trevor, iam gonna invite myself over in a couple years. Your just hour or so north of all the good looking women.

[codawolf]

Ok... After following this thread and the powder coating thread I decided to call Donnie and see how this works. Here are pics of my first batch. Only 250 boolits to start but I wanted to see how they shoot with out sizing first. That and the little cheap convection oven from Walmart would only handle about 150 at a time or it would take about 20 minutes to set the coating. After the second coating they were coming in at 0.453 0.454. A bit bigger than I want but we will see what the 1911 says. I am still a little worried I didn't bake them long enough but the coating doesn't come off with acetone and it held up to the hammer test pretty darn good.

76640
After first coat and bake.
76641
Baking.
76642
After second Coat
76643
After second coat and bake. Notice the smashed boolit
76644
Comparison of the first and second coat smashed.

[Ausglock]

Looks good to me.
This is the red/copper? Mine come out exactly the same colour after the first and second coating.
Good job.
The red/copper does add to the dia more than the other non metallic coatings.

I have 200 45ACP to test today with the New experimental Pearl red and Rose red coatings.
Pearl red
76651

Rose red
76652

[toddrod]

No FPS as have no chronograph, sorry (for the soup can load)

If you shake until tacky you will get a rough coat, I am shaking until covered and them dumping without going tacky.

The finish is mirror smooth then!

Also, initially I was shaking til very tacky to scoop up the colour from the mixing bowl, this just put nasty scrunge in the lube grooves.

I bake in the wifes oven, the smell goes away :)

I got a rough coating today, using red copper, by shaking till tacky, but I did not read this tip before trying.

[atygrit]

766537665476655

OK, i'm having a few issues. I uploaded a picture of a pictures with 1 coating but had to cook them 10, 15, then 20 minutes and I'm still getting the coating to rub off with acetone. I lightly rub the bullet for 30 seconds.

The oven is pre-warmed to 375 degrees Fahrenheit.

Any ideas on what I'm doing wrong would be appreciated.

[codawolf]

Have you tried putting a thermometer in the oven to verify the temperature? I know with the little cheap one that I got the temperature dial wasn't even close. when I set it to 375 I was barely at 320.

[Ausglock]

OK, i'm having a few issues. I uploaded a picture of a pictures with 1 coating but had to cook them 10, 15, then 20 minutes and I'm still getting the coating to rub off with acetone. I lightly rub the bullet for 30 seconds.

The oven is pre-warmed to 375 degrees Fahrenheit.

Any ideas on what I'm doing wrong would be appreciated.

I'd say that you have too much coating on for a first coat. On this bullet (with a 5-1-7 mix) you should not have any coating down in the lube groove. did you smash some? Did the coating flake off?

Try it again, but with less coating or more bullets in the bucket. After testing multiple mixes of over 16 different coloured resins, I have to say that every one of them is trial and error. I have coated and found it not to work, so back into the smelter and try again.

It takes a bit of trial and error to get it right. but once right, it is easy.

Fired off the pearl red and the rose red 45 load today. Sweet and accurate. barrel shiny clean and virtually no smoke. I fired some conventional lubed bullets afterward as a comparison of smoke. Bloody smoke everywhere. thought it was a bushfire, the smoke was so bad. Anyone would have thought it was a black powder gun :-)

[gunoil]

LMAO,, Choking in the bushfire! So right. I did the smoke and choke the other day, @ the indoor range it makes me sick, headaches, cancer in california, hehehehe. I cant do the smoke anymore.

[Ausglock]

test results of the rose red and the pearl red 230gr FP 45 bullets.
All fired at 15 yards standing freestyle from a Para GI Expert 1911 8 Shots in each.
Rose red
76711
Pearl red
76712

[redrockant]

test results of the rose red and the pearl red 230gr FP 45 bullets.
All fired at 15 yards standing freestyle from a Para GI Expert 1911
Rose red
76711


Pearl red
76712


He's not bullchitting.. I was with him. Not the slightest hint of leading in any of our guns

[gunoil]

I think we've already proved accuracy is good and barrels (pistol) are clean. Iam working on my temps and sloshing mix. I still need to get a oven temp therometer. Waiting for 223 and 30 cal test from rifle peeps w/gas checks.

Hehehe, i ordered a magma star before i had hi-tek-supercoat. It was over 90 day backorder. So, now if needed I have worlds finest lube bullet and hi-tek-supercoat.

Its good we have hitek and ausglock to help. Its great to have glock projectiles although i shot no more than 150 lube/lead bullets thru my glock anyway then clean barrel and shoot another 150. But this is whole nother world for glocks with hi-tek, well, easier to clean the glock barrel and shoot HTS hi-tek all day long.

[BBQJOE]

Atygrit, I also would suggest getting an oven thermometer. I had similar problems. My oven wasn't getting hot enough.

[atygrit]

I picked up a $5 oven thermometer and my oven was about 25 degrees off. I was able to get the bullets that I posted earlier to pass the acetone and smash test, but it took another 15 minutes in the oven. This *** oven is going back to Wal-Mart, because it takes to long to reach the temp and when I put the bullets in, the temp doesn't recover fast enough.

[gunoil]

I bought 31100 hamilton beach convection @Kmart/99$. I wire'ed (with twisted safety wire) stucco mesh to two oven trays. And made 4x2 1/2 dry tray. 8 foot sheet @ homeless depot for 8$.

http://i1113.photobucket.com/albums/k511/putt2012/CDA3493B-EF51-469D-8B0C-3B4822CCADAC-19482-000015CED3271ED8_zps9973c05a.jpg

Use it to dry my brass and WQ boolits. See the 5$ yard sale box fan, oh yes.
http://i1113.photobucket.com/albums/k511/putt2012/855F6E5A-964E-415D-8FE5-E73412258F35-139-0000041378238055_zps6d28a2af.jpg

[BBQJOE]

I bought 31100 hamilton beach convection @Kmart/99$. I wire'ed (with twisted safety wire) stucco mesh to two oven trays. And made 4x2 1/2 dry tray. 8 foot sheet @ homeless depot for 8$.

http://i1113.photobucket.com/albums/k511/putt2012/CDA3493B-EF51-469D-8B0C-3B4822CCADAC-19482-000015CED3271ED8_zps9973c05a.jpg



I bought the same oven at kmart after returning my first one to walmart. :-)

[atygrit]

What was the brand you returned to Walmart?

I have a Farberware from Walmart that I want to return because it just takes so long to heat back up after I put the bullets in.

[atygrit]

2nd coat on my 1st try.
76740

They look good to me and pass the smash test. I am getting just a hint of removal from the acetone. Is this acceptable?
76741

[gunoil]

Check em while sizeing (what they look like after sizing? I know some peeps dont size!) and check when bullets are seated in brass. Are you scraping off lil' slivers when seating. U see lead @ top of brass? Nines are a SOB. I hate nine brass. Thinkin bought leaving 9mm, but there islots of it here free for the pickin. Iam a picker.
http://i1113.photobucket.com/albums/k511/putt2012/42F659CD-5C81-43A7-BF1B-AB8522AE2E76-21548-00001663580A30AA_zps44bd30bb.jpg
And a cleaner! 700RPM
http://i1113.photobucket.com/albums/k511/putt2012/E52D630F-ECBD-4346-A8A4-53AEFB476C20-210-000002398A74456C_zps0e2ce52a.mp4

[Ausglock]

2nd coat on my 1st try.
76740

They look good to me and pass the smash test. I am getting just a hint of removal from the acetone. Is this acceptable?
76741

Looks great. The wipe off is nothing. Size em, load em, Fire em and be happy that you are now smarter thanks to Aussie know how.

HI-TEK for President..... :-)

[prickett]

My coloured Bullet stash.
76594

The new Gold and Red are sweet.

Hi Trevor,
Do you find any color to be easier to work with than any other color?

[prickett]

BBQJOE, you may have to size larger. I have checked a few 9mm bores with about half needing a .358" boolit. Definitely water drop your boolits as the 9 is a high pressure cartridge, unlike the 45acp.
Check the inside case mouth diameter to make sure it is at least .359" to allow the boolit to release freely upon firing if you go to .358"

I have several 9mm's and I second the suggestion to size to .358"

If using Lee belling dies, you can replace its sizing component to use a .38 S&W sizer. That bells much better than the 9mm sizer and is a completely drop in solution ($5 from Lee).

I'm not sure about the water drop, though. Once you bake the finish, doesn't that "undo" the water drop's hardening?

[gunoil]

prickett is smart.

I have lee expander dies turn down on laithe to RCBS step dies dia..

If i seat and crimp in two stages, 9's aren't to bad. I size boolit at .355. If this dang loadmaster had of had 6 holes, i like a bullet feeder. Gonna sell some stuff round here and get a 1050, ya dont think so, just hide and watch. Dang tappered case, hard to size and bulges at bottom from range. Yea, I have a bb kit.

[SpotHound]

trev

Are the 2 reds suitable for rifles? I got the colour you see in my post as "red" but its not red enough for me.

[BBQJOE]

What was the brand you returned to Walmart?

I have a Farberware from Walmart that I want to return because it just takes so long to heat back up after I put the bullets in.
Ha ha ha!!!! Lol's and all that! The one I returned was indeed the farberware.
it looked just like this one, without the chicken. :-)

76776

[BBQJOE]

@gunoil: Be careful in those crocs. They are indeed comfy, but probably the most dangerous shoe on the planet!
For me: Crocs+slick wet floor=shattered knee.

[Ausglock]

trev

Are the 2 reds suitable for rifles? I got the colour you see in my post as "red" but its not red enough for me.

No idea. I don't play with cast in rifles, Sorry.

The pearl red probably could as it has a fairly high metallic component from the looks of it.
The Glitter Bronze and the New experimental Gold might be good too.

[atygrit]

I might be over thinking this, but I'm still getting some color to wipe of of the 1st coat after baking. I'm doing the 5-1-7 mix and l went lighter this time on a bigger batch of bullets. But after 10 minutes I was getting some color to wipe off so I baked them again for 5 minutes and then again for another 5 minutes. I did get a thermometer to make sure my oven is at the correct temp, and it appears to be correct.

Should I be getting any color to wipe off with acetone or is some acceptable? If so how much? This is the part that is driving me nuts, because they look good to me, but they are failing the acetone test.

7679676797

[HI-TEK]

I might be over thinking this, but I'm still getting some color to wipe of of the 1st coat after baking. I'm doing the 5-1-7 mix and l went lighter this time on a bigger batch of bullets. But after 10 minutes I was getting some color to wipe off so I baked them again for 5 minutes and then again for another 5 minutes. I did get a thermometer to make sure my oven is at the correct temp, and it appears to be correct.

Should I be getting any color to wipe off with acetone or is some acceptable? If so how much? This is the part that is driving me nuts, because they look good to me, but they are failing the acetone test.

7679676797

Hi,
Can you please tell me what coloured coating you have?
It is not clear when looking at your coated projectiles.
Also, can you please tell me if how you cast, and if you use any lubes or release agents during casting?
Are you able to send me a pm a with a detailed description of your steps taken to get to coatings stage. It greatly helps if you can give me as much details as possible, so I can diagnose any areas where it can cause this sort of problem.
HI-TEK

[gunoil]

Yes, BBQ, the crocs are home shuttle and drought weather. I know.

I listed the HB oven at first of thread after extensive research and using university of Oz also. My friends, its all here. I dont play, i quit school because of recess.

[prickett]

I tried my new Gold HI-TEK yesterday (coated)/today (shot). My 9mm's coated like a dream the first time I ever tried it! They were smooth and gorgeous. I shot them and the barrel was clean and lead free. I was surprised at how they went into the oven dull gray and came out gold. I was afraid I hadn't mixed the coating well enough after I'd coated them, but before baking them.

Now, the bad news. I also coated .45 ACP (usually the most forgiving round to cast/reload). Its coating turned out very grainy. When sizing, it was like sizing raw lead w/o any lube. I really feared I was using so much force I'd break the press loose from the loading table. In looking at the boolits, quite a few had the coating stripped either completely or partially off the driving bands.

One thing I noticed was that the front half of the oven tray was lighter colored than the back half. Here, I figured it was due to the temp in the oven not being the same in the front as in the back (even though its a convection oven). I'm thinking this can be corrected by placing the rack as far towards the back as possible.

I'm also wondering if I loaded too many boolits onto the tray. I probably loaded as many as the 9mm's I was successful with, but these were 230 gr. versus 125 gr. for the 9mm (so almost twice as much metal to have to warm up). I wonder if they needed to be left in longer than 10 minutes, or baked in smaller lots. Opinions?

Finally, can these be saved? Can I re-heat them to "fix" the current bad coat, then add another coat to get the bald spots resulting from the sizing operation?

[hawaii five-0]

What brand oven?

[Ausglock]

I do 300 9mm, but only 200 45 on each tray.

[RDP]

Gunoil,
Please tell us more about your brass cleaning system.
Thanks.
Rich

[prickett]

What brand oven?

Black and Decker IIRC. Was a Walmart $39 special.

[gunoil]

31100 kmart/hamilton beach (large convection oven) 99$.The bkack one.

[Jumbopanda]

I just scored this for $40 on Craigslist today. :)

76850

[Love Life]

Got my coating in today. It will be on like donkey kong in the near future.

[Ausglock]

I just scored this for $40 on Craigslist today. :)

76850

Sweet pickup.
Does it have fan forced circulation and top and bottom heating elements?

Love Life: You will now become a casting hermit.

My missus only sees me of a morning before going to work and late of a night when I come down from the shed to sleep.
Good thing my shed has a toilet, fridge and a hot plate in it.

[Love Life]

Lucky!!

My casting kingdom is in my non temp controlled garage. Stifling in the summer (thank God for no humidity) and blistering cold in the winter.

Didn't get much casting and reloading done in December/January when we had 30 days where it never got above freezing and was in the negatives every night. Nothing like being coyote hunting, going to make a scope adjustment, and your glove freezes to the dial (had a bit of snow on the glove). -11 degrees at noon is great hunting weather!!

[prickett]

Has anyone tried boiling their conventional lubed boolits (to remove the wax lube), then coat them with HI-TEK? A few weeks ago I tried that with Piglet Coat and got leading in my barrel. I'm not positive, but I'm thinking some lube must have remained on the boolits, preventing good adhesion of the paint. Has anyone else tried this and been either successful, or, can confirm my suspicion that good adhesion is prevented?

[gunoil]

Skeeered,&lazy of that notion,, I just throw-em back in hot pot and start over.

[Whizzer]

Has anyone tried boiling their conventional lubed boolits (to remove the wax lube), then coat them with HI-TEK? A few weeks ago I tried that with Piglet Coat and got leading in my barrel. I'm not positive, but I'm thinking some lube must have remained on the boolits, preventing good adhesion of the paint. Has anyone else tried this and been either successful, or, can confirm my suspicion that good adhesion is prevented?

Ha! Sometimes I just re-melt and re-cast them just because I want to cast, and really don't need the pills!

I like to cast and reload my own boolits, as much as (or maybe more than) I like shooting them!

[jeanrieux]

How much of a problem do I have if the coating is fairly flaky (I.e. reaching into a box of bullets and having the equivalent of paint chips on my hands)? Won't have a chance to shoot them for a while, but will these likely cause leading/coating to come off to a large degree?

[Jumbopanda]

Sweet pickup.
Does it have fan forced circulation and top and bottom heating elements?

Love Life: You will now become a casting hermit.

My missus only sees me of a morning before going to work and late of a night when I come down from the shed to sleep.
Good thing my shed has a toilet, fridge and a hot plate in it.

Yes and yes. I was actually tempted to use it for food instead of bullets because it's pretty fancy and has a rotisserie function, but I need my bullets!

[Jumbopanda]

How much of a problem do I have if the coating is fairly flaky (I.e. reaching into a box of bullets and having the equivalent of paint chips on my hands)? Won't have a chance to shoot them for a while, but will these likely cause leading/coating to come off to a large degree?

The coating should not be flaky at all. I'd imagine that the coating would be pointless it if can't properly adhere to the bullets.

[Jumbopanda]

I just did my first couple of batches, and have had no problems with curing. I baked 200 .30 cal 200gr bullets at a time at 375F for 15 minutes. I've found that 10 minutes doesn't cut it, and acetone will still be able to take a bit of the coating off. I have found that some bullets end up slightly darker (either uneven distribution of the coating or uneven heat) than others, so perhaps next time I'll try 5-1-10 instead of 5-1-7. I put three coats of 10mL on each batch. I started with 6.25mL, but found that wasn't enough and many of the bullets ended up half-coated. 10mL seems about right and leaves no excess at the bottom of the container, and the bullets are dry within a minute or so after being poured out. I might even try 12.5mL and reduce it to two coats.

Has anyone had problems sizing their coated bullets? I've found that mine can be extremely difficult to size, and at one point one of the lag screws that hold my press to my workbench actually started stripping out. The most difficult ones tend to leave a "fin" along the base of the bullet after sizing.

The bullets are 0.3125" as-cast, and 0.315" after coating. I'm sizing them down to 0.310"

76883

[Ausglock]

JR.
The flaking will lead like buggery. If you put the first coat on too thick, It will flake when smashed.

JP.
Get some Hornady oneshot case lube (pump bottle) give the bullets a spray and wait for a few minutes for it to dry. then size. HI-TEK makes a PTFE sizing lube that mixes with Metho and the bullets literally fall through the sizer die.

I have sized a .360 down to .356 with 2 fingers on the ram handle.

[Jumbopanda]

JR.
The flaking will lead like buggery. If you put the first coat on too thick, It will flake when smashed.

JP.
Get some Hornady oneshot case lube (pump bottle) give the bullets a spray and wait for a few minutes for it to dry. then size. HI-TEK makes a PTFE sizing lube that mixes with Metho and the bullets literally fall through the sizer die.

I have sized a .360 down to .356 with 2 fingers on the ram handle.

I use lanolin oil mixed with 99.9% isopropyl alcohol in spray bottles for case sizing, might that also work for the bullets? I don't know if you've seen the Youtube video of the German guy talking about his polymer paint coating, but he puts a dab of paste wax in the container with the bullets and swirls them around a bit afterwards, giving them a nice shine. Perhaps I'll also try that and see if it makes sizing easier.

EDIT: I just went and tried the lanolin. Worked like a charm, thanks for the idea. :)

[HI-TEK]

Has anyone had problems sizing their coated bullets? I've found that mine can be extremely difficult to size, and at one point one of the lag screws that hold my press to my workbench actually started stripping out. The most difficult ones tend to leave a "fin" along the base of the bullet after sizing.

The bullets are 0.3125" as-cast, and 0.315" after coating. I'm sizing them down to 0.310"

76882

Hi,
Can you please advise what alloy you are using?
Have you done a diameter test before and after coatings?
What calibre is your cast product?
Generally, thicker coats make sizing harder, and, the skirt at end is a typical effect due to hydraulic deformation.
I note, that despite skirt formation, the coating is still stuck.
You have done well with your coating process.
My first suggestion is to try to end up with a much thinner overall coating when finished, this should reduce sizing problems.
If you are sizing harder alloys, it may be more useful to use a product that Donnie has called 5000/IPA. This material applied as a spray will give you a dry film that will allow sizing the most difficult alloys and is clean and dry.
Alternatively, use the Extreme catalyst instead of normal catalyst.
This will make an extra slick coating that reduces sizing loads greatly.
I believe that Ausglock and Redrockant, has tested and tried these systems. May be you can ask them for their findings to see what was found as best way they used these materials.
I hope that I have answered your questions.

[Jumbopanda]

Hi,
Can you please advise what alloy you are using?
Have you done a diameter test before and after coatings?
What calibre is your cast product?
Generally, thicker coats make sizing harder, and, the skirt at end is a typical effect due to hydraulic deformation.
I note, that despite skirt formation, the coating is still stuck.
You have done well with your coating process.
My first suggestion is to try to end up with a much thinner overall coating when finished, this should reduce sizing problems.
If you are sizing harder alloys, it may be more useful to use a product that Donnie has called 5000/IPA. This material applied as a spray will give you a dry film that will allow sizing the most difficult alloys and is clean and dry.
Alternatively, use the Extreme catalyst instead of normal catalyst.
This will make an extra slick coating that reduces sizing loads greatly.
I believe that Ausglock and Redrockant, has tested and tried these systems. May be you can ask them for their findings to see what was found as best way they used these materials.
I hope that I have answered your questions.

Yeah the coating cured pretty well. 10 min in the oven didn't pass the acetone test, but 15 min did. I also did the smash test and they passed as well. I'm using an approximate hardball alloy, nothing too terribly hard.

A second ago I just went in the garage and tried Trevor's case lube suggestion on my remaining 158 bullets. I laid them out on a pan and gave them a few sprays, then went to size them. They sized extremely easily! I guess it wasn't much of a problem after all. :P

Trevor, do you remove the case lube from the bullets afterwards or does it not matter?

76884

[Ausglock]

No. I leave it on. The "oneshot" drys and doesn't effect accuracy or preformance.
The same with the HI-Tek ptfe lube. It drys and is no longer a problem.

I use 10 BHN alloy for my 45 bullets. The lee 230gr FP BB is a joy to size. as is the lee 230gr TL RN.
I machined the bevel base off the 200gr SWC and it does give a very small sizing skirt.

[HI-TEK]

Yeah the coating cured pretty well. 10 min in the oven didn't pass the acetone test, but 15 min did. I also did the smash test and they passed as well. I'm using an approximate hardball alloy, nothing too terribly hard.

A second ago I just went in the garage and tried Trevor's case lube suggestion on my remaining 158 bullets. I laid them out on a pan and gave them a few sprays, then went to size them. They sized extremely easily! I guess it wasn't much of a problem after all. :P

Trevor, do you remove the case lube from the bullets afterwards or does it not matter?

76884

They look great.
You have done well.
They are a very long wall profile projectiles compared to what I have seen many times before.
You would greatly benefit with the dry 5000/IPA lube.
Just by spraying just enough to form a ghostly film over you coated projectiles, your sizing load could halve and produce a very slick polished dry finished product.
Any way it seems that you are onto it and doing well.

[Jumbopanda]

Maybe tomorrow I'll try baking for 12-13 minutes and see how that does. As you can see the bullets are sort of a tan color instead of gold. I'm guessing it doesn't matter much, but gold bullets would be cool.

[HI-TEK]

Maybe tomorrow I'll try baking for 12-13 minutes and see how that does. As you can see the bullets are sort of a tan color instead of gold. I'm guessing it doesn't matter much, but gold bullets would be cool.

The Gold and other colours will go darker with baking.
The resin has strange property and goes from clear, to yellowish to tan, and to tan/brownish.
This will affect all chosen colours as you are looking through a tanned film and see a "composite" colour.
With all metallics, Gold, Red Copper, Bronze and others, it is very important to mix original container well before decanting small volumes, so you get a representative colour lot for coating.
Donnie had place a couple of projectiles in cans to help with mixing and shaking mixtures.
(Just like in aerosol paints there is a ball inside can so you can mix contents well)

Once the stuff is heat cured, any longer cooking times will tend to darken coating.
It would be interesting to see how you go with your extended times of cooking, and comparing current products..

[Gateway Bullets]

The resin has strange property and goes from clear, to yellowish to tan, and to tan/brownish.

Yep,that resin is a strange beast! I coated some projectiles and they turned out BLUE...... Lol Sorry Joe, just couldn't resist!

[BBQJOE]

Still working on things...
Yesterday I was thinking that maybe my alloy was too soft, because after two coats I was still getting leading. I made up a batch of harder alloy and water dropped. Changed the mix up to 5-1-7. Shot 10 rounds through the 9mm M&P and was still able to remove some lead dust from the barrel. Not ribbons or flakes, just lead dust.
Is this normal, or am I just almost there?
Maybe a third coat?

Sized to .357 3.5 gr 700x.

[bigfelipe]

Lucky!!

My casting kingdom is in my non temp controlled garage. Stifling in the summer (thank God for no humidity) and blistering cold in the winter.

Didn't get much casting and reloading done in December/January when we had 30 days where it never got above freezing and was in the negatives every night. Nothing like being coyote hunting, going to make a scope adjustment, and your glove freezes to the dial (had a bit of snow on the glove). -11 degrees at noon is great hunting weather!!

I just set my shed up a few days ago. New AC unit mounted in the wall as well as an exhaust hood. Already had heat. I'm ready to cast and cook in there now! Just about time to start running the red copper...

[BBQJOE]

I just found my answer. After the rush began and things were drying up, I ended up with a few pounds of 700x. I was told this would work. So I've spent all summer trying to work up loads with it for 9mm. Awful results with tumble lubes and even hi-tek. Lots of leading with tumbles and moderate leading with hi-tek. After trying everything I could think of, I decided to try switching powders, and tried my old faithful, unique.
No leading at all with the hi-tek!
Yay, happy dance!!!!

[Ausglock]

Still working on things...
Yesterday I was thinking that maybe my alloy was too soft, because after two coats I was still getting leading. I made up a batch of harder alloy and water dropped. Changed the mix up to 5-1-7. Shot 10 rounds through the 9mm M&P and was still able to remove some lead dust from the barrel. Not ribbons or flakes, just lead dust.
Is this normal, or am I just almost there?
Maybe a third coat?

Sized to .357 3.5 gr 700x.

Joe. load a few dummy rounds (no powder) and then pull the bullets with a puller hammer and see if there is ant exposed lead on the bullets after pulling.

I found that I could fire 11-12BHN alloy in 9mm with 2 coats at reasonable velocities. A friend tried the same bullets in his reloaded 9mm ammo and got leading. it turns out he didn;t have enough belling of the case mouths and the case was shaving the coating off the bullets as he was seating them. I like to have the bullet sit in the case mouth by at least 1mm. This stops anything getting shaved off the bullet.

Good news on the powder swap.
Have you tried Hodgden universal? it is actually made here in OZ and sold as AP-70. a very good 9mm powder. 4.2 to 4.4gr with a 125gr coated bullet.

[BBQJOE]

Good news on the powder swap.
Have you tried Hodgden universal? it is actually made here in OZ and sold as AP-70. a very good 9mm powder. 4.2 to 4.4gr with a 125gr coated bullet.
No problems with the belling, got that down. Powder is still hard to come by in the states. I've been sitting on my unique because it works perfect in all my guns, and obviously still does. Now it's time to try this coat on the 44.

[toddrod]

Black and Decker IIRC. Was a Walmart $39 special.

I am returning my oven, same as yours, because it would not go above 325 degrees. I verified with an oven thermometer.

[BBQJOE]

I am returning my oven, same as yours, because it would not go above 325 degrees. I verified with an oven thermometer.
Get the HB.
Winner, winner, chicken dinner!!!!

[Thompsoncustom]

I'm sure this has been covered somewhere but does anyone water drop there bullets after the last coating? I'm worried that water dropping after casting won't do any good because of the time/temp in the oven but if you could water drop after the final coat and not hurt the coating that sounds like a Win win.

[Ausglock]

I think leadman tested this. Maybe check his posts?

[Jumbopanda]

I gave it another shot today and did two coats of 10mL on 158 .30 cal 200gr bullets, then set the oven to 375 and baked for 12-13 minutes.

They came out great! They are a nice golden color instead of tan or brown.

For sizing I gave them four light sprays of case lube, shook them around, and then did another four sprays. You can barely tell there was any lube on them after sizing.

I also coated 9mm 110gr bullets with 6.25mL per 250 bullets. Two coats as well. They came out nicely, but I think I will use 7.5mL next time for a slightly thicker coating.

76948

[Ausglock]

JP. remember... thicker is not better. you are better to do 3 thin coats than 2 thick coats.
But, they look bloody great!!!

[gunoil]

Zoom thru some hi tek supercoat with this, it has bullet feeder. Next toy is mrbulletfeeder.net,, his collator. Then 6000 per hour. hehehehe. Yes, but i dont even have 6000 boolits. To lazy.

Came in yesterday:
http://i1113.photobucket.com/albums/k511/putt2012/8FFD035D-E501-463A-93E8-623C3E28AD32-5608-000005D44121E24E_zps13856895.jpg

Iam so damn lazy, and need my time,, gonna buy 1000 (unsized/unlubed) for 55$ then coat. Then run thru this beautiful machine.

Almost like being rich and buying Berrys or montana gold bullets. Hell maybe better, well a whole bunch of fun and enjoyment. And dont forget super speedy, so i can mow yard.

[redrockant]

Gunoil, please excuse my ignorance but is this a sizing machine? If so how much, what brand......please tell me more

[Ausglock]

Gunoil, please excuse my ignorance but is this a sizing machine? If so how much, what brand......please tell me more

It is a Star sizer made by Magma.

[gunoil]

Star, redrock! And this is delux w/ all acessories @$774.00 to the door. You see the bullet feeder, just fill tube with clean hi tek bullets. Tube can go to ceiling. Best would be to buy collator and fit to lube-sizer from mrbulletfeeder.net.. Hell, members put motors and even air assist on them.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wXbLxgJnBnI

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n8NdY15RstE

[redrockant]

It is a Star sizer made by Magma.

I thought they had a big **** shovel handle on them this looks neat. Trev do we need one?

[Ausglock]

I thought they had a big **** shovel handle on them this looks neat. Trev do we need one?

It will do the job. But it isn't an Auto-sizer. you can spend $$$ and try and convert it to Auto drive.
Have you been able to contact Malcolm Bone yet?

Gunslick: Do your sizer dies have lube holes in them or not?

[leadman]

I just got back from a mini vacation with the wife and granddaughter. Did not have time to heat treat the rifle boolits before we left. I will test my boolits from the previous posts on water quenching and heat treating tomorrow hopefully.

I have read where many of the posters are going to bake the Hi-Tek inside a building. After doing a preliminary reading of the Aussie MSDS sheet I do not think this is a good idea without some type of forced air hood or a respirator. I do mine outside and can see light smoke coming out of the ovens for the first 5 minutes or so. My garage has a 5,500 cfm evaporative cooler blowing into it and I also have another fan blowing the fumes towards the big door.

Maybe Hi-Tek can refresh us on the personal protection needed during this process.?? Would not want anyone to end up with health issues doing this.
Not picking on this product as any type of painting needs proper ventilation at some level.

I think when I have more data gathered I will make a seperate thread on my finds concerning water quenching and heat treating along with shooting results.

[Ausglock]

Leadman.
Good air flow is a must, as you stated.

I bake in my shed. However, I have the garage door open, both windows and the people door open as well. There are 2 whirlybirds on the roof and a ceiling fan set to blow upwards rather than downwards.
Since starting this fun coating, My oven has gone from silver stainless to vomit brown around the door and the glass is now dark brown too.

[Thompsoncustom]

Thanks for the update Leadman looking forward to your results.

[Jumbopanda]

Am I the only one who's getting very little in the way of fumes and odors while baking?

[prickett]

Iam so damn lazy, and need my time,, gonna buy 1000 (unsized/unlubed) for 55$ then coat. Then run thru this beautiful machine.


Who sells unsized/unlubed? I want to play around with HI-TEK and Piglet, but it's too hot to cast.

[Gateway Bullets]

I want to play around with HI-TEK and Piglet, but it's too hot to cast.

Amen....way to hot!

[leadman]

Jumbopanda, I can say for a fact that you do not have to be able to smell or see something to have it harm you. Hi-Tek is an engineer IIRC so he should be able to provide more definite answers on protection.
There are many things we deal with every day, like gasoline that we are so used to handling but with a little common sense we manage to do so without blowing ourselves up or passing out. Just think of it like this: Would I clean parts in my garage with the door closed and the propane heater going?

[bigfelipe]

Who sells unsized/unlubed? I want to play around with HI-TEK and Piglet, but it's too hot to cast.

I know Lucky13 Bullets in NC will if you call and ask...

[Ausglock]

Amen....way to hot!

No way... Just need a bigger Air/con unit.....

Leadman: Yep. I can't smell anything when baking, but the stains on the oven suggest that there is something bad coming out. better to be safe than sorry.

[HI-TEK]

Jumbopanda, I can say for a fact that you do not have to be able to smell or see something to have it harm you. Hi-Tek is an engineer IIRC so he should be able to provide more definite answers on protection.
There are many things we deal with every day, like gasoline that we are so used to handling but with a little common sense we manage to do so without blowing ourselves up or passing out. Just think of it like this: Would I clean parts in my garage with the door closed and the propane heater going?

Hi to you all,
Any coating, heating and curing of any coatings including paints and solvents, all require adequate ventilation to remove fumes.
Because of all the different set ups and places involved with use of the coatings, (solvent based or other) it is very difficult for me to address every situation.
All data supplied requires that adequate ventilation is used to minimise exposures to users and any fumes or vapours are exhausted from workplace.
If coatings are applied outside buildings, where there is no confinement of fumes or solvent vapours, care must still be exercised to ensure that users are not subjected to vapours or fumes from their process set up.
Solvent vapour masks, gloves, and protective clothes and glasses should be worn.
As people are using solvents, all care should be exercised, and taken, that no fires or possible explosions can result from vapours of fumes eminating from any processing.
Solvents used, are similar to Nail polish removal solvents, and is used in homes.
I always encourage safety aspects to all users of any solvent based systems and, even home paints are not nice materials, and, even some that are water based, as they also emit some vapours which are less evident.
All are encouraged to use safe practices.
(What is of note is that people are melting Lead, fluxing with various materials, of unknown compositions, as we all know, also emit toxic fumes. Aside from possibly burns from molten alloy spatter, and due to locations, some do it inside their shed, garages etc or outside, and people simply avoid exposure by fans or wind blowing away the fumes generated. Many don't use industrial type protective gear to protect themselves.)
If any one is wishing to get more information about any specific such matter, I would be happy to assist if I can, and where possible.

[gunoil]

Dont u guys size ever now and then? Iam putting a mrbulletfeeder.net on this thang! hehehehe. 3/4's of a 1000 dollar bill and aint even got hit pluged in to the wall. WHY? Because iam a running hi tek superclean bullets thru it. hehehehe. Ah,yea. Just wait bout a month or so and i will plug on the mrbulletfeeder.net to the wall. Now i know some of ye dont size. yea!
http://i1113.photobucket.com/albums/k511/putt2012/5DBD01F4-236F-47FD-AFFE-C748BF330DF1-5608-00000670819E1B1D_zps44155086.mp4

I love mashin' em thru the lil' hole. relief...

http://i1113.photobucket.com/albums/k511/putt2012/3EF3C6A8-556D-4517-8836-F5408E9B886C-5608-00000686BF95C1B8_zpsab4d727f.jpg


Sig938,g26,db-9,xds45,micro desert eagle,NAA2agnum,sub2000/40cal

[Ausglock]

Gunslick. Do the sizer dies still have the lube holes in them?????? or are they smooth without holes??

[leadman]

I size for some of my odd size boolits coated with HT in my RCBS luber sizer with the holy dies in it. LOL. No problems.

[gunoil]

Still have stock holes trev!

I took out rubber O-rings. Love it, near future gonna put collator on it from rick. Slicker than owl shat.

[Ausglock]

I tried sizing in a LAM2 and the die skimmed some coating off the bullet.

[leadman]

Some of the older dies for LamI and Lyman sizers did not have much if any taper on the top. This can be fixed with a dowel and emery paper.

[Ausglock]

got an 11.5mm reamer today. going to ream the lube groove out of a 45 SWC mold and see what happens.

[toddrod]

I returned that cheap BD oven this morning to Walmart and picked up the Oster oven instead. It made all the difference in my coating process. All my bullets are slick now and looking pretty. Much thanks goes out to HiTek and Donnie @ Bayou Bullets for bringing this great coating to the USA

[Just Call Me...G]

I gave it another shot today and did two coats of 10mL on 158 .30 cal 200gr bullets, then set the oven to 375 and baked for 12-13 minutes.

They came out great! They are a nice golden color instead of tan or brown.

For sizing I gave them four light sprays of case lube, shook them around, and then did another four sprays. You can barely tell there was any lube on them after sizing.

I also coated 9mm 110gr bullets with 6.25mL per 250 bullets. Two coats as well. They came out nicely, but I think I will use 7.5mL next time for a slightly thicker coating.

76948

Panda,

Those are some mighty fine looking boolits you got there.
What are you going to use them in?


G

[hawaii five-0]

O.K, I got my boolits coated with first coat of black. Have a new Hamilton Beach 31100 oven. Can I do more than one shelf at a time? If not, bottom shelf, or middle? Does it matter?

[gunoil]

i was told middle oven rack and one tray per cook. 5-O

[DrewTenney]

After I coat about 100 boolits with the hi tek, that come out perfectly pretty green, the second batch i make is all gummy and sticky and don't want to dry nice and even like the first batch... the green hi tek turns coppery ugly... and its not the heat, I've played around with that and made a perfect batch, then right after.. a dicked up one. suggestions?

[gunoil]

Out of your same mix bottle? I guess you shook it, 5-1-7 is a good mix. Put coats on super lite. Ive had good luck, i might get a bubble on one if i put to much on. Cut it more like trevor said.

Have you sen how much work, jigs, money, etc., goes into powder coating. Thats nuts.

[Ausglock]

Remember... this is water thin. it is better to put on too little than too much. you can always throw on a 3rd coat if needed.

I only cook on the middle shelf as the top and bottom heat elements are then equal distance from the bullets.
5-1-7 mix
Or 5-1-10 if you want colour down in the lube groove. Use a bit more at this mix ratio to swirl.

[leadman]

Sounds like the coating might not have been dried long enough. If the top surface of the coating is dry but the rest is still wet it will outgas and mess up the surface. Makes it look like it was boiled. If it is still sticky try removing it with acetone. If it won't come off bake it some more.
These boolits will still shoot fine, just look nasty. Yes, I did the same thing! LOL

[Jumbopanda]

Panda,

Those are some mighty fine looking boolits you got there.
What are you going to use them in?


G

300 Blackout subsonic loads

77202

[Ausglock]

Sweet looking little round. Great looking bullets.

Got the Lee 358 158gr RNF mold yesterday. going to cast some, coat some and size down to .356 and try these in the 357Sig.

[BBQJOE]

After a little over a week using hi-tek here are a few observations
GET AN OVEN THERMOMETER! These el-cheapo toaster ovens are all over the place temp wise. I keep one on the tray while baking, and I don't start timing it until the oven reaches 350°. Also a convection oven is best to keep the heat even.
Bullets like .38 and 9mm are easier to do than big bulky ones like 240 wad cutters. I had much better luck doing the 240's in a smaller tub like a margarine tub.
As Trevor said, 1 rack, in the middle.
Make sure that the bullets are completely dry before baking, they may feel dry, but quite often aren't. Use a fan. I've been using a fan for about 10 minutes, if the oven is just a little warm yet from a previous batch, I'll pop the bullets in for 5 minutes, then pull them back out while starting the oven again.
5-1-7 Gives better results than 5-1-5
SHAKE THE DAYLIGHTS OUT OF THE COLOR!
Put a few bullets in the can, and SHAKE, SHAKE, SHAKE! When you think you are done shaking, shake some more.

DON'T GET IN A RUSH!

I've had excellent results in 9mm with this. I was having awful results with .44 with tumble lubing. I think I must have scrubbed 10 or 11 pounds of lead out of my S&W 629 today.
I then ran some 240's through it using hi-tek, and all was well.
Anyone who's sitting on the fence is just wasting their time with anything else.
Get a half liter and try it! A half liter will easily coat 12,000 bullets.

Take all your beeswax and paraffin, and give it to the kids to make candles!

[gunoil]

What he⬆ said. Alox can flux your lead pot. Dont get in the alox smoke, it says cancer on the bottle. Alox smells like sompins z$$. eeeeeeh.

[kdiver58]

I purchased 1/2 liter of the green and 1/2 liter of the red/bronze to share with a friend of mine. I'm hoping he will post his results and will not steal his thunder. He did all of the work. He put together an acid test. The results were over the top good. I'm sold.

Below is his post. I spent a lot of time looking down the bore of the scoped 44 . I went land by land and groove by groove . I drew pictures of what I saw and the locations of the old fouling. When he got done the bore was squeaky clean. The concussive force of the loads could be felt in the bench and the resulting fireball was impressive. If anything was going to vaporize the back of the bullet and deposit in the bore this would have. These boolits were BERM RANGE lead. We had to leave and meet up with other people so the only thing we didn't do was tunnel in the berm and find one of the boolits.

[jmoore]

Howdy! Thanks to y'all's inputs a friend and I decided to give this coating a try. The first attempt resulted in way too much coating on the test 429421 boolits (discovered after reading Trevor's posts back on roughly page 20 of this thread), probably 0.0015" per side, some minor chipping after sizing to 0.432" and a less than smooth appearance on the unsized areas.:
77225
Before sizing. Lower boolit has one "too heavy" coat, the upper, two.

77212

So what to do as a first test? Load up some .44 Magnum rounds with a maximum charge of 2400 and see what happens! No sense wasting time up close, why not just let fly at 50 yards (off a rest)?
7721677217
Target is on the frame just to the right of the walkway.

Scope zero wasn't far off, but it took a little time for the revolver to settle down (started with a previously fouled bore). But after getting somewhat on the 2" square, several five shot groups were fired out of the circa 1989 S&W 629.

77215
First five after getting basic zero at 50 yards

Here's the target after 20 rounds!:

77214


Oh, what's fairly amazing is that the coating removed the old fouling and a bit of leading from "old style" rounds fired previously. At the end, the bore was quite shiny, even with fairly soft bullets driven as fast as ~20 grains of 2400 would drive them.

Here's an unrested group shot by my friend at 25 yards. It's his first time shooting this revolver to boot. (Feel free to comment on the "festivities" kdiver58!):
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Thanks again, and I hope this first post on the forum is at least a little useful for some fence sitters. If the first attempt was this good, imperfections and all, I can't wait to see how it goes when we get the process down pat...

[seedeeze]

Can one mix colors? Say i want to mix gold with the copper to get something different. I think it would be okay but better to a be sure.

[gunoil]

Great post jmoore, thanks! I have set up for 44 magnum with dies and such, just need money for pistol. Keep posting and give us tips and pics. Maybe how your oven is set up.

[HI-TEK]

Can one mix colors? Say i want to mix gold with the copper to get something different. I think it would be okay but better to a be sure.

Hi,
Thanks for your post.
Folk here have mixed colours for years, to get that "special" colour of effect.
Some coat with one thin colour, then recoat with another colour. It all works.
Secret is use thinned dilute coatings, that way you use minimum amount of coating and with multiple coats you cover the lead any way and with adequate film.
Just make sure that it is well baked between each coat.
All should be well.
Having a reliable thermometer is a very good idea as you need temperatures to be correct when baking.

[jmoore]

Great post jmoore, thanks! I have set up for 44 magnum with dies and such, just need money for pistol. Keep posting and give us tips and pics. Maybe how your oven is set up.

After reading of the oven dramas in this thread i went and spent the extra $30 or so and got the $85 Oster oven with the digital display at Target. (Kind of a creepy place for one that rarely shops there, or is it just me?)

http://www.target.com/p/oster-digital-toaster-oven-stainless-steel-black/-/A-13773422#prodSlot=medium_1_2&term=convection+oven

It heats up quickly and the fan seems to keep the temp fairly uniform across the rack. (As observed by watching boolits cook.)

I think one secret to getting the .44 to shoot is ensuring the expander is sized to the bullet diameter. Most expander plugs run ~0.426" dia. Fine for jacketed bullets, but wretched for anything but the hardest cast boolits!
The HI TEK coating will help I think in getting those revolvers with 0.432"+ cylinder throats to shoot at maximum potential, particularly with the red copper, etc. formulations. My intent is to work up a good IHMSA Field Pistol load for some .44s. Velocities won't be all that high, but the last targets shot are at 100 yards, so accuracy needs to be good through the entire match! That's been the challenge to date with cast boolits: developing a load that shoots extremely well even after a long string of fire. I quit shooting IHMSA for about ten years and have just jumped back in a few months ago. Have learned more in the past 3 months than i did in 3-4 years of previous wranglings in the largely "pre-interwebs" days. But aside from this forum, it's been mostly a hard look at the equipment and doing lots of measuring.

[gunoil]

yea, lite loads for 100 yrd. See if donnie will throw ya a bone and answer some ?'s. After all, his brother is jerry miculek. Or if ya aint the phone type, just email.

[Just Call Me...G]

300 Blackout subsonic loads

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That is the Hi-Tek 'gold' correct?
2 coatings of the 10ml, correct?

Whose boolit mold?...looks like the NOE 311365

Are you planning on launching said projectile through a suppressor?
Looks excellent, BTW


G

[Love Life]

AHHHH!! You're killing me smalls (directed at everybody already enjoying the HI-TEK)!! I have my red copper sitting in the house and I will be running my first batch on Sunday.

I'll be coating the NOE 454-230-RN H&G clone, and about 20 lbs of 358429 boolits.

[prickett]

Are any colors harder or easier to coat with than other colors?

[gunoil]

What prickett said⬆ ... Wait til "nano technology" gets ingrained into HTS.

http://i1113.photobucket.com/albums/k511/putt2012/C124C2CA-2F9A-43DC-9C12-08A904C56307-169-000000D19D2AFC22_zpsfced870f.jpg

[kweidner]

Are any colors harder or easier to coat with than other colors?


The gold is easier to read as far as too much time in the oven than the black. I was having problems with the black at first as I was using too much soak time. Becasu it was black you can't get a very good read if you are approaching too much time heat etc. Perfected timing watching the gold. It turns chocolate if baked too much. Took what I learned and applied it to the black and all is well.

[Ausglock]

There is some amazing results here. You blokes are doing bloody great.
I did some 230gr RN 45 bullets with red/copper first and then the green second coat. this gave a Camo coloured bullet.

I like coating with the Rose red. it is a very good colour and easy to coat with. The new Gold is also good, but needs to be shaken and added instantly to the bucket of bullets. The fire engine red is getting tested tomorrow. I'm waiting for the sky blue to arrive so I can coat some and post a few photos.
I had a play with some black powder coat powder and acetone this arvo...What a blood nightmare!!!! doesn't mix. clumps together and clumps on the bullets, sticks to the drying trays and leaves tray marks on the bullets. After cooking, the bloody coating (if you can call it that) is soft.

I gave it away as a bad joke. If people want to play Mad scientist with powder coating, then bloody good luck to them.

I will be sticking to the HTS.

After-all we are here to cast, lube and fire bullets for fun. Not pretend to be a chemical engineer.

[redrockant]

Todays colours
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