.45-70 reload deer

[ChristopherO]

Hello Men,
The OP didn't say there was a 3" hole all the way through the animal but that the boolit made "3" holes in both lungs". irishtoo when on to say "no meat loss". I take this as the entry and exit wounds were normal size but the spongy lung tissue received the trauma that we come to expect out of these cast boolits. Appears to have worked as well as those I've taken with the 45/70 and hand cast slugs.
.

[irishtoo]

yes christoper....exactly right. i miss stated. not a 3" open void but 3" of mushy jelly tissue. lots of blood loss. thru and thru chest wound. the exit was larger than the entrance. the load worked well. also it is cheap to reload and pleasant to practice with. i shoot several hundred rounds thru the summer between .45-70 and muzzleloaders. with the 45-70....0ne shot....one deer! irishtoo.

[trapper9260]

I use the Lee 405 cast in my muzzle loader 50 cal with a sabot and takes the deer with no problem as long I do my part. I had some help on this forum for the problems I had in the past with usen the wrong bollit.

[warren5421]

I use either a trapdoor made in 1884 or one made by H&R shooting a Lyman 536 gr bullet in front of a full case of black. Shots in Indiana are all under a 100 yards, more life 75'-100'in the woods. I don't remember a time the bullet didn't pass through the deer. I like the way the .45-70 hits and does the job if I did my part and put the bullet in the right zone.

[irishtoo]

trapper would go into more detail on that .50cal sabot load in a muzzleloader? is it a inline? twist rate? thank you irishtoo

[Outer Rondacker]

trapper would go into more detail on that .50cal sabot load in a muzzleloader? is it a inline? twist rate? thank you irishtoo

Not the same But I use as hollow point 44 mag projectile in a sabot in my .50 cal muzzleloader. Mine is an inline. Ok the ones I have at the moment are made by Hornady.
https://www.grafs.com/retail/catalog...productId/5479 Just an example. Cost is up to .12 cents apiece.

[trapper9260]

trapper would go into more detail on that .50cal sabot load in a muzzleloader? is it a inline? twist rate? thank you irishtoo

I use a side hammer 50 cal. and the twist is if I remember is 1:24 so it was came to that need a boolit that is over 1" long and what looks to work is the Lee 405 gr of 45 cal. and use TC sabot with 80grs by volume FFG of 777 . I have 2 side hammer 50 cals that have the same twist . That takes the same data.

[irishtoo]

very good thank you

[ChristopherO]

irishtoo,
I looked up the chrony results using 14 grains of Unique in the 26" Marlin Cowboy, average of 1,186 fps. I suspect you are in the 1,200 fps range on velocity at the muzzle.

[white cloud]

If you size your bullet right and use the right alloy, when do you need a gas check for 45-70? I notice many of the molds for sale do not have gas checks in this caliber.

[Winger Ed.]

I notice many of the molds for sale do not have gas checks in this caliber.

In a rifle: If you stay under about 1800-2000 fps, with a good alloy & lube before leading becomes too much of a problem,
you really don't need a GC for anything- especially if you powder coat.

My Marlin CB in .45-70 is so punishing to shoot over BP speeds with a 405,
I sold the GC mold to one of the big, huskie guys here.
The next mold for it will be a plain base.

[white cloud]

Thanks for your kind reply. Do you have an opinion of the Lyman #457122 mold for the 45-70? I am planning to start acquiring what is required to reload 45-70 in anticipation of picking up a Marlin in that caliber.

[ChristopherO]

Hello White Cloud, I gravitate toward the 405 grain or heavier boolits, but that Lyman should drop a deer with aplomb, with or without the HP. What I've found out with the Marlin CB is that fit matters between the boolit and the bore of the rifle. Mine slugs out at .4585" which means a .460" boolit does best. I'm not sure what that Lyman specs out at, or what the barrel of the rifle the Marlin you eventually purchase, but it can make a difference. One thing be mindful of, I found out, is that whatever mold you acquire the boolit has to be able to cycle in the lever action or it is an effort in frustration. Most will, but certain really long nose offerings may be an issue. That 330 grain should cycle just fine, though.

I use plain base (PB) boolits in the plinker rounds, 1000 to 1300 FPS and gas checks (GC) in those that are designated for hunting, 1600 to 1800 FPS.
The Lee 405 FNPB is the plinker mold, but it was too small and I had hone it out. It was my first purchase. The next mold is the Accurate 460C-405GC. It cycles fine and kills deer very well at 1700 FPS with softer alloy. If I knew then what I know now I would have passed on the Lee mold and purchased the Accurate with one PB and one GC cavity and been quite happy, saving time and money.

Depending on the model you are looking at will help determine how fast you want to push a hunk of lead. As mentioned above, the Cowboy kicks like a blue mule with the plastic butt plate when the velocity is elevated high. I had to try the 1900 to 2100 FPS loads early on, but don't enjoy folks seeing me cry at the shootn bench, lol. The 1200 FPS load is fun. The 1700FPS load isn't too bad, either. Accuracy is plenty good and the results were what I was looking for. You will have much fun with the Marlin when you put your kit all together.

[Winger Ed.]

Do you have an opinion of the Lyman #457122 mold for the 45-70? .

I have a big bunch of 405GC cast and ready to load, but have since sold the mold to one of the members here.

When I first got my Marlin CB and loaded with 405FPs and mid-teen-ish charges in my Marlin CB,,,,,
It took some double checking, and head scratching to figure out which end of it was more dangerous than the other.
Since then, I've dropped down to low-teen, BP speeds, and its tolerable to shoot more than 3-4 times at a sitting.

If I ever run out of the 405s I have, that mold will be the next one I buy for it.

[Good Cheer]

My brother's one hole varmint load. 500 grains at over 1700FPS.

I occasionally mention that he's liable to get shaken baby syndrome.

[Sgt H]

White Cloud I have taken a number of whitetails and 1 turkey with the Lyman/Gould 457122 cast 30/1 loaded to the original express velocity over BP and smokeless. IMO one of the best cast bullets for deer but it does expand quickly and sometimes violently. The HP depth is about half of the bullet length. A couple of the deer shot at ranges of 20-30 yards had multiple exit holes. Our deer here in TX are not real big, the largest buck I have taken only field dressed 140#. I prefer lung shots where the only bones hit are ribs and I don't tear up the shoulders. They usually run a bit but not very far. I have not had any leading problems in my Sharps or Browning 1886.

[white cloud]

Sgt H, thanks for your reply. I have a number of nice hunting rifles but I like lever guns. I am hoping to get one of the new Ruger/Marlin 45-70s. Here in S.C. the deer are not real large either but since I put out food plots the deer are getting bigger. I only take double lung shots so it sounds like that bullet should work well. Do you have any idea how fast a BP load with the Lyman 457122 bullet might be?

[Sgt H]

The BP velocity should be about 1450 give or take a bit if you have 22" or more of barrel. Would be less in the 18" guide gun but would be easy to get to that level with smokeless loads. The old 45/90 express load was about 100fps faster if I remember correctly. The Lyman/Gould bullet at 1450 or so is an easy shooting load that doesn't beat you up. Over 40 years ago when I first hunted with a 45/70 I loaded 300 JHP's as fast as I could safely push them with a bunch of 4198 (I was younger and dumber then). Velocity was 2200 FPS out of the 22" barrel of the 1895 Marlin I had at the time. They were devastating on whitetails, most dropping where they stood but the recoil was brutal.

[Rapier]

I like shooting slow thumpers, got a 444, a 45-70 and just acquired a 375 Win. I need a 378 250-300 gr mold for that 375. The brass is supposed to come in today.

[StrawHat]

Good afternoon and Congratulations !
Popping corn crunchers with our own home made slugs does bring a big smile to the heart.
I also am a flintlock hunter. Last time I was out to pop one I had a 1826 made Hall flinter with me.

Attachment 294394Attachment 294395

Did not know you had a Hall, Mike!

Have you taken a deer with the “improved Hall” aka Burnside?

Kevin