38-55 BP primers?

[Hogpost]

I've always used Magnum primers for BP: 44-40, 45-70, 11mm Dutch, etc. Consistent, clean, and what "all the pros" recommend. Now I want to do 38-55 (in a Win 94 Legacy) for both target & pig hunting, but have heard this caliber & smaller do better with regular primers. Something about primer power kicking the bullet out of the case before full powder ignition. Even been suggested to use pistol primers, but that seems for uncrimped single-shots. Anybody have experience in this area?

[Don McDowell]

If you're shooting blackpowder try some large pistol primers. They work a bunch better than magnum rifle primers.

[NickSS]

I have been loading a 38-55 for both lever action and single shots for several years now and have only used plain large rifle primers with excellent results. Some of my buddies have gone to pistol primers with good results and I have been thinking of doing so but my C Sharps high wall shoots so well with the load I have that I have been reluctant to try something different.

[August]

I only use large pistol primers. After chronographing loads with different primers, it was clear that the pistol primers yield a much more consistent result than do rifle primers.

Black powder is much easier to ignite than smokeless powder, thus magnum primers are NEVER required in black powder loading.

[John Boy]

To reduce the brisance on ignition of black powder, use a primer with the lowest energy flash ... http://www.castingstuff.com/primer_t..._reference.htm

[Hogpost]

Cheese Louise, now I'm really confused! The BigBoys of BPCR Silhouette (Mike Venturino, Steve Garbe, etc) are all very strong on the need to use magnum primers for consistency in large BP cartridges. While BP does not REQUIRE powerful ignition, they insist they get better consistency and those 500-yard/MOA BPCR boys are tougher nitpickers than my grandma. It's always worked for me (nuthin' but Swiss FFFG, minimal compression) even in 44-40. Some of you guys are telling me the absolute opposite; but you've also got decades of experience more than me. At least everyone seems to agree on non-Mag for 38-55.

Looks like I have some experimentation on my own to do: I don't want to fiddle with pistol primers in rifle primer pockets, so I think I'll break out the old chrony and look for the most consistent (and weakest?) standard rifle primers; and maybe try some thin over-primer wads. So, I've got some primer borrowin/swappin to do with my buddies, and a whole bunch of careful comparative loading & shooting to do...

Thanks, guys! You've made this project more fun! I love this site!

[oksmle]

I used large pistol primers mainly because of the sometimes light hammer strike of the old, original BP rifles I was shooting. Never had a hangfire, or failure to fire with the LP primers. Then when I began shooting the modern stuff I simply stayed with what was already working. What August stated about the consistancy at the chronograph is the same as my experience.

[Gunlaker]

Cheese Louise, now I'm really confused! The BigBoys of BPCR Silhouette (Mike Venturino, Steve Garbe, etc) are all very strong on the need to use magnum primers for consistency in large BP cartridges.

Magnum primers used to be the hot ticket. Now standard or pistol primers are the thing.

Personally I do find better results with mag primers in the .45-70 for uncompressed Goex loads. But my best loads are std match primers with compressed loads.

But then I've only been doing this for a few years.

Chris.

[August]

Steve Garbe and Mike Venturino are avid competitors. Do you really think they're going to tell you straight and then have to fend you off at a major match three years from now? I don't think so.

[NickSS]

Actually the conventional wisdom when I started shooting BPCR over 20 years ago was to use magnum primers with GOEX Powder that was only lightly compressed. More recent developments is to more heavily compress the powder and use pistol primers and even paper wads between the primer and the powder to cut down on the flash even more. I have experimented and have found that you can get good accurate loads with almost any combo and it takes a really good shooter to tell which is best for himself. Me because of physical problems do not shoot anywhere near as good as I did even 10 years ago and probably never will in this life but I do try out new ideas I read about and if I get good results I keep that and if not I discard it. One of the joys of BPCR is that you can get there in any number of ways.

[Don McDowell]

WEll said Nick. There's an awful lot of urban myth floating about on what's good and what's not in bpcr. But in the end it exactly like you just laid it out.

[Boz330]

Magnum primers used to be the hot ticket. Now standard or pistol primers are the thing.

Personally I do find better results with mag primers in the .45-70 for uncompressed Goex loads. But my best loads are std match primers with compressed loads.

But then I've only been doing this for a few years.

Chris.

Mike and Steve's book is a good primer but it was written 20 years ago.

Bob

[herbert buckland]

Even in the large 577-450 case with no powder compresion other than compresing the filler on top of the powder ,I have noticed a improvment in acuracy by changing from magnum primers to large pistol primers

[Hogpost]

Well, you guys are right, as expected. Tried magnum primers and standard rifle primers in 38-55: big difference in consistency: the highest velocity came from the magnums, but round-to-round velocity varied a whole lot more than with the standard rifles. Still don't want to diddle with pistol primers in rifle pockets, but am going to try some thin over-primer wads just to see if they help. Thanks!

[August]

Well, you guys are right, as expected. Tried magnum primers and standard rifle primers in 38-55: big difference in consistency: the highest velocity came from the magnums, but round-to-round velocity varied a whole lot more than with the standard rifles. Still don't want to diddle with pistol primers in rifle pockets, but am going to try some thin over-primer wads just to see if they help. Thanks!

You can lead a horse to water ...

[tom threepersons]

In my 45-110 B/P Ctg loading. I place a single over primer wad cut from a phone book "Yellow Page". This seems to reduce the flash to the Berdan levels used in the old days. It works well in the Sharps. Yes you can lead a horse to water, but they are damn hard to drown.

[Don McDowell]

No diddling needed with the pistol primers just seat and go.
Using a wad over the flashhole now there's some serious diddlin goin on...

[Jon K]

Well said August............

Jon

[Gunlaker]

Well, you guys are right, as expected. Tried magnum primers and standard rifle primers in 38-55: big difference in consistency: the highest velocity came from the magnums, but round-to-round velocity varied a whole lot more than with the standard rifles. Still don't want to diddle with pistol primers in rifle pockets, but am going to try some thin over-primer wads just to see if they help. Thanks!

The pistol primers are the same diameter as rifle primers. They are a tad shorter though. Pressues in bp rifles are less than that found in many modern pistols so there won't be any issues there either.

If the height difference bothers you, put a newspaper wad between the primer and the primer pocket.

Chris.

[Hogpost]

I've zero experience with pistol primers in rifle pockets, so only have all the published horror-warnings about set-back and damaged breechblock faces & etc. to go on. Sounds like you experienced guys are telling me not to worry about all that for BP, so I'll take your advice and try it. (Well, that's what forums are for...; thanks!)

And I read or heard somewhere about placing a thin paper sheet between the primer and the case when seating the primer, so the primer cuts it's own wad and the wad is not loose at the bottom of the case. Makes sense, but again I have zip experience here. If/when I get to diddling with overprimer wads, does that ring a bell with anyone?