guns as an investment

[lightman]

I have made money guns a few times but if I adjusted for inflation it might not be so much. You probably would do better to catch the market down and invest in an ETF.

I have made some money at the Tulsa Gun Show a few times. I would buy a handgun from someone walking around trying to sell and walk around with it. I always made $50 or $100. One time I did that in 30 minutes or less. Another time I carried it around for 4 hours or more. Buy, Sell, Trade-------Right?

[Shawlerbrook]

There are more profitable ways to invest your money, but none of them are as much fun.

[schutzen-jager]

No one has mentioned the other end of the issue - liquidity. When I need money I may need it now or within a few months. How easy is it to get the increase from a gun vs. the index fund? Selling a gun is based on finding the buyer who wants it, and that cannot be programed.

guns are same as stocks, a lot depends on when purchased + amount paid - would you sell a stock, mutual fund, or annuity when you needed cash if the going price was 75% less than your purchase price ? - i know of many people that have lost their life savings in the past over situations like this - i have never lost any money on even common non collectible firearms over time - + i get the pleasure from owning + using all my accumulations including collectibles -

[kerplode]

Equities and real estate are investments. Guns are a hobby.

I buy guns I want and sell them when I get tired of them. I'm not planning to finance my retirement on Glocks...

I recently read an article in one of the gun rags where the author was lamenting not buying some single action something or other back in the day for $100 or whatever. He went on to say it'd be worth about 10x as much now. After I flushed, I went and looked up the cumulative inflation for that period. Any guesses what it was? Yeah...10x.

Imagine if he had put that $100 into even the most boring of consumer staple stocks...

[JoeJames]

No one has mentioned the other end of the issue - liquidity. When I need money I may need it now or within a few months. How easy is it to get the increase from a gun vs. the index fund? Selling a gun is based on finding the buyer who wants it, and that cannot be programed.

Being a pedigreed hill billy whatever firearm I sell goes into my rat hole, separate from anything else; just in case something floats by that I really want. Flashing a few Arkansas credit cards ($100 bills) will get their attention pretty fast!

[jimlj]

I don't think *most* firearms are a good financial investment. If you are buying a gun to stick in the safe for future retirement, there are far better places to invest your money. The gun you bought in 1973 for $50 may be worth $500 today. If you just stuck that gun in the safe and didn't get 50 years worth of enjoyment out of it, you lost money. For $2 in 1973 my buddies and I could pool our money and buy half a tank of gas and cruise all night long. Today that $2 gets you about half a gallon of gas.

[GOPHER SLAYER]

I remember one sure fire investment that did not live up to expectations. George Luger brought two pistols to the trials the Army was holding to select a semiautomatic pistol. I think it was 1911. Ater the trials the Army couldn't decide which pistol they wanted so they asked Luger to bring more 45 caliber pistols for more trials. He told them to bugger off. He had the Grman Army to supply as well as all the other countries who wanted the Luger. Our Army adopted the 1911 as we all know. The two 45caliber lugers that used in the trials were left with the Army. One was lost to history, the other one surived in great shape. It came up for auction many years ago. The winning bid was well over forty grand. I read an article about the pistol and the man who bought it. Several years later he put th pistol up for auction and it brought a little over thirty grand. He lost big time on that sure thing.

[ddeck22]

The other issue is scalability. I can buy $1 million in diversified funds pretty easily, putting $1 million into firearms for profit would be difficult. As someone else mentioned, there is a carrying cost (insurance, storage, etc) that eats into profits. Funds have no carrying costs.

Maybe do 5% of your portfolio in guns and if it works out, great, if not, then it isn't the end of the world.

[slim1836]

I bought rifles and pistols I wanted and could get them at a good price. I knew I could make money upon resale. Exception to this is my 2 AR's, however I still may be able to make a little.

My very small 401k sucks, having gone down to the point of maybe cashing in soon and buying something I can make money on. I will not be around to see the 401k make anything substantial, nor will my wife. At our ages, 70 & 63, we can make it to the end.

My coin collection will bring a pretty penny, more than my 401k. Not so much on my stamp collection. Both will bring in much more than I have in them, having collected since the early 60's.

Slim

[schutzen-jager]

The other issue is scalability. I can buy $1 million in diversified funds pretty easily, putting $1 million into firearms for profit would be difficult. As someone else mentioned, there is a carrying cost (insurance, storage, etc) that eats into profits. Funds have no carrying costs.

Maybe do 5% of your portfolio in guns and if it works out, great, if not, then it isn't the end of the world.

happened here + in several other countries, a few times when all stock certificates were worthless except for stating fires, but firearms + other physical commodities had value + increasing demand not based on collector value -

[Ed K]

I bought rifles and pistols I wanted and could get them at a good price. I knew I could make money upon resale. Exception to this is my 2 AR's, however I still may be able to make a little.

My very 401k sucks, having gone down to the point of maybe cashing in soon and buying something I can make money on. I will not be around to see the 401k make anything substantial, nor will my wife. At our ages, 70 & 63, we can make it to the end.

My coin collection will bring a pretty penny, more than my 401k. Not so much on my stamp collection. Both will bring in much more than I have in them, having collected since the early 60's.

Slim

Nasty tax rate on collectibles.

[Land Owner]

i have found that the simplest no hassle means to be selling to FFL holders from collects associations - i price them at apx. 60 to 75 percent of avg. retail which is much more than i paid for them - no auction, internet, transfer fees, or legal problems when done this way - i have sold both collectible + non collectibles this way - - try your state collectors association for leads -

Yes, some through their FFL. Yes, 60-75 percent of avg. retail. Yes, more than I paid. REALLY GOOD DEALS. No auctions. No transfer fees. No legal problems. Both collectables and non-. Kept paperwork on buyers and guns as receipt for sale. Sold guns mostly to current State CCW Permit Holders, face-to-face. Made a good bit of money but the effort sucked the fun out of the hobby. It has taken years to get over the burn.

IDK about a State Collector Assn.

[FISH4BUGS]

Opinions on guns as an investment?
I know, alot depends on what you pay for a firearm, the type of firearm - handgun, rifle, antique, etc.
I still think guns are a good investment. The problem is that you have to be willing to sell or trade them at some point.

YMMV, but I collect early High Standards, Colts, S&W's, pristine doubles, and anything else that catches my eye. There are 3 things to buy: condition, condition and condition.
I won't pay retail plus unless i REALLY want it....and I think that happened only once.
If you know the value of good collectibles, you can occasionally get a decent deal. When you turn them over, you get your money back and a profit.
I was lucky. My NFA stuff was bought in the late 70's and early 80's. I sold almost all my collection for a down payment on a house. I really struggled with that one because i could never afford to replace them. So I asked myself, which do I want more - a house of the guns? The rational brain said the house, of course.
Some have been very good investments. I don't think they are a good investment for strictly the return, because you get to use them while you own them. I shoot everything except two guns. These are NIB 1931 made H&R Sportsman and a NIB 1948 made High Standard HD Military.
You may love your guns but they don't love you back. They represent the pleasure of owning them, but if something better comes along and we can make a deal.....well....bye!

[Wag]

Investing in physical assets is always problematic. Art, precious metals, firearms, baseball cards, cars.... You name it. You really do have to be an expert or else you're going to waste a lot of money at the time of acquisition, waste money on insuring and protecting the asset because you incorrectly believe that it will rise in value, etc. etc. If you lose everything in a fire or theft, good luck getting your insurance company to cover the loss for an amount that you believe to be fair and equitable. My biggest fear of something like that is that such things get stolen from you or from your heirs, most likely by other family members.

Stocks and bonds and other negotiable instruments, real estate, etc. are more marketable and, therefore, have more potential appreciation capability. They can lose, too, but if you're careful, most of them will rise again in fairly short order. Some of these assets will provide a steady, reliable income stream as well.

--Wag--

[375supermag]

Hi...
Never considered the guns I bought as investments. They were bought for specific uses and used a lot.
Only ever sold a few(because of a divorce) and most probably lost money although I no longer recall the prices paid or what I got for them when I sold them.

I do know that the firearms I own are never going to be sold. My son already thinks of them as his and he will inherit them

[shooterg]

Can't shoot a 401/457, stock or bond (and I do have 'em). From what I've seen of auction prices my wife will do just fine when she auctions my stuff - she'll probably be pleasantly surprised at how much more the "arsenal" is worth than what she thinks I had in 'em . Me, I'll be on my cloud watching her at her new beach house remembering how much fun I had with the stash and her !

[TyGuy]

I don’t consider my guns to be a legitimate retirement investment but they are my primary hobby. I have so many friends who spend all their extra money (and then some…) on cars that lose their interest every year or so. It’s sickening to think of how much they sink into these things and then either sell at a huge loss to buy the next one or find themselves on the phone with insurance and the car on a rollback. Don’t get me started on the people who are constantly buying new “hip” wardrobes. Some people are great at wasting money. I work with a guy who is constantly changing hobbies. He buys and sells boats and ATVs constantly at a loss. Now he’s into RC cars and dumps all his money into upgrades and repairs. Next month he’ll probably sell it all for next to nothing to get into model airplanes.

I feel like my guns are a way to enjoy today and eventually get something back when I or Wifey decide it’s time to sell. They rarely go down in value and even if they don’t keep up with inflation it’s still a back up reserve that can be sold or traded at a moment’s notice. In the meantime they put a smile on my face and keep me away from other ways of burning my paychecks.

I’m really surprised transferable MGs haven’t been mentioned. That is one of the only real investments I see in this hobby. If you actually shoot them the cost of feeding them will really eat into any gains they make thought! But then again, what is the price tag on pasting a big goofy grin on your face? Haha

[FISH4BUGS]

I’m really surprised transferable MGs haven’t been mentioned. That is one of the only real investments I see in this hobby. If you actually shoot them the cost of feeding them will really eat into any gains they make thought! But then again, what is the price tag on pasting a big goofy grin on your face? Haha

Actually my (former) NFA collection DID turn into a great investment, although it wasn't what made me buy them. I just thought they were cool as all get out.
I started buying in the late 70's and early 80's when the guns were cheap and not many people really were into NFA items. When I sold them, they benefitted from the run up in prices way past the ban post 86.
One of the reasons I started on this board was because I learned you CAN shoot cast in full auto subguns. I needed to learn all i could about that. No they are not cheap to feed but a little discipline goes a long way. Here is one example: never load 10 magazines before going to the range. Load one mag at a time at the range. Ammo consumption is lower that way.
....and yes, the grin is still there after 45+ years.

[HATCH]

I wouldn't purchase a firearm as a investment.
With that said, I am sitting on $50K in firearms that cost me 1/3 that cost or less.
It has to do with purchasing a quality firearm and taking care of it.
It also has to do with knowing when something is way under market value and buying it.

Prime example - 1894 FG - Marlin 41 mag - originally purchased in 2006 for $450. Current value is between $2000 and $2500. That is about a 9 to 10 percent rate of return.
But that is a cherry picked example. The rate of return typically isn't that great. Its resale value is high because that model isn't made any more and was only made a very limited time.

At most typically you if you shoot the weapon and take care of it, you will break even and make a few bucks on resale but the rate of return will be about the same as if you had invested the money in a typical savings account.

NFA transferable machine guns are always going to go up in value because there is a limited amount of them out there. If you had money to burn then I would look for deals.
Look for ones that are way under market value. Just keep in mind that besides having a toy to play with your not gonna retire on the profit you make on them unless you get great deals and purchase a lot of them.