One would almost think that after five pages, the OP would be considered as "Trolling".
RRR
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One would almost think that after five pages, the OP would be considered as "Trolling".
RRR
"I Make the part.............................that makes the parts"
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I am new to casting but not reloading and I didnt want to like powder coating. I was using a Lyman 45 to traditional lube my boolits and liked doing them that way. I finally broke down and powder coated. Not for color but for less mess using my bevel base molds. I do not have a lube heater and was using TACX and it worked fine but smokey. Nobody wanted to shoot down wind of me. I tried powder coating on a whim and the smoke went away. I do not see any time saving but its cleaner than the traditional lube with my set up.
Sounds familiar. Real familiar.Originally Posted by typz2slo
I used to skim through the forums and when I saw powder coating I used to shake my head in dis-belief.
Then one day I happened to read about shake and bake and HF Red. I already had a toaster oven that wasn't used in 20 years and ASBBs were all over the house already so I figured, why not ?
That's the day the world of shooting cast boolits forever changed for me. And I'm loving it.
Motor
If you're fouling the gas system of an AR (or any gas system rifle) you're doing something wrong. AR's don't foul nearly as much as one may think over another type of gas system.
Has anyone else noticed that if someone goes onto a thread and post a negative comment (why they feel the need to do so is unknown) Those who like whatever they are speaking of go into making the sale mode. You see it over and over most of the time it gets ugly and the thread has to be removed and infractions are handed out. I just like to say PC must have a effect on those who use it and it clams their tempers since this is still going. Thanks guys for being adults lets keep the name calling and other insults out.
Reloading to save money I am sure the saving is going to start soon
Thank you for sharing that
Everybody wants to be right. I do what works best for me. It might not work for someone else. If someone is interested in what I am doing I will help them as much as I can. If they don't like what I do that is okay too. If all this arguring is a indication of the mentality of gun guys and casters then we might as well go ahead and turn our guns in. Some simple thing like bulletcoating tears this forum apart then we don't stand a chance of standing together on anything. United we stand,divided we fall!
Boolits !!!!! Does that mean what I think it do? It do!
Uhuh..of course it is..
Don't worry about life, no-one gets out alive.
Quote ''If all this arguing is a indication of the mentality of gun guys and casters then we might as well go ahead and turn our guns in. Some simple thing like bulletcoating tears this forum apart then we don't stand a chance of standing together on anything. United we stand,divided we fall!''
__________________________________________________ __________________________________
Your frustration is felt by many here I assure you. Some are reduced to sounding plumb stupid because of personality issues. I see and hear em at the range all too often as well.
For a period I was anti-NRA some years back over Wayne La Pierre's behavior during the Project Exile debacle. My belief was and still is that individual liberties should be defended by individuals. That would make one think that a loose collective would develop. In your dreams.
People will let personality clashes destroy our nation. Not everyone, but enough to cause disunity. I have since forgiven Mr. La Pierre and had to admit that while I believe the NRA should function as a gun club, but since we as individuals cannot even function harmoniously in a setting like this, I owe a debt of gratitude to the NRA for doing what we as individuals are failing to to do.
In the right hands a firearm can defend a nation as the framers intended. Done responsibly those hands can defend a nation without ever firing a shot against domestic tyrants. it is not hard to understand why anti liberty gun grabbers believe they can prevail when they see personality fueled carping that is all to frequent among us.
Plain truth. You do not have to be smart to own a firearm or post online. I accept that stupidity will never self regulate. I even accept that in the young ignorance is often overly vocal.
What really upsets me is that I see people who I am almost sure are more intelligent than me involved in these personality fueled arguments that clutter these forums and other venues. And they are not all young people.
Discuss......not argue.
if someone attacks you unfairly resist the temptation of go to their level in response. If your ideas are valid then over time they will be proven out, and we will ALL benefit whether we are the originators of a process or just tweakers of a process or just schleps who read at the right time and had fantastic information delivered right into our laps without contributing a thing to the
process other than being civil to one another.
Guys I don't know what the answer is to us getting along. For me it is trying to state things I believe as unproven, simply the way I currently do them. I can only control me and how I react to others.
I just recently increased my NRA life membership to the Patron level. Until we can learn to get along I see the NRA as the best protection of our right to keep and bear arms and therefore our ability to preserve liberty.
Yet even at age 69 I find myself fervently hoping that we somehow manage to pull it together and individually become freedom's best hope for the future, regardless of whether we are NRA members or not affiliated with any gun rights organization.
If you like to argue and sound stupid then make it about football or basketball. Something that really doesn't matter. The best dunk or pass reception does not feed the hungry nor clothe the poor. But our behaviors here should offer no solace to those who would deprive us of our, or our children's or grandchildren's liberty.
in the hands of a good man or woman, a firearm, while only a tool, can defend a nation. In the hands of a man or woman lacking character that same firearm is worthless at best and a danger at worst.
I don't want my son or grandchildren cursing me because I behaved in such a way that liberty is lost to them. And yes......my behavior here counts. And so does your behavior. I hope to see the day when we ''as individuals'' are freedoms best defense and the NRA has strength because we as individual members give it strength, not the other way around.
To those who understand let us do what is necessary, drawing on character. perseverance and a sense of duty. To those who don't understand I am sorry to have bored you. Just be civil and you will enjoy benefits as well...............Mike
Call me old fashioned, but I don't have any problem with my old Red Rooster lube. If it ain't broke...
Glad you have found the lube that best suits you. Hope it continues to serve you well.....MIke
good example of what I am talking about that could have gone down hill fast. Are we about done with this thread now has everyone got it out of their system cabin fever should be breaking soon.
Reloading to save money I am sure the saving is going to start soon
I must have missed something back in the thread somewhere, I personally did not think anyone was arguing in it.
Most of what I have seen so far is some guys asking WHY we do what we do, rather than ridicule coaters for coating..
All good my way anyways...
Don't worry about life, no-one gets out alive.
I didn't WANT to like the powder coated bullets I cast myself, but I'm of the opinion...to truly say I don't like it, I had to try it.
I freakin LOVE LOVE LOVE it!!!
I do the simple shake and bake method...and I'm loading my handgun ammo cleaner and cheaper than ever before. Like close to .22 cheap.
I work in the iron industry, and am responsible for managing a group which is constantly trying new ideas. (If you aren't getting better, you're falling behind)
I am not a newby in gathering realistic applicable data, nor am I implying anyone else here is either.
What I personally have learned...
The polyester based powder coating (when baked on bullets) is indeed a very hard coating which strongly resists erosion and thermal breakdown.
I have seen copper and lead fouling literally just go away, in my handguns. That's a good thing. For folks that load/reload their own, it's seriously amazing and is worth a second look. For folks that only use "commercially produced" ammo...it'll be out soon. It's that good. For folks that are happy without it, good for you...if it ain't broke don't mess with it!
-Butch
I actually read through about all 6 pages of this thread earlier tonight while I was at work and I say GOOD FOR YOU. Sadly though I think you are a dieing breed. People like yourself who KNOW how to mix alloys and make what you want and have been doing this a long time, but times are changing. We all know it. I have always wanted to be like you and that attracted me to this site in the first place, but I have not had enough reloading under my belt to even come close to your knowledge. I have always wanted to be able to cast and know my mixes and know how to whip up the proper alloy with the correct bhn for my application but I never had this or that and when I finally did get all of the things ready to cast, PC came along. I have told a lot of folks that there are two kinds of folks who cast, THOSE that are the alloy masters and they know a lot about what they do, and those that are new, and they do not know a lot, but they can now PC and PC has ALMOST made this a level playing field now. Much like Samuel Colt made all people equal(Well, all people that could afford his firearms).
Until I become an alloy master I can hide behind my PC and take the cheap route. I actually enjoy PC though but I agree with you in the colors. I have not found a single color that I really like, so I keep buying them. Now I have 30+ colors. I have so many damn colors I have not even tried them all out yet, but I have made glow in the dark bullets, neon green bullets, black and gold bullets, and now my latest creation, my red rimmed hollow points. For me PC is about dressing up my lead to look like something that is NOT necessarily a bullet. Like my Mint Green Porcelain hollow points with red rims. Yeah, they look sloppy, but I plan on making more and hopefully they will soon look like tea cups or like actual porcelain bullets with red rims. Why so much time and effort into making them look pretty? Because this is the digital era and I want some NICE rounds that I can take photos of that make MY photos and firearms stand out from all of the rest. I want some NICE wallpaper for my computer monitor so when I step away from my computer and lock it people can see a nice 1911 with some crazy looking bullets that just can not be real... And then they ask me and I get them hooked into reloading and casting, like my previous supervisor...
Times are changing man. You do not need to because hey, what you do works, but I am no expert like you and I have not played with my lead as much, but I DO know what happens when I put glossy red over emerald green and I DO like me some bonded black chrome bullets (you might like those).
I even have a document that I am working on that details every step of MY process which intersects a few processes here as well. I made it at the request of my friend who wanted to be able to cast a ton of boolits (maybe even a literal ton) and then coat them and store them so he can use them as he needs them. He is new too and he wants to get his daughter into shooting and if she gets to pick a color and shoot, well, kids like that sort of thing I guess. So I am not upset at all and I have no problems with your statements. I know EXACTLY where you are coming from. You are like my father, except my father does not even trust himself enough to learn how to reload, and he never did and that always kept him out of reloading. I am the first in my family that is PRO 2A and adamant about it. I am the only one that cares and if me taking photos of my work and sharing them and talking with others helps to get more people into being gun owners then that is way more than I ever did while I was in church...
But I also think we can still make a PCer out of you. I think you should head on over to Prismatic Powders and have a look at what they got. With over 12k color combinations there I bet they might have something that you might think does not look half bad on your bullets.
As for other comments in this thread. Mr Smale is clearly not a liberal progressive (and nobody said he was) So I can appreciate his attitude that he does not like it. Here in California once a liberal progressive states that they do not like it, they follow up that statement with "And I want to see that it gets banned..." so it is truly refreshing to see someone simply state their opinion and leave it at that. This site is filled with various people of differing backgrounds and I appreciate that even after 6 pages of a thread that started on a negative comment, a flame war has not broken out. THAT is what separates you folks from other sites. So by all means, keep on not liking it, but if you ever want to get your feet wet, I will be more than happy to assist you in whatever way that I can or give you guidance in what I do to get my results.
Until then, enjoy my new Hollow Points that light the paper on fire as they go through... (just kidding, they might not ever get shot because they are just to pretty in MY opinion...) Oh, and they were made from my FIRST BRASS NOE 2 cavity mold that someone bought for me and sent my way because I offered them assistance and actually made them a large care package of various powder coated projectiles in .356, .357, .358, and .451. I would have never bought an NOE on my own, but now I want more and I intend to buy a few more of them when I get back on my feet.
Glamour shots have not yet been staged, only these group shots so far...
Stilly, those are really cool!
Some of you may have seen this before. I had PCed some boolits that I was NOT going to use, just trying some colors out. I had one boolit that had two heavy coats of PC, which I later threw in the pot for a remelt. I was surprised as they melted to see a rubbery jacket in the form of the boolit floating on the melt!
Picked it up with needle nose pliers and dropped in the waste basket. Now this boolit had received a two heavy coats,(No I don't do this all the time, just used the boolit over for a color test) and it was the only one that floated to the top like a deflated rubber balloon in the shape of the boolit.
Wish I had taken a picture of it. I was really amazed at the toughness of the powder coat.
Maker of Silver Boolits for Werewolf hunting
Ok. Let's see if I can do this with out offending anyone. Most of you are PCing your boolits for reasons that either make sense to you or are important for one reason or another. I got that part. Most of the reasons you have for PCing a boolits I don't have issues with. I'm not having leading issues, I don't care what color they are. The greasy mess doesn't bother me. Long term storage is not a problem as I can store they dry and lube them when I want. I don't shoot indoors so the smoke is a non issue. I'm not interested in impressing the ladies with pretty boolits. Barrel fouling is a non issue. Right now I'm shooting a 365gr greased .416 boolit at about 2100+ fps from my 416Rem at about 2". My question is. Will PC help me in gaining noticeable accuracy or velocity or better yet both? If it will, I will be trying PC. If not, I'd rather not waste the time. I can PP if this won't work.
I can't say if powder coating will noticeably increase your accuracy or increase your velocity. It sounds like you are perfectly happy doing it your way. So goading you to come on and try powder coating would be tantamount to poking you with a sharp stick.
Perhaps sometime in the future you'll purchase a firearm that does not respond well to your usual procedures. You might ask those same questions after powder coating is out of it's infancy and more is known about the process and what it can do for boolits.......and what it cannot do.
I have a friend who is simply not interested in all the experimentation and all he wants to know is a straightforward ''how to'' with nearly guaranteed success. I have given him some pistol boolits and he has fired them with satisfaction. 45 caliber pistol boolits. Some 38 caliber WC's and that is about all I think know about powder coated boolits.
My wife used to get frustrated with me because we certainly did not agree in many areas. After many years of having her trying new approaches to get me to change my mind I asked ''can't we just agree to disagree. I cannot honestly agree with you so i will be lying if I say I do''. Still it went on year after year. Maybe I should have just said different strokes for different folks and left the ''disagreement'' word out of it. Anyway there was never resolution until her death.
We all come here on these various forums voluntarily. Most of us come here to learn and for the camaraderie. I suspect some stay to teach. I am always amazed at the knowledge some have here of chemistry, electricity and electronics and a myriad of other subjects.
Me, I'm just pretty good with people. Used to have no use for em. Then I had to learn to deal with em because of my job, politicians, professional people and working class individuals. Men, women, drunks, people with a chip on their shoulder. Then somewhere in the process I finally developed empathy. I continued getting older and my hormone levels dropped I suspect, and I was less apt to jump at someone who seemed to be invading my space. Nothing left to prove, Secure in my person.
Life is good. Even though I've learned I was never really as smart as I thought I was. I have learned to forgive others, and as important learned to forgive myself. I have a problem with one aspect of me. I was so arrogant about what I thought I knew. I remember with some shame all the head butting I did through the years. Believing I was something because I won so many conflicts. Even read some stuff by Gerry Spence on how to argue and win every time.
The problem. If I won then someone else lost. If I lost then they won. Unfortunately the truth lost in many cases, buried in the personal conflicts and arguments that developed out of what should have been simple discussion.
Look.....many people come here to learn. Some are inpatient and just want it all at once, 100% accurate info. Ain't gonna happen. Some things are opinion because it has not be proven by enough people over a long enough period. Might be the truth, in infancy and as yet not recognized as truth.
When we let our hormones get the best of us resulting in personality conflicts the main loser is determining the truth. The best process. The best product currently. The people coming here for just information who are turned off, leaving never to return.
That is not a legacy I want to be part of. I am betting the majority of the people here feel like that as well......including moderators. The carping and backbiting only make their jobs more difficult as well.
I will not write of this matter again. I have said it every way I can think of. This is a great place full of knowledgeable people. If we develop a sense of restraint when we believe we are being challenged or even insulted, if we take the high road.......we do not lose. Everyone gains. Moderators can handle conflicts that become a real problem. People who desire to stir up trouble do not stay long when their efforts are ignored or addressed by moderators.
rbuck351 made a statement and asked a question and did it the right way. Most here do. Let us encourage those who don't ask or respond well to become better at it.
I love powder coating....pistol boolits. I hope great strides are made in powder coating rifle boolits, getting good accuracy and high velocity. I tried paper patching 8x57 a few years back with some success. Arthritic fingers hope powder coating becomes a viable alternative. Dismantling my soap box...........Mike
Ya know...
I wonder if a PC flowchart would help people... Because really that is what it is. It COULD be a solution if all else is failing or it could be a solution if you just want something different or want to have fun in a weird sort of way... And THAT is PC in a nutshell...
And thank you Hickok. They almost look more like Muscari flowers now that I think of it. Maybe my next colors will be to imitate those... Blue with white rims...
I actually have a mini database that I have started collecting data for that details all of my different color combos and how I got them... :\
I came to the PC forum to see if it can help. Apparently PC won't help with my issues at this point but I think I will try anyway. What the heck, it won't cost much. Swaging an already cast boolit has produced some good shooting boolits. I'll try coating some of those and maybe lubing a PC boolit. Who knows, maybe that will be the best of both systems. I am guilty of looking for a simple approach and have not done all the work that is needed. I still need to do a chamber/throat cast and experiment with different alloys modify my loading dies and make the proper M die. I will find a way to get velocity and accuracy with cast and at this point I don't care which method works. If I have to go paper patch I will but probably not for 22 and 25.
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