Ruger#1 vs New Win High Wall

[oldred]

The Hi Wall is John Moses' first design. Number 1 Hi Wall, the patent model, is in the Cody Museum and it will have you standing flat footed in awe if you ever get there to take a look at it.

The No. 1 (3) is Bill Ruger's homage to John Moses and a fine tribute.

Have both, shoot both, love both. It's possible to disassemble the Ruger, the Browning (Winchester) not so much.

The original high walls and the newer ones are not to be confused as being the same, actually comparing them is comparing apples and oranges since they share little in common except for the general outline and the model name, they are two COMPLETELY different rifles! The new Browning/Winchester (Jap) rifles are almost as different as the the Ruger, NOTHING internally is the same and there is only a vague similarity on the outside, other than the fact they are both falling block designs they share nothing in common. The older original designs were very simple and very strong rifles and while the new model 1885s are also strong they are not the simple design of the old 1885s and are a completely new and more complex rifle with quite a few small internal parts.

[Crusty Deary Ol'Coot]

Ah yes, the 300 H&H --------------------

Please no one miss understand me here, the cartridge is a fine one and is well proven in many areas.

However, unless I desired to take a trip down memory lane I might choose something other then the, "Super 30."

Again, fine cartridge! But, if I didn't want the better proformance of say the 300 win. mag. or the 300 Weatherby, why not go with another classic cartridge, namely the 30/06 Springfield.

The 300 H&H sits just about middle between the "06" and the 300 Win. Mag. and will save you a fair amount in brass and powder costs, and all the while the 06 will loose you very little to nothing in game taking ability.

Now, one point possibly in the back of your mind is the fact that a single shot rifle in 300 H&H is just a quick trip with a reamer from becoming a 300 Weatherby, and brass for the 300 Weatherby is just a quick trigger pull away from the 300 H&H.

In goes a 300 H&H cartridge to the Weatherby chamber and, bang, out comes a 300 Weatherby case all fire formed and ready to go into your 300 Weatherby sizing die.

So, that would save LOTS of bucks over buying Weatherby brass.

But yet, other then the possible trip down memory lane I might really think about the 06/300win mag options.

Keep em coming!

Crusty Deary Ol'Coot

[Tatume]

Several people have used the term "Jap" in this thread (and others). As the son of a WWII veteran who fought in the Pacific Theater, I grew up understanding this to be a racist epithet. I’m not accusing anybody of anything, just pointing out that the term can be misunderstood by some.

[oldred]

Jap is just short for Japanese so it shouldn't be considered racist, I think "Nip" would be however.

[TCLouis]

True Single Shot Rifles have a Hammer, every time, always.

It is written in stone . . . or at least it should be.

[Crusty Deary Ol'Coot]

Yep, my RUGER #1 has a hammer and it is just where I like it, inside, out of the way, unseen.

CDOC

[montana_charlie]

Jap is just short for Japanese so it shouldn't be considered racist, I think "Nip" would be however.

How far would one want to take this conversation?
Jap is short for Japanese, and Nip is short for Niponese ... as in people from Nippon.
Similarly, Canuk is not intended to insult Canadians and Ozzie is not meant to demean Austrailians as they are just short versions of the 'proper' terms.

Gook, zip, or slopehead would be racial epithets ...

CM

[oldgeezershooter]

Just my two cents. I have two Ruger #1's a Varmit barell 25/06 and a medium sporter in 45/70 and both have outstanding accuracy.
The 25/06 will shoot MOA all day long and the 45/70 is almost there.
All it took was playing with different loads and bullets and boolits, not to mention powders, but I have worked up some dandy loads for both.

[Char-Gar]

I have both and like them. The handling qualities and method of operation is just a matter of personal choice.

My Rugers (No. 1 and No. 3) have been accurate rifles, but the No. 1 does require a little fiddling with to get it to do it's best.

The Japchester does very well right out of the box.

As far as ultimate accuracy goes, I also will give the Japchester the nod by a small degree. I highly suspect it is the quality of the barrels vs. the quality of Ruger barrels.

[Gtek]

Recon to base - over. We have confirmed PC on slope - over. Awaiting orders before engage - over. Gtek

[bigted]

Base to recon...Base to recon...you have a go...i repeat...go go go!!! confirm after action over.

[XTR]

Personally I think the 1885 is just damned gorgeous, so I bought one. You can get a #1 for about 2/3 the price I think.

[oldred]

I always liked the looks of those things too but could not justify the cost of a new one, since I like working with guns as much as shooting them I decided to build my own. The receiver and internals were machined from a block of 4140 HT steel and the barrel is a Green Mountain 2" round blank that I milled to a tapered octagon. The wood came from a local walnut tree that was about to be cut up for firewood but was given to me for the asking. It is chambered in 45/90 with a 32" barrel and weighs 14 1/2 pounds, the pics were taken just prior to bluing. I did some redesign of the trigger group to eliminate the external screws and pins that hold the trigger assembly and sear, this was done to give a cleaner exterior of the receiver and to provide for trigger adjustment.

[Crusty Deary Ol'Coot]

Eeeeeeeeeeyooooooow,

Dat do be nice!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

CDOC

[50-170-700 sharps]

WOW! That is one sharp looking rig oldred!

[williamwaco]

To me this would be a great "one gun" rifle if I were ever forced into such an ungodly situation.

Perhaps I misread your meaning here but I think you are asking about a"SHTF" rifle.

If that happens, the LAST thing you want is a belted case. You need something that can be made from readily available ( military ) cases.

For that purpose I would not consider anything that could not be made from the .30-06 case.


But, If I misread your meaning, go with the Winchester ( or Browning) - ( Same gun ).

I have owned six ( 6 ) - yes six Ruger No. One rifles. NONE of them could be counted on to beat 3 MOA.

I have owned 2 Winchester 1885's and both will average 1.5 MOA with cast bullets and an occasional one half MOA "teaser".



Note that in both cases, I am talking about "out of the box accuracy." If you want to tinker with it then choose the one that calls out to you.





Merry Christmas.



.

[pilot]

Oldred, I'm in awe.

[BruceB]

Interesting thread.

I have (and really enjoy) two #1 rifles at this time. Several others have come-and-gone over the last few decades.

All these #1s gave at least usable accuracy, and weren't sold due to failures to perform.

The newest one here is in .303 British, and is too new for a fair evaluation. The other is a #1H in .416 Rigby. It will group TEN RCBS 416-350s under an inch at 100 yards, running at over 2000 fps. This performance comes with just a 4X Leupold and retirement-age eyes....what's NOT to like?

I find the high-wall rifle to be butt-ugly, compared to either the #1 or its little brother, the low-wall. "Life's too short to shoot ugly guns!" Strictly due to its appearance, there won't be any of this type in my racks. Is this a too-feeble excuse? I appreciate the design's sterling qualities, but just can't get past the clunky appearance (in MY eyes, at least).

Oh well....differences of opinion make horse races...

[Crusty Deary Ol'Coot]

BruceB, guess I come down with you as per the shootability of the #1.

I may bed and float the forarm of my #1s, I do the same to other hunting rifles, any brand any type, but never have I come anywhere close, even remotely close to the experience that WilliamWaco talks about with the #1.

I haven't been forced to bed and float to get the rifles to shoot well, I bed and float because I come down hard on consistance of point of impact on hunting bolt actions, single shots or whatever. I don't do the potential problems of wood to metal contact on hunting rifles. I Just don't go there!

My first - late 60s - early 70s - was a 7 Rem Mag and it, like everyone since, has been a good shooter.

Now if William's experience is that he picked up some factory loads and his rifle didn't like them, well OK I understand. Otherwise, I don't want to ride an airplane with William, cause he is one unlucky dude!

However, each and everyone of my RUGER single shots have been hand loaded for, the loads worked up for that rifle. That is what I do with center fire rifles, be they RUGERS or another brand, and no matter what the action type.

Maybe I have just been lucky, but that 7 Rem mag was a long time ago and as said, everyone since was a good shooter.

Personally I don't have any issues with the high wall, other then I don't like exposed hammers on game hunting rifles. Would be great to have one for a varmit/ground critter/wolf rifle, but for hunting, make my rifle hammerless.

Keep em coming!

Crusty Deary Ol'Coot

[bigted]

wowww ...thought i just read that somebody does not like the flowing lines of the winchester/browning hiwall in any of its sexy configurations...had to be a miss-print tho as im sure that there is nobody that would actually put in print that they dont like the hiwall look with the flowing lines that make it one of the classics' of all time!...lol just pullin yer leg bruceb.

bet you cant tell what rifle is dear to me huh? some fall hopeless over the sharps...some a snazzy boltgun...myself it has always been the winchester origanal hiwall that does it for me...i have 4 of the new ones and i will bring home an origanal when i find what im looking for. have been in love with the hiwall since a boy so i always go goo-gaa over a nicely built anything that resembles a hiwall...yep even the jap-chesters...i doubt you will have anything that recoils any harder then the 45-120 i had in a lite barely 8 lbs rifle either and i shot this with the deep curved butt-plate and i tought me the importance of allowing the curve to grace my arm not my shoulder.

back to the origanal question...HIWALL OR RUGER...whichever gun feels best and looks rite to ya will serve you for a very long time to come and will definetly do all the accuracy that you want to squeeze into it.

have fun with your choice and post your results here as i for one will want to read your experiences and choice and why.

as for the belted case thing...i wouldnt have it any other way either...either belted or rimmed as this gives a firm place to chamber to and the 375 ruger tought me the importance of a good belt or rim to properly chamber to. ran a case neck too far on 50 cases and almost every one miss-fired due to the primer being too far away from the pin. dont have that to worrie with when i meet ol grizz in a tight spot any more...all have a rim or belt to chamber against so that primer stays rite where is is spose to be.

that 300 h&h will serve you well and im confident the rifle you wrap around it will do the same.