Success with the .357 sig.

[abqcaster]

I had been reading up on loading cast in .357 Sig. Not much of it was encouraging. There seems to be a lot of fear of setback, and of leading due to the high velocity. Many people just don't seem to or want to deal with the short neck of the case or where the case head spaces.

I recently got a good deal on a used .357 Sig barrel from Storm Lake, for a Glock 23. I had been intrigued by the caliber since it had been developed, but never got a chance to work with it. Patrick Sweeney had a lot of good things to say about the caliber, but dismissed the idea of using lead projectiles. That sounded like a challenge to me. So, I read up more and ordered what I needed to produce my first batch.

It seemed rather providential. I had gotten the barrel at a very low price, and then the same shop had several dirt cheap lots of range brass in .357 Sig. I had some COWW lead from The Captain, and I sweetened it with 50/50 solder from Idaho_Elk_Huntr. Bless them and their great deals! I got a reasonable facsimile of Lyman #2 according to the LASC information. I cast using the Lee .356-102-RN mold, and water dropped. I don't know the BHN other than "really hard." It's around nosed mold so I wasn't concerned about expansion or brittleness.I was worried about the tiny lube groove though.

I pan lubed them with modified NRA lube: 2:2:1 Alox:Beeswax:microcrystaline wax +about 1% carnauba. The microcrystaline wax raises the melting temp for use out here in the desert. Sized them to .356 with a lee push-through sizer.

I used R-P headstamped range brass: Cleaned with dawn dish soap and citric acid. Polished with walnut + a tbsp of mineral spirits. Polished again with corn cob and turtle wax. Sized with a lee .40S&W carbide sizing/de-priming die, and "de-glocked" (not really necessary) with a lee bulge buster. Cleaned the primer pockets (wanted to be really rigorous for the first time) and trimmed with a Lee length gauge. LEE gauges let you cut to about halfway between max and min case length. Dummy loads I made were just a hair proud in the "plunk test" without trimming. I then, neck sized with a lee .357 Sig steel sizing die and installed Remington SP primers with a lee safety prime on the neck sizing down stroke.

I expanded the neck the smallest amount I could to get a bullet to seat without shaving. Charged in the same operation with 8.4gn of Acc#5 (I'm NOT any kind of ballistician follow this at YOUR peril), gleaned from the LEE reloading manual's 115gn lead data. Finally seated the bullet to 1.145" OAL because a) the bullet itself is very short, and b) it's a round nose so I had some forgiveness in the barrel that you don't get with a flat nose. At this OAL the cartridge fit in a .40S&W magazine comfortably and I was able to run them out without a jam using my thumb. Also at this OAL, I was sure that the lube groove was still in the case neck and not exposed to any powder (barely). I crimped using the same seating die to a snug enough taper crimp to pass a reasonable thumb test and pass the "plunk test" in my new-to-me barrel. I had made several dummy loads prior to the finished rounds to get to this point and manually cycled them a few times, and never saw any setback.

At the range:

It was really, really cold day and I was sick of using numb fingers to load up my magazines. So, I only tested 10 of the 20 rounds I made. I fired them all with only 1 FTF. I kept them all on the same 12"X18" half-stump I had on a platform. The target stump was at 7 yds. One of the outermost shots even managed to turn the stump about 80 degrees. I removed the barrel and saw absolutely no leading.

I think the FTF was a result of using a .40 mag instead of .357 Sig mag. The Sig mag has a different follower and keeps the cartridge tip pointed right, if there's any drag on it. There's not enough support from the .40 S&W follower for that. I could use a shorter OAL, but that starts to put my lube groove too far into the case. And like I said, I only got one FTF.

At this point I'm going to get some dedicated mags and play with the powder charge to perfect the load. I'm also going to try using PB-GCs made with Pat's die to up the velocity, and start using Acc#9 as has been greatly recommended. I didn't start with ACC#9 because the minimum charge would create too high a velocity, from my experience, for naked lead even if it was water dropped.

Thanks for all the knowledge here to help me get this far. I'll keep you all posted on my progress.

[abqcaster]

I followed up with more of the same load, 20 rounds more. I got some minor leading but the accuracy was terrible. I also tried using the the PB GC I spoke of earlier but installing them was a nightmare. The RN profile of the Lee 102gr boolit made it impossible to get a consistent position to crimp on the gas check, using a Lee push through sizer. I experimented by "pigleting" the bullets with HF's matte black powder coat. I found it was too messy and I never could find a sweet spot temperature-wise that hardened the coat properly and didn't melt my bullets. That was a matter of the oven I was using. So, I scrapped all the modification plans and started over with the mold.

I communicated my needs for a large lube groove, on a 122-124gr boolit, with a proper profile to Tom at Accurate Molds. turns out he had just designed the perfect mold I was looking for. I ordered it and cast with it as soon as I could. I also found that the flat nose profile allowed for easy and consistent PB GC installation. I've so far loaded 1/2 box of .357 sig with PB GCs and 1/2 box without. We'll see how they fare at the range this weekend. They're sitting on top of 12.9gr of AA9.

[ss30378]

Double tap loads a 180 grain cast bullet bullet in both their 357 sig and 9x25 dillon. It's a GC design and they claim 21 bhn. I hear of decent reviews of it so i know it's possible to do. Good luck!

[abqcaster]

Well, I got minor leading at the last 0.5-1.0" of the barrel using unchecked boolits. Using boolits with PB GCs the barrel was clean as a whistle. I haven't cronographed them yet but the published data says I should be getting over 1300fps with this load/barrel combo. It's not terribly snappy either and the brass piles up about 5 feet behind, and to the right of me. I believe I have my .357 sig recipe nailed down.

[xacex]

Now that you got it nailed down, go try some powder coated ones and see how that works for you!

[abqcaster]

I tried "pigletting" and don't care for it or the coated bullets themselves, and I really don't want to get even more equipment to fill up my workshop for proper powder coating. I'm quite happy with the what I have now. Thanks for the suggestion, though.

[Ausglock]

I run a Glock 35 with 357Sig Barrel. I shoot coated bullets 145gr RN with SIGed 40 S&W brass to Major powerfactor in IPSC.
I use 357Sig and 40 S&W mags with no issues.
Everyone says the 40 brass is too weak. Well 90% of all sig shooters here in OZ use 40 cases and there have been no problems.

[xacex]

I have used 40 cases before, but only load a little above 9mm+p or about 38 super, and toss the case after one use. Hate to have a case blow out with weak brass in a Glock. Now I am considering using a Glock 29 barrel in a Glock 30 that is chambered in 357 sig since I sold the G22 I was shooting 357 sig out of before. I like that round, hate the 40.

[exile]

Has anyone tried the Lee 120 grain tc mold in .357 Sig? Is the nose short enough for it to be usable in this cartridge? Thanks.

exile

[exile]

@exile,



No, but I have tried the Lee 358-125-RF with good success. I loaded them to only about 1200-1250 fps since they were not GCed. They cycled well with mild recoil.

Marshall

Thanks. exile

[Tackleberry41]

I was just loading cast in my 357 sig other day, lyman 147gr and NOE 158gr w HP pins for 145gr. Powder coated neither leaves anything in the barrel. Both are accurate. Powder coated you can pretty much use jacketed data. I got 1350fps easily using 800x. I was watching for set back but never had any issues. I see data for AA#9, but the 357 sig was designed for short barrel use, #9 seems a bit slow for a 4in barrel. The faster powders work better.

I guess mags it depends on the gun. My FNS40 the mags are marked 40/357, they dont sell a different follower. And feeds either one from the same mag.

[abqcaster]

I was just loading cast in my 357 sig other day, lyman 147gr and NOE 158gr w HP pins for 145gr. Powder coated neither leaves anything in the barrel. Both are accurate. Powder coated you can pretty much use jacketed data. I got 1350fps easily using 800x. I was watching for set back but never had any issues. I see data for AA#9, but the 357 sig was designed for short barrel use, #9 seems a bit slow for a 4in barrel. The faster powders work better.

I guess mags it depends on the gun. My FNS40 the mags are marked 40/357, they dont sell a different follower. And feeds either one from the same mag.

Where did you find 800x data for lead in 357sig? I've been wanting to try 800x in that caliber but can only find AA#5, 7 or 9 data for it.

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[Tackleberry41]

800x data is in the Lee manual. They only list it for the 147gr with a good boost over the other powders. 7.9gr start to 9.0gr max which is compressed. Thats jacketed data, not seen any for cast. I have found powder coated works fine w jacketed data.

[abqcaster]

Thanks!

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[Groo]

Groo here
Try the lee 105gr SWC and crimp in the crimp groove........
Also try the lee tumble lube on the bullet..
Watch your sizing and headspace on the shoulder

[warboar_21]

Has anyone tried the Lee 120 grain tc mold in .357 Sig? Is the nose short enough for it to be usable in this cartridge? Thanks.

exile

I have the mold but just haven't had the time to cast any. I bought it with the intention of having one bullet for the 357Sig and my 9mms.

So far the only cast I've used in my Sig 229 is the hunters supply 125gr. They have worked really well and no leading. I loaded up several with Max charge of AA#9 with no leading

[dkf]

Where did you find 800x data for lead in 357sig? I've been wanting to try 800x in that caliber but can only find AA#5, 7 or 9 data for it.

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I just go off data for a similar size/weight jacketed bullet. I start a tad under listed starting load for the jacketed and work up.

[abqcaster]

I've also used the Lee 356-120 TC, for whoever is asking. It works very well.

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