First attempt failure

[Sneakybuffalo]

Skip to Update:Round 4- Bullets...sorta

So, I tried casting for the first time today. I have about 20 lbs. of lead. I put it all in a pot on a Coleman single-burner propane stove outside for about an hour. It was gorgeous outside as we had a cold front come through, so I thought it would be a nice day to sit outside and cast. However, it was really windy and since it's a cold front, that means lower atmospheric pressure,but I live in south Louisiana so I doubt the pressure matters. I let it burn for nearly an hour and didn't even get any bottom melt. I know these things are more than capable of melting lead, so I'm trying to determine what factors led to failure to melt.

So some of my thoughts are:
-too thick pot
-too windy
-too much lead

Would putting a lid on the pot help or is that a bad idea?

Any input from the more experienced would be appreciated.



Update: Round 2

So, I was able to successfully melt my lead down today. Thanks for all the input everyone. However, I have now run into a new issue. I was pouring the lead into a 16 small muffin tin using a large spoon since I didn't have a ladle. It took way too long and now I have about 8 lead ingots stuck in the tin. How do I get them out?

I was thinking of cooking them in my toaster oven at max for about 15 mins.

Would that do the trick?

Also, the muffin tin can't handle the weight of all that lead so in the future I will only fill it halfway.

Update: Round 3

So, once I got home, I played around with the tin full of lead and it turns out that all I had to do was pry at it a bit and then they would make a little popping sound and slide right out.

Not the prettiest set of ingots, but they are mine. Now for the next adventure: boolits



Update:Round 4- Bullets...sorta

Right now I'm going with ladle as its cheaper and money is tight as I'm looking for a job post graduation atm. Plus, I like learning the hard way first.

I did try casting some boolits earlier today. They were pretty much all rejects. And i ruined the rest with a failed powder coat attempt lol. Ill post pics later. I need to work on my setup a bit.

I need a smaller pot so I can do small batches as that one is just too big if all I want to cast is a couple pounds at a time. I also need to work on ergonomics as kneeling/sitting on the ground is rough.

This seems to be some pretty good lead though. After water dropping, my fingernail doesn't make the slightest indention in the lead. Guess ill need to look up the pencil test and see if that would tell me more.

Also, after sizing the reject bullets, it seems I am getting drops anywhere from .307 to .310 with most being .308 or .309. I haven't slugged my bore, so I'm not even sure what I want to be shooting for, but that still sounds like a problem.

Is that a heat issue? Tin issue? Grip on the mold issue? Any ideas?

[ShooterAZ]

Not enough heat and not enough time. Putting a lid does help. Try again...

[RogerDat]

Wind is the enemy. Blows the burner heat away from the pot and blows the pot heat away too. Any sort of wind screen, even some scrap wood should help.
Been my experience that a lid will help, just make sure you can remove it to flux. Welding gloves, hook etc.

You don't say what fuel your single burner stove uses but my coleman using coleman fuel can melt plain lead. Better than the electric hot plate.
Size pot to burner, you want the entire flame to be on the pot bottom, not running up the sides when the stove is on high.

My guess is on the wind being the main issue unless your stove was too small.

If you have a propane torch hit the lead with that after its warmed up by the burner, liquid lead in the bottom does a better job of heat transfer.

[spfd1903]

Have used a Coleman single burner many times. May have lost too much heat to the wind, and a lid always helps.

[wbrco]

+1 on wind. As relative newbie as well, I had some of the same problems. Make sure your tank is full and pumped up good. Don't try to run 2 burners. Even with blocking the wind, it will still take 15 or 20 minutes to get the first melt going.

[Dusty Bannister]

If that is an aluminum sauce pan, read about the hazards of melting lead in aluminum. Get something stronger.

[longbow]

Hard to tell what the pot is but if aluminum I second Dusty Bannister's comment.

I use a propane two burner stove and have for many years. Before that I used a Coleman camp stove. Had a bottom pour pot for a while but didn't like it. I am a confirmed ladle caster. I also cast outiside and in much lower temperatures than you will ever see in Louisiana. I have cast at -15 degrees C so pretty chilly and had no problems. I use a 25 lb. cast iron pot on the propane stove and ladle cast.


As stated, a lid will help and also what I have done for many years is that I got an old tin can and cut the end out so it is a tube that fits around my pot and helps hold heat against the pot sides as well as being a wind deflector. Depending on your pot size a 1 gallon paint can should work. It makes quite a difference in melting time. An insulated tube would be even better.

Longbow

[jonp]

Wind. You also might cruise to a yardsale or wal mart and get a stainless steel pan. I have melted lead on a hotplate several times with no problem so the heat is enough for sure

[Sneakybuffalo]

Update on round 2 in the OP.

[fouronesix]

You may have some soldering to the muffin tins or since they are thin may have dents thus mechanical lockage. I know quite a few use them, but thin muffin tins are not very good for ingot molds. Usually cast iron ingot molds are best. Some use the cast iron cornbread (ear corn shaped) molds. To go cheap and for smaller quantities of lead you can even fashion ingot molds out of scrap wood 2x4s. Or get some heavy angle iron, cut to desired lengths and weld ends on.

If all else fails bite the bullet and buy a real ingot mold- Lee, RCBS or similar and look around for a good, heavy ladle.

[Tallbald]

I myself went ahead and bought the Lyman cast iron lead melting pot for under $20. I figured I'd waste that much in gasoline lookng around town for a stainless or cast iron pot that would do. Additionally, there's the ability to pour directly from the pot to the ingot mold with the purpose-made lead melting pot. It's one less chance for a mishandle to cause me a splash of liquid lead that I figured I'd risk transferring to the mold with a spoon or ladle.
I use a two burner 1979 vintage Coleman fuel camp stove. The lid and sides keep wind away nicely. I do use a steel expanded piece though on the stove grid because the wide spacing of the steel factory grid can make the pot tip if it gets moved wrongly to the side. it's a safety concern to me. I can melt a 10 pound pot of soft lead in about 10 minutes with the flame high, even though flames do sneak up the side of the pot a lot. I find that leaving a half inch of melted lead in the bottom instead of pouring all of it out each time makes the new added lead melt a lot faster (undoubtedly old news to everyone else here). For ingot molds I use small 2.5 ounce stainless steel condiment cups from Walmart attached to a hardwood board through drilled holes with bolts (I learned this from another post I researched here on the forum). I'm not cheap----I'm frugal. Enjoy the learning experience with casting. I have yet to cast my first slug, but now have everything I need and will start before really cold weather hits. Don.

[GP100man]

I agree ,if that`s an aluminum pot stop using it NOW !!

Any kind of steel pot will work , I still use a 2qt SS pot to do small smelts & 2 pots made of scrape 8" pipe 5" deep.
When melted & cleaned I grab the side with a pair of visegrips & pour into my angle iron molds ,if ya make some be sure to put a bit of draft (angle) on the ends so the ingot will come loose .

I learned mostly by reading & trial error (started in `83)but the 1 tool I wish I`d purchased earlier is a good lead thermometer. The 1 NOE sells is as good as they come .

Now as far as the ingots ya have ,they look clean , but 1 thing I saw was some cratering on a few (the first 1s I bet) , that means the molds weren't dry & moisture was trapped underneath, in the future heat ya molds (ya can see the moisture flash off) to insure they`re completely dry., same goes when adding cold ingots to a hot melt ,heat em to dry em . It`s when we force moisture under the surface of a melt we get into trouble with the tinsel fairy !!!!

Yrs ago an old shooter/caster told me when workin with hot alloy keep EVERYTHING hot (he was talkin `bout dryness) & you`ll be OK.

1 bad mistake I made early in my casting quest was I`d drop bad boolits back into the pot directly , Don`t do it !! I was having to stop & clean molds `bout every 10th pour & splashed lead is kinda hard to remove !

Anyways you`re off to a good start ! Just a reminder wear your safety equipment , even if I don`t !!

While it`s on my mind I will ask, if your think which way to pour boolits ladle or bottom pour , in my opinion bottom pour is safer & cleaner , a lot less splashing going on .

Enuff for now .

GP

[Sneakybuffalo]

Right now I'm going with ladle as its cheaper and money is tight as I'm looking for a job post graduation atm. Plus, I like learning the hard way first.

I did try casting some boolits earlier today. They were pretty much all rejects. And i ruined the rest with a failed powder coat attempt lol. Ill post pics later. I need to work on my setup a bit.

I need a smaller pot so I can do small batches as that one is just too big if all I want to cast is a couple pounds at a time. I also need to work on ergonomics as kneeling/sitting on the ground is rough.

This seems to be some pretty good lead though. After water dropping, my fingernail doesn't make the slightest indention in the lead. Guess ill need to look up the pencil test and see if that would tell me more.

[butch2570]

When making your ingots in a tin muffin pan you need to dump the muffins out as soon as the last muffin you poured has solidified enough to support pushing on it with a large spoon without the spoon sinking into the ingot . Try it , and see if that doesn't do the trick for ya.. Mine pop out easily doing this , but if they cool off too much they seize into the pan.

[Sneakybuffalo]

Yeah, the last 4 I poured popped out fine. The rest had been sitting in there a while since I was slow to pour and was figuring out my system. I've got a better system now and will only pour half the pan at a time so I don't anticipate any more issues and if I do, I'll adapt some more, but they came out easy enough.

[JWT]

I had quite a bit of cratering on some ingots I poured recently. The muffin tins were new and quite hot. I figure it to be outgassing from the coating. There was an odor when I dumped the ingots.