Micro Lathe and Cartridge Conversions - Bad idea?

[Rfeustel]

Cool pictures, thanks, Almar. Curious - what is the threaded case for? Were you making some kind of modified case gauge?

[almar]

No i threaded the back end of the 50 bmg case to screw in a brass extension to make it a rimmed case to fit a 12 gauge, after fireforming that case became a high pressure capable 12 gauge brass shell. AKA 12 GAFH.

[ulav8r]

Would like a Taig to go with my 3 larger lathes, but a single lathe for use should be able to cut threads. That would greatly increase it's usefulness. Purchased a Taig headstock several years ago for my factory use. Don't remember exactly what we used it for, but was quite satisfied with it.

[Butcherbill]

If you have the space and funds I would go mini lathe over micro, I’ve had a mini lathe for over 20 years and it’s always been handy. You sacrifice precision with a lot of the smaller cheaper equipment but it’s not like you’re doing things that require it, I don’t know how many times I’ve had to make a bushing or a bolt or re thread something to a different threading etc etc. I’ve currently got a Grizzly mill/lathe combo and for my uses it been adequate, I’d love separate bigger machines but in all honesty I don’t need them for what I need to make.

I’ve made collets for my collet bullet puller, pilots for my case trimmer, expander mandrels, just working on a one piece cleaning rod and handle with bearings. A lathe comes in handy for so many things, couple years back my neighbor’s swather broke a part while cutting our hay field. He needed a couple domed rivets to reattach the blade on his sickle mower so he could re weld the broken joint, good luck finding one on a weekend in the boonies. He had one that was too short so I grabbed it and used it for dimensions and spun him up a couple longer rivets, he was back cutting hay later that day.

[bangerjim]

Taig is a very good little machine. Kinda gangly looking...... but aren't we all!!!!!

I live 8 miles from their factory and have been there several times and own most of their accessories which I have retrofitted to my Sherline. I even designed & built a motorized variable speed reversable lead screw drive mechanism for the Sherline! The Taig compound rest and tailstock sure are great adapted to the Sherline.

Taig is a good choice for a solid USA-built tool.

I also own a 9x36" South Bend Precision Toolroom Lathe for major high-accuracy metalworking, a HF 7x12 lathe (resides in my loading shed out back for misc uses for low to medium accuracy needs), a custom 5" 3c Collet lathe with all the attachments (!) made in Phoenix AZ in 1962 by a company long-gone from here.

Add 4 milling machines to that and I've got quite a gaggle of stuff! Not counting all the many woodworking tools.

Have fun with your new venture.

bangerjim

[nuclearcricket]

I have a 7X14 lathe I purchased from MicroMark. I went with that one because they put English lead screws in it from the get go. I have used it a lot over the years. I have added a 4" 4 jaw chuck. A smaller ER collet chuck and made an ER40 collet chuck for it. I have made a lot of things on that lathe, from just turned expanders to loading dies. Threaded parts for antique scopes and other stuff. Depending on the length of the bed, a 7" lathe will take up about 3 feet of bench space. My suggestion would be to buy as big as you can afford and have space for. While you may not need the larger diameter, the extra horse power will be appreciated in the long run.
Sam

[hickstick_10]

I had a Taig for 20 years, no complaints other than its Gates drive belt and gave it away to a friend and moved to a Unimat my mom found in the neighbour's recycle bin. The taig is very robust, the bearings are sealed for life I used one to make parts to win 1st place for my mechanical engineering capstone project in university. Their downfall is the attachments, the 3 jaw chuck from Taig isn't the best quality (you can order a better one from Sherline) mine lacked power feed and the motor has to be bolted onto something seperate from the machine.

I really, really dislike how Taig handles their belt drive, the belts are expensive, difficult to swap on the pulley and will crack in time. They use them because that's whats required to transmit power from 1/4 hp to such a small machine in limited space.

The unimats are nice in that they're light, have an integral motor mount (which the taig lacks) and will fit in a drawer, but they are light duty machines intended for model making.

The recycle bin rescue lives under my reloading bench, needed some rebuilding and expensive parts from Ebay to get power feed, half the weight of the Taig, 1/2 the horsepower, but sharp tools it will handle brass fine. You can also turn it into a small drill press or milling machine for light duty. The machines uses magneto bearings that requiring grease every once in awhile, I make my own belts from urethane round belt off Amazon, I bought 20 feet for close to the same price as a Taig belt shipped to me and I doubt I will ever wear them out.

Big downside is turning tapers is a challenge, theres no compound rest, only a swivelling headstock and thats really cumbersome to use. You get around it for extracted grooves by swivelling your tool post and doing plunge cuts.

FB_IMG_1782444185482.jpg
FB_IMG_1782445083148.jpg


I liked it so much when a new in the box unimat 3 with all the attachments was for sale I got that as well, this machine is a step up, a clone of it is sold as the Seig Co, I think grizzly makes a version to. The chucks and collets were all made in Austria, very good quality, lots of people have made entire clocks with this machine, the accuracy is there. I have a contraption for it that allows it to cut threads, which I've only used once for a small screw and am grateful I have better machines.

Same homemade urethane belts, better arrangement of bearings on this machine (no primitive magneto bearings) and I can keep the mill/drill column in place when I need it. It also has a compound slide like a normal lathe.

FB_IMG_1782445068584.jpg

Since theres two lathes in close proximity, they started to breed. This Cowells from England I used for scope rings but mostly for clock parts, best of the bunch because it has a back gear for serious torque. This one was made for actual micro machining of cast iron and steel parts. It also threads like a 7x12 using gears. Uses oil cups in the bearings and sewing machine belts that a can buy 6 for the cost of 1 Taig belt.

FB_IMG_1782444265965.jpg

The micro lathes are capable, but I agree the 7x12s are more capable machines out of the box (at the cost of 2-3 times the weight and you can't stick them in a cupboard or on a shelf when done using it), they will do everything the cowells will do at 1/10th the price of the new one. Look for used stuff, its out there cheap and learn to sharpen your tools. The micro lathes are VERY small machines, a brass 20 gauge case will be close to their max capacity between centers. Lots of fun to use, dont take up much space but for serious machining I use a larger lathe.

One final thing to consider is that the tiny machines have a much much higher rpm than the 7x12s, I can spin at 4000-5000 rpm no problem and thats very helpful for drilling very small holes and turning small diameters.

[greyhawk]

I have been considering getting a lathe for cartridge conversions, specifically for rim timming, thinning, and cutting extractor grooves. To date, I have been doing some of these with a file and drill press. I'm considering a micro lathe, like the Taig: https://taigtools.com/product/micro-lathe-ii-m1017/

I wish I had more time/need and space for a larger, bench top lathe. But that's not in my life right now. I just need to work on brass and make mandrels that fit in the mouth of cases to hold them on while working.

Am I going to be disappointed, or can something like the Taig do that basic job? Lots of posts talking about larger bench top lathes, and I'm jealous at what people can do (I'd love to make a fire forming tool for example). But right now I'm focused on brass cases and cartridge conversions.

Thank you

I can buy a nice small benchtop lathe for just over 1K aussie dollar- landed in my local town - your Taig will leave you very little change from that. I would look really hard for the room to fit the benchtop one (I was loaned a small desktop model makers lathe years ago and was disappointed)

Definitely get a straight shank collet holder and a set of collets can easily hold case bodies with a bit of taper (22/250, 308 etc )

[mjb206]

I had a Taig for 20 years, no complaints other than its Gates drive belt and gave it away to a friend and moved to a Unimat my mom found in the neighbour's recycle bin. The taig is very robust, the bearings are sealed for life I used one to make parts to win 1st place for my mechanical engineering capstone project in university. Their downfall is the attachments, the 3 jaw chuck from Taig isn't the best quality (you can order a better one from Sherline) mine lacked power feed and the motor has to be bolted onto something seperate from the machine.

I really, really dislike how Taig handles their belt drive, the belts are expensive, difficult to swap on the pulley and will crack in time. They use them because that's whats required to transmit power from 1/4 hp to such a small machine in limited space.

I'm curious why you had issues swapping the belts on the pulley - with their current setup, the motor is on a pivot plate - you simply lift the motor up and forward towards the lathe and move the belt to the pulley set you'd like to use. It's very easy. I agree they do wear, but I've never had one crack.

[Rfeustel]

I had a Taig for 20 years, no complaints other than its Gates drive belt and gave it away to a friend and moved to a Unimat my mom found in the neighbour's recycle bin. The taig is very robust, the bearings are sealed for life I used one to make parts to win 1st place for my mechanical engineering capstone project in university. Their downfall is the attachments, the 3 jaw chuck from Taig isn't the best quality (you can order a better one from Sherline) mine lacked power feed and the motor has to be bolted onto something seperate from the machine.

I really, really dislike how Taig handles their belt drive, the belts are expensive, difficult to swap on the pulley and will crack in time. They use them because that's whats required to transmit power from 1/4 hp to such a small machine in limited space.

The unimats are nice in that they're light, have an integral motor mount (which the taig lacks) and will fit in a drawer, but they are light duty machines intended for model making.

The recycle bin rescue lives under my reloading bench, needed some rebuilding and expensive parts from Ebay to get power feed, half the weight of the Taig, 1/2 the horsepower, but sharp tools it will handle brass fine. You can also turn it into a small drill press or milling machine for light duty. The machines uses magneto bearings that requiring grease every once in awhile, I make my own belts from urethane round belt off Amazon, I bought 20 feet for close to the same price as a Taig belt shipped to me and I doubt I will ever wear them out.

Big downside is turning tapers is a challenge, theres no compound rest, only a swivelling headstock and thats really cumbersome to use. You get around it for extracted grooves by swivelling your tool post and doing plunge cuts.

FB_IMG_1782444185482.jpg
FB_IMG_1782445083148.jpg


I liked it so much when a new in the box unimat 3 with all the attachments was for sale I got that as well, this machine is a step up, a clone of it is sold as the Seig Co, I think grizzly makes a version to. The chucks and collets were all made in Austria, very good quality, lots of people have made entire clocks with this machine, the accuracy is there. I have a contraption for it that allows it to cut threads, which I've only used once for a small screw and am grateful I have better machines.

Same homemade urethane belts, better arrangement of bearings on this machine (no primitive magneto bearings) and I can keep the mill/drill column in place when I need it. It also has a compound slide like a normal lathe.

FB_IMG_1782445068584.jpg

Since theres two lathes in close proximity, they started to breed. This Cowells from England I used for scope rings but mostly for clock parts, best of the bunch because it has a back gear for serious torque. This one was made for actual micro machining of cast iron and steel parts. It also threads like a 7x12 using gears. Uses oil cups in the bearings and sewing machine belts that a can buy 6 for the cost of 1 Taig belt.

FB_IMG_1782444265965.jpg

The micro lathes are capable, but I agree the 7x12s are more capable machines out of the box (at the cost of 2-3 times the weight and you can't stick them in a cupboard or on a shelf when done using it), they will do everything the cowells will do at 1/10th the price of the new one. Look for used stuff, its out there cheap and learn to sharpen your tools. The micro lathes are VERY small machines, a brass 20 gauge case will be close to their max capacity between centers. Lots of fun to use, dont take up much space but for serious machining I use a larger lathe.

One final thing to consider is that the tiny machines have a much much higher rpm than the 7x12s, I can spin at 4000-5000 rpm no problem and thats very helpful for drilling very small holes and turning small diameters.

Thank you for such a response! I'm considering a larger lathe. I think the Sherline 17" should be ok in my shop and I'm really considering it.

[Rfeustel]

Thanks, Greyhawk. All the advice keeps pointing me to go a little larger. And thanks for the pointer on collets.

[ebb]

What's one of those unimats worth? I have one but have never used it, because i have a big lathe. As with most things in south Florida it is a little rusty and needs a good cleaning. It runs and has spare belts.

[Rockindaddy]

I would say look around for a nice old bench top Atlas or South Bend with several chucks and a collet set up. It will be about the same price if not less than the tiny lathe from China.

[15meter]

If you're looking at just brass, HSS tooling is cheap and available and easy to grind to any profile you want. Research grinding wheels, the better quality white wheels will sharpen 10X better than the standard gray wheels that come on most grinders. From there you can step up to even better quality wheels but at a price. I keep one gray wheel just for rough grinding, never for sharpening any cutting tool. The sharpening is done on either of the white wheels I keep mounted all the time. I don't sharpen carbide so I don't need the green wheels. I use Norton wheels.

And get a wheel dresser, a clean, dressed wheel will make you life way easier on the lathe.

I have a 60-70 year old South Bend 9x24 that does everything I need in the brass forming arena. It has a set of collets that make holding brass a cinch.

[country gent]

I have several pedestal/bench grinders in my shop. one is a grizzly tool grinder with diamonds for carbide tooling. A 8" jet with a 60 grit and 100 grit wheel on it for high speed tooling. A small HF set up and dedicated to tig electrodes.

The wheels that come on most grinders are on the coarse side for sharpening tools. You get a new cutting edge thats takes way to much time on a hone to cut truly clean. I think most grinders come with a 36 grit and 60 grit. for general use. they are also on the hard side not breaking down to stay sharp. A well dressed wheel cuts cleaner and cooler. the dressers work but ten to round corners and face, The dressing sticks do better but become dull also. I use a diamond point dresser give good sharp surface flat and sharp corners. The green wheels are okay but break down quickly used for carbide they need to to keep a sharp edge. Once sharpened to a fresh edge a littlwe time with a set of hone stones really finishes the edge and also allow a light radius to be formed.

One few get a chance to use try are the low speed grinder hones these can really put an edge on a cutting tool . They dont generate the heat . Normally they have wheels from 120-600 grit. I used one for sharpening scrapper blades.

The thing to really look at on na grinder is the rests adjustable is good solid is most important.

[almar]

Thank you for such a response! I'm considering a larger lathe. I think the Sherline 17" should be ok in my shop and I'm really considering it.

Its what i got but its so far from stock now i dont think it can still be called a sherline anymore.
I just today tested an electronic leadscrew i made for it. Any thread metric or imperial is a press of a button away. Extremely happy about it. I also have 5c headstock for it and a 1500w motor with a driver. More mods to come...mostly for rigidity.

[PaulH]

I had a TAIG for several years and then replaced it with a Grizzly 7X14. Personally, I found the TAIG was a more precise lathe. The 7X14 has much more capability, but the slop in the compound rest leads to vibration and a rough finish. One of these days I'll need to take it apart, scrape the surfaces and tighten the gibbs to get rid of the slop. If you get a well built 7X14 they are good machines, but you might need to do a bit of a rebuild to make it a precise machine.