simple Hi-Tek coating

[hawaii five-0]

Ausglock- IMO the powder coat and Piglet method are in their infancy, and will be improved rapidly. I agree that HTS is the easiest, with best results so far. However, it's great that people are dedicating effort, time, and $$$ to other avenues and sharing their information on this forum. I tried the HTS for the first time this week on some 230 grain .300 Blackout boolits, and am most impressed with how they appear to have turned out. Target and barrel will be the final judges.....

[Love Life]

^^ Agreed. It is nice to see research and results on both methods.

IMO, for the low pressure stuff, HI-TEK and Powder coat are only accomplishing what LLA does, but with more work. With that being said, the benefits of clean dies and hands during and after the reloading process is what is worth the extra work.

It seems both methods (HT or PC) both work and it is a pick your poison kind of thing.

[BBQJOE]

I'm just wondering if anybody is using the different colors as codes. One color for this weight or that, or maybe an indication of powder charge. Or do you all just like the pretty colors?

[hawaii five-0]

Don't forget-less smoke....

[Ausglock]

My colours are all mixed up.
But I will probably settle on Rose red for 45, Gold for 38/357, Blue (if it works) for 9mm, and Green for 40.
But..you never know :-)

[BBQJOE]

My colours are all mixed up.
But I will probably settle on Rose red for 45, Gold for 38/357, Blue (if it works) for 9mm, and Green for 40.
But..you never know :-)
Hasn't it already been determined that green is strictly for zombies? :kidding:

[Lizard333]

Anyone using these boolits in suppressors? I'm currently getting excellent accuracy with my 311041 boolit in my 700, using a sealed AAC suppressor. I was until I found out that it might not be such a good idea. Another forum member suggested Hi tech coating, which lead me here. I'm only pushing them to 1060 FPS. So I don't think speed will be the issue. I'd hate to buy the product and have it not work.

Very cool read, you guys have a lot of great info.

[gunoil]

they shoot coated bullets in ar-15 at 2700 with gas checks. Thats all i know. I do pistols. I like flagstaff.

[Ausglock]

Anyone using these boolits in suppressors? I'm currently getting excellent accuracy with my 311041 boolit in my 700, using a sealed AAC suppressor. I was until I found out that it might not be such a good idea. Another forum member suggested Hi tech coating, which lead me here. I'm only pushing them to 1060 FPS. So I don't think speed will be the issue. I'd hate to buy the product and have it not work.

Very cool read, you guys have a lot of great info.

G'day Lizard 333
I have personally pushed a 100gr RN to 1760 FPS out of a Glock35 with 5" 357Sig barrel. Very snappy little load :-)

All coated with HI-TEK coating. Barrel was clean and shiny.
Today, I fired 200 rounds of Major power factor 38 Super out of the SV Infinity with 4 port compensator. Loads coated with the HI-TEK New Gold.

Barrel is clean and the compensator shows no fouling.

[castalott]

Well guys...all is not well...

The first batch leaded all the guns. Hmm..the coat wasn't dry enough...back to the oven ...check with a thermometer and when the oven said 450...it said 325 to 425.
This was after more than enough time to warm up. So I do another first coat-really thin. Get the oven up to 400 and bake for 20 minutes. Put on 2nd coat and bake for 20 minutes. Acetone removes both coats. Put the rest back in the oven again for 20 minutes. Both guages must be off as the boolits are starting to melt but the coating can still be scrapped off with a fingernail...( these were some older cast boolits I washed with acetone to clean...but still.....)

I am trainable-all my old girlfriends thought so anyway- so what gives?

[gunoil]

it would help to have a perfect oven. Tell us your ratio would help. You are sayin you coat thin. 8 mins is enough at 375. Your oven is convection, it has to be. Let your bullets dry for 30 mins before oven. Trevor blows hair dryer on his too before cooking.

[Ausglock]

Castalott.
go to page 19 and read post #366
Follow these steps and it will work.

20 minutes is far too long to bake. Remember... it has to be thin coats.

[castalott]

A little more info. The first batch was 3 different fairly freshly cast boolits. They were cooked on the same settings for 5 minutes. Everything was air-dryed with a fan until the batch wasn't 'sticky' (every time). I had cooked the 2nd batch for 10 minutes but acetone would remove the coating. I went to 15 and then 20 trying to get the coating to set. My mix was 5-1-7. I'm gonna try 5-2-7 next time.
Yes, I put boolits in the color and shakeshakeshake. I mixed everything until I was mixed out.
My oven is a new convection type. I cook on the center rack only.I cool the boolits between coats. It's a new gallon of acetone.
I'll re-read the directions again....

[Ausglock]

do not do 5-2-7. you do not need extra Catalyst. the 5-1 is perfect to get the hardening. the 7 of acetone lets it swirl around better. remember.. less is better. thin coats.
don't be in a hurry. swirl until the sound changes. then lay them out to dry. 10 minutes (or there abouts) and then wave a hair dryer on heat over them. check your oven temp with a thermometer. 190deg C. do not try and put too many bullet per tray. I do 250 to 300 9mm and only about 150 to 200 45 per tray. 10 minutes and take them out and let them cool. once cold, smash one or 2 and see if the coating flakes off. if it does, you are still putting it on too thick. when you rub with acetone, only do it to cold bullets. a little colour is no problem. a lot of colour, big problem. I have found that the only way to fugg it up is to put the coating on too thick or have too many bullets in the oven or the temp is too low. everything else works.

TAKE YOUR TIME. don't rush. once you have it working, then you know what you have to do.
I coated and cooked 4000 9mm this afternoon in a few hours. have another 2000 45 to coat and cook tomorrow night.

[kbstenberg]

Ausglock I know neither you or Gunoil shoot rifle. I'm just throwing this out there for those of us that do.
I find it interesting that you can push your 357sig to 1700fps. I know comp. rifles to pistols is like comp., apples to oranges. BUT. If a pistol bullet can be driven to that velocity why cant a rifle bullet?

[Ausglock]

Ausglock I know neither you or Gunoil shoot rifle. I'm just throwing this out there for those of us that do.
I find it interesting that you can push your 357sig to 1700fps. I know comp. rifles to pistols is like comp., apples to oranges. BUT. If a pistol bullet can be driven to that velocity why cant a rifle bullet?

Today, a mate was firing his 44 mag. lever rifle using 240gr coated lead bullets. We chronoed them at 1815FPS. kicked like a mule. But the barrel was clean and shiny.
Note: no gas checks

[Ajax]

Has anyone tried this in 30-06 at closer to factory speeds? If so what were you results? Did you use a gas check? would lubing also hurt it any?

Andy

[Love Life]

I have my 1st coat on a messload of 358429 and H&G 34 clones out drying right now.

I am using red copper. I'll bake them this afternoon, and then apply the second coat. The1st coat went on real thin.

[BBQJOE]

Castalot, When first starting out with this stuff, it is really common to put too much on. We want to see the coloring on the bullet to believe it's there. I'm using gold. You can't even see any color on the bullet with the first coat until it's been in the oven for about five minutes.
My first success was using 1/4 teaspoon on 50 9mm's tumbled in a small yogurt tub.
We also tend to want to start out large and put way too many bullets in the oven at a time.
Try a smaller batch.

[Love Life]

Just got my first batch with the 1st coat out of the oven. Some turned a brownish color and some didn't I'm assuming uneven heating in the oven allow some to over cook and some not to. I wacked them with a 9 lb sledge and the coating was fine. Acetone test went well. I just applied coat 2 and they are drying. I'll get them in the oven later. These are 358429. They will be sized to .358 and loaded over 5.3 gr of unique in 38 special brass.

If these pass the smush and acetone test, but still lead, then I will have some serious questions and experimenting to do. I'm pretty sure I can coat this bullet over that charge with chapstick and they'd do fine in my S&W model 28. So we'll see what happens.

[Love Life]

2nd coat and 2nd cook done. Passed the acetone and the smush test. Some appear as if they cooked to long due to the golden color, but then again some got more of the color than the others did when swirling. One thing I will do different next time is coat less boolits at a time in the coffee can. Seems I get better color distribution that way. None of them are coated as thick as the gold ones or the ones I see Gun oil coated. Oh well. I'll shoot them anyway and see what happens.

Does the color do anything to aid in the coating or is it just to look cool?

[gunoil]

I guess base product is same for all colors. I let oven preheat. Were all still learning! The convection makes best bullet. The very expensive pizza oven is best, i was told. Heck, iam happy and a amature. Start with clean barrel,shoot,then brush barrel lightly then u see how clean this HTS is. Boy, my presses and dies are superclean, including my magma star lube-a-sizers with tall tube bullet feeder. I still need to pick up an oven thermometer. I love estate sales, good old quality stuff thats cheap.

[Ausglock]

the colour does nothing as far as leading goes. 2 thin coats are fine to stop leading. But remember bullet fit to bore is still the king.

When doing gold, I too get some dark bullets. it has to do with the air circulation in the oven. This is why I only cook on the middle rack. it helps even out the temperature. Also don't overload your cooking tray. a little room around the bullets promotes air flow for a more even coating colour.
Good work Love life.

[kbstenberg]

Ajax most everyone has been using HT on pistol stuff. There has only been 2 postings pertaining to rifles. Several people (Love Life & Popper) are applying HT now. If reports from other members look promising I will jump on the Bandwagon and start experimenting with HT. But I can't see using HT just for pistol. My results with 45/45/10 do everything I want. With no baking. Kevin

[gunoil]

No baking, but smell, sticky, waiting for it to dry, size then slosh alox mix again. Running the stuff thru your sizers and bulletfeeders and barrels and your fingers. This stuff does not have " CANCER" written on the bottle. Ive used alox, this is quicker, yea i know recluse's (it does improve) formula. Alox smell like sompins @$$. period!

For 5th time, they have figured and shot bunches @ 2700 in ar-15 w/gas checks. Donnie Miculek's friends, where you buy the stuff. Or thats what donnie told me on the telephone. Google: jerry miculek

This HTS has been in oz land 20 years, I dont think the "miculek" family would bring this to USA or sell it unless they checked it out intense before.

[Love Life]

Here is my 1st run after 2 coats and cooks. As you can see the distribution of the color is screwy. Less bullets in the coffee can at a time will fix that. What I was concerned about was the yellowing. I see that I evident in the lube groove of the bullets Donnie sent me. His are much more evenly coated though. Hopefully the next try will come out with better color distribution.

As you can see they passed the smush test from the 9 lb sledge with no flaking. I then wiped them with acetone (the paper towel) with just a smidge of discoloring on the paper towel, but I couldn't see where any coating came off of the bullets themselves. I mic'd a bulle, and then there are 3 bullets that have not been messed with other than the coating baking process.

[Just Call Me...G]

Ajax most everyone has been using HT on pistol stuff. There has only been 2 postings pertaining to rifles. Several people (Love Life & Popper) are applying HT now. If reports from other members look promising I will jump on the Bandwagon and start experimenting with HT. But I can't see using HT just for pistol. My results with 45/45/10 do everything I want. With no baking. Kevin

Kevin, Amen...I am just fine with my current pistol boolit process and honestly could care less about HTS and pistol.

I am VASTLY more interested in rifle results and the possibilities of running HTS-coated boolits at higher supersonic velocities as well as use in subsonic/suppressed.

I have e-mailed/spoken with Donnie on numerous occasions and he has specifically mentioned that they are at the very beginning of the learning curve regarding HTS and rifle applications.

As a matter of fact I shipped him 38 pounds of various rifle-designed boolits that I cast so that he can coat them and experiment.

Donnie also mentioned his friend who shot the HTS boolit @ 2700fps...but even he said that he does not have any info beyond that...so we can officially stop quoting this story.

Where the metal meets the meat is what I (and the other rifle shooters) are interested in.
Conjecture, emphatic enthusiasm, it's 20-year use, etc. is all good and well.
What purpose or designation for rifle application is the question being asked...

Donnie and I are still in communication and thus far his first outing with HTS and rifle use did not go well.
Once he has done more R & D, he has assured me that he will be sending back some of my own boolits coated with HTS for me to use.

I will keep the thread apprised when this happens and what my results are, objectively.


Keep The High Ground,


G

[Love Life]

Here are my thoughts so far.

I scrapped the 1st batch of 358429 (shown in picture) because they look like ****. You need to use some one shot when sizing or you'll size the coating away (even though the boolits passed the smush and wipe test).

What I will do next time:
Coat less boolits in the tub at a time.
Heavier 2nd coat.

I did the above with the H&G 34 clone for the 45 acp and they look MUCH better.

The 358429 required 8-9 minutes of cook time.
The 45 acp 230 gr RN required 10-12 minutes of cook time.

Now to my thoughts on the color. The red copper has mucho solids (already a known), but I feel the solids in the red/copper impede a nice coating. I feel the coatings with less solids will give a much better and even coating of color. I know looks aren't everything, but I like good looking stuff.

Now to my thoughts on using this in rifle and pistol:
In pistol I believe it will work very well.

In rifle I believe it will be an epic fail. The coat will be uneven on the rifle boolit which WILL not be conducive to accuracy. Just the way it is. I'll test and hopefully prove myself wrong, but I feel that I am right. Not only that, but from what has been read here the alloy needs to meet the velocity/pressure envelope.

There is a lot of assuming going on in what I typed above, but I will test it, verify, and report back. I would like to try a different color, but this stuff ain't cheap. I won't be able to test for another 2 weeks because I have to leave to town to go to my brother's wedding.

To be continued....

[goblism]

I noticed the green goes on a lot smoother than the red, the red sized hard at first but the green is sizing easy.

One thing i noted is on larger bullets (400 grain 476 diameter) my coating turned yellow/slightly brown with the green coating. It passed the smash and acetone test, but i am guessing the extra mass might cook the coating longer than other smaller bullets. My 200 grain SWC in 45 acp look pretty good and are very slippery after the green coating.

I initially did the 5-5-1 with my red and changed to 7-8 parts of acetone with much better results (also used the green for my second batch)

[BBQJOE]

Lovelife, what color is that supposed to be?
Something just ain't right.
I'm thinking you're not mixing the the can of color enough.
My coat doesn't come off when sizing.

[Ausglock]

Here is my 1st run after 2 coats and cooks. As you can see the distribution of the color is screwy. Less bullets in the coffee can at a time will fix that. What I was concerned about was the yellowing. I see that I evident in the lube groove of the bullets Donnie sent me. His are much more evenly coated though. Hopefully the next try will come out with better color distribution.

As you can see they passed the smush test from the 9 lb sledge with no flaking. I then wiped them with acetone (the paper towel) with just a smidge of discoloring on the paper towel, but I couldn't see where any coating came off of the bullets themselves. I mic'd a bulle, and then there are 3 bullets that have not been messed with other than the coating baking process.
LL. What is your mix.
This looks to be not mixed right.

Have you used 5-1-7? remember... you have to shake and then put the coating in the bucket immediately and swirl around or it will settle out. this looks settled out to me.

[Love Life]

I used 5-1-7. I shook the poo out of the red before adding it to the 5-1-7 mixture. I then shook it really well before adding the complete coating to the boolits. Where I screwed those up is I had waaaaayyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyy to many boolits in the tub and didn't add enough coating on the 2nd coat.. The mix is right, the temp was right, too many boolits in the tub is wrong.

There is a learning curve here.

Taking what I learned from the goof up with the 358429, and applying it to the 45 acp RN, you can see the coating covered better and doesn't look as dookyish. I will try a batch with 5-1-10, and maybe reverse things and try one at 5-1-4.

We'll see. The advice for a thin 1st coat is spot on, but a thicker 2nd coat coated better (with the color at least).

[gunoil]

Your stuff is on to thick and when i size mine it does not come off. I think it is dirt cheap, 36$+ shipping will do 12 thousand bullets. It cost the same or more to do other coatings.

Thin it out with acetone, first coat i do is so thin it looks like i screwed up, second coat is best. I let it dry 30 mins. Go run your press a while then come back. I did what trev says and it wirks good.

I looked again, LMAO, yours look like "terrible". Your 5-1-8 on the next batch and shake them 40 seconds in a plastic cool whip container,,, NOT A CAN! I would watch youtube vid again. That guys good. When i finish i put lid back on plastic container.
http://i1113.photobucket.com/albums/k511/putt2012/34D74C93-A41B-4313-8CB0-5104821582CA-13419-0000113C23515959_zps6962b06b.jpg
[above] I MIX THEN POUR INTO YELLOW MUSTARD SQUIRT BOTTLE WITH BLACK TOP ON IT. IT STAYS IN THERE UP TO FOUR DAYS, BY THEN ITS GONE.

http://i1113.photobucket.com/albums/k511/putt2012/FCBE6C93-EC65-4230-9558-21886E3EC4A6-13419-000011756A9FF6E9_zpsb4c33417.jpg
http://i1113.photobucket.com/albums/k511/putt2012/C7A8A7F2-3FA7-4A08-8F63-A924C83FADC4-17465-0000121458E87F37_zpsa3ee7809.jpg
YOU BOUGHT THIS 31100?
http://i1113.photobucket.com/albums/k511/putt2012/D42E6D19-6F8A-4F77-9766-B1FCD8A78D22-13419-00000F467DBE3736_zps6ad30829.jpg

[Love Life]

It doesn't look any thicker than some of the other coated boolits in this thread. I'll give it another go with a light 1st coat (My 1st coat looks like the boolits are nekkid) and a lighter 2nd coat, but I need to bake these 1st and see how they size and shoot. I may need a different sizer. These cast at .454, the coat adds to the diameter, and I will be sizing to .452. Hmmm. Only time will tell. I'll get it figured out here.

I also need to see how the 5-1-10 works out.

[jcobb651]

Are these loaded using data for cast, jacketed, plated, or what? I tried the piglet method of pc....wasn't for me. Going to order HT in a few days.

[BBQJOE]

LL, you're getting closer, but it still looks wrong.
Try doing like just 50 bullets, in a small tub. Nothing big like a bucket or coffee can.
Did you put a few bullets in with the color to help mix it like the BB's in a spray paint can?
Again, when I apply the first coat using gold, the color is invisible on the bullets until they bake.

Your first try actually looks better than mine.
This was my first batch below.

77500

I didn't mix well enough, didn't let dry long enough, and my oven didn't get up to temp. I was also trying to coat too many at a time, in too big of a container.
In other words, I did everything wrong a person could with this stuff.

I fixed all those issues, and here's what I'm putting out now.

77501

[Love Life]

I shake them in a plastic folgers coffee can. It is no different than your cool whip tub...

I'll try 5-1-10 and see how that coats. There is always tomorrow, and I will agree, they do look pretty terrible!!! Those boolits have a face not even a mother would love. Wait...does that make me their mother? I don't love them.

So on my next run:
Mix 5-1-10
Get a different tub
Leave 1st coat the same
Go lighter on second coat

The important thing to remember in all this: Shake everything like a polaroid picture!

I have the Walmart oven, but a thermometer verified it hits the temperature I need. It gets hot on top of the oven and I let the boolits sit up there while it heats up. Back to the drawing board.

P.S. My boolits look better from a distance...

[Love Life]

LL, you're getting closer, but it still looks wrong.
Try doing like just 50 bullets, in a small tub. Nothing big like a bucket or coffee can.
Did you put a few bullets in with the color to help mix it like the BB's in a spray paint can?
Again, when I apply the first coat using gold, the color is invisible on the bullets until they bake.

Your first try actually looks better than mine.
This was my first batch below.

77500

I didn't mix well enough, didn't let dry long enough, and my oven didn't get up to temp. I was also trying to coat too many at a time, in too big of a container.
In other words, I did everything wrong a person could with this stuff.

I fixed all those issues, and here's what I'm putting out now.

77501

I learned the lesson about too many boolits in the tub real quick. Once I put less in the tub the 1st coating got better. I can't hardly tell they have any coating on them until I bake them. I'll get this figured out and then I'll proceed to come back and laugh at all of this.

[BBQJOE]

I have the Walmart oven, but a thermometer verified it hits the temperature I need. It gets hot on top of the oven and I let the boolits sit up there while it heats up.



This might also be an issue. Let them dry in front of a fan.

[Love Life]

I let them dry for 4 hours in the Nevada sun.

Sitting them on top of the oven is just to get them warm. I can still pick them up.

[Ausglock]

Do not put on top of the oven. It is too hot and sort of 1/2 cooks them. Just let them sit for 10 minutes or so and wave a hair dryer over them just before placing in the oven.

[Love Life]

No more putting them on the oven or me then. I'll let the Nevada sun and wind take care of all the drying then.

[Liberty'sSon]

Love Life, I think I remember you mentioned mixing the mixture after adding acetone " very well" could it be that more acetone is flashing off than should before you pour the mixture onto the bullets? Could this cause the splotchiness you are getting? Just a thought.

[leadman]

For those asking about rifle loads check my posts in this thread. I'm at 2,550fps in the 30-06 with a 200gr boolit and 2,650 fps with the 22 K-Hornet. Accuracy was not what I want but could be used for hunting at 100 yards. I heat treated some more boolits but they did not attain the BHN I want so will cast another batch with a different alloy. The previous test boolits were cast of straight linotype, 22 BHN.
I also found out the hard way that previously boolits lubed with Carnuba Red or LBT Blue Soft can not be coated with HT. This is after using mineral spirits to remove the lube, then washing with laundry detergent and hot water, then Purple Power and hot water, then a commercial liquid cleaner used in auto body shop to clean paint before repainting. The coating does not adhere well and chips off on these boolits while "fresh" boolits coated at the same time coated just fine.
Been pretty busy with orders for boolits so haven't had the time to devote to testing plus I am running low on the IMR4350 and can't find any for sale. I'll check around again this week or switch to 4831 for the 30-06 testing.

[gunoil]

Your there lovelife. Your trying to hard.
http://i1113.photobucket.com/albums/k511/putt2012/855F6E5A-964E-415D-8FE5-E73412258F35-139-0000041378238055_zps6d28a2af.jpg
This rack and you see the white fan setting on floor behind it. Do it the same all year long. They dont need to be outside. TWO THIN COATS @ 375 for 8 mins. Dontforget middle rack. You have not been doing 2 thin coats.... Like most! Like trev said: do not set on top of oven, just put cool bullets in pre-heated oven.

[jmoore]

Any particular reason for the separate cooling rack? I just made a couple of oven sized trays to start and have let the boolits cool on those whilst the others cook.

Did some red copper and some green 429421s. Using the same amount of coating as before but 3 and 2 1/2 times as many projectiles as previously. Probably more in the ballpark quantity-wise. Thought the copper was going to be too thin, but it has color. The variation in as-cast diameter well excedes the coating thickness this time! The grooves and the front shoulder did not always receive color, but if there's no leading and the accuracy is good, then looks just don't matter to me.

77507
Left boolit is from test batch #1. The others are from the latest run.

As far as rifle boolits and Hi TEK coating goes, there's an 1891 Argentine Mauser waiting. May have to get a 311299 mould versus the 314299 on hand, as the bore is a very smooth and uniform 0.312".

Annoyingly, Lee doesn't make a 0.312" or 0.313" push through sizing die, but if the holes don't strip the coating from the boolit, maybe this old .45 ACP sizing die bored out to take Lyman boolit sizers will work:

77506

ETA: Oh, BTW, I've been mixing the coating ingredients IN the coating containers by letting the boolits do the work for me. The secret being keeping a lid on the container whilst mixing. THEN taking off the lid to coat. The latest run sticks well and has no color removed at all when wiped down with acetone after curing.

[leadman]

jmoore, the Lee sizing dies are easily enlarged by using emery paper and a dowel. I put them in my old Craftsman hobby lathe and wrap a pencil with emery paper and do it that way.
If your bore is .312" a .313" boolit would be appropriate. The 311299 might not be large enough. I have 2 1891s, a full military and a sporter. Both shoot great.
Your boolit coating looks great.

[jmoore]

jmoore, the Lee sizing dies are easily enlarged by using emery paper and a dowel. I put them in my old Craftsman hobby lathe and wrap a pencil with emery paper and do it that way.
If your bore is .312" a .313" boolit would be appropriate. The 311299 might not be large enough. I have 2 1891s, a full military and a sporter. Both shoot great.
Your boolit coating looks great.

Thanks! The coating does seem better, even if the results of the first test were quite pleasing.

Tried the lapping trick in a Lyman, but never could get the central area to enlarge enough to matter. But given the short boolits sized in the 4500 press, it works well enough. Haven't experimented with the Lee dies, yet. If the Lyman dies work, then it may be awhile. Will see in a couple of weeks, probably.

Need to get some zeros with a good Field Pistol load for the IHMSA match this weekend. Might try the Red Copper boolits, as there's more of 'em.

[gunoil]

Yea jmoore ,,,some nites i need 2 racks. Cooling drying.

[Ausglock]

I use seperate trays for drying and cooking. The reason: any wet coating will stay on the drying trays and can be cleaned off with acetone on a cloth. Any coating that is on the cooking trays will get baked to the tray and cannot be wiped off.
Just my way of good house keeping.

When I am mixing, I add the colour first, then the catalyst, then the acetone.
I played with the red/copper and now an mixing it 5-1-10. this give a much better coating. you use more solution (but still the same amount of colour and catalyst, just more acetone to swirl around) and gives a lighter in colour and this mix gets to all the sharp angles and grooves of SWC bullets. Using the extreme or 2-extreme catalyst makes the bullets easy to size.

[Love Life]

Ok. So I read the instructions posted by Ausglock. I did pretty much the opposite of what he said to do. I'm a guy and I don't need no stinking instructions!!!

I will follow the instructions and get better results next time.

[gunoil]

ah! ,, there ya go guys. Thanks always Trevor. Keep is simple.

[castalott]

Ok...part of the mystery is solved. I have been reusing the same mixing container. Today I put 10 boolits in it and a few drops of new coating. Swirling the boolits around they became very coated. The new coating was freeing up what coating had dried from previous uses and made the boolits look like *&%$@%. ( It was a thick, splotchy, ugly coating. Not thin, smooth, pretty, or useful.)

Hmmm... sitting with head in palm...Dad always said I have to be smarter than what I am working on....

[josleynrm]

runfiverun

How's your accuracy on the 223 at 2700?

I ran some 55 grain with HITek at just over 2400 and accuracy was horrible, but there was no leading. They pretty much disintegrate in dry newspaper. Alloy was at just over 18 BHN.

Robert

[gunoil]

You did not have top on mix container? Keep top on it. Will make a lil' difference. There shouldn't be hardly any in the container. Next mix with 10 parts acetone, it will wet what lil' bit u have in there down. Do 5-1-10, try this mix trevor said. It looks like not enough (when put on thin) but after you cook u see! Then you say: " oh yea, quite a bit of color". Then your not scared to put the second coat on thin also. Everyone does that first. I do 2 thin coats. Miculek said: 3 thin for rifle.

[gunoil]

R5R,Josleynrm, u used gas checks and bullet disintegrated?

Well, least i can shoot my lil' keltec carbine/40s&w. I think i getting green next time.

[Ausglock]

Gunslick. Wait for the fire engine red coating. It is sweeeeeeeeeeeeet. Also known as red 254.
THE EXPERIMENTAL SKY BLUE should be here today. I will coat and bake and post a few photos, if it works.

[Love Life]

Lucky. You get all the new colors to play with first. Then again , you live in Australia which is the home of the most poisonous...well...everything!

[Ausglock]

Ok. So I read the instructions posted by Ausglock. I did pretty much the opposite of what he said to do. I'm a guy and I don't need no stinking instructions!!!

I will follow the instructions and get better results next time.

Ha ha ha... when all else fails ...R.T.F.M.:-)

[Love Life]

Don't tell me to read the manual. I have been coating bullets for 3,645 years and have never had an issue before. I'm not wrong!! You're wrong, everybody else is wrong, but I'm not wrong! I came here to help all of you learn coating :kidding:

[gunoil]

Ok, trev! I'll wait.

It will look good in my collator, hehehehe
https://www.dropbox.com/s/tnbanubu3qz6mz1/1%20PtDwn%20DAA.wmv



I been to 3 county fairs, and aint seen nothing to beat it.

[Ausglock]

Don't tell me to read the manual. I have been coating bullets for 3,645 years and have never had an issue before. I'm not wrong!! You're wrong, everybody else is wrong, but I'm not wrong! I came here to help all of you learn coating :kidding:

Thankyou, Jedi Master for showing us the error of our ways :-)

[Love Life]

Gotta keep things lively around here.

[BBQJOE]

I tried doing some HP's today. Knowing there was no way to get the inside coated well, I decided to try and keep the inside from getting coated at all. I put the mix in the tub first, then added the bullets.
I might go for a third coat on these.
77625

[kbstenberg]

Ausglock does it matter if you let the bullets dry before baking for an extended time. Say you only had a little time and wanted to get one step out of the way. An hours or days later you do the baking
Or is it better to do all the steps one after the other? Kevin

[gunoil]

You can wait days. KB

[Ausglock]

I have had trays of coated and dry, but un-baked bullets sitting around for a week or so. They baked fine when I got to it.

[Copper75]

http://img.tapatalk.com/d/13/07/30/e8u4uny7.jpg

Top one from last week, bottom from tonight. Better, but still not acceptable.
I'm using 5-1-7.
I'm thinking I'm still getting the coating to heavy.

That sound about right?



Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk 2

[redrockant]

Just try 5-1-10, light coats are best.

[Ausglock]

http://img.tapatalk.com/d/13/07/30/e8u4uny7.jpg

Top one from last week, bottom from tonight. Better, but still not acceptable.
I'm using 5-1-7.
I'm thinking I'm still getting the coating to heavy.

That sound about right?



Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk 2

Yep. way way way too much coating. thin it out more. 5-1-10 and only use a tiny amount. remember you can always put more coats on, but you can't remove a heavy coat without re-melting.

[jmoore]

http://img.tapatalk.com/d/13/07/30/e8u4uny7.jpg

Top one from last week, bottom from tonight. Better, but still not acceptable.
I'm using 5-1-7.
I'm thinking I'm still getting the coating to heavy.

That sound about right?





Could it also be a sign of letting the mix flash off too much during the shaking procedure? I've not kept mixing after the tone change, which, once the lid is removed takes very little time, indeed!

[Ausglock]

I don't use a lid when I'm coating. Just an open plastic bucket. the thinness of the coating is the key.

[HI-TEK]

I tried doing some HP's today. Knowing there was no way to get the inside coated well, I decided to try and keep the inside from getting coated at all. I put the mix in the tub first, then added the bullets.
I might go for a third coat on these.
77625

They look awesome.
Well done.
Are they baked two coats?
When you look closely, there seems some that are a little darker (more tan) colour.
It could suggest that you may have some uneven heating taking place, where some get more heat than others.
Even if darker in colour, they should all work OK. If they are too light in colour with same batch, they may not be cooked adequately.
Try to get them all same colour after baking, by shaking tray periodically whilst cooking. This should help with change of hot air circulation around each projectile, and you may get more even heat up & cure with all.

[Ausglock]

How I store my mixed coating.
77651
77652
77653

My swirling buckets.
77655
Casting setup. 3 6 cavity molds at once. I can cast fast and the molds do not overheat.
77656
158gr RNF coated with Rose red
77657
125gr RN coated with fire engine red (red 254)
77658
150gr RN coated with New Gold
77659
230gr FP coated with Pearl Red
77654

Yummy.......... :-)

[LongGun1]

Nice!! :D

[Mike Hughes]

I finally got around to testing some 223. First attempt showed some promise but also needs improvement. I loaded approx. 30 rounds of 60 gr boolits from a Mihec group buy mold, 3 thin coats of Hi-Tek with 19.5 gr of H4895. These were fitted with aluminum gas checks from my freechex III and running 2350 fps.
I went through a ridiculous amount of ammo getting my scope to zero at 100 yds. Finally ready to try a five shot group, first 4 grouped into 1.5 inch, 5th shot was off the paper. Only had 3 more rounds left, all of them also off the paper. What the heck, got home and found the barrel to be heavily leaded.
My next batch will be the same, but going to lube with carnauba red.
My 9mm just keeps getting better. Got a Mihec .359 125 gr hp. Shot 300 of em loaded with 4.3 gr of Unique. Accuracy was excellent and barrel was shiny new (barely even a trace of powder residue.) I'm sold on the Hi Tek for handgun, but need to more rifle testing (will be posting results)

[BBQJOE]

Jmoore, it also appears to me that your bullets aren't getting completely dry before baking. Some of the roughness looks similar to what I first got when there was still acetone gassing off in the oven.

[goblism]

Ausglock how long have you stored the mix in those bottled before? I know I should try and use the mix in a few days but I am wondering if you have had luck with weeks or even a month or two

[Ausglock]

Ausglock how long have you stored the mix in those bottled before? I know I should try and use the mix in a few days but I am wondering if you have had luck with weeks or even a month or two


G'day. Some have been mixed and sitting for a month or so. I just give them a shake every now and then. The red/copper was the first coating I tried. It is the oldest one I have mixed. I used it again last night and it worked perfectly.
It is still winter here (20 deg C of a day and down to 5deg C of a night) when summer get here (42Deg C) I will be storing the mixed coating in the fridge.

[jmoore]

Jmoore, it also appears to me that your bullets aren't getting completely dry before baking. Some of the roughness looks similar to what I first got when there was still acetone gassing off in the oven.

Them's not my boolits, if you are referring to the red colored rifle boolits. The .44 mag boolits coated last (see Post #564) aren't rough at all!

[gunoil]

ausglock,,do you size all your bullets? The 2 new magma star sizers i bought have give me lots of free time to do other stuff.

http://i1113.photobucket.com/albums/k511/putt2012/D57AF4B0-BACA-476E-A5E4-14E77F8DA839-169-0000013B72A993B6_zps496c268a.jpg

[Ausglock]

yep. I'm using Lee push through sizers in a Lee C press mounted upside down.

[garym1a2]

For what its worth I tried Hi-tek with the 300 blackout and a L155gr gas check copper. Running 1700fps. Accuracy was fine and it did not lead. My process was seat a gas check, coat 3 times size it. Problem is with C-red conventinal lube I just seat the gas check and run it thru the Lyman 4500 and I am done. Both ways shoot decent, leadfree and accurate, just the conventional lube was was less labor for me.

The handguns are different, that's where I want to save some labor as the coat process and the push thru process should save some labor. Plus the fact that the conventional lube is a hassel with dirty dies and a dirty chamber.


I finally got around to testing some 223. First attempt showed some promise but also needs improvement. I loaded approx. 30 rounds of 60 gr boolits from a Mihec group buy mold, 3 thin coats of Hi-Tek with 19.5 gr of H4895. These were fitted with aluminum gas checks from my freechex III and running 2350 fps.
I went through a ridiculous amount of ammo getting my scope to zero at 100 yds. Finally ready to try a five shot group, first 4 grouped into 1.5 inch, 5th shot was off the paper. Only had 3 more rounds left, all of them also off the paper. What the heck, got home and found the barrel to be heavily leaded.
My next batch will be the same, but going to lube with carnauba red.
My 9mm just keeps getting better. Got a Mihec .359 125 gr hp. Shot 300 of em loaded with 4.3 gr of Unique. Accuracy was excellent and barrel was shiny new (barely even a trace of powder residue.) I'm sold on the Hi Tek for handgun, but need to more rifle testing (will be posting results)

[jmoore]

Forgot the hammer test photo! This one took five or six blows:

77773

[gunoil]

Put em on the train track, multi-colors. Make her a nice lookin bracelet.

jmoore, to me your photo looks like art print. Look good hangin on the wall. IJS,IMHO.

[swheeler]

How I store my mixed coating.
77651
77652
77653

My swirling buckets.
77655
Casting setup. 3 6 cavity molds at once. I can cast fast and the molds do not overheat.
77656
158gr RNF coated with Rose red
77657
125gr RN coated with fire engine red (red 254)
77658
150gr RN coated with New Gold
77659
230gr FP coated with Pearl Red
77654

Yummy.......... :-)

Ausglock; how long are you able to store your mixed coating in the refrigerator? By mixed you mean pigment, catalyst and the ACETONE all stored for days, weeks.

[Ausglock]

Ausglock; how long are you able to store your mixed coating in the refrigerator? By mixed you mean pigment, catalyst and the ACETONE all stored for days, weeks.

Yes. That is what I call mixed. I have only been playing with this stuff for a bit over a month. My mixed coating is out on the bench all the time, But I imagine in summer I will store in the fridge. As to storage life, I'll have to wait and see.

[BBQJOE]

Them's not my boolits, if you are referring to the red colored rifle boolits. The .44 mag boolits coated last (see Post #564) aren't rough at all!
Sorry, my mistake.

[swheeler]

Alrighty then, waste should not be a problem, thanks.

[BBQJOE]

Hell, I'm dealing with 100+ temps here, and I've had a bottle mixed on the bench for a week or better, and it's just fine.

[g5m]

hi tek kit for 36$







.



Get to work.

Just curious, but where is the kit available for $36? I've seen it at about $65 but not the $36 figure.
Thanks.

[gunoil]

call donnie, tell em ya want 1/2 kit.

[Ausglock]

Popper.. Mate. I feel your pain.
Weeds to kill, lawn to mow, windows to clean, paths to pressure clean, eaves to de-cobweb, hedges to trim, more bloody weeds.

I need to retire to have time to make bullets..... :-)

[g5m]

call donnie, tell em ya want 1/2 kit.

Thank you.

[jmoore]

Popper.. Mate. I feel your pain.
Weeds to kill, lawn to mow, windows to clean, paths to pressure clean, eaves to de-cobweb, hedges to trim, more bloody weeds.

I need to retire to have time to make bullets..... :-)

Ditto, but it's not like I have a real job! More like a hobby gone way overboard.

I use the lawn mower noise to mask the racket from the cement mixer that's cleaning the recovered range lead. That lead along with some salvaged linotype is what has supported the introduction to coating.

[Ausglock]

I use the lawn mower noise to mask the racket from the cement mixer that's cleaning the recovered range lead.

mmm... Interesting... Cement mixer eh? Wouldn't have any photos of it and showing how the range reclaimed lead comes out?
I'm sick of smelting range re-claim and ending up with 3/4 pot of clay dust and 1/4 lead.

[jmoore]

Put em on the train track, multi-colors. Make her a nice lookin bracelet.

jmoore, to me your photo looks like art print. Look good hangin on the wall. IJS,IMHO.

Institute of Jesuit Sources?

Institute of Jewish Spirituality?

Intrinsic Jitter Spectrum?:
"Jitter is the dynamic deviation of event instants in a
stream or signal from their ideal positions in time,
excluding modulation components below 10 Hz."

So many acronyms, so little computer lingo savvy!

ETA1: Dunno about photos, will have to look (There's thousands of 'em, not all end up where you'd think...)

ETA2:Some washed bullets. (Some I'd shot and recovered for study):
http://i20.photobucket.com/albums/b226/dave4201/Jmoore%20Stuff/general%20ammo%20and%20reloading/Bullet%20Casting/2013-06-14jmoorestuff007_zpsb7cdc68e.jpg (http://s20.photobucket.com/user/dave4201/media/Jmoore%20Stuff/general%20ammo%20and%20reloading/Bullet%20Casting/2013-06-14jmoorestuff007_zpsb7cdc68e.jpg.html)
ETA4: Now that I think about, those weren't washed in the mixer! The mixer cleaned scrap is generally a bit better.

ETA1 (cont.)But it's the el cheapo electric motor driven thing as sold at Harbor Freight, et. al.

The mixer removes a huge amount of gunk. Some remains, but i'd guess 95% is removed.

ETA3:

http://www.bing.com/images/search?q=habor+freight+cement+mixer&FORM=HDRSC2#view=detail&id=1CBDE7BE35FBE0B52E38267F413C27C823FE9648&selectedIndex=1

"Central Machinery" 3-1/2 cubic foot mixer, I think.

[Ausglock]

Well.
I tried the new HI-TEK Brick Red and the Blue/violet today.

The brick red is not a very apt name for the coating.
This coating is the closest thing I have ever seen to looking like a jacketed bullet.
It is a shiny copper jacketed colour. The photo does not do it justice.
It was mixed 5-1-15 and coated twice. Smash and wipe proof. baked at 190 deg C for 10 minutes per coat
77896

The blue/violet gives a Bluish gunmetal grey. I couldn't get a decent photo with my phone.
I'll take the DSLR up to the shed tomorrow and get some photos in daylight.
It was mixed 2.5 blue, 2.5 Violet, 1 extreme Catalyst and 15 Acetone.
This an experimental colour and I imagine HI-TEK will be inundated with calls for both these colours.

The new Gold has been re-mixed. 5-1-15 and it coated great. A nice yellow gold.

[BBQJOE]

I just went out and did some real shooting this morning since getting into this hi-tek coating. It was awfully nice to come home and not have to scrub alox and pastewax from my hands!
It's also nice not to have my dies gummed up with that carp anymore.

[Ausglock]

Joe. it's good not to have all that grease all over your gear. I only detail strip and clean my Glocks twice a year as they just don't get dirty. A bore snake before shooting is all they get otherwise. Even the 1911's only get a boresnake and a full clean every few months.
Revolvers love this stuff. no more grease buildup under the topstrap or around the forcing cone/front of cylinder.

[gunoil]

Big Ditto: BBQJOE

5-1-15, i like that ausglock.

[BBQJOE]

Big Ditto: BBQJOE

5-1-15, i like that ausglock.
I've gone from 5-1-5 to 5-1-8. Isn't 15 a bit thin? I would think it might need an extra coat.

[gunoil]

I just made the best yet 2 coat 45acp listening to ausglock and useing mucho acetone. Superthin,superclean,supercoat hi-tek! I quit water drop,, back to towel because we are cooking at 8/10 mins @ 375 F. Just think:cast/and then " its shake and bake mama".

So easy to size:
http://i1113.photobucket.com/albums/k511/putt2012/8AAA6EA9-4FC7-4A52-B8AB-6D05693A12DD-242-0000013B182AAADE_zpsfeac75a6.jpg


Now some of you are to young to know: "its shake and bake mama". Iam sorry!

[BBQJOE]

This coating is the closest thing I have ever seen to looking like a jacketed bullet.

Wait a minute!!!!
Isn't that like a vegetarian who wants imitation meat?

Blasphemy I say! :-)

[kweidner]

As an experiment I cast, coated and fired some within a 3 hour period. Out of the pot cool to the touch blended coww and superhard was arounf 14bhn. Straight to coating and cooking they went. Here are the results.

77936
barrel after firing a magazine

77934

My guess is they will age harden to 16 or so in a couple days. Any coating that is missing from recovered bullet will go away once the 9mm reaches that magic 15+

Ok Ipad insists they go upside down. it is what it is....I rotated them 2 times to no avail.

[gunoil]

how did u install them here? I use photobucket. wish i could install straight from my iphone 5.

They look great, superclean barrel huh? Can use alox to flux pot i guess.

[kweidner]

how did u install them here? I use photobucket. wish i could install straight from my iphone 5.

They look great, superclean barrel huh? Can use alox to flux pot i guess.

you can just hit insert photo icon on browser and then choose from camera roll.

[Ausglock]

With the 5-1-15.
You are still using the same amount of colour and catalyst. just adding more acetone to give a far more even coating that gets into all the grooves etc etc.

Nice photos. great results. how was your accuracy?

[BBQJOE]

With the 5-1-15.
You are still using the same amount of colour and catalyst. just adding more acetone to give a far more even coating that gets into all the grooves etc etc.

Nice photos. great results. how was your accuracy?
Yeah, but then you have to add more solution to each batch of bullets to achieve the same amount of coating, right?
Or am I thinking this wrong?

[gunoil]

kweidner: can i do that with iphone?

No BBQJOE. I went out to my bottle tonite that has been setting there week & 1/2 or more, just squirted more acetone in it and made it thinner. I dont know why members dont get 5-1-15 or even 5-1-10. [edit] You might can get it clogged up. I try to shake good. I have had clumps on a few bullets. Then when you cook it bubbles in that thick area. Whats that?

Well maybe it will wirk next time. As long as its cover real good, iam happy.

[Mtbkn]

With the 5-1-15.
You are still using the same amount of colour and catalyst. just adding more acetone to give a far more even coating that gets into all the grooves

AusG. Aren't you using a different catalyst than what's available here in the US? It would seem using acetone to the tune of 2/3'rds more would make it a very thin solution. Possibly too thin?

[Ausglock]

I have mixed the red/copper 5-1-15 with the normal catalyst and it coats great. The mixed solution is thinner which makes it easier to get coverage. But the amount if actual coating remains the same. The extra acetone flashes off after giving a good coating. Try the 5-1-10 if you don't want to go to 5-1-15.

[gunoil]

No , not to thin. I tried it tonite. The best i ever coated.

[prickett]

I've been coating with the gold HI-TEK. My first two attempts, the boolits came out looking... well, gold. Since then I bought a thermometer and found that the oven was heating to 25-50 degrees less than the selected temperature, so I cranked it up. I believe max temp was around 400 degrees.

Now, the boolits come out looking almost brown rather than gold. I've not yet shot either. Is either one better than the other? Should I strive to get the darker color (brought on by more heat), is the gold more durable (brought on by less heat), or, does it matter?

Things I've learned (mainly from you guys)...
Be very picky about any extension cords used. I think I picked up an additional 25 degrees just by switching to a shorter cord.
Buy an oven thermometer. The oven's dial temperatures don't match actual temperatures
Limit the number of boolits. The amount cooked should be determined by their weight and by your oven's capability. The heavier the boolit, the fewer you can cook.
Rather than try to mix up just enough HI-TEK for each individual application, mix up a larger batch, then just use as much as necessary, saving the remaining mix for future cooks.

[BBQJOE]

I'm not sure if I'm going to cast tomorrow or coat, oh wait, I'm almost out of bullets. I need to cast.
I will try moving up to 10 or 15 just to see. My 9's are coating pretty nicely at 5-8, but my 240gr .44's are needing three coats of 5 or 8 to get nice coverage.

[Ausglock]

I've been coating with the gold HI-TEK. My first two attempts, the boolits came out looking... well, gold. Since then I bought a thermometer and found that the oven was heating to 25-50 degrees less than the selected temperature, so I cranked it up. I believe max temp was around 400 degrees.

Now, the boolits come out looking almost brown rather than gold. I've not yet shot either. Is either one better than the other? Should I strive to get the darker color (brought on by more heat), is the gold more durable (brought on by less heat), or, does it matter?

Things I've learned (mainly from you guys)...
Be very picky about any extension cords used. I think I picked up an additional 25 degrees just by switching to a shorter cord.
Buy an oven thermometer. The oven's dial temperatures don't match actual temperatures
Limit the number of boolits. The amount cooked should be determined by their weight and by your oven's capability. The heavier the boolit, the fewer you can cook.
Rather than try to mix up just enough HI-TEK for each individual application, mix up a larger batch, then just use as much as necessary, saving the remaining mix for future cooks.

Gold or brown, they will still work fine. if the temp gets too high, reduce the time in the oven.
Last night I checked my oven. It was starting at 170deg C and about 7 minutes into the cook, the temp went to 200Deg C after all the bullets got to temperature. the final 3 minutes ensured that the coating was "baked" correctly. I'm thinking of fitting a better PID temp controller to my oven.
Joe; the thinner mix works great on bigger bullets with deep grooves. Just add about 30% more mix to your swirling bucket (but you are still only using the same amount of coating as 5-1-5...remember......)

[BBQJOE]

Just add about 30% more mix to your swirling bucket
Exactly what I was getting at.
The more you thin it, the more you have to add.

[leadman]

prickett, if the temperature is over 375 degrees in my ovens it turns the coating brown. If it gets too brown it will also be brittle and will not pass the hammer test. Try 375 degrees at 8 to 10 minutes and the color should be better.

[leadman]

I have the boolits for my 30-06 and 223 Rem coated. Finally got an alloy that would heat treat to the bhn I want. Used 50/50 COWW/lino. Heat treated at 425 degrees for one hour and they were 32 BHN.
Can't find any IMR4350 to continue testing with it so am going to change to either AA4350 or my stash of IMR4831 from WWII. Will decide tomorrow when I start loading.
I went to the 5-1-7 and it does coat better, may try the 5-1-10, or somewhere in-between to see what happens. I did notice that with the 5-1-7 it was easier to size the boolits.

[jmoore]

Shot the red copper 429421 .44 Mag rounds today with a Trail Boss load. Results were not as good as with the "too thick" coated boolits. No leading in the forcing cone and rifling origins, which was the old bugaboo, but there was a small amount of lead near the muzzle with three different revolvers. Accuracy down as well, mostly vertical stringing, but that could have been the trigger puller. Even the scoped 629 off the rest was off form a bit. Nothing serious, in fact it's somewhat expected, as the coating was quite thin!

My stupid mistake was spraying lube on the rest of the batch as I was going to size them in the Lyman 450. Turns out that step wasn't needed, but adding another good coating layer now probably is out of the question.

The bummer is that I've really nothing ready for the IHMSA match tomorrow...Too much else happening to have made contingency plans. So the real wring out will be another month away. Maybe some Unique powder will show up by then, as the 10 5/8" AFS barreled revolver rather prefers it, coated boolits or lubed.

[BBQJOE]

I'm ready for the all new tie-dye color.
It would be perfect for taking out hippies and.......never mind. :-)

[leadman]

jmoore, check your lube as some of it is water soluble. I would try cleaning with hot water and dish soap to see what happens. Then clean them with acetone and you might be able to coat them once more.

[Ausglock]

I tried putting a 3rd coating on after sizing using Hornady oneshot lube. wash in soapy water and swirled in acetone then let dry. applied the coating and baked.

Nice crinkle finish :-( ...... back into the pot they went....

[jmoore]

I tried putting a 3rd coating on after sizing using Hornady oneshot lube. wash in soapy water and swirled in acetone then let dry. applied the coating and baked.

Nice crinkle finish :-( ...... back into the pot they went....


Just exactly what I used. Figured it wouldn't take another coat. Might just lube 'em and let fly in one of the .44 Specials. They've been neglected of late whilst I've been working on the mid range (100m) stuff.

ETA: Correction on the Central Machinery cement mixer mentioned a page or two back: It's a 1 1/4 Cubic foot model. About US$170. It was about the same price as a large vibratory cleaner at Harbor Freight, but it might be called on to actually mix cement one of these days, and Lyman finally sent me a new base for the old 3200 vibratory cleaner which was killed trying to clean range lead. The mixer will tumble 30+ lbs of lead for long periods with no strain. (If you forget about it!) 60 or so lbs can be run long enough to get the worst dirt off in short order, but the motor warms up quite a bit! (With water, the load is probably over 100lbs.) Soap optional, but don't add much...

[kdiver58]

I shot about 80 rounds of 41 mag coated with 2 coats of green. 2 thin coats. I only coated 80 boolits so I used .5 cc of catalyst , 2.5 cc's of color and 3 cc's of acetone. baked and repeated . This was on a Saeco 220 grain bevel base SWC. Behind it I had 6.9 grains if Tite-group. There was a little bubbling at the base of the recovered boolits . I think they needed another coat. I also feel the hotter Tite-group load and the bevel base may have also contributed to the bubbling at the base. There was a little leading in the barrel .. By my standards not bad at all.
jmoore was there and can weigh in. A little cooler powder, one more coat and a little lighter load and I'm good to go.
Here is a 5 shot group, by jmoore, from my 6" model 57 at 25 yards, iron sights standing. This is after I had already run 60 rounds through the gun.

[swheeler]

Looks good to me but I think that is a five shot group;)

[Ausglock]

looks great.

I spent the day testing the new blue coating. sadly is has been a failure. after baking, the colour would wipe off all the way back to a bare bullet.
Back to the drawing board, HI-TEK... :-)

[dverna]

jmoore can shoot. That is a great group at 25 yards off hand.

But here is the $64k question. You are looking at "A little cooler powder, one more coat and a little lighter load". If you used a good commercial lube (White Label for example) would you already "be there"? This is my issue with coating. If you still need to size, why invest the time/space to mix stuff, shake, dry, bake, cool two or three times? I can process over 1000 bullets an hour with a Star without breaking a sweat and use less than a square foot of bench space.

Gunoil has a Star and still coats and I cannot understand it. Maybe the smoke using lubes bothers others more than it does me. Maybe it is the "pretty colors" (colours for our Aussie friends). But my priorities are accuracy, productivity and no leading. At this point, coating offers little incentive for me unless it provides an advantage with high velocity rifle bullets. Popper and a few others are doing some work on rifle bullets but so far results have not been stellar. If I am incorrect, please PM with the threads I have missed.

Don Verna

[sparky45]

It's a choice Don, just like deciding on a T-bone or a Fillet. I DON'T like the sticky mess with conventional Lubes, the smell, the "concoctions" trying to make the perfect Lube, the recurring cost. Truth be known, conventional Lubes cost WAY MORE to fabricate - on a boolit to boolit basis than the Hi Tek formula. Now, I have a Lyman 4500 and a Star and when my Hi Tek half Liter gets here I'll be using them "dry" so to speak to size my boolits to bullets and hopefully never look back. BTW, have you prices Beeswax lately? Where I'm at it costs me about $18/LB, YMMV. Also, I almost forgot, I don't have a Leading issue to deal with when I push my .45 Colt's to fast.
But again, it's a personal choice.

[prickett]

jmoore can shoot. That is a great group at 25 yards off hand.

But here is the $64k question. You are looking at "A little cooler powder, one more coat and a little lighter load". If you used a good commercial lube (White Label for example) would you already "be there"? This is my issue with coating. If you still need to size, why invest the time/space to mix stuff, shake, dry, bake, cool two or three times? I can process over 1000 bullets an hour with a Star without breaking a sweat and use less than a square foot of bench space.

Gunoil has a Star and still coats and I cannot understand it. Maybe the smoke using lubes bothers others more than it does me. Maybe it is the "pretty colors" (colours for our Aussie friends). But my priorities are accuracy, productivity and no leading. At this point, coating offers little incentive for me unless it provides an advantage with high velocity rifle bullets. Popper and a few others are doing some work on rifle bullets but so far results have not been stellar. If I am incorrect, please PM with the threads I have missed.

Don Verna

No smoke
No sticky carbon/wax sludge on feed ramp or action internals
Clean barrel
Can shoot through Glocks
Can shoot softer lead
Much faster to lube & size if you don't own a Star/Much cheaper than buying a Star
Choice of colors
Allows you to use bullet feeders on your progressive press

I find myself asking just the opposite question as I'm reading the other threads in the lube section. I ask "why are you still looking when we've found the solution".

[jmoore]

I shot about 80 rounds of 41 mag coated with 2 coats of green. 2 thin coats. I only coated 80 boolits so I used .5 cc of catalyst , 2.5 cc's of color and 3 cc's of acetone. baked and repeated . This was on a Saeco 220 grain bevel base SWC. Behind it I had 6.9 grains if Tite-group. There was a little bubbling at the base of the recovered boolits . I think they needed another coat. I also feel the hotter Tite-group load and the bevel base may have also contributed to the bubbling at the base. There was a little leading in the barrel .. By my standards not bad at all.
jmoore was there and can weigh in. A little cooler powder, one more coat and a little lighter load and I'm good to go...


(That was a five round group, BTW. I usually load 'em that way at the range. Many of my revolvers are shot using the same five chambers every time.)

The recovered .41 boolits out of kdiver58's Model 57 showed signs of what looked like gas cutting near the base. Probably should have taken a photo, but the camera never came out of it's case. That Titegroup load was not fierce, but probably a little warmish for punching paper.

I don't think his revolver had leading around the forcing come area, either, (which seems typical of lighter loads) so I think it's just a matter of fine tuning.

Meanwhile, back at the ranch, I did another couple of coats of green on the uncontaminated boolits. Found that it's not all that hard to induce condensation when washing the batch with acetone! Cold lead! Like to never have gotten them to flash off when adding coating immediately after the wash. Force dried them quite a while and then cooked. Seems to have come out OK, so the last coat was added this morning which went according to plan, oddly enough!:wink: I think they're close to the thickness of the first test batch, but with better adhesion. So maybe better results next outing. Might be easier to beagle the mold to get slightly larger casts, but it's still experimentation time.

[gunoil]

Dverna, yea but i will have to make up some pretty blue ring lube bullets to shoot. Dang i just recieved the thing. And now i have two, yea 2, got lucky an stumbled on another. Prickett nail it, hi/tek "is it". I just have the attitude of trying some star bullets but my hi-tek bullets leed the way. Iam shooting hi-tek every day. 45acp & 9mm.

[goblism]

tried some of my hi tek bullets in 44 mag and 475 today, both leaded after 20 ish rounds of heavy loads (44 mag were gas checked) Have had ok luck with conventional lube in these guns in the past, should i try a 3rd coat?

[dverna]

Sparky,

White Label lubes are less than $2/stick. Saving a few dollars a year is no incentive. And there is no saving if I place any value on my time. I have never, and will never, brew my own lube when I can buy good lube that inexpensively.

It looks like after the .41 Mag test, the poster thought he might need a third coat and/or a "cooler" load. So coating is not a panacea.

Prickett,
My priorities are performance and productivity. I have three progressives so adding bullet feeders to all of them (or even one of them) is more expensive than a Star lubrisizer. But I already have a Star and have no plans for a bullet feeder. I think anyone who invests in a bullet feeder before getting a Star lubrisizer has not thought things through. I have never used another type of lubricator but I understand they can make a mess with lube leakage.

I have no need for soft pistol bullets as I only shoot paper or steel with pistols. My alloy is 92/6/2. For the few boxes of soft lead bullets I may want for self-defense I purchased a PB GC maker.

I will grant you that not having to clean you gun is a plus.

If you are referring to the "extreme lube" thread, my understanding is that most of the testing/interest is with rifles. As i stated earlier, this is the area of interest for me. Traditional lubes do everything I need for pistol bullets. I think part of my "satisfaction" is that having shot traditional lubes for over 40 years (with little leading issues) I accept "gunk" and a bit of smoke as normal.

Sparky nailed it. It is a personal choice. I keep following these threads in the hope of seeing accuracy testing with rifles at high velocities. But the vast majority of cast bullets are shot in pistols so I need to be patient.

If I did not have a Star, I would certainly look at the Hy-Tek coating. ES PC'ing is a "loser" for me due to the need to stand bullets up on end and keep them from falling over - what a pain. I will shoot lower velocity cast rifle bullets or shoot jacketed before going through that.

I am not saying bullet coaters are 'wrong'. I wondered if I missed something - thus the questions. I really hope you guys are successful. We need people who push the envelop and advance our hobby. Having a coating that easily yields 2 MOA groups at 2800 fps would be a real game changer. Good luck gentlemen.

Don Verna

[Ausglock]

tried some of my hi tek bullets in 44 mag and 475 today, both leaded after 20 ish rounds of heavy loads (44 mag were gas checked) Have had ok luck with conventional lube in these guns in the past, should i try a 3rd coat?

What colour was it? Red/copper with 3 coats would be more than enough.

[goblism]

What colour was it? Red/copper with 3 coats would be more than enough.
The 44 mag was green, the 475 was the red, fairly thick coats as they were my first run

[Liberty'sSon]

Goblism, I think the main mistake people make with Hi Tek is coating too thick. Perhaps you didn't get good adhesion on the first coat. Did you do the smash test or the acetone test? Maybe Ausglock will chime in on more on this one.

[goblism]

Goblism, I think the main mistake people make with Hi Tek is coating too thick. Perhaps you didn't get good adhesion on the first coat. Did you do the smash test or the acetone test? Maybe Ausglock will chime in on more on this one.
Both passed well, only the red was thick. The green was done with 5-1-8 and nice even coats

[sparky45]

dverna; good points all. Sounds like you've put a lot of thought into the process and are making good choices. I don't mind "jumping" the gate a little and trying other methods of reloading, especially if it gets me away from the nasty smelling, sticky lubes that others have for sale or the "special formulas" that abound on this website. I have a Lyman 4500(loaded with White Label) and a Star for those other boolits I need to lube for my rifles, but I really wanted to try the Hi Tek system. Probably going to size the pistol bullets with the Star sans any lube of course.

[leadman]

I am going to do one more test on the 30-06 and the 223 soon. Was going to do it Sunday but did not get enough done today so it will probably be Wed. These boolits are heat treated 50-50 COWW/Lino, 32 BHN one hour after the heat treat.
I hope these show better accuracy than the straight lino boolits. My thoughts are that the coating will take the velocity but the alloy may not be up to the job. Shooting will tell the tale.
The thick coated boolits seem to size much harder and also show a slightly slower speed on the Chrony, maybe 20 to 30 fps. I did have a couple of loads that I got just a little leading on and IIRC it was with the thicker coating.
I only use 3 coats just because Donnie does and it works and looks better than 2 with the Red Copper.

[Ausglock]

Leadman.

HI-TEK makes a sizing lube 5000. it mixes with Iso or metholated spirits and really make sizing easy. I can go from .360 down to .356 in one easy pass through the die.

[Thompsoncustom]

alright I've been back at this again and having problems with leading.

Bore size is .3555 and pulled bullets measure .357 so shouldn't have any problems there.

Bullets pass both acetone test and smash test.

Using 3 light coats and no problems sizing.

Now I'm think the problem is coming from my bore not being lead free to start with, no matter how I force a copper chore boy through it, it doesn't seem to get all the lead out and I'm thinking my lightly leaded bore is cuz more leading? If that makes sense.

Got some Wipe out no lead and Wipe out patch out coming so hopefully I can get a spotless bore and try some more. Any tips on using a chore boy? It seems like most people think that's the hot setup but I haven't had luck with it yet.

[Lizard333]

Rather than using chore boy, try shooting some jacketed bullets through. Copper, if any, is a LOT easier to get out.

[BBQJOE]

I wonder if you could put some wadding in a cartridge, pack it with chore boy, and shoot it out? :bigsmyl2:

[gunoil]

thompsoncustom, gotta be your lead casting mix. Drain pot, put something different in there & add some of those ingots back in, run temp @750, dont flux. Do not put your mold on pot to heat-up. Buy heat-eye at walmart, turn it almost all the way up. Set your mold on that. Your mold will be stable after few pours.

Get some bore cleaner, lets it soak for couple hrs., then chore-boy, then repeat.

[Thompsoncustom]

thompsoncustom, gotta be your lead casting mix. Drain pot, put something different in there & add some of those ingots back in, run temp @750, dont flux. Do not put your mold on pot to heat-up. Buy heat-eye at walmart, turn it almost all the way up. Set your mold on that. Your mold will be stable after few pours.

Get some bore cleaner, lets it soak for couple hrs., then chore-boy, then repeat.


Hmmm very well could be, I've always ran WW but the other day my brother found some lead down by the river. Appeared to be some kind of lead sheet that got all mangled up but melted and cast just fine tho I have no idea what it was the bullets were nice and shiny and it didn't appear to have any zinc in it.

Alloy is water dropped and I'm only pushing them just over 1100fps so even super soft I would think they would be fine but maybe not? The leading has me puzzled because I know fit is good the coating looks good but I never thought about my lead mix.

[gunoil]

Mix 1/2 ww's wid stuff your brother got. Soart your ww's careful, and dont be skeeered to throw away stuff that concerns you in your ww container. Draine your pot into ingot molds and remix 1/2 & 1/2. The stuff your brother brought you is good stuff. To good, thats why ya need to cut it. On second thought 2/3 ww and 1/3 your brothers stuff. There are threads for hardness testing.

http://i1113.photobucket.com/albums/k511/putt2012/14DE9B5C-7DB8-45AE-BFB4-F7BFA0598220-242-0000013AD927028A_zps70dd097f.mp4

I quit dropping in water for HI-TEK, just drop on towel, then coat, then cook. Its getting hot again anyway.

Build this: 2 1/2 X 4' from 8$ sheet of stucco wire mesh from home depot. I have a wood air staple gun/found some wood. I dry my brass on it too. The 2 racks that came with my oven have stucco wire on them too. I used twisted wire in 6 places to hold it on.

http://i1113.photobucket.com/albums/k511/putt2012/855F6E5A-964E-415D-8FE5-E73412258F35-139-0000041378238055_zps6d28a2af.jpg


"Its shake and bake mama"

[Thompsoncustom]

Hmmm now you really got me thinking about this alloy. I have some 168gr SWC cast up to I could shoot and see if they lead as they only travel 750 fps. If they don't lead than it's the alloy and if they do I'm probably missing something else.

Don't really want to melt down 3000 coated bullets if I don't have to but that's what you get for playing with unknown alloy's I guess.

[jcobb651]

Ok. I got an order of gold in feom Donnie yesterday morning. Built a drying rack and have my oven ready to go. Using 5-1-10 ratio. Measurements were cc from a syringe. Maybe a teaspoon from the table worth of total product. Placed the mixture in an clean peanut butter jar and threw in a double handful of bullets. Swirled about 30 seconds and dumped them on my drying screen. Now I've read all the comments about the most common problem being using too much mixture. Looking at the bow dry pills I'm not sure if I used enough. Here is 200 grain rnfp from a lee mold. http://img.tapatalk.com/d/13/08/05/yge5yde3.jpg

Does it look like I need more coating? It also looks to me like either I didn't shake the color up good enough or it disolve good. Should I put these back in rhe melt pot, add more coating, or go ahead and bake for the first time?

[BBQJOE]

Ok. I got an order of gold in feom Donnie yesterday morning. Built a drying rack and have my oven ready to go. Using 5-1-10 ratio. Measurements were cc from a syringe. Maybe a teaspoon from the table worth of total product. Placed the mixture in an clean peanut butter jar and threw in a double handful of bullets. Swirled about 30 seconds and dumped them on my drying screen. Now I've read all the comments about the most common problem being using too much mixture. Looking at the bow dry pills I'm not sure if I used enough. Here is 200 grain rnfp from a lee mold. http://img.tapatalk.com/d/13/08/05/yge5yde3.jpg

Does it look like I need more coating? It also looks to me like either I didn't shake the color up good enough or it disolve good. Should I put these back in rhe melt pot, add more coating, or go ahead and bake for the first time?
Looks to me like you didn't shake near long enough. Put a few bullets in the can to help agitate.
About 1/4 + teaspoon should coat about 50 of those bullets.
Try doing small batches in a small tub at first.

[jcobb651]

Thanks bbqjoe...took your advice and made up another batch....dropped 3 bullets in the mixing bottle ans shook it like a bad habit. This here is the result of the first coat on the rack drying by the fan. http://img.tapatalk.com/d/13/08/05/udynydub.jpg

I like the looks of this much better than my first attempt. A 1/4 teaspoon was used to measure out all the ingredients this time. Pefect for 50-75 200 grainers I think.

[prickett]

jcobb,
can't tell whether the first picture you posted was pre or post baking. if pre-baking, you won't see any gold, just a dull coating on the boolits. Not until you bake does the gold color appear.

[jcobb651]

Both pics are pre bake. So did I use too much in the secind pic?

[swheeler]

gunoil; are you saying that 8-10 minutes at 375*F draws the temper back on heat treated alloy?
That just doesn't sound correct to me, but I could be wrong, it's happened before;)

[jcobb651]

First bake. http://img.tapatalk.com/d/13/08/05/unyqa2ag.jpg

For comparison the two on the left are as dropped and un coated.http://img.tapatalk.com/d/13/08/05/a8amudus.jpg

[jcobb651]

Passed the acetone wipe test and the vice smash.
http://img.tapatalk.com/d/13/08/05/4yze3uha.jpg
http://img.tapatalk.com/d/13/08/05/ure4uva7.jpg

[kweidner]

gunoil; are you saying that 8-10 minutes at 375*F draws the temper back on heat treated alloy?
That just doesn't sound correct to me, but I could be wrong, it's happened before;)

That was my experience. 3 times at 375 took em from a 19-20 to a 9!

[BBQJOE]

Passed the acetone wipe test and the vice smash.
http://img.tapatalk.com/d/13/08/05/4yze3uha.jpg
http://img.tapatalk.com/d/13/08/05/ure4uva7.jpg
Yay!!! you got it! Now do a happy dance. :happy dance:

Also, there's no need to stand them up. They won't take on rack marks.

[Ausglock]

First bake. http://img.tapatalk.com/d/13/08/05/unyqa2ag.jpg

For comparison the two on the left are as dropped and un coated.http://img.tapatalk.com/d/13/08/05/a8amudus.jpg

Outstanding result.
They look good. your first coat did look as if it wasn't shaken enough before you did the mixing.

Thompsoncustom:
I'd say your alloy is too soft.
I tried 10BHN out of a 38 super and had severe leading. changed to 14BHN and no more leading. this was with the exact same coating and sizing for both lots.
in 45ACP I can run 10BHN all day with 2 coats and no sign of leading at all.
My 14BHN alloys are: 2lbs Lino, 9Lbs COWW, 1/2lb pewter.
The other is 5lbs Lino, 5lbs pure lead (roof flashing)
This is used for 9mm, 357,40,44
Range lead comes in at 11 BHN and is used as is for the 45.

I had problems with mixed coating over the weekend. coatings that had been mixed for a few weeks had "gone off". The coating when baked, would not pass the wipe test. strangely enough, the red/copper, Rose Red, Blue/green did not have this problem. A lot of the experimental colours did, So I have tipped them out and will start new coating mixes.
HI-TEK is sending a care package with 6 new colours and a new 3-extreme Catalyst to try. I really need a casting machine and a sizing machine....Gunslick... loan me a star will ya??? :-)

[swheeler]

I don't know, but intend to find out for myself. If it proves to be true then for many of my rifle loads they will have to be quenched after final baking, but 375F won't provide the ultimate hardness for any alloy I've used, and sounds like 425-435 for an hour will burn the coating and ruin its effectiveness?

[prickett]

Both pics are pre bake. So did I use too much in the secind pic?

I'd say yes. Based on my experience, you'll just see a dull but clear coat (with NO gold color visible). Once you bake, the clear dull coat miraculously turns a very attractive gold.

[gunoil]

no swheeler, just sayin why water drop if ya gonna put em right back in the heat. I just drop on towel then on kooling rack. Coat em then:
http://i1113.photobucket.com/albums/k511/putt2012/8AAA6EA9-4FC7-4A52-B8AB-6D05693A12DD-242-0000013B182AAADE_zpsfeac75a6.jpg

I dont know much, but theys a guy building a ammo factory by the airport and i'll prob get some good tips. Hes interested in hi-tek.

[swheeler]

Gunoil; do you know if 8 minutes at 375F draws the HT back on bullets already treated, that is what I want to fin































d out

[gunoil]

dont know swheeler, But i'll find out days to come.

Well popper,
you go hot to cool to hot to coat to hot oven to cool. Well, popper did you WD last time cooked? I think some did post ago that no change when WD'ed after final cook.

[Thompsoncustom]

Got out last night and tested my coated 168gr SWC going 700fps. Tho they still leaded it was 10 times less than the 125gr bullets so I'm thinking you guys are right it's my alloy. Now the 125gr's are going to be melted down but what about the 168gr bullets do you think they can be made to run around 750fps? I hear of people pushing pure lead in a .45acp so my question is it the speed or the pressure that's more important when running pure lead?

And if you think it's going to be a real pain just say so and I'll melt them down with the 125's.

[Ausglock]

I tried pure lead coated 3 times in the 45 and it still leaded. Cut it 50/50 with COWW and now no problems.

[gunoil]

Yes, melt them down. ausglock just told you again. [3/4 WW's & 1/4 of your bullets] See you just need some WW's, and you'll be fine.

[ryokox3]

Apologies in advance if this is covered in the previous 690 posts, but I just don't have it in me today to read them all.

My first attempt left very rough boolits (rough texture not coverage). I'm assuming this should not be the case and I used too much mixture, or not enough acetone. These are my first so I'm doing small batches. 5ml color, 1ml hardener, 6ml acetone. Another attempt with less boolits was 2.5ml color, .5 ml hardener, 3ml acetone.

Mixture is placed into a mason jar without lid. Swirled for 30 sec to a min then dumped onto .25" hardware cloth. one time I left alone, another I agitated them on the hardware cloth every few minutes. Sound correct? Anything I should change from your experience?


On another note, is there a pic somewhere showing boolits with all the colors next to each other. Would be neat to see them all side by side.

-Ry

[gunoil]

try 5-1-10. And u do need to read some of the post, vids and pics.

[ryokox3]

Thank you Gunoil I'll try that mix out. I should not have implied I did not read any of the thread, I did go through a bit of it and watched a u-tube vid mentioned early on. Still there are a lot of posts, and one can only read so much in a sitting or 3.

[gunoil]

Yea, just scatter thru em, especially ausglocks. Better to be thin than thick, you can just coat again. Too thick, your trouble again.

[jcobb651]

Also be sure to shake the mixture thoroughly before applying to boolits. Helps to have a couple boolits in the mixture while your shaking. I use a couple of 1 ounce 12 ga slugs. When you think you have shaken it enough, shake some more then pour immediately on the boolits to be coated. If it sits it will begin to settle again. My experience with the gold anyway.

[codawolf]

Shake it like mad then shake it again before you mix then shake your mix before you apply it. I got clumping if it tumbled them to long. If you hear the sound change while you are tumbling them you may have tumbled them to long especially with the red copper.

[BBQJOE]

Ryokox3, If they're coming out with a rough texture it means you are not letting them dry long enough before baking. The roughness is caused by the acetone gassing off. They'll feel dry in just a few minutes, but they're not. Put them in front of a fan. I leave mine for at least half an hour to be sure.
If I have any question about them, I'll turn on my oven for just a minute then pop them in to warm up a little. Then I take them out, and preheat the oven.
Hurrying with this stuff doesn't work.

On a different note, I shot about 100 240swc's in .44 on top of 6.5gr Unique through my Winchester lever rifle with ZERO signs of lead.

[Ausglock]

Thank you Gunoil I'll try that mix out. I should not have implied I did not read any of the thread, I did go through a bit of it and watched a u-tube vid mentioned early on. Still there are a lot of posts, and one can only read so much in a sitting or 3.

Page 19 post # 366
Read it and re-read it and you will be fine.
mixing such small amounts may be an issue. I like 50ml of colour, 10 ml of catalyst and 75ml of acetone. this gives enough to coat about 4 to5000.

Once the sound changes, dump them on the drying tray and leave them for at least 10 minutes, but 1/2 hour is better.

[castalott]

looks great.

I spent the day testing the new blue coating. sadly is has been a failure. after baking, the colour would wipe off all the way back to a bare bullet.
Back to the drawing board, HI-TEK... :-)

I'm using black but not too well, it seems. Anyone else using black? How is it working for you?

Thanks in advance, Dale

[high standard 40]

Since I live only about 20 miles from Bayou Bullets, I recently drove there and picked up a Hi-Tek kit from Donnie. I wasn't picky about color so I ended up with red copper. Today, I had an opportunity to run my first batch. I mixed it 5-1-8 and did a small batch of fifty 40cal bullets to get my feet wet. The learning curve is pretty simple. I did a couple more batches and I seem to have it down pat now, easy enough. I did the hammer and acetone test and passed both and I am pleased with the appearance. The coating looks very even, I did 3 coats.

I decided to try this because I have a Dan Wesson 44 Mag that has resisted all attempts with cast bullets. I have adjusted alloy from soft to hard, measured the cylinder throats, forcing cone, slugged the bore, and loaded according to what "should work". Custom "M" die expander, fast powders, slow powders, light loads, fast loads, different lubes, I even lapped the bore.............I still get leading. Not heavy but enough to affect accuracy after 20-30 shots. Some combinations have been better than others but none have solved the problem.

Maybe this Hi-Tek lube will do the trick. I sure hope so.

[gunoil]

glad your here, you ever run gas checks in 44? I would t know.

[atygrit]

I'm using black but not too well, it seems. Anyone else using black? How is it working for you?

Thanks in advance, Dale

I'm using the black and I don't think I have any hair left! I think I'm having mostly oven problems. I have returned three ovens and I'm now on my 4th. Every single one of them couldn't get up to temperature and of course I ran out of bullets to coat to test the new oven. I'm really getting frustrated.

I had two coats on and they passed the acetone and the smash test, but when I sized them the lower base of the bullet had the coating scraped off. So I thought for the hell of it I would put another coating on with the new oven. Seemed to work ok when I sized them again, nothing scraped off.

But after loading some dummy rounds and using the bullet hammer (puller) I had some scraping at the base. Not all over, just in some spots. Is this acceptable??? After viewing it I didn't realize the casting was so bad, but you will get the idea on the scraping. Also I'm getting a small nick in the base of the bullet from what I believe is occurring when I seat the bullet. Is this normal when seating lead bullets?

78380

[Ausglock]

Since I live only about 20 miles from Bayou Bullets, I recently drove there and picked up a Hi-Tek kit from Donnie. I wasn't picky about color so I ended up with red copper. Today, I had an opportunity to run my first batch. I mixed it 5-1-8 and did a small batch of fifty 40cal bullets to get my feet wet. The learning curve is pretty simple. I did a couple more batches and I seem to have it down pat now, easy enough. I did the hammer and acetone test and passed both and I am pleased with the appearance. The coating looks very even, I did 3 coats.

I decided to try this because I have a Dan Wesson 44 Mag that has resisted all attempts with cast bullets. I have adjusted alloy from soft to hard, measured the cylinder throats, forcing cone, slugged the bore, and loaded according to what "should work". Custom "M" die expander, fast powders, slow powders, light loads, fast loads, different lubes, I even lapped the bore.............I still get leading. Not heavy but enough to affect accuracy after 20-30 shots. Some combinations have been better than others but none have solved the problem.

Maybe this Hi-Tek lube will do the trick. I sure hope so.

I coated a few 100 44 (.429) for a mate that casts his own and lube sizes. he gets leading in his S&W 29 and his lever rifle in 44 Mag too. I coated 2 coats of red copper and he fired them yesterday with zero leading in either gun. He is now casting like a demon for me to coat for him.
I'd say you need a bit more belling of the case mouth. What type of Sizer are you using? I got this when I was trying to size with a Lyman 450 and a LAM2. both with no lube in them. I went back to the lee push through sizer die and no problems like this since.

[atygrit]

I'm using the Lee .356 push through sizer. I think I'm putting a pretty big flair on the case mouth right now, but I can try a little bigger.

[bstone5]

The crimp maybe what is removing the coating from the bullets since the area is near the base of the bullet.
The hammer bullet puller is removing the coating when the bullet is removed through the crimp

Maybe Maybe Not

I was having the same problem with some 158 grain SWC used in a 38 Special when I removed the bullets with a hammer bullet puller.

i did the same test to see if the coating would stay on the bullet after the bullet moved out of the case.

I backed off of the crimp a little and the problem went away.

[atygrit]

Can anyone tell me if the other colors are more forgiving than the black?

[Ausglock]

The red copper and the gold are good. But the black works fine too. The blue/green seems to be the easiest to use due to the fact that there are no metallic solids in it to try and keep in suspension when you are mixing and squirting on your bullets.

[leadman]

I have gone to the 5 parts color, 1 part catalyst, and 7 parts acetone. This seems to work well but if is not all used in a few hours I have to add more acetone to the mix as it evaporates. I store it in a sealed mason jar inside a heavy plastic bag in the refrigerator and it still oses acetone so just keep this in mind. The amount of acetone can be varied but the color and catalyst ration should be 5 to 1.
Many of the problems with roughness I see here are from not mixing enough to bring the solids up from the bottom of the container, or not letting the coating dry long enough before cooking. Thick coats can also cause the roughness also but I have found if you let these dry long enough they come out of the oven just fine. Tumbling the boolits too long when the coating is applied can also cause roughness as the coating is drying and being pulled off the boolit and sticking to another boolit. I can feel and hear when the coating is starting to dry and stop. IIRC Donnie says to tumble for 20 seconds.
Sizing in a Lyman or RCBS luber-sizer can be done but if your sizing die has very little flare at the top you may need to use a dowel and emery paper to taper it some more to prevent the base from having the coating scraped off. The easiest and least expensive method is probably the Lee push thru dies. Do check these for roughness on the lower part of the hole if they are new. I had to polish a couple.

[Ausglock]

I have started to use juice bottles with the pop tops for the mixed coating. they are available from the supermarket with apple juice etc etc. They re-seal with a push on the poptop. And the acetone does not evaporate.
78403

I was using Coke bottles, But am changing to the juice bottles.
78404

I use a 1 gallon plastic bucket to do the swirling in. Roughly 200 to 300 9mm bullets at a time
78405

[ryokox3]

Thanks again to all who replied to me. I did a batch last night and it was MUCH better considering coat#1. I put the second coat on and it will be baked tonight.

I need to look up what kind of plastic squirt bottles will be acetone tolerant if I'm to make a larger batch as suggested. Then again the mix from last night might be good enough. I'll find out tonight. Mix was (5-1-12)

[high standard 40]

I'd say you need a bit more belling of the case mouth. What type of Sizer are you using? I got this when I was trying to size with a Lyman 450 and a LAM2.

I am using a Lyman M die with a custom expander that holds the case dimensions so that I get only .002" bullet pull. The factory M die expander was much too small and gave too tight a grip on the bullet. I size using a Lyman 450. My cylinder throats are .4295" and I've tried bullets sized .429" and .430".

[atygrit]

atygrit those don't look like they've been sized. What size is the mould dropping?

They are definitely getting sized. They are casting at .357-.358 (about) and when I size them with the Lee push through sizer to .356 there is a noticeable smooth section. Maybe they didn't show up well in that photo, but they are getting sized.

[jcobb651]

As far as looks I'm real happy with the way my latest batch turned out with one coat. Is a second coat recommended for looks or function?

[fixerupper]

I'm using black but not too well, it seems. Anyone else using black? How is it working for you?

Thanks in advance, Dale

Im using black. I like it alot. Heres what i do.

First off.... shake the bejeebus out of everything before mixing. After mixing.... shake the bejebus out of your solution before applying each time.

I use the 5-10-1 ratio. Since we're doubling up on the acetone.... make sure you up the amount of solution to use when swirling. If you used 2 teaspoons for a bucket of bullets, use three now. I swirl in a butter tub with a lid at first. The lid slows down the evaporation of the solution allowing you to get a more even distribution and coverage before drying. After swirling for 30 seconds or so with the lid, I take the lid off and swirl till the sound changes and the wet solution is gone, then dump on the drying trays. The first coat should end up being a nice evenly covered shade of grey. I've found a little hotter and a little longer on the baking helps. I go 400 degrees for 13 minutes, and Ive checked my oven with an oven thermometer. Pistol bullets gets 2 coats, rifle bullets get three.

When Im done.... my finished boolits looks like a dark pewter rather than black. When I get a second, Ill upload some pics. Rifle boolits with the copper gas checks almost look toooo pretty to hide in a case.

One last thing. ALL Finishes, whether for hardwood floors, auto painting, house painting, etc..... ALL require an extended time before FULLY cured and FULLY hardened and I "suspect" HiTek coatings are no different. I do not size or load any of my newly coated rounds untill they have set at least a week.

Hope this helps......

Fixer

[leadman]

popper, Donnie recommends the Red Copper and Gold for rifle loads. These have a good amount of solids in the color that the others don't.

[atygrit]

Im using black. I like it alot. Heres what i do.

First off.... shake the bejeebus out of everything before mixing. After mixing.... shake the bejebus out of your solution before applying each time.

I use the 5-10-1 ratio. Since we're doubling up on the acetone.... make sure you up the amount of solution to use when swirling. If you used 2 teaspoons for a bucket of bullets, use three now. I swirl in a butter tub with a lid at first. The lid slows down the evaporation of the solution allowing you to get a more even distribution and coverage before drying. After swirling for 30 seconds or so with the lid, I take the lid off and swirl till the sound changes and the wet solution is gone, then dump on the drying trays. The first coat should end up being a nice evenly covered shade of grey. I've found a little hotter and a little longer on the baking helps. I go 400 degrees for 13 minutes, and Ive checked my oven with an oven thermometer. Pistol bullets gets 2 coats, rifle bullets get three.

When Im done.... my finished boolits looks like a dark pewter rather than black. When I get a second, Ill upload some pics. Rifle boolits with the copper gas checks almost look toooo pretty to hide in a case.

One last thing. ALL Finishes, whether for hardwood floors, auto painting, house painting, etc..... ALL require an extended time before FULLY cured and FULLY hardened and I "suspect" HiTek coatings are no different. I do not size or load any of my newly coated rounds untill they have set at least a week.

Hope this helps......

Fixer

That would be very helpful. Thank you for the heads up on the oven temperature.

[fixerupper]

78494


ok.... let's see if my phone cooperates


Black HiTech coating

[Ausglock]

Looks good.

[kbstenberg]

BBQ JOE in post 695 you stated that you shot your coated bullets in a lever action 44. But you neglected to say what kind of accuracy they had. Inquiring minds want to know. Kevin

[Jumbopanda]

Regarding heat treating, I've heat treated a few boolits that were already coated and found that they turned reddish-brown (I'm using the gold coating), but still pass the hammer and acetone tests. I haven't shot them yet but will soon to see what happens. The Hi-Tek MSDS says that the coating will be damaged by prolonged exposures to temperatures above 300C (572F), which is obviously much much higher than what is used to heat treat boolits.

[leadman]

I completed by testing of water quenching and heat treating the coated boolits. I had a variety of alloy that I was working with but did include some 50-50 lino and COWW alloy. This is how it ended up:

50-50 COWW/Lino heat treated to 32BHN one hour after casting. (been about 1 1/2 weeks since cast now) I then coated the boolits 3 times with RED Copper at 375 degrees for 10 minutes. Today the BHN is 14 for the coated boolits, 35BHN for the uncoated boolits.

I coated an 18 BHN alloy 3 times with Red Copper, then heat treated at 475 degrees for one hour. This burnt the coating and it would flake off when hit with the hammer.

I coated an 11 BHN alloy 3 times with RC, then heat treated at 375 degrees for one hour. This was 14 BHN on 7-27, 18 BHN today. Coating unaffected.

During testing I had a failure of my SAECO tester so am going to rerun the test of water quenched alloy from the mold, then coating. I think that this is worthwhile though since my reading today are 18 BHN and the original alloy was probably 11 BHN.

I am disappointed that the 50-50 COWW/Lino did not retain the hardness of 32 BHN. I am going to the range in the morning to shoot the boolits in my 30-06 and 223 Rem at high velocity. I'll report on the results of the shooting later.

[atygrit]

78494


ok.... let's see if my phone cooperates


Black HiTech coating

Those are much darker than mine. I think I'm going to have to start from scratch to try and get what you posted.

[leadman]

popper, I think at this point if one needs a hard alloy with the HT coated boolits the alloy should be of the proper ingredients to get this. Don't rely on heat treating or water quenching. I am going to continue the search though as I do not like to buy antimony.
The 50-50 COWW/Lino alloy was new truck size wheelweights and used lino that tested 22bhn. I think I may try a 25-75 COWW/lino to see if the reduction of the softer ww will provide enough arsenic for the heat treating. I am going to cast some more of the 50-50 alloy and (gasp) lube them with my blend of Carnuba Red and Magma lubes. I do want to hit over 2,600 fps with my 30-06 and the 314299 at 200 grs.!
I am going to try to heat treat some straight lino to see what happens. Larry Gibson said he can get it up over 32 bhn so I'll give it a try. My old batch of lino would not heat treat but it could have been depleted as it was normally 19 bhn.
Anyone know of a way to add arsenic to the linotype without adding lead?

[jmoore]

I am using a Lyman M die with a custom expander that holds the case dimensions so that I get only .002" bullet pull. The factory M die expander was much too small and gave too tight a grip on the bullet. I size using a Lyman 450. My cylinder throats are .4295" and I've tried bullets sized .429" and .430".

I've been having success with 0.000" to 0.001" case to boolit interference fit in the .44 Mag. Have about quit crimping as well, but that's with 2400, Unique and Trail boss. Probably will crimp when using H110, but that's generally a jacketed bullet powder for me.

Using the standard catalyst, the Hi Tek coated boolits have shifted forward little to none. Those Keith type boolit noses are positioned mighty close to the cylinder face, so it HAS been of some interest from a practical standpoint. Quite surprised by the lack of shifting, but it hasn't hurt my feelings one bit to not crimp.

[Copper75]

I may finally be getting close!
http://img.tapatalk.com/d/13/08/07/epuvy4e9.jpg

[BBQJOE]

BBQ JOE in post 695 you stated that you shot your coated bullets in a lever action 44. But you neglected to say what kind of accuracy they had. Inquiring minds want to know. Kevin
On an 8" target at about 25 yds, I got a few bullseyes, and pretty much covered the target with holes. I need to take another go on a fresh target now that I think I have the peep site dialed in.
My eyes just aren't what they used to be, and I'm sort of a hack. :-)
I've not shot this rifle much, and have never tried it with factory ammo, so I really don't have a baseline.

[BBQJOE]

Duplicate.

[waltham41]

Dumb question of the day, do you need a convection oven or can you get by with a regular toaster oven?

[gunoil]

pose ta have a convection oven member!

I bought 31100 hamilton beach @ Kmart.

[jcobb651]

Convection oven is recommended to even out the temperature. Without the air moving non convection ovens can have hot / cool spots.

[w0fms]

I'm doing PC Electrostatic, but what worked great in a standard Infrared quartz element toaster oven in Yellow melted Black PC boolits. I suspect that if I knew that would have happened, reducing the thermostat temp on the $19 Wally World special and then using the Harbor Frieght non-contact thermo I could have come up with a thermostat setting that was in the 400-450°F range at the coating.

So saying that, I suspect that you (and I on the next run) can use the cheap non-convection oven.. you will have to be careful and figure out a way to sample the temperature to keep in in the safe zone.

The advantage of the convection is that it will even the temps out. Probably not 100%... but "a lot".

[Ausglock]

For HI-TEK coating, you really need a convection oven.
The one I'm using still has hotspots, So I'm going to butcher it and fit another fan to the other side. easy to find on ebay.

Now..If I could find a cheap Pizza type oven, that would be even better. the one with the travelling mesh belt.

[leadman]

If you use a sstandard toaster oven it is good to have the rack that has a solid plate on the bottom with the slotted oven rack in it. I drilled holes in the solid base to help the heat circulate and it works great. I guess this rack is for broiling. My other rack for the toaster oven is a standard oven rack with the hardware cloth (1/4" mesh) and you have to really watch the temperature as the boolits right over the or under the elements can be overcooked.
If you have a Goodwill check there as I bought my convection oven from them on a 50% off day for $3.99. On the convection ovens from what I seen the fan normally only runs in the bake position so be sure to check this.

[leadman]

I had mixed results at the range today with the WWII 4831 not providing me with the velocity I wanted so will re-shoot this with some Reloder 17.

The highlight of the day was the 223 Rem in my Contender with a 23" barrel. I am very happy with the results and my buddy volunteered to test additional rounds in his AR. The boolit was a Lyman 45gr RN with gator check, 3 coats of Red Copper, H4895, Win small rifle primer, 2.02" overall length. Alloy was 50-50 COWW/LINO, heat treated but annealed by the cooking to about 14 bhn. Here are the loads and group sizes at 100 yards:
22.5grs, 2,724fps, 1.651" group,
23.0grs, 2,806fps, 1.321" group,
23.5grs, 2,892fps, 2.585" group,
24.0grs, 3,065fps, 1.819" group.

There was no leading and I think from looking at the cases and primers it might be possible to go up another grain in powder.

[Love Life]

I'm getting there. 2nd batch of 358429 done with 5-1-7 came out looking better. They passed the acid wipe and hammer smash. Next is to size and shoot. The 230 gr rn for the 45 acp came out much better looking on the 1st coat and bake. I hit them with the 2nd coat and they are drying overnight. Hopefully all goes well. I will try 5-1-10 next.

[gunoil]

you got it LL. Mine sets out there in plastic bottle (bout 3 tablespoons)week or so. Then charge it with lil' acetone. But like BBQJoe said, theres a fine line where ya "might" need a skosh of color charge too. Then shake it up.







"its shake an bake mama"

[BBQJOE]

It's too dark for pics right now. But let me say this; if any of you are thinking of trying this in the house in your kitchen oven, DO NOT DO IT!!!!
My convection oven purchased specifically for this application, is now officially golden in color. Interior and glass.

[gunoil]

How could someone be that stupid joe, well i guess. You could see purple wambats & green roos! I cook on back deck.
http://i1113.photobucket.com/albums/k511/putt2012/CDA3493B-EF51-469D-8B0C-3B4822CCADAC-19482-000015CED3271ED8_zps9973c05a.jpg

[Ausglock]

My convection oven purchased specifically for this application, is now officially golden in color. Interior and glass.

Mine too. The glass started out clear. it is now a very dark brown tint.

Lookout for the drop bears too, Gunslick.

[Love Life]

Agreed in that you have to shake the holy bejesus out of the red!!

I'll post more pictures once I'm not ashamed of my boolits. I may order some green for pistol as well.

[bstone5]

To clean the glass use a single edge blade razor blade in the plastic holder to remove the powder coat from the inside and out side of the glass.

The cured powder coat will scrape off easily and the glass will be clean, after scraping I use some carburetor cleaner on a paper towel to finish the cleaning.

[leadman]

popper, I have shot this same boolit to over 3,000 fps before with the wax based lubes. I think I can get some more out of them and will try it next week probably. I want to change primers and see if that makes a difference and maybe seating depth later. The Contender is a 1/2 moa shooter with bulk 55gr jacketed bullets so hope to get the cast to shoot better.
I have actually exceeded the book jacketed velocity with the 200gr boolit in the 30-06 with LBT Blue Soft, just over 2,600 fps.
I am thinking of heat treating straight lino, then coating only twice and see if some of the extra hardness will stay in the alloy.
Going to cast in the morning.

[Ausglock]

Will lino heat treat on it's own or do you need to add something with arsenic for it to work?

[leadman]

Larry Gibson had posted that lino will heat treat on its own so I am going to try it. IIRC I read that an alloy with antimony will HT, but arsenic makes it obtain full hardness faster. I know some have said it needs the arsenic, this is why I mixed it with 50% COWW for the first batch. I do have some reclaimed shot I can add if need be also.

[waltham41]

If you use a sstandard toaster oven it is good to have the rack that has a solid plate on the bottom with the slotted oven rack in it. I drilled holes in the solid base to help the heat circulate and it works great. I guess this rack is for broiling. My other rack for the toaster oven is a standard oven rack with the hardware cloth (1/4" mesh) and you have to really watch the temperature as the boolits right over the or under the elements can be overcooked.
If you have a Goodwill check there as I bought my convection oven from them on a 50% off day for $3.99. On the convection ovens from what I seen the fan normally only runs in the bake position so be sure to check this.

Thanks to all who answered my concern about the toaster oven. So basically with a toaster oven you have some boolits that over cook and others that don't cure right because of poor temp distribution in the oven?

[jcobb651]

Not saying that you WILL, just something to watch for. Its also a really good idea to get a thermometer to ensure the temp is what you think it is. On my convection oven 400 is really 375.

[waltham41]

so is there anybody that is doing this with just a toaster oven? Would like to hear your results.

I have an oven thermometer so I have that base covered ;)

[w0fms]

Uh, I'd say try it. I suspect you can get it to work. Use lighter colors and it'll help....

[leadman]

I use a toaster oven and a convection oven, as posted above. The temperature may vary more in the toaster oven so put the oven thermometer and watch it thru a cylce and see how it does. You may also want to move it around on the rack to check temps.

[fixerupper]

so is there anybody that is doing this with just a toaster oven? Would like to hear your results.

I have an oven thermometer so I have that base covered ;)

Im using a quartz element toaster oven. I posted up a pic a couple of pages back. Mine is very small with an element at the top and botom.... seems to work OK. But I am going to spring for a larger convection oven so I can do larger racks at a time.

[waltham41]

I ordered a liter of red/copper today, will try a few rounds in the toaster oven while I wait for my wife to find me a convection oven at the good will or a yard sale LOL

Thanks for the advice guys, looking forward to coating some boolits.

[Love Life]

I ordered a liter of red/copper today, will try a few rounds in the toaster oven while I wait for my wife to find me a convection oven at the good will or a yard sale LOL

Thanks for the advice guys, looking forward to coating some boolits.

Please post your goof ups. Seems everybody goofs it up on the first try or two...

[kbstenberg]

Has anyone combined there PID to there oven to get a better consistent heat?

[Ausglock]

Has anyone combined there PID to there oven to get a better consistent heat?

Waiting for the SSR to arrive. Going to PID my oven temp to see if it can be kept at a constant temp. As well as fitting another convection fan.
Currently waiting for a delivery of new experimental colours from HI-TEK. I have been casting like a demon this week, to have enough bullets to test all these new colours on. I have 4000 45 and 6000 9mm bullets ready to get coated. I really need to go mine my range again.

[LongGun1]

Has anyone combined there PID to there oven to get a better consistent heat?

I will be adding convection fans & 3 PID Controllers/SSR/etc to a dedicated 220 vac double oven (one side setup for prewarming boolits prior to coating & the main oven for baking the coating). It also has a griddle/hot plate on top (for preheating molds).

[BBQJOE]

How could someone be that stupid joe, well i guess. You could see purple wambats & green roos! I cook on back deck.

You don't think it could happen?
Just sayin'. ;-)

Wait! I do have a huge industrial sized smoker. Hmmm, mesquite smoke scented gold bullets.
I wonder if there is a market???

[gunoil]

hehehehehe

off topic: magma star blue lube bullet. ?,ya have lead then blue lube ring then lead base. How come no leading? Guess the blue is on frt & base too.

[leadman]

gunoil, If you use the magma boolit lube I am about 90% certain you will have leading. I tested about 5 commercial lubes and Magma always leaded and the velocity was always lower, up to 100 fps in handguns.
I did find a use for it though. I mix it 1/3 by weight with Carnuba Red and it withstands the heat better here in Arizona. Less sticky also.

[Ausglock]

I found that Jake's Purple Cerasin was the best of the hard lubes for hangun loads. It needs a heater to flow.

[jmoore]

Has anyone combined there PID to there oven to get a better consistent heat?

The Oster oven I bought apparently has one built in. One reason i went for the digital display, figured it would be part of the package. You can hear the elements cycling on and off quite often during the cook.

Will be likely trying out the red copper in a "lead-o-matic" S&W 624 today. That is if the range isn't underwater and I survive the 1 1/2 drive...

[gunoil]

Dang leadman, you'ed take the fun out of christmas. I gotta shoot a few of em, i just got the expensive thing! Heck of a lot better than alox.

LEADMAN, I now have two magma sizers. The new one is set up for HTS only. Always had lite leading back when i used alox. Less headache, i have enough blue star lube to last for year.

http://i1113.photobucket.com/albums/k511/putt2012/FD5756A8-E8E0-44F8-9F24-A88BA3D3DD46-5320-000005E002424FC7_zps00e73a67.jpg

jmoore, iam gonna try green next or the best pistol color with no metal flake in it like copper or gold.

[jmoore]

Will be likely trying out the red copper in a "lead-o-matic" S&W 624 today. That is if the range isn't underwater and I survive the 1 1/2 drive...

Did i say "underwater"? How about "undermudandtrees"?

78697
78698
78699
Got run off by the worry warts after only a couple of buckets. It wasn't raining at the time!
78700
78703
78705

78706

The 624 is slowly cleaning itself, thanks to the Red Copper coating, but the boolits are still a little small for it, so accuracy is not there, yet. The 629DX did well at 25 but the vertical stringing was there at 50yds again.

78696

I'm thinking it's the trigger puller, but haven't nailed down the drama! The coating did it's part, though, even though the throats on the DX are somewhat smaller than the boolits. Shades of .45 Colt dimensional shifts...

The new brass allowed some boolit slippage under recoil, but it's probably won't be there afterwards. A light crimp will be used for new brass loads in the future.

So, it looks like the Hi Tek coating is going to make life easier. Shot some older type conventional loads as well and much prefer the coated boolits! Maybe the incoming .41 mould will mate with it's firearms better.

Need for things to dry out some before doing much casting. Rain all the time...

ETA: I can't figure out how to get rid of the photo below!

[Ausglock]

jmoore.
Crimping on coated bullets is fine.
My 357Sig loads get a very heavy crimp to stop bullet set-back. When a puller hammer is used to remove a bullet from a loaded round, there is a little bit of coating removed. But when fired there is not any sign of coating being removed. Maybe it is the pressure of firing that makes the case swell away from the bullets and doesn't hurt the coating. I fire 1000's of rounds out of the Glock35 in 357Sig and the barrel is shiny clean.

Revolver shooters here also crimp hard for 38 special, 357Mag and 44 Mag, 45LC etc etc. no sign of issues with coating removal.
So...crimp that puppy to within an inch of it's life, and see how it goes

[Ausglock]

Ausglock - just be sure NOT to hook the fan motor (induction motor) to the controller. It will stop working and you could blow the SSR due to voltage spikes. They are made to run resistive loads, not inductive loads.

Thanks for the info. Might have to re-think this...

[gunoil]

Fire pressure making case swell away, ditto that. Never thought of that. Thanks. ausglock

Got second star sizer working today with hi-tek. Still waiting on bulletfeeder and few small parts.
http://i1113.photobucket.com/albums/k511/putt2012/90C50DCC-2402-4193-A2DB-AE950D61091B-5320-00000652C0958E36_zps33c7bf81.jpg

This blue one is an original star made in san diego california. Things are built like a tank. If i get up enough nerve iam gonna do up some blue lube boolits to shoot.

[josleynrm]

No gas checks. Just coating. Bullets disintegrate on impact with stack of dry newspaper. I haven't done anything else with it since. I plan on trying a little slower and maybe thinning the mix as suggested.

[sparky45]

I see what you've done with the base(s) for the Star. You've switched the heater base that came with the new Magma and put it on the Star to run the lube, nice. I fab'd a base from a scrap of aluminum and drilled it to accept the heater element from my 4500. However, I just received my order from Donnie and the only lube i'll be using is with the 4500, and HT on the Star. I have to get my oven yet and then it's shake and bake time. I cast a couple of hundred 358477's today for a trial batch and I have 4 or 500 45's ready to coat. They're WW's that I water dropped. Now for the oven.

[gunoil]

iam lazy sparky, i quit Water dropping for HTS. Just towel drop.

800/cool/coat/375/cool/coat/375/cool/size.

I would water drop star blue boolits.

[Ausglock]

you are a lucky bugger, Gunslick. Star sizers are virtually un-obtainable in OZ.
If you find another one, grab it for your old mate Ausglock??? :-)

[leadman]

jmoore, most of the mold companies make the 41 molds to drop at .410". Guess they never looked up the SAAMI spec for cast in the 41mag, it is actually .411". I have sent several molds back because they dropped too small. Then I thought to buy an inexpensive Lee and lap it out if needed. It came and dropped at .411"!. It is the 215gr Tumble lube SWC and it shoots great.

[gunoil]

Ausglock. I will. Keep eye on ebay & estate sales.

There are american still around the usa (heres ya sign).
http://i1113.photobucket.com/albums/k511/putt2012/DE8AD1E7-1BEA-4CC0-8A18-F6C14B6D44A3-5320-0000067C7767FA19_zpsbec15be5.jpg

[gunoil]

Ausglock. I will. Keep eye on ebay & estate sales.

There are american still around the usa (heres ya sign).
http://i1113.photobucket.com/albums/k511/putt2012/DE8AD1E7-1BEA-4CC0-8A18-F6C14B6D44A3-5320-0000067C7767FA19_zpsbec15be5.jpg


If ya voted for obama we dont want your business your to dam stupid to own a firearm.

[jmoore]

jmoore, most of the mold companies make the 41 molds to drop at .410". Guess they never looked up the SAAMI spec for cast in the 41mag, it is actually .411". I have sent several molds back because they dropped too small. Then I thought to buy an inexpensive Lee and lap it out if needed. It came and dropped at .411"!. It is the 215gr Tumble lube SWC and it shoots great.

The next trick would be figuring out how to make good casts with a Lee mould...Have had several go's over the years and always get frustrated. But that's a whole 'nother subject that's surely covered elsewhere.


jmoore.
Crimping on coated bullets is fine....

...Revolver shooters here also crimp hard for 38 special, 357Mag and 44 Mag, 45LC etc etc. no sign of issues with coating removal.
So...crimp that puppy to within an inch of it's life, and see how it goes


As for crimping, I wasn't worried about the coating, it's just that I'm a cheap SOB who has handgun cases that have been in use for 25 years or more. Mostly 9 and .45 ACP, but there's a mess of old revolver cases as well. Hard to sort the annealed ones from the not, sometimes, and they just don't shoot quite the same. At least when I'm shooting well enough to tell the difference, which is getting tougher all the time!

Coated a mess of .44 gas check type SWC boolits this morning, but no gas check. Old Lachmiller 2-holer mould that drops nice 0.434-0.435" boolits. More suited size-wise for most of my .44s. Hate that the new Lyman four cavity isn't dropping larger boolits! But if the Lachmiller agrees with the revolvers at the range, then that's what will be used for the long range stuff. Trying to make hits at 75 and 100 yards whilst standing is the goal. 25 and 50 yards aren't the drama, but good results there are required before moving on.

I think the coating will help. Having no Unique powder is mighty annoying, as the absolute best work was done with it. Of course, it ran out just as the Hi Tek testing started!

Still put out about the landslide at the range. Likely means tons of lead will be bulldozed away, or one of the "big fish" will get it.