first smelt: mixed 23 oz national 111 bar into range scrap..seems very hard

[guy_with_boolits]

I suppose the 111 bar was 50/50 tin and lead: http://castboolits.gunloads.com/show...l-Lead-Co-bars

Range scrap was mostly pistol. Vast majority jacketed.

The total resulting smelted/cleaned block weighs 28.4 lbs

It seems pretty hard to me.

It "rings" when tapped. Kind of like 6061 would.

So if my math is right and we assume pure lead from the scrap, the resultant alloy is:

454.4 oz total alloy weight
1/2 of 23oz 111 bar = 12.5 oz tin
12.5oz / 454.4oz = 2.7% tin

Not sure how much antimony if any is in there..

Just looking for comments! Any way I can do a rough hardness test somehow to prove its 20+ BHN? (or disprove?)

This block is almost certainly going to be made into 45ACP pistol using the LEE 200gr flat wad cutter mold and alox

[guy_with_boolits]

[Neverhome]

Artist pencils is the cheapest way to test hardness. There’s a chart somewhere on this site with the rough breakdown of which pencil hardness equals which alloy hardness.
I hope you DONT have a 20 bhn if your plan is for 45 acp.
2.7% tin in pure lead(which you likely don’t have) is no where near 20. Did you mean 10?

[guy_with_boolits]

Artist pencils is the cheapest way to test hardness. There’s a chart somewhere on this site with the rough breakdown of which pencil hardness equals which alloy hardness.
I hope you DONT have a 20 bhn if your plan is for 45 acp.

I probably should not have dumped the whole bar in, but it was melting and I couldnt help myself...

Thing is I dont have any artist pencils

okay this article says a 3% alloy of lead and tin has a BHN of 8 so maybe I am okay.... http://www.lasc.us/Kelter_Cast_Bullet_Alloys2.pdf

[Neverhome]

I got mine for I believe 9 bucks at Walmart. The variety covered every possible alloy I’d ever use.

[Neverhome]

These worked for me though I’m sure there are others.

[Conditor22]

http://castboolits.gunloads.com/show...-testing-trick

[gwpercle]

45 acp don't need to be super hard .
My free unlimited wheel weight source retired from the tire business so I started mixing the COWW metal 50/50 with soft scrap lead , stick on WW's and range scrap .
Whatever BHN this is (no hardness tester either) it works great ...just as good if not better than straight COWW . All my boolits are air cooled and conventionaly lubed and sized .
This mix also works well in revolver and 30-30 loads .
Gary

[Burnt Fingers]

Truth be told the range scrap would have been fine for 45 ACP. Maybe a small amount of tin added. Like 1/4 a bar or less.

[bangerjim]

You can buy artist pencils at WalMart or any art store. Very inexpensive compared to the Cabine-style (very accurate and repeatable) tester I use.

Pencils will get you in the ±2 hardness range. Close enough. Again, do not dwell on hardness! It's not that important any more, as proven by modern data. And if you PC your boolits, you can run harnesses of 8-10 in most pistols and light rifle loads. I sure do not worry about hardness like I used to in the olde daze. I know the make-up of all the feed ingots I use (x-ray gun analysis) and just throw this and that into the casting pot (+ a little Sn for mold fill-out) to get in the ballpark of 10 hardness for EVERYTHING.

I do NOT mix up huge batches of alloy! You may want to change that mix someday and you will have hundreds of pounds of stuff you do not want on hand. I mix it on the fly as the pot empties. Knowing the EXACT % alloy of my ingots allows me to do that very accurately.

banger

[36Power]

I *think* an ordinary #2 pencil is somewhere around 12-14. You probably have one of those laying around. A pencil test with it will at least tell you if you're north or south of that bhn.

[Super Sneaky Steve]

A lee hardness tester is worth the investment if you're going to mess with alloys.

If you powder coat you can get away with way softer metals. I'm shooting a tested 8bhn out of a rifle going 1700fps without leading because of the powder coat and gas check.

I shot the same alloy out of 9mm without PC and I got bad leading and poor accuracy. After boiling the lube off I PC'd the same boolits and shot perfectly.

Save your hard stuff for later. Might make a good cast .223 Remington boolit. Use scrap with PC for all handguns.

[Cast_outlaw]

Well hope this helps