shoulder tame 45-70

[Larry Gibson]

Nice. Now I need to come up with a good red dot load that is tame..yet useable on 300gr

Start a 6 gr and work up in 1/2 gr increments to 8 gr. Let the target and your shoulder tell which load is "best".

[Soundguy]

Start a 6 gr and work up in 1/2 gr increments to 8 gr. Let the target and your shoulder tell which load is "best".

Cool.. 6gr and thats red dot for 300gr? appreciate it. I may make some tomorrow or tonight.
very much appreciate it sir.

[Soundguy]

heading to the range shortly with some 300gr lfp over 6-8 gr red dot for testing..can't wait.

[marvelshooter]

Another powder that seems to behave with cast and light loads is Titegroup. 7 grains in my 35 Remington and my son's .308 will shoot an inch at 80 yards with virtually no recoil.

[Soundguy]

yup..ive seen lots of tightgroup reduced loads especially after trail boss became hard to get.

On a positive note..this week midwayusa and brownells both listed trailboss for sale, but went out of stock immediately.

[Soundguy]

Wow.. I could shoot 8gr red dot loads all day!

Tried 6 and up.. all worked fine..but 8 felt light enough still..and sounded nice.

I see a few places online some were doing up to 12gr.. but I presume those are not really a reduced load anymore.

Still..8 felt nice.. I wonder if it would take small hog? Or if i would need to go up a half grain or grain?

Thanks for the comments.

[Larry Gibson]

Wow.. I could shoot 8gr red dot loads all day!

I wonder if it would take small hog? Or if i would need to go up a half grain or grain?

If the 8 gr load is pushing your 300 gr bullet at 850 - 1000 fps it is the equal of 44 and 45 cal revolvers pushing 300 - 310 gr bullets that same velocity. Those revolver loads are touted as "hog killers". Would seem plausible your load should have no problems killing hogs. I wouldn't have any qualms shooting a hog with my Rapine 270 gr bullet at 1050 fps.

Still, being on the low end of the cartridge capability, I would be ready for and practice for follow up shots.

[RACWIN375]

OMG
you can load unique in anything as a light load !

what do you want to load with unique ?
I been looking for unique for years now

[RACWIN375]

Cool.. 6gr and thats red dot for 300gr? appreciate it. I may make some tomorrow or tonight.
very much appreciate it sir.

make 5 rounds @ 6g Red Dot 5 rounds @ 6.5g Red dot and so on up to 10g or so depends on how much power or kick you want
enjoy find a load that prints a tight group at the yardage you shoot and has the kick you can shoot 100 round of and not need an ice pack on your shoulder

I have a nice 30-30 load of 8g Red Dot with a 110g copper plated Berry's, it's like a 22RL BUT it brings 110g and knocks now steel plates on the pistol range

[Soundguy]

I stopped at 8 today..may see what 8.5 and 9 feels like another day.

[Soundguy]

Well, I went back out to the range this morning and brought up. My usual trail, boss loads of fourteen point five grades, and then some red dot loads that I continue to work up. turns out, nine grains of red dots, it's virtually identical to fourteen point five grains trail box in both point of pain and how it feels on the shoulder. i was shooting one of each in both barrels and then mixing them up randomly, and I could not tell the difference. i'm pretty sure 9 grains of red dot under a 300 grain lead flat point. It's going to become my new range load for 45-70. it will save my dwindling trail. Boss stash, now that I found that extra eight pound jug of red dot.

[Soundguy]

Forgive some of the odd punctuation and weird spelling. Errors, you can thank AI for that. I'm using speech to text on my phone.Since my hands are a little bit oily from cleaning the guns, and this ai stuff is just horrible,

[Sgt H]

I hate all that spellcheck, punctuation check and the other AI crap also. I turn that stuff off on my phone and computer. I don't need a machine to write what it thinks I want to say or how to spell something.

[Pirate69]

This is from QuickLoad. 45-70 cartridge, 300 grain boolit, 30.625" barrel and assumed 2.530 inch COAL.

Red Dot
6 grains 943 fps 7,100 psi
7 grains 1024 fps 9,003 psi
8 grains 1100 fps 11,048 psi
9 grains 1170 fps 13,220 psi


Unique
6 grains 868 fps 3,904 psi
7 grains 961 fps 5,052 psi
8 grains 1045 fps 6,335 psi
9 grains 1122 fps 7,750 psi

Note the pressure is starting to get a little high, for a Trap Door, with 9 grains of Red Dot.

[Soundguy]

Perhaps approaching high for a trapdoor..but should be safe in a modern gun, ( or am I missing something? )

ps..thanks for the workup.

I tried 9gr the other day, felt great! Shooting it out of a double rifle.

[Larry Gibson]

TD MAP runs 28,000 psi. Most BP 45-70 loads run -n the 19.000 psi to mid 20,000 psi range as actually measured depending on the granulation of the BP used and the weight of the bullet. Based on actual pressure testing of several granulations at 70 gr under a 405 gr cast bullet in the 45-70.

None of those loads with a 300 gr cast bullet even approach that level of pressure. It is questionable whether several of them generate enough psi to adequately obturate the case to seal the chamber.

All of them are quite safe for use in TDs.

The question of what is a "maximum" load with those powders and bullets is more a matter of keeping the bullets in the 900 to 1200 fps range for best accuracy.

[Soundguy]

TD MAP runs 28,000 psi. Most BP 45-70 loads run -n the 19.000 psi to mid 20,000 psi range as actually measured depending on the granulation of the BP used and the weight of the bullet. Based on actual pressure testing of several granulations at 70 gr under a 405 gr cast bullet in the 45-70.

None of those loads with a 300 gr cast bullet even approach that level of pressure. It is questionable whether several of them generate enough psi to adequately obturate the case to seal the chamber.

All of them are quite safe for use in TDs.

The question of what is a "maximum" load with those powders and bullets is more a matter of keeping the bullets in the 900 to 1200 fps range for best accuracy.

Good deal.. I absolutely love the 9gr red dot load.

Thanks gentlemen!

[Sgt H]

I would seriously question the Quickload predictions posted by Pirate. I have chonographed lots of Unique loads in 45-70 and those predicted velocities seem way off. One load I use is a 340 over 12.5grs Unique which averages 1185 from a 30" Shiloh Sharps and 26" 1886 Browning. A friend loads 10grs Bullseye (faster than red dot) under a 300 which is 1050 from a 22" 1886 Browning SRC.