Lee PrecisionLoad DataRotoMetals2Snyders Jerky
MidSouth Shooters SupplyInline FabricationWidenersTitan Reloading
Repackbox Reloading Everything
Results 1 to 19 of 19

Thread: "Best" Lube for Low-Velocity .45-70 Trapdoors?

  1. #1
    Boolit Bub
    Join Date
    Sep 2011
    Location
    Southern Middle Tennessee
    Posts
    41

    "Best" Lube for Low-Velocity .45-70 Trapdoors?

    Contrary to the title of this thread I am not looking for the one "best" lube of all available lubes for my Trapdoors. That question, probably responsible for many flame wars, is closely akin to asking, "Which is best, Coke or Pepsi?" "Which is best, paraffin-based Quaker State or Full Synthetic Mobil One oil?" "Which of your children is the best?"

    I will be shooting some smokeless, some duplex loads, and some black, all low velocity grease groove boolits in my .45-70s. I normally keep Carnuba Blue (LsStuff) in one of my 450 sizers for .45acp and 9mm low speed loads. I have another 450 that I was planning to load with Modified Emmerts or another good lube which I could use with my Trapdoors, '74 Sharps, and 1871 Buffalo Classic, all .45-70 and low velocity regardless of powder. The Modified Emmerts would be;
    50% Beeswax
    40% Crisco
    5% Anhydrous Lanolin
    5% Jojoba Oil

    I know that some have recommended a mixture of about 5-5 1/2% Beeswax to 4-4 1/2% Virgin Olive Oil. I've never used a Beeswax/Olive Oil mixture but would appreciate any feedback anyone could offer on how it performs compared to, for instance, the Modified Emmerts recipe above. I have also considered tumble lubing with 45-45-10 Liquid Xlox (LsStuff) for such low velocity loads.

    Therefore, I guess my enquiry is more like which is better for low-velocity .45-70, Liquid Xlox, Modified Emmerts, or Beeswax/Olive Oil?

  2. #2
    Moderator


    Winger Ed.'s Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2007
    Location
    Just outside Gun Barrel City, Texas
    Posts
    9,674
    For low speeds, pretty much anything will work.
    I don't get out the good stuff like Lyman's Orange Magic until my speeds get up into the teens.
    In .45ACP going as slow as they are- 1,000 fps or under:
    I've had good luck with the kid's broken crayons, the wife's 'fu-fu candles, and motor oil.

    For what you're doing, I'd just use whatever was in the sizer, or what I had the most of.
    In school: We learn lessons, and are given tests.
    In life: We are given tests, and learn lessons.


    OK People. Enough of this idle chit-chat.
    This ain't your Grandma's sewing circle.
    EVERYONE!
    Back to your oars. The Captain wants to waterski.

  3. #3
    Boolit Master

    Join Date
    Feb 2006
    Location
    WNY
    Posts
    1,523
    Since you're shooting low velocity with a mix of black powder and smokeless loads, I'd recommend you use SPG for everything.
    "We take a thousand moments for granted thinking there will be a thousand more to come. Each day, each breath, each beat of your heart is a gift. Live with love & joy, tomorrow is not promised to anyone......"

    unknown

  4. #4
    Moderator


    Winger Ed.'s Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2007
    Location
    Just outside Gun Barrel City, Texas
    Posts
    9,674
    That reminds me of a article in a old Lyman manual where they were discussing different BP lubes.

    One that came highly recommended by some old guys and worked well was chicken fat.
    From how slippery and how hard it is to wash off my hands after processing chicken pieces, I tend to believe it.
    In school: We learn lessons, and are given tests.
    In life: We are given tests, and learn lessons.


    OK People. Enough of this idle chit-chat.
    This ain't your Grandma's sewing circle.
    EVERYONE!
    Back to your oars. The Captain wants to waterski.

  5. #5
    Boolit Grand Master


    stubshaft's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2009
    Location
    Southernmost State of the Union
    Posts
    5,879
    Since you're shooting BP and smokeless, I would mix up some "Gatofeo" lube! [1# mutton tallow (dgw), 1# candle/canning wax (gulf), 1/2# beeswax (online and elsewhere)] Been using it for years in my smokepoles and to lube wads for my revolvers and shotguns.
    Old enough to know better, young enough to do it anyway!

    Men who don't understand women fall into two categories: bachelors and husbands!

  6. #6
    Boolit Grand Master


    Larry Gibson's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2005
    Location
    Lake Havasu City, Arizona
    Posts
    21,324
    I use 5 parts beeswax to 4 parts (volume measurement) virgin olive oil. Works excellently for BP, smokeless and duplex loads in my 45-70 TDs. Also excellent in other BP cartridges like 45 Colt and 44-40.
    Larry Gibson

    “Deficient observation is merely a form of ignorance and responsible for the many morbid notions and foolish ideas prevailing.”
    ― Nikola Tesla

  7. #7
    Boolit Buddy DAVIDMAGNUM's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2013
    Location
    Maryland's Eastern Shore
    Posts
    196
    Since you're shooting low velocity with a mix of black powder and smokeless loads, I'd recommend you use DGL for everything.

  8. #8
    Boolit Bub
    Join Date
    Sep 2011
    Location
    Southern Middle Tennessee
    Posts
    41
    Quote Originally Posted by Larry Gibson View Post
    I use 5 parts beeswax to 4 parts (volume measurement) virgin olive oil. Works excellently for BP, smokeless and duplex loads in my 45-70 TDs. Also excellent in other BP cartridges like 45 Colt and 44-40.
    Does this mixture work OK as a pan lube so I could try a small batch before committing to a sizer full of it?

    Would the Modified Emmerts have any benefits over this mixture? I sure like the Lanolin and Jojoba in the Emmerts.

  9. #9
    Boolit Master gc45's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2015
    Location
    wash
    Posts
    544
    what larry Gipson said.

  10. #10
    Vendor Sponsor

    Chill Wills's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2011
    Location
    Was-Colorado, Wyoming now
    Posts
    3,175
    Quote Originally Posted by broken-mold View Post
    Does this mixture work OK as a pan lube so I could try a small batch before committing to a sizer full of it?

    Would the Modified Emmerts have any benefits over this mixture? I sure like the Lanolin and Jojoba in the Emmerts.
    Your "Modified Emmerts" will work well for pan lubing. It was designed to be able to push bullets out of the lube cake with out using any kind of messy Kake Kutter device at room temperature. Heat the bullets in the pan slightly before lubing, I use bread loaf pans, and pour in the lube mix and after it sets up and cools, the cake should come out. It shrinks. Put lube cake with the neat rows of bullets, a row it a time, over the edge of the work table and push each bullet down into the waiting hand. Bullets will be lubed with the grooves full and no lube where it should not be, clean.

    Pre-heating the bullets corrects the small air pockets that sometimes show up in the lubed Grease Grooves of the bullets.

    You may already know, but if you put your bulk lube in an old coffee maker and let the warmer melt it, it will never get too hot and it will pour into your lube pan where you want it to go using the pour spout and handle.
    Chill Wills

  11. #11
    Boolit Master

    Kraschenbirn's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2006
    Location
    East Central IL
    Posts
    3,463
    +1 post #10 (Chill Wills). Started out pan-lubing using SPG shortly after obtaining my first BPCR...about 15 years ago. Put together a batch of 'modified Emmert's' when I ran out of the SPG and have never looked back. I shoot both 38-55 and 47-70 at BP velocities without any significant leading.

    Bill
    "I'm not often right but I've never been wrong."

    Jimmy Buffett
    "Scarlet Begonias"

  12. #12
    Boolit Master
    Join Date
    May 2017
    Posts
    3,741
    Quote Originally Posted by Winger Ed. View Post
    For low speeds, pretty much anything will work.
    I don't get out the good stuff like Lyman's Orange Magic until my speeds get up into the teens.
    In .45ACP going as slow as they are- 1,000 fps or under:
    I've had good luck with the kid's broken crayons, the wife's 'fu-fu candles, and motor oil.

    For what you're doing, I'd just use whatever was in the sizer, or what I had the most of.

    I would put a caveat on that because of the intention to shoot some blackpowder ---any ole BP lube should work fine with smokeless at these velocities but not the reverse (smokeless lube with BP not)

  13. #13
    Boolit Buddy Brimstone's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2012
    Location
    Florida
    Posts
    160
    I use Gato Feo too. I use beef tallow I refined from hamburger meat.
    It has a lot of gelatin in it so requires refining via melting and cooling, removing the gelatin that settles in the bottom. Once done and filtered is brought up to temp to sterilize and ready for mixing.
    Then it's the usual ratio of 1lb tallow, 1lb paraffin wax and 1/2lb bees wax.

    I've had mine in jars in the shelf and in my Lyman 45 for over a year without issues.

    I started making it specifically for lubesizing my BACO mold .460 500gr Frankford Arsenal bullet clone. 3 large grooves hold a massive amount of grease.

  14. #14
    Boolit Master
    Join Date
    Apr 2015
    Posts
    612
    Quote Originally Posted by broken-mold View Post
    Does this mixture work OK as a pan lube so I could try a small batch before committing to a sizer full of it?

    Would the Modified Emmerts have any benefits over this mixture? I sure like the Lanolin and Jojoba in the Emmerts.
    I use that mixture and pan lube for my trapdoor. No issues with pan lubing with it.

  15. #15
    Boolit Master

    Eddie Southgate's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2016
    Location
    Southern Middle Tennessee/ Hillsboro Alabama
    Posts
    1,180
    Plain old black as tar Ideal lube . I used it for years before I ever knew there was anything else. It is the original black powder lube. I still keep a sizer loaded with it and use it quite a bit but I got a good supply that I been using out of for years. Not sure if you can still buy it or if the new Black Powder Gold is all they have now. Might be the same stuff just a different color as far as I know.
    Last edited by Eddie Southgate; 02-19-2024 at 06:06 PM.
    Grumpy Old Man With A Gun....... Do Not Touch !!

  16. #16
    Boolit Master
    Join Date
    Nov 2017
    Location
    brisbane ,qld,australia
    Posts
    2,147
    Moly powder and a enough beeswax to make it stick ......MoS2 ......best bullet lube ever ........steel coated with moly will not stick to lead.

  17. #17
    Boolit Master
    barrabruce's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2009
    Location
    Far Nth Qld Australia
    Posts
    1,989
    Quote Originally Posted by john.k View Post
    Moly powder and a enough beeswax to make it stick ......MoS2 ......best bullet lube ever ........steel coated with moly will not stick to lead.
    And moly grease they say.

    But it stays on everything as well as the bullet.
    One little drop or smear and it spreads for ever
    From the load bench to all around the house and garage and the boss lady gives you that look.

    Ohhhh.
    Not for the faint of heart.
    Last edited by barrabruce; 02-22-2024 at 08:07 AM.

  18. #18
    Boolit Grand Master Good Cheer's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2010
    Location
    the Ark
    Posts
    5,298
    Lanolin, olive oil and beeswax.

    Click image for larger version. 

Name:	LOOB.jpg 
Views:	2 
Size:	37.0 KB 
ID:	323979

  19. #19
    Boolit Buddy
    Join Date
    Jul 2010
    Posts
    335
    Ford moly EP tube grease works for smokeless or Black powder. Only downside is having to apply it a finger dab at a time. Very soft, but it doesn't melt or run.

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •  
Abbreviations used in Reloading

BP Bronze Point IMR Improved Military Rifle PTD Pointed
BR Bench Rest M Magnum RN Round Nose
BT Boat Tail PL Power-Lokt SP Soft Point
C Compressed Charge PR Primer SPCL Soft Point "Core-Lokt"
HP Hollow Point PSPCL Pointed Soft Point "Core Lokt" C.O.L. Cartridge Overall Length
PSP Pointed Soft Point Spz Spitzer Point SBT Spitzer Boat Tail
LRN Lead Round Nose LWC Lead Wad Cutter LSWC Lead Semi Wad Cutter
GC Gas Check