Aluminum Suppressor Cleaning Pic Thread

[DaleT]

Steve , That is a Sandman , there was no physical damage to the can, just cosmetic .

[steve urquell]

I believe this, honestly I do, but if you take a piece of paper and glue it to the base of a bullet, then fire the bullet, the paper will invariably remain unburned. Paper burns at 451F while lead vaporizes at around 750F, at atmospheric pressure. At even 5 atm of pressure (74psi) paper still burns at 451F but lead won’t vaporize until 3,000F. I can’t see how lead is vaporizing from the base of a FMJ bullet, but I have no idea where it does come from. I’ve thought about powder coating a bunch of them to see if I get lead in the can.

From lead bullets I think it’s splatter rather than vapor deposits, but that I also don’t know.

What I do know is the best way to dispose of used dip is to put it in an open container in the sun and let it evaporate. The metal salts will precipitate out, they don’t evaporate, and then you put the crusty container into metal recycling or landfill trash whichever you have.

I’ve thought about using a small submersible pump, like a saltwater aquarium pump, to create a washer for a sealed can. Just keep running the dip through with as much pressure as the little pump will put out. Also thought about filling a can with dip and inserting an ultrasonic cleaning probe in the center of it.

I agree, weigh when new. Some companies used to rebuild for you once the weight got past something, I don’t remember the details.

I don't know what the hell to tell you on this.
I quit shooting my reloads through my Banish 45 and went to a steady diet of factory FMJ figuring on no leading.
I shot quit a few boxes, both 9mm and 45acp, didn't think I needed to do much cleaning.
When I finally took it apart it had lead condensed on the baffles, a lot of it.
Let the baffles set in Breakthrough Suppressor Cleaner which works very well on carbon but not so much on lead.
I ran the baffles through my ultrasonic cleaner, I am now a believer about ultrasonics and aluminum.
I didn't ruin my baffles but did get some pits here and there. Never do that again.

Exactly how do I get splatter from Full metal jacketed bullets?
This is lead that has vaporized and condensed on the baffles.

If you care to take a trip, I will let you shoot my guns or yours if they have threaded barrels through my suppressor (Disassembled and checked to be lead free first of course).
Hell, I'll even buy the ammo.
Maybe I need to pull all the bullets and glue paper to them.

I might actually try this on some that I reload using FMJ bullets with exposed bases that I have.

I don't know about vapor vs splatter but I do absolutely know that PC burns off of lead bullet bases. FMJ bullets have exposed lead bases, JHPs do not because the jacket could fly off being open on both ends.

My suppressor leading happened when my FIL loaded some soft lead PC boolits and then overcrimped them. Whether the leading was from the base or from the undersized boolits skidding down the bore I do not know. I do know they were so soft that the powder granules imprinted themselves in the boolit bases. Pic below.

I am on the fence with PC protecting suppressors. I will disassemble my suppressor soon and report on any leading as I have fired some PC w/o the header paint on them. I feel like if the alloy is harder leading is less likely to occur.



Next 2 pics are red Hitek and PC both burned off of boolit bases.

[steve urquell]

American reloading pulled bullet below. 9mm FMJ.

[JimB..]

Okay, I jumped over here, but I don’t have anything to add. Need to do some experimentation.

[MakeMineA10mm]

Okay, I jumped over here, but I don’t have anything to add. Need to do some experimentation.

Based on your post on the other thread, commenting about paper not burning off when it has a lower flame temperature than lead:

It’s not just heat which is the actor. There is a combination of heat, pressure, and the sand-blasting effect of powder granules during the ignition process through the expanding gasses process through the bore.

I already know the next question: Why does this result in leading in the suppressor rather than the barrel? That has to do with why a suppressor works. A can suppresses the report of the firearm by slowing down and cooling the gasses of the shot. The reason lead shows up in the can and not the barrel is because the lead remains vapor under heat and pressure (in the barrel), thus when shooting with no suppressor, the lead vapor doesn’t cool and condense until it is out in the atmosphere. (This is why indoor ranges must have fancy ventilation systems - the lead is vapor and airborne, but as it cools it condenses on surfaces and even can be inhaled if you are close enough to the muzzle, or the atmosphere gets saturated.) Shooting the firearm with a can causes a lot of that lead vapor to cool and condense inside the can, thus creating the deposits.

So, why does paper not suffer from the same problems as lead, and we end up with paper vapor? Great question! Paper, vs. lead, is not a chemical element. Lead, being an element, exists at the molecular level, thus can be vaporized more easily. Paper also has some interesting properties. As you note, paper patches used on bullets do not suffer much damage (other than sharp rifling corners slicing through it) and can be found more or less intact (not burnt) on the ground. This is an example of its toughness. I had an engineer friend awhile ago who worked for a label-making company. We were talking about paper-patched bullets, and he commented about the machines at work and how the paper running through them at high speed and with, let’s say “tension,” as opposed to pressure (it’s still pressure, but not the tens of thousands of pounds which exist in firearms when fired) which initially polishes and buffs the rollers to a high sheen, but also, over enough time, can change dimensions of the rollers, not unlike sandpaper (but with no grit, so it takes a LONG time). Paper is way stronger than we think. It’s kind of like Super thin concrete - it has great strength and qualities under tension, but apply the pressure the other way, and it cracks/tears very easily, giving us the idea it is actually a weak material. It’s not.

[Plate plinker]

I don't know about vapor vs splatter but I do absolutely know that PC burns off of lead bullet bases. FMJ bullets have exposed lead bases, JHPs do not because the jacket could fly off being open on both ends.

My suppressor leading happened when my FIL loaded some soft lead PC boolits and then overcrimped them. Whether the leading was from the base or from the undersized boolits skidding down the bore I do not know. I do know they were so soft that the powder granules imprinted themselves in the boolit bases. Pic below.

I am on the fence with PC protecting suppressors. I will disassemble my suppressor soon and report on any leading as I have fired some PC w/o the header paint on them. I feel like if the alloy is harder leading is less likely to occur.



Next 2 pics are red Hitek and PC both burned off of boolit bases.

Late to the party as usual, but how much lead deposits are from the primer compound? ANY?

[steve urquell]

Late to the party as usual, but how much lead deposits are from the primer compound? ANY?

When I only shot plated bullets or JHPs with fully enclosed bases I had zero leading--only carbon. The blast baffle is where it shows up initially and then the first 2 baffles in the core. I'm assuming the lead has cooled enough beyond that to not splatter on any more baffles.

[Plate plinker]

Pretty much the same here, just spent like 5 hours scrubbing and scraping lead deposits out of the banish 45. I had fired ALOT of 22lr through it. Probably not doing that anymore the other primary use was the PCC with both plated Barry’s and my PC stuff.IMG_7438.jpg
Pulled out more than 1200 grains of lead and carbon.

[fordwannabe]

I have been doing this to my cans for years. I have a mix of 50/50 acetone and automatic transmission fluid in a glass jar and submerge the can in the fluid,,,you can watch the particles accumulate in the bottom of the jar. Give it a shake once in a while and after a couple days pull it out and wipe it down. Done. I have done this to all three of my cans from new.

[Zadokite]

Go to the auto parts store and get a bottle of type 5 brake fluid. NOT 5.1
It's silicone oil...coat the internals of the suppressor...cleaning will be exponentially easier. I have been using it for years.

[steve urquell]

I've been shooting .357 loaded to 1000fps or so. 3.9gr of TiteGroup on 125gr. Probably 200rds of PC cast at ~12BHN. The radiused edges on the blast baffle are lead buildup. Some of that is carbon but on the edges it is definitely lead.

Most of the buildup on the baffles (the grunge on the cardboard) was fairly soft like dried grease and dirt on a car suspension and easily scraped off. This is because I smear silicone grease on the baffles.

[atfsux]

I have had good results after cleaning my cans by using a foaming lithium grease to spray inside the cans to coat the internals as a preventative to retard residue from adhering to the inside bits. It works well, AND also makes for a decibel reduction as a "wet" suppressor for the first few shots.

BUT,...it is smokey as a funny car burn-out! Thick dense white smoke emanates from the thing as is burns off the excess. And being lithium, it's probably toxic too, so I don't breath it in. If you're trying to stay hidden in the bushes, this is definitely a position disclosure concern. The bright white plume whisping around you is like a neon sign saying HERE I AM!!

[steve urquell]

I have had good results after cleaning my cans by using a foaming lithium grease to spray inside the cans to coat the internals as a preventative to retard residue from adhering to the inside bits. It works well, AND also makes for a decibel reduction as a "wet" suppressor for the first few shots.

BUT,...it is smokey as a funny car burn-out! Thick dense white smoke emanates from the thing as is burns off the excess. And being lithium, it's probably toxic too, so I don't breath it in. If you're trying to stay hidden in the bushes, this is definitely a position disclosure concern. The bright white plume whisping around you is like a neon sign saying HERE I AM!!

I tried Lee Alox and it had a similar response with the smoke. The silicone grease I use does not smoke or smell and is heat resistant
I tried melting some one day and it would not thin or melt with a butane torch blowing on it.

[elmacgyver0]

I have had good results after cleaning my cans by using a foaming lithium grease to spray inside the cans to coat the internals as a preventative to retard residue from adhering to the inside bits. It works well, AND also makes for a decibel reduction as a "wet" suppressor for the first few shots.

BUT,...it is smokey as a funny car burn-out! Thick dense white smoke emanates from the thing as is burns off the excess. And being lithium, it's probably toxic too, so I don't breath it in. If you're trying to stay hidden in the bushes, this is definitely a position disclosure concern. The bright white plume whisping around you is like a neon sign saying HERE I AM!!

Since I don't plan on ambushing anyone soon, the dense white smoke would not be an issue for me.
Lots of good info, suppressors RULE!

[spoon]

I have used Simple Green diluted. If the part is submerged for about 3 days (left outside in the sun, summer) the carbon will be softened and comes off with a bristle brush. I have done this on aluminum pistons with no damage to the piston. Don't know why it would not work on a can.

[Dantiff2]

I finally got around to trying Ballistol Suppressor cleaner. I plugged and filled my suppressor and let it sit overnight. Drained it in the the morning and all carbon was just a scum that easily washed out. Then I noticed some lead around the edge of my first blast baffle using my bore-cam. I then made up a batch of 50/50 peroxide and white vinegar and soaked the can for a few hours, changing the hazardous mix every half an hour. The result was a brand new can inside with no more signs of leading anywhere. DO NOT pour down the drain. This is very hazardous! My suppressor has thousands and thousands of subsonic, powder coated rounds through it. I'd guess in the 4000 round range, plus a mix of supersonic shots in-between. I believe my lead was from under sized cast bullets that I had for a 9mm pcc. They were .355 and my guns like .357 diameter and the .355 and .356 shot like crap but it was fun "getting rid of them"
Dan

[steve urquell]

I finally got around to trying Ballistol Suppressor cleaner. I plugged and filled my suppressor and let it sit overnight. Drained it in the the morning and all carbon was just a scum that easily washed out. Then I noticed some lead around the edge of my first blast baffle using my bore-cam. I then made up a batch of 50/50 peroxide and white vinegar and soaked the can for a few hours, changing the hazardous mix every half an hour. The result was a brand new can inside with no more signs of leading anywhere. DO NOT pour down the drain. This is very hazardous! My suppressor has thousands and thousands of subsonic, powder coated rounds through it. I'd guess in the 4000 round range, plus a mix of supersonic shots in-between. I believe my lead was from under sized cast bullets that I had for a 9mm pcc. They were .355 and my guns like .357 diameter and the .355 and .356 shot like crap but it was fun "getting rid of them"
Dan

Can you clarify what your baffles and tube are made of? The dip is not supposed to be used on aluminum and this thread is about cleaning aluminum suppressors. I don't want someone dissolving their baffles.

[Dantiff2]

Can you clarify what your baffles and tube are made of? The dip is not supposed to be used on aluminum and this thread is about cleaning aluminum suppressors. I don't want someone dissolving their baffles.

Hell, I don’t know. HAHAHAHA. Apparently not aluminum! . Hybrid 46 magnum rated so some sort of magic, probably a stainless.

[steve urquell]

Hell, I don’t know. HAHAHAHA. Apparently not aluminum! . Hybrid 46 magnum rated so some sort of magic, probably a stainless.

The Hybrid 46 is built from titanium, inconel and 17-4 stainless steel.

Please everyone else with aluminum suppressors do not use the dip.

[DaleT]

Thanks for asking that Steve, now I don't have to.