Some gunshops are not much different than a used car lot.

[Tackleberry41]

We all know a few shops, the overpriced ones, the ones who were more than willing to gouge people on 22LR. Or the old saying 'you have it its junk, they have it its gold'.

Was over at a friends for the holiday, he works at a gunshop, telling me how cool his boss is. They were doing a black friday sale. Have decided I simply cant learn to like Glock. So was looking to get rid of my G23 for another 40cal. But something I can get a barrel for in 357 SIG. He tells have just what I want, a S&W M&P compact in 40, been there a while, so could make me a good deal. So sure I'll swing by. I know not all shops are this way, where the only fair deal is where they have screwed you over. It was a chance to get rid of a gun they can't move for one they can move easy. Many love glocks, I have tried just can't. The S&W has the ambi slide release, fits the hand good. And the 2 guns are pretty much the same price. Wasn't like it was just a used G23 traded for a new gun. I still have the box and everything that came with it, 3 extra mags, a conversion barrel to 357. Full length guide rod, spare springs, had put aftermarket trigger parts in it, but still had all the factory stuff. A paddle holster and mag carrier. None going to do me any good I get rid of my only glock. Oh he explained he has to make money, I never ask for anything but a fair deal. Not one who stands there and beats them up for extras. He went thru the spiel about his cost blah blah blah, as if I have no idea how a business works. And would guess if the 2 pistols retail for the same price, the dealer price is going to be really close. The exact same holster may be $40 over on his wall, but out of the package is only $5. Didn't matter about it had all the extra parts people generally go buy, and NOBODY will want the extra caliber.

So being a black friday sale, plus best friend of his employee. He would do me a favor of taking my gun and all the extra stuff, all I needed was another $120, and I got the other pistol with...well the way it comes from the supplier. His price on the M&P was $552 before taxes and transfer, stopped at my LGS last night, where Im just a shmuck off the street, no sale going on. Same pistol, $540 out the door. And will very likely trade me.

Some may say I was expecting to much. But the same shop had a used SIG556 on the wall. Looked like a cool rifle $1200. Well only thing I have is my HK33 I could trade, not like I need another 5.56 semi auto. Its not a century built gun, but MKE under license by H&K since HK doesn't even make them anymore. So a factory built rifle. Only imported for 2 yrs, so not exactly alot of them running around. Those who keep up would know they are not easy to find and are not cheap. Plus I have a pile of magazines, again not cheap, the factory ones are close to $100 ea. Well hes gotta make money, so my $1400 rifle, plus $300 in mags, $500 cash and I could have his $1200 rifle. He acted like he could only realistically put that HK in the rack for $1000, what the book said, the mags had no value.

I wonder if part of it is simple prejudice, not skin color. But there are some who only like certain things, anything else is not worth having. He asked what the knob up by the front sight was..um the cocking handle, so extensive knowledge of the rifle. They sell lots of AR-15s, some in the rack, parts, plus assemble custom ones. Yea a pmag for an AR is $10 so not much of a deal breaker, for a HK33 their a big deal. Him and my friend are all things AR, very traditional, he owns glocks, thats it. A Rem 700 as what else you gonna buy? Hes also the same friend who pretty much refuses to use cast bullets in anything. Had his boss not been there probably would have traded me the pistol.

[mold maker]

Pretty much sums up most of the shops round here. They say business is slow. Wonder why?
OTOH A shop across the river has a big parking lot and folks carrying purchases all day long. Much better prices and NO
BS.
Just goes to show, you don't always get what ya pay for, but you do pay for what ya get.

[fatnhappy]

caveat emptor

[WILCO]

I always vote with my wallet.

[DerekP Houston]

sad to say, this is why most of my collection has come from online purchases. I tried the gun show route and lgs/pawn shops. For the price they asked and the run around/dismissive attitude towards certain brands I just ignored em. I use the local ranges at the stores, they are great, but I'm not going to pay 100-200 markup on another gun. Even with shipping and ffl transfer I come out ahead. Some places here are selling used guns for ~10-20 under brand new online...

[Buck Neck It]

I used to buy my guns from "Leroy", but I see that he just got busted in Colorado Springs...

[popper]

Pretty much like used car lots, waiting for a sucker to come by.

[Love Life]

That's why I usually sell private party.

[lancem]

Pretty much why I quit trading in guns a while ago. Easier to sell it outright and then use the cash to buy what I want. Then again it seemed that too many times I had seller's remorse and now just keep adding to the collection instead of changing it around anymore.

[Tackleberry41]

Its an odd thing, known the guy I guess 14 yrs, have yet to buy or a gun from him or thru him. Hes been working at gunshops for the last several years. Talks alot, but have yet to get more than the most basic accessory thru him. Usually having a friend in a gun shop is a good way to get deals. I do know how a gun shop operates, place near me is always selling guns, but has great prices, he goes with volume. Other places figure they have to squeeze every penny out of you. Theres another place here, I go to occasionally, never bought anything but reloading stuff or archery stuff from them. Overpriced on guns, and very snobby about what they do sell. They don't have it its junk.

Not sure on his boss, says hes a good guy, but didn't feel that way. Would have thought 'hey your Johns friend the one who does all the crazy reloading and builds guns, maybe some projects we can help each other out with'. But it was more of just another jerk I need to screw over. May be some political drama going on, their both very very conservative, me and my friend do not see eye to eye on some things. Its not a big deal to me, everybody is entitled to their opinion on things, not so much with him. I noticed he has CNN and the other 'liberal media' blocked out on his TV. And I do think part of it is gun snobbery. People can be that way. Their both very big fans of the AR15, what else would you possibly own, he always says I have 'weird' guns.

[375supermag]

Pretty much why I quit trading in guns a while ago. Easier to sell it outright and then use the cash to buy what I want. Then again it seemed that too many times I had seller's remorse and now just keep adding to the collection instead of changing it around anymore.

Never was much into trading guns...

Like this poster...I just keep adding to the collection.

I bought a new S&W M&P 40 earlier this year ...something new, first polymer gun, first .40S&W, etc. I am pretty much a SA/DA revolver, 1911 .45ACP kinda guy, but thought I can try out this innovative 21st century stuff and then trade it on something SA revolver style after I satisfy my curiosity.

Yeah...that worked out great. I now am quite impressed with the M&P to the point where I am considering using it a a carry piece. It is accurate and recoil is very manageable and the cartridge has adequate power for self-defense needs. It isn't going anywhere. In fact a couple of drop-in barrels (9mm and 357Sig) are a distinct possibility, if I don't just buy another M&P in one or both of those calibers.

My little experiment with polymer handguns just pushed back my plan for a matched set of Uberti .45Colt Cattleman revolvers for at least a year.

[bedbugbilly]

That's pretty much the same type of experience that I've had at different times with some gun shops. In AZ, I hit a few pawn shops and was amazed at no only their lack of knowledge but the whopping prices they had on some handguns and rifles and they wouldn't budge on price. Of course they've been sitting in the case or rack for two or more years and they complain about how poor business is. I have on gun shop here that I've done some trades with and they always seem to be fair about it. It makes a difference if both parties are satisfied instead of just one and the other party feeling like they got screwed. I made up my mind a long time ago to take my business elsewhere if the attitude is that they are doing me a favor . . whether it be gun trading or buying reloading supplies, etc. Those that gouged (and still do) on the ammo during the shortage can go fly a kite as far as I'm concerned. I was in business many years and I always treated my customers with fairness and sometimes plus that . . . that's what keeps them dedicated customers.

[castalott]

I have an understanding with my FFL...I say "How much out the door?" He then knows I'm serious and gives me a good price without any hassles. I either take it or not.. usually say "yes". He likes the fact that I don't haggle with him at all. Saves him and me time.

I spent an afternoon there visiting with friends and observed a guy who was trying to beat him down another $25. It went on all afternoon.. like the depth charging of a WW2 submarine. At the end of the day "owner" had enough and recommended 2 other shops not far away.

Normally "owner' is friendly ,happy kind of guy but that day he was drained and nervous. I asked him if he liked the way we did things and the answer was "YES".

[AK Caster]

Everyone has an opinion of what a fair trade in price would be. And everyone knows you always end up with more $$ if you sell out right then buy what you want.

[Tackleberry41]

Im not one to haggle on price. Nor one to stand there and beat them up for accessories to make the deal more one sided. I know a guy who he is simply not happy until you are holding the smelly end of the stick. He will haggle forever to get just a little more out of you. Now if he has it of course, well your going to pay full retail plus a little extra. I learned long ago that we simply will not have any sort of dealing like that. You only get to stiff me so many times before I learn my lesson. But I am a fair man, if you have a tag on a gun and I think its a fair price, here's the money. I want a holster I will buy one, or an extra magazine, or a box of ammo.

I see people go into shops and think a partial box of rifle ammo somehow makes their gun worth more. Whats the shop going to do with it? Who knows if its factory or not? Whats somebody going to do with 14rds of some brand they don't sell anymore? I watched an older guy one day trading a gun at the place near me, he had a full box of ammo, but of 6 different brands of ammo 'that should be worth something'. No not really, its going in the trash can, no he figured it should add $20 to his trade as thats what it cost on the shelf.

Some gun shops just don't seem to understand that theres this thing called the internet. That they can jack up their prices and you won't have any choice but to buy it. And some shops will sit on a gun for a long time to get that price they wanted. I would think it would be better to make a little less to move it, then stock something you can sell easier. My friend told me the S&W had been there a while, just couldn't find a buyer, tho might have something to do with that extra $50 piled onto the price. Where the glocks fly out the door, so he moves a gun he can't move, and gets one he can. But still felt he had to make $120 cash off me, then again when he sold the trade in. He of course acted like 'well the holster is not worth anything, and Ill have to throw the parts in the trash, along with the barrel'. When we all know they would end up in somebody elses gun or one of his, the spare mags would be sold off.

He finally found a sucker to buy the mosin, I had looked at it before, maybe should have kept my mouth shut. I was looking for one, looked it over, told my friend this is probably a Finnish rifle. But it wasn't very pretty, big chunk of wood spliced in under the action in the stock. And the bore was junk, would tear up patches it was so rough. So its a parts gun. No its a Finnish rifle so he put it out for almost $300. Took a while but somebody paid him for it. My friend was asking if I was interested in an Enfield, meh..maybe. Not for $450.

[Col Tom]

My LGS treats people right. I don't make a habit of selling my guns, but I took advantage of Ruger's LC9 trade-up offer to a LC9s ($100 gift certificate from Ruger after you've made your best trade-in deal). I first went to my LGS, told him what I wanted. The appraiser (not the owner) told me what the LC9 was worth to them (not much). I said I'd check with the big box store (almost an hour's drive away) since I was headed that way and asked the LGS to call if they could up my trade-in (he said he'd speak with the owner). The big box appraiser offered me $40 less on the trade than my LGS--so even though they had the LC9s on sale, I would lose more than I would accept. As I left the store, my LGS appraiser called. He said the owner wanted me as a regular customer, so he'd split the difference in the original offer. He also matched the big box sale price. It cost me $25 to "trade up" after the Ruger promotion. Other folks have similar stories. This LGS is owned by a retired Illinois state trooper. All his help is either retired law enforcement or retired military. They also run an indoor range (where I buy my range scrap for smelting lead to cast boolits). They're proponents of concealed carry and all-around good, decent folks. Guess I'll stay a regular.

P.S. Every time I walk in there now, the LGS counter guy/appraiser (a retired Marine) likes to tell me that they still have my "****" LC9 (it was like new-in-box) in the showcase and whether I'd like to buy it back for a good price. I tell him I wouldn't have an LC9, I have the LC9s, to which he counters: "That's the problem--no one wants an LC9 anymore!" I just smile and agree.

[MBTcustom]

Unfortunately, **** rolls down hill. All the people the shop owner has to pay are interested in only one thing that that is money, an lots of it. Being in the gun business myself, I have had to come to grips with the fact that I can't go to the IRS with a really cool rifle to pay my taxes. Can't go to the gas or electricity company with a Glock and 5 magazines and keep the lights and heat on for another month. Can't pour 100 rounds of 45ACP out on the counter to buy half a tank of gas.
Money is what keeps the doors open. It doesn't matter how fair the trade is if you've got people breathing down your neck with their hands in your pockets looking for money, the guy trying to trade is just wasting time (no offence).
That's the problem. Business can't happen without cash flow, and cash is something that both the LGS and the gun owner/buyer are badly short on at the moment. It's tough to be in business to cater to people's leisure activities, when there's no money floating around for people to enjoy their down time with.
Just try selling the stuff you were hoping to trade him, and see how cutthroat the market is. You go in there with cash (whatever you could get for your used gun), and he'll deal. His job is to move guns, so if he just trades, he's doing nothing but treading water while the business fails.
Get on gunbroker and see what people are asking for their used stuff and ask yourself if it's worth it to you to pay their asking price. Nope. You'll crawl over gunbroker from top to bottom and buy the cheapest gun that matches what you're looking for, looks functional, and you'll feel like you got shafted when the deal is done, and so does the seller.
Gun shop owners do not have time to play those games.
Sucks, but there it is. I sure hope things will lighten up a bit one day.

[FISH4BUGS]

Every potential buyer has the obligation to figure out what the object of his purchase is generally going for in the market. Pay attention to GB, all the on line sources, the gun shops on line, the gun magazines, other gun shops, and get a feel for what it is worth.
I went to a large gun shop in Kittery Maine and looked at a NICE S&W 1905 fourth change Hand Ejector M&P Target that they wanted $1295 for. It was a 98% gun with some small scratches on the side plate. I passed and asked nicely if they will keep that price. They said yes, because it just came in. I knew it wasn't worth that and because I know these guys, told them so...nicely of course.
A week later a 96% S&W M&P Fourth Change Hand Ejector Target was advertised as part of a large ad in Shotgun News by another dealer for $495. Sold!
You have to know what something is worth and what you are willing to pay for it. You may pay a bit of a premium for condition, accessories, options, etc. but you still have to know. If you are paying a premium, then you need to know how much of one. Not what the dealer says but what YOU say. You are the customer. You are driving the bus here, not the dealer.
Like Claudius was told by King Harrod just as he thrust the knife into Claudius' back.....trust no one.

[Tackleberry41]

Unfortunately, **** rolls down hill. All the people the shop owner has to pay are interested in only one thing that that is money, an lots of it. Being in the gun business myself, I have had to come to grips with the fact that I can't go to the IRS with a really cool rifle to pay my taxes. Can't go to the gas or electricity company with a Glock and 5 magazines and keep the lights and heat on for another month. Can't pour 100 rounds of 45ACP out on the counter to buy half a tank of gas.
Money is what keeps the doors open. It doesn't matter how fair the trade is if you've got people breathing down your neck with their hands in your pockets looking for money, the guy trying to trade is just wasting time (no offence).
That's the problem. Business can't happen without cash flow, and cash is something that both the LGS and the gun owner/buyer are badly short on at the moment. It's tough to be in business to cater to people's leisure activities, when there's no money floating around for people to enjoy their down time with.
Just try selling the stuff you were hoping to trade him, and see how cutthroat the market is. You go in there with cash (whatever you could get for your used gun), and he'll deal. His job is to move guns, so if he just trades, he's doing nothing but treading water while the business fails.
Get on gunbroker and see what people are asking for their used stuff and ask yourself if it's worth it to you to pay their asking price. Nope. You'll crawl over gunbroker from top to bottom and buy the cheapest gun that matches what you're looking for, looks functional, and you'll feel like you got shafted when the deal is done, and so does the seller.
Gun shop owners do not have time to play those games.
Sucks, but there it is. I sure hope things will lighten up a bit one day.

Yes we have all heard this time and time again, nobody else can possibly understand what its like. I really doubt its a whole lot different than any other business, the kind many of us have had or have now. You buy things, then sell them for a profit. But gun buyers are the business, no time for them? Its funny as you will go into a gun shop and theres several guys sitting there, talking not buying anything, plenty of time for them. We all understand cash flow, but most businesses seem to operate in some vacuum. Their cash flow, nobody else exists, they get mad when a distributor talks cash flow with them or the bank or anybody else. I have tried to explain to bosses in the past that I need cash to pay my bills, free work for customers may work out great for the dealership, but does not pay my bills. They just shrug their shoulders and as it was explained to me once 'thats just the way #@&* is, go somewhere else if you don't like it'.

Customers are the business. People who can easily buy guns off the internet or other places. So treating a customer right is what gets them coming back. Yea a place might make more on single sales and that guy never comes back after feeling a bit used. Or make a reasonable profit on something and people will come back. I saw someone on here saying CDNN had a sale on a rifle I was wanting, yea it was considerably cheaper. But that won't keep that shop near me open, so I paid a little more for one they had in the rack, cash flow. The place I go, has very fair prices, ones I do not haggle over, or spend time arguing over extras. And he has gotten lots of repeat business from me, he takes the time. I joked with him today, he still doesn't just keep copies of the paperwork already filled out for me. The deal that the gun shop Fri figured they had to screw me just a little extra, the one I turned down. Guess it really wasn't that unfair, LGS around the corner made a straight up trade on an actually more expensive gun than the S&W I was looking at. No haggling, no explaining how business works, or what I had was junk. He thought it was fair, so did I, both sides are happy. So that other shop lost out on that business plus future business, not very good for the cash flow.

[trapper9260]

As for me I do not trade or sell any of my guns ,what ever that is. But I deal with a gunsmith to get some things work on and fix and also buy some off of him and He told me how it is and i do to him and he helps me out on what ever i need and some times he give me a deal on thing and some other times if he know for how something is he can not sell because it been open he ask me if I can use it and if so it is yours.Also if I do not have all the money off the hand he will just let me pay what i can till it is paid off and no interest and then after out the door I go with it.He dose not do that with that many he told me because some have burn him on some things and he was stuck with the item. I did get 2 guns from him ,from 2 different people done that to him and one of them he cut me a good deal to get it off his hands.If I go with buying from someone privet I go with someone I know pretty well and also make sure I get a paper that I bought it from them and all and call it good after.