Seat & Crimp Separately?

[alamogunr]

I see many statements that members seat their boolets and then crimp. I've never done this but it sounds as if it would give me a better product. I've never seen an explanation that details how this is done.

Do you use the seat and crimp die and just adjust it to seat the boolet first and then back off the seat stem and adjust the die to crimp? Or is a separate crimp die used?

[guicksylver]

Simple answer.. No

The reason being, when using a combination seating die the boolit is pushed further down into the case as the crimp is being formed.

In some extreme cases this could also lead to bulged cases.

By using separate dies, the boolit is first seated and then the crimp is formed.

The Lee crimp die is an excellent, inexpensive product and does its job well by creating a "factory" style crimp
and is fully adjustable.

Hope this helps.

Dan S.

[Jupiter7]

Usually seat and crimp consistency is directly related to brass length when using combo die. I use a separate crimp die for all pistol cartridges.

[357shooter]

For auto loaders that use a taper crimp, crimping as a separate step (in a separate station) after seating helps, the case isn't moving while crimping brass into the lead. Even if it's just a little bit. I find that doing it separately for revolver bullets makes it easier to adjust either seating depth or crimp independently.

As far as the Lee pistol FCD, the crimp that it applies is the same crimp as their seating die applies. What makes it different is the sizing ring that it uses. It's primarily designed for jacketed bullets and can swage down intentionally oversized cast bullets, through the brass. I don't use or recommend one when loading cast bullets.

[sig2009]

Yes. Always seat and crimp in separate dies.

['74 sharps]

On my revolver rounds, I seat & crimp in same operation and have never had any issues.

[Whitespider]

Depends.
Some dies, using some boolits with generous crimp groves, I have no problem doing it as a single step in a single die... others not so much.

[guicksylver]

OK I will show my age.

With most hand gun calibres used today a tapered crimp die used for auto loaders or a rolled crimp used on heavy calibres

with thick cases will probably not show any problems.

BUT try a combination seating , crimping die on a bottle neck cartridge such as a 38-40,44-40 or a 30-30 and

if it is not perfectly adjusted sooner or later you will end up with a collapsed case.

Also if you pull a boolit that has been seated and crimped in a tapered die you will see where the lead has been pushed

ever so slightly forward.

Just saying, best practices are best practices.

Dan S.

[454PB]

I seat and crimp in two separate steps. It has solved many accuracy and chambering problems.

[enfieldphile]

Word Up!

I like the Lee 4-die set, except for the FCD. Die # 3 seats the boolit. In auto pistol, I use a Lee Taper Crimp die. For revolvers, I use a Redding Profile Crimp die.

No one has mentioned press type. A 4-station press is really good for handgun ammo. I have the Lee classic cast (cast iron) 4-die station press. Die 1 resizes & decaps (new primer seated @ first station). Die 2 expands and powder is dropped. Die 3 seats boolit. Die 4 crimps.

The same process can be done on a single-stage press, just slot of die & brass swapping involved!

For auto loaders that use a taper crimp, crimping as a separate step (in a separate station) after seating helps, the case isn't moving while crimping brass into the lead. Even if it's just a little bit. I find that doing it separately for revolver bullets makes it easier to adjust either seating depth or crimp independently.

As far as the Lee pistol FCD, the crimp that it applies is the same crimp as their seating die applies. What makes it different is the sizing ring that it uses. It's primarily designed for jacketed bullets and can swage down intentionally oversized cast bullets, through the brass. I don't use or recommend one when loading cast bullets.

[mdi]

Seating and crimping in two steps is often recommended to new reloaders. Fewer problems and easier to set up. When I was reloading on a single stage I would run an empty case up into the die, run the die down 'till it touches the case, then back off. Then adjust the seating stem. After all the bullets are seated, I just re-adjust the die for crimping; back way of on the seating stem, and run the die down for a crimp. Works this way regardless of taper or roll crimp. Often when a new reloader, without a lot of experience adjusting dies, has problems with bulges or scraping lead (the crimp is being applied against the bullet while it's still moving, crushing/buckling the case), it's just mis-adjusted dies so separating the processes is the easiest solution...

Not a problem if you know how to "fine tune"/adjust the seating and crimping to happen simultaneously...

My solution is a 4 hole turret press with a dedicated profile crimp die in the 4th hole for my revolvers and an RCBS taper crimp die for my semi-autos.

[Maximumbob54]

I no longer try and combine any steps as it's just as easy to do everything one at a time and get better results across the board. I even prefer to deprime first and then clean before sizing instead of combining sizing and depriming.

[alamogunr]

OK! Several have said they crimp separately w/a crimp die. Do reloading manufacturers sell crimp only dies and are they different for taper crimp and roll crimp?

I am aware of the Lee FC dies. I am also aware of recommendations to not use them on handgun ammunition because of possibility of sizing the boolet.

[Ben]

Seating the bullet to the proper depth in one step and following up with a crimp in a separate step now for over 30 yrs.

Ben

[Char-Gar]

The whole purpose of seating and crimping in separate operations is to prevent lead being shaved from the bullet as the crimping case mouth contacts the side of the bullets as it is moving down to it's final resting place.

If matters not if you use two separate dies or adjust a single die as you set out in your original post.

It is OK to seat in crimp in one operation if you are roll crimping into a crimp groove on the bullets as there will be no lead shaved.

Use a taper crimp on auto pistol bullets or any other that does not have a crimp groove.

Use a roll crimp on bullets with a crimp groove.

I have no experience with the LEE FCD, so will just keep my mouth shut on that issue.

If you want to taper crimp you will need to buy a die just for that purpose.

If you want to roll crimp in separate operation, buy another used seating die on ebay as most have crimp rings in them. Just remove the bullet seating stem.

[alamogunr]

I didn't start this thread because I was having a problem. I agree it is somewhat tedious to adjust a seat & crimp die. But, once adjusted(per procedures posted as a result of another question), it does the job for me. I was curious why so many recommended separate operations and what die they used.

[alamogunr]

The whole purpose of seating and crimping in separate operations is to prevent lead being shaved from the bullet as the crimping case mouth contacts the side of the bullets as it is moving down to it's final resting place.

If matters not if you use two separate dies or adjust a single die as you set out in your original post.

It is OK to seat in crimp in one operation if you are roll crimping into a crimp groove on the bullets as there will be no lead shaved.

Use a taper crimp on auto pistol bullets or any other that does not have a crimp groove.

Use a roll crimp on bullets with a crimp groove.

I have no experience with the LEE FCD, so will just keep my mouth shut on that issue.

If you want to taper crimp you will need to buy a die just for that purpose.

If you want to roll crimp in separate operation, buy another used seating die on ebay as most have crimp rings in them. Just remove the bullet seating stem.

This was posted while I was making my last post. This was the information I was looking for. I may try to find a used seat die for one cartridge, as recommended, and try it out.

[blikseme300]

I have bought Hornady and Lee crimp dies as single units. The Lee FCD for rifle works very well but caution when using for auto pistol as it can swage down the boolit.

[jhalcott]

For many years I used a single set of dies to seat the bullets, Then readjust and crimp them in a second step. I purchased another set of dies and STILL crimp in a separate step. It's just the way I do it.

[mj2evans]

Once I started seating and crimping in two steps I stopped bulging 30-30 cases and swearing at myself. In retrospect I cannot see how I ever thought you could do both steps in one die at the same time.