Best Old Military Rifles

[badbob454]

m14 ..................................... accuracy. lots of ammo,brass available fast rate of fire
m1garand................................. same ''
model 1903 ..................................same '' but bolt action slower fire rate
Russian sks,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,accuracy ease of reloading lots of surplus/reliable under extreme conditions
model 1917 yugo 24/47, as good as the 1903 but heavier to carry but can reform 06 ammo in my 8mm

m44/russia accurate ,ammo harder to find ,
ar/blackrifle in 223 lightweight rifle, ammo lightweight , not as powerfull as the 30cal's but a fast rate of fire . ammo readily available brass easy to find
my favorite is the m14 , i cannot afford one . so i love my sks russian

IF i had only 1 gun, it would be an sks i can shoot it as accurately, as with a nice bolt gun with open sights

[gifford]

I've had a bunch of the old Milsurp rifles, commencing in the 60's with the ten dollar Enfields. The only one I have now is my swiss 96/11. Simply a fine milsurp rifle and very accurate. Got plenty of G-11 ammo and some new Hornady.

I would like to pick up a nice older SKS but something always seems to intervene.

[gew98]

For right now I'm really liking the Springfield 03 & the Swiss K31.

The 03 because, it's well made, very usable for anything I would use a 30-06 for.

K31 because the ones I looked over yesterday were extremely well made, may be the most accurate rifle across it's production of any of the milsurp rifles. Thats what I am finding any way. Also it's straight pull bolt & how it works I find very intriguing.
Ammo or brass for it is not the hemroid I was making it out to be.

Of course I will be wanting a Mauser or 5........perpetual isnt it

Just stay away from a class C steel 03 receiver , make sure the stock is not cracked at the wrist , handguard no cracked , rear sight not worn loose , and above all check the firing pin tip... you really don't want a peirced primer on an 03 - they don't handle them to well , don't ask me how I know.
The main flaw I found with 03A3's is the thin delcate front sight blade and the ability to have the rear sight knocked off the rifle by sheer accident.. not endearing features to me.
The Model 1917 is a great choice , but I found over the years the Patt14 still outshoots it's 30 cal offspring handily.
Can't say a thing about straight pullers... between the Ross and the 88/90 & 95 steyr's they impressed me very little. I like rugged accurate rifles..not range queens with a delicate nature.
Surplus south american mausers in 7,65 caliber are hard to beat for the money and accuracy , and you can crank out brass from 30-06 , 270 , 25-06. And in a pinch 308 cal bullets do work well in them.
The 7,92 mausers out there can vary in accuracy wildly...usually due to stocking problems. Generally the sights are great and rugged for 'combat' but not for target shooting , but hey they were not made for the range queen work.
The No4's have good sights and ergonomics , the No1 MkIII's have great ergonomics and fair sights.... but as with any military rifle that likely has been reworked more than once in service you may find stocking issues the bane to accuracy unless addressed properly. All in all it's a pretty rare event when I have come across an Enfield that cannot shoot well. Only problem I ever encountered with an enfield was using surplus chicom 303 - brass was brittle and longitudal splits not uncommon , which never hurt the rifle other than fouling the bore with lousy bullet jacket alloy and of course the disconcerting puff of smoke in the face with the split brass.
I loved shooting 30/40 krags... but even sporters cost an arm and a leg these days. Have had alot of fun and great results with those Mosin rifles excepting M38 & 44 carbines. For their cost the Mosins are still a bargain... you just have to check action screw tension often when using surplus or full loads.

[MtGun44]

"If I had only one gun it would be an SKS"

Wow.

Bill

[bruce drake]

Hey, if that is what he can afford to shoot, than let him be happy with what he has.

But then again, I sold my SKS shortly after I rebarrelled a bolt action Mauser to 7.62x39. Now I have a short handy carbine with an effective light-recoiling 30-30 class cartridge that is a lot more accurate than my old SKS.

I'm more concerned about his statement that he can reform 30-06 cases into 7.62x54R for a M44...

Bruce

[405]

For right now I'm really liking the Springfield 03 & the Swiss K31.

The 03 because, it's well made, very usable for anything I would use a 30-06 for.

K31 because the ones I looked over yesterday were extremely well made, may be the most accurate rifle across it's production of any of the milsurp rifles. Thats what I am finding any way. Also it's straight pull bolt & how it works I find very intriguing.
Ammo or brass for it is not the hemroid I was making it out to be.

Of course I will be wanting a Mauser or 5........perpetual isnt it

Just curious. Is this from first hand experience or from seller or internet forum chat?- "may be the most accurate rifle across it's production of any of the milsurp rifles. Thats what I am finding any way." While the K31 is well made and many shoot very well, I'll guarantee not every milsurp, no matter the type, you run into will be the proverbial "tack driver".

[Ed in North Texas]

I might have missed one or two replies, but it seems there is one which has not been mentioned.

The best milsurp rifle (or handgun) is the one you have - until you desperately need the next one, and the one after that, and then......



Ed

[gew98]

I might have missed one or two replies, but it seems there is one which has not been mentioned.

The best milsurp rifle (or handgun) is the one you have - until you desperately need the next one, and the one after that, and then......



Ed

Now dang it Ed... you let the cat out of the bag !...

[kenyerian]

Several have came and gone here over the years and my family has enjoyed all of them. The sks is a fun gun that is cheap to shoot. Some of the Mosin Nagants have been decent shooters but my favorite is the Garand.

[MtGun44]

Yeah, Bruce, I missed that one. I suppose it may extract, but I would have never
thought of trying a rimless case to form a rimmed case. Shows how limited my
imagination is. Of course, the base diameter of an '06 is about .473 and the
base diameter of a 7.62x54R is .487. . . . . . . I expect that it will expand out
if you use enough powder.

Bill

[Multigunner]

Yeah, Bruce, I missed that one. I suppose it may extract, but I would have never
thought of trying a rimless case to form a rimmed case. Shows how limited my
imagination is. Of course, the base diameter of an '06 is about .473 and the
base diameter of a 7.62x54R is .487. . . . . . . I expect that it will expand out
if you use enough powder.

Bill

I have heard of Mosin Nagants having been rechambered to take the 8mm Mauser without the barrel being set back, and the bore remaining its original size, and these were said to have been fired with no reported problems.
But no reported problems doesn't mean much if the shooter is no longer in any shape to report what happened.
I suppose thats within the realm of possibility if they used the old 8mmJ cartridge with .318 bullet and the rifles had maximum dia bores of .316 that I hear were not uncommon.

I don't remember where this was done, it was during WW1 IIRC.

Even if the original chamber was tight as a hatband there would be .005 clearance all around, and since even a tight chamber usually has .002 clearance best you could expect would be .007 clearance even if the cartridge sat dead center in the chamber.
Some milspec cases may handle that kind of slack, but I wouldn't risk it.

Centering the case by wrapping the base with layers of cigarette paper might help, but thats still an awful lot of faith to put in a cartridge case.

[gew98]

The only Mosin rifles I have ever had that were 8mm conversions were the Polish 91/98/25 and one M91 that was rechambered and bored out for 8x50 steyr.
Neither one had the original .310-ish bores and both had had the barrel set back and recut , the polish rifles very noticeably so. But the polish conversions of carbine length with a german type bayonet lug and front band were very accurate and trouble free. The 8x50 steyr 91 was a fair shooter but all I had at the time was a tin of round nosed 1920's dated 8x50 and ignition was spotty on that old surplus with noted low power 'bangs'.
Every Bannerman 30-06 converted Mosin I have handled I WOULD NOT EVER shoot.
The germans were big on converting rifles they captured to their 7,92 round if the rifles warranted such work. They rebored/rechambered a number of belgian 89 rifles and carbines and reissued them as the base 7,65 cartrisge used by the belgian rifles made conversion cheap. The russian 91's required a new or heavily modified bolt head/extractor , along with barrel work and as such the germans did not pursue reworking them to their service caliber.
The austrians captured gobs of 91's and did some conversions to their service caliber , but not terribly many as they had a fair amount of captured 7,62 on hand as well the germans manufactured 7,62 cartridges for the Mosin's they reissued after capture.

[Bob S]

Bob,

That bolt handle cost as much as the K31?
Bruce

http://theswissriflesdotcommessagebo...efore-emailing

$198.25 and he says he has 12 left. The alternative is 335 SF ... not sure what the exchange rate is these days ... for the Burgin.

Buy the LHO first, then get the rifle.

Resp'y,
Bob S.

[rjathon]

http://theswissriflesdotcommessagebo...efore-emailing

$198.25 and he says he has 12 left. The alternative is 335 SF ... not sure what the exchange rate is these days ... for the Burgin.

Buy the LHO first, then get the rifle.

Resp'y,
Bob S.

What is an LHO?

[JeffinNZ]

Let's be honest. Any milsurp is good because for the most part they are dirt cheap for what you get and all lend themselves to cast boolit shooting. Cheap to buy, cheap to feed and built like a brick outhouse. It's a beautiful thing.

Why has no one seconded my Carcano post? Guess I just know a good thing when I see it.......

[Beekeeper]

I'll second it Jeff,
My 7.35 is one of the only milsurps I have not had trouble with using cast boolits.


beekeeper

[waksupi]

I really think the 8X57 is one of the best of the cast boolit chamberings. Generally accurate, good bore size, what's not to like? I guess I would have to say it may be a bit over bore, as many chamberings are for our purposes, but it is a good bang for the buck.

[Beekeeper]

For me!
I am a Mauser nut so any old Mauser works for me.
My favorite are the 2, 71/84 Mausers I have that I built from barreled actions before parts became unobtainium .You can shoot black or smokeless out of the so they are the best of both worlds.Paper patch or grease groove it doesn't care
Just wish they shot a smaller slug, doesn't take long to ruin your lead supply.

Got a bunch of the others but the 71/84's are my favorites and they sure draw a crowd at the range.


beekeeper

[Good Cheer]

Favorite military that I've owned or fired is an 1888 purchased from the NRA for $35 and then squandered another hundred on a custom cast boolit barrel and mold made to fit it. From the outside it's still the same old ugly. On the bench it would win the cold ones back when the neighborhood range was built in the back of an icehouse. Shooting jacketed in it would literally ruin the barrel so I keep the mold in as new shape. Stuck it in the handles yesterday evening for when I get the chance to fire up the melter.

[badbob454]

Hey, if that is what he can afford to shoot, than let him be happy with what he has.

But then again, I sold my SKS shortly after I rebarrelled a bolt action Mauser to 7.62x39. Now I have a short handy carbine with an effective light-recoiling 30-30 class cartridge that is a lot more accurate than my old SKS.

I'm more concerned about his statement that he can reform 30-06 cases into 7.62x54R for a M44...

Bruce

yeah oops.... i can use 06 to reforn to 8mm mauser , and yes all i can afford , and a nice gun, a great defense, small to med hunting, or plinking gun .its just fun to shoot , and at 4bucks a box or reload cheaper , cant beat it for affordability