My 1st experience with triple 7

[roaddog1m]

I live in South Dakota and finding the Holy Black is nearly impossible. I have a buddy that's going to split a case with me when he gets down to Nebraska but for now, I decided to try Triple 7. I've used Pyrodex and don't have a lot of good things to say about it.
I did a little reading and although there isn't a ton of available data out there, (not the most net savvy guy in the world) I settled on 50grains by weight pushing my 405grain bullet out of a roller I recently bought. (I don't know a lot about rollers or BPCR except what I've recently read) I had cast some 22BHN 405's (actually 388) and used Liq alox as lube.
When I first got it home, I loaded some rounds up with 42.5 grains of Varget and got 1435 fps on average out of them. I had trouble finding a place to get 200yds because of snow but finally found a spot and set up over the hood of my patrol vehicle (sand bagged). (Yep, we can do that out here) I set my chrono on the other side and shot a nice 6" group of five shots @ 200yds. I wrote down the load and sight settings for 100 and 200yds. The more I read however, the more I wanted to make the switch over to BP.
I checked all over the damn state and couldn't find any of the real thing. I had some Pyrodex left over but wasn't willing to waste my time on it. (the pellets are cr@p too)
Back to the Triple 7. I made up some bullet lube out of 50/50 bees wax and olive oil (cuz that's what I had here available) and pan lubed some of my 405's. I loaded them on top of 50gr by weight and a card wad that I made out of a cereal box using a 45 ACP case as my cutter. I put together 12 rounds and loaded my 44cal Navy with a light load of 15gr by weight.
I went out today and shot them over the chrono. The 45-70 clocked 1425fps and the 44 came in at 505fps.
I just shot off hand at 100yds but ended up with a seven inch group. I was pretty happy considering I wasn't trying all that hard.
I shot the revolver at a 7yd target and clover leafed them all. It was a very light load with almost no recoil.

Over all, my impression of Triple Seven is very good! Clean up was a snap! Can't wait to get the real stuff in there!!!

Tom

[Swede44mag]

I bought Pyrodex RS on sale if I could afford it I would only use the 777 in everything but the flintlock. I don't care for their pellets though.

Sounds like you are having fun Keep it up.

[Don McDowell]

I live in South Dakota and finding the Holy Black is nearly impossible. I have a buddy that's going to split a case with me when he gets down to Nebraska ! Can't wait to get the real stuff in there!!!

Tom

Enough with the excuses.
http://www.grafs.com/retail/catalog/...ategoryId/3501, they'll ship you 1 lb if that's what you want.

https://www.powderinc.com/cgi-bin/bp...ER_ID=!ORDERID! Ships in 5-50 lb lots

[littlejack]

Come'on Don. Cut um some slack.
Jack

[Don McDowell]

I did , could of left em links to places that will only ship full case lots.

[Patman]

While I was waiting delivery of my Sharps a couple of years ago, I witnessed a good friend touch off some rounds loaded with triple 7 out of his Sharps, caliber 45-120. After watching him get pummeled after only 3 rounds I decided right then and there that I would only shoot real blackpowder from my Sharps when it arrived. My only regret right now is that I didn't get over the eyewash effect of the size of the 45-120. Next time it will be in a more friendly 45-70.As for my friend, he went home and pulled his other rounds apart .

[roaddog1m]

Thanks Don, I'm waiting now for confirmation that my buddy is picking up a case and splitting it with me.

Patman: 777 is a bit more powerful than BP and you can't pack a 45-120 case full of that stuff and expect not to get thumped. (unless hunting Rhinos, then you want to get thumped) I think I read 15% less and make sure you are comparing apples to apples as far as loads measured by volume or weight. I'm still learning myself but starting out on the other end of the spectrum. I like the 777 but I will be switching over to the real stuff as soon as it gets here.

[Kraschenbirn]

At one time, I considered giving 777 a try...over-the-counter BP is as difficult to find in IL as in SD...but was put off by the "not for cartridge reloading" warning on the label. Has Hodgen's changed their mind or is it the general opinion that the warning just another CYA for product liability?

(Thinking about it again 'cause I'm down to my last pound of Goex Ffg and won't be passing anywhere close to Graf's anytime soon.)

Bill

[Don McDowell]

So what's the big attraction to the fake smoke? If you don't have the gumption to put in an order with one of the several suppliers that will ship blackpowder to your home addy, why not just shoot smokeless? There's no shortage of smokeless loads that develop less pressure and better accuracy than 777 and the other fakes, and you don't have to put up with the billowing clouds of white smoke.

[roaddog1m]

I'm pretty new to the BP scene actually. I've been handloading since 1990 unless you count the years camped out beside my Dad as he loaded shotgun shells on his old Herters press. Those days, my job as to use a black magic marker and write "6" or "BB" on the brass somewhere.

Since then, I started loading myself for pistol and rifle. I competed in IPSC and shot over a thousand rounds a week preparing for the Nationals. I've even won a few guns along the way. Spent 8yrs in the military, 11yrs in LE, been divorced twice, hit by a car, shot at, had several people try to stab me and I've shot and killed in the line of duty. I've lost count years ago of how many fights I've been in just on duty alone. I'm still in LE and work on an Indian reservation. I'm not new to guns or shooting or seeing dead people for that matter. I am however new to BPCR's and find it intriguing that so many people seethe hatred towards a black powder substitute and talk down to someone whom they don't know because he admits that he's testing it in a rifle. Very interesting. Thanks to anyone who responded without sarcasm.

side note:
My Dad passed on last spring and I took his old Herters press (that's older than me) and put it to use along side my two Dillons and two Rock Chuckers.

[cajun shooter]

Roaddog1m, It might seem to you as a newbie to our forum that Don was a little gruff with his answer. I myself am ex- military 4th ID 65-67, former cop who lost two riding partners in line of duty and have been shot, cut, and beaten. I suggest that you stay around long enough to see what is going on. With your life encounters you should know that it is not good to have a rush to judgement before gathering all your info. Don, is one of the nicest guys on the forum but he and I even bumped heads once. We both were man enough to work it out and I consider him a friend. Don, is the same as I am. We both have a heavy dedication to the sport of black powder shooting. We have on average 3 newbies every few weeks or more that come to this forum and ask for a load for one of the BP subs and every single one of them give the same answer. I can't find BP in my area. This is not 1903. You may purchase BP from several online sources that will ship any amount you wish to buy. The more you buy the better the price. Our world is in the drive thru mode and if they can't do that then they say they can't buy it. To us who are truly dedicated to the sport it is aggravating that people say they want to shoot BP but will not put out any effort to do it. We have a huge sticky section that is loaded with information but every week a newbie will say what is the best powder and load for my 45-70? They are so lazy they want you to do all the work and hand it to them. You will lose respect fast by not putting some effort in. You should know how it is if you have a cop who sits on his butt and expects every one else to do his work. There is a man on the SASS forum that has written a few books about shooting the BP subs and yet calls himself a BP shooter. I asked him why he didn't shoot the real powder and chose to shoot the subs. His answer was that he lived in Houston and the closet store with BP was 20 miles away. That is crazy as I drive 5 hours round trip or have Fed-Ex come to my house. If you want to shoot BP then you can. Have you ever taken a call because no other units would respond and then see one on your way sitting on his butt. This is in that same area. If you want to shoot subs then that is fine but don't make up lame excuses. We want our sport to grow and continue after we are gone. Welcome to the forum and thanks for your Service. Later David AKA Fairshake

[Don McDowell]

There's no sarcasm intended.
The old arquement "I can't get powder locally" is bogus and has been for more than 10 years, it's old and been hashed out on all the internet boards for ever.
I do not understand the attraction to the fake stuff. Regular smokeless is the same price as the fake stuff, only if you go with something like sr 4759 or 4227 you can get twice as many round per pound as you can with the fake stuff, and really don't have to worry about clean up. The fake stuff will attack your brass so cleaning up the brass is necessary, and you need to get the fouling out of the barrel so you use water and then have to oil the gun... I'm not seeing any advantage over black there either....Have never seen anybody win a match anywhere using the fake stuff when going head to head with shooters using either smokeless or black, another good reason to pass it by.
The fake stuff at 21 or so apound is higher than you can get a 5lb order of Goex sent to your door from Powder Inc.

[Don McDowell]

As a LEO is South Dakota, I would of thought you would of had contact with the 1/2 dozen or so State Troopers that shoot black powder at matches all over this part of the country, not to mention the two or three matches they throw every year at Winner.

[Bullshop]

There are exceptions in getting powder of any kind shipped TYD as in here in Ak. I have tried most everyone on the net and cant find a way to get it done.
I will say though that if I was in SD I bet I would have a good stash of BP put up.

[roaddog1m]

I guess I'll start off by saying that I wasn't asking for a load or advise. Just stating what results I had gotten using 777 ffg in my 45-70 and in my Navy. I didn't ask where to get BP as I had a retired trooper who does shoot BP matches going down to pick us up and split a case with me. I simply bought a lb of 777 and tested it in the mean time and posted the results of my 1st tests. I didn't ask for anything Don and I'm sure that you get tired of "newby's" getting into "your" sport all the time. Maybe you should take a look at your own signature block before you go flame some guy you don't even know.
Call me crazy but in this day and age, I don't think I want to add my name to some potential government list of people who can't fly because they ordered over ten lbs of black powder.

In every fish bowl, no matter how small (even if it's just an internet forum) there's a goldfish swimming around thinking that he's a shark.

I'm out!

[Don McDowell]

Well as I said , there is/was no sarcasm intended.
You were the one that made the claim twice in one post that you couldn't find any blackpowder and didn't know anyplace to get any other than what your buddy might be able to find in Nebraska.
As to your statement about "and I'm sure that you get tired of "newby's" getting into "your" sport all the time." It's just flat wrong.
Next time you see Mr. Dupree tell him I said hello.

[nwellons]

I was having a hard time finding BP in Georgia until I discovered the local Bass Pro Shops store is stocking Goex. Got two cans of FFG about 3 weeks ago for my .42 Berdan and .43 Egyptian rifles.

[stubshaft]

Can't get it in Hawaii either. I have only 3 lbs of 3F left and have taken to using it as a priming charge under T7 in my 50 flintlock. If I could get it, it would be all that I shoot.

[Patman]

roaddog1m... I'm not looking down on anyone who wants to experiment with a sub, my decision on shooting only the real stuff was based entirely on what I witnessed when my friend pulled the trigger on his. Tears can ruin a fella don't ya know?

[The Double D]

South Dakota....how far are you from Miles City Montana? There is a GOEX distributor there.

If you root around on the Hodgdon website long enough you might find my picture with the Kudu I took in South Africa using 777. It shoots good and gives plenty of energy. I wouldn't put another grain of it in a brass case or rifle I own ever again.

T-7 contains potassium perchlorate, the same stuff that is in Corrosive primers, that we all avoid.

That stuff eats brass. Here is my brass that shot nothing but T-7. This is Martini brass, $5 a case when I bought it. Babied that brass. Kept it cleaned and shiney polished. Put it away in storage for 2 years while I was overseas. When I took it out this is what it looked like.



Sorry for sharing my experience with you since you didn't ask.

Bad habit, after almost forty years shooting the various popular shooting competitions of the day, reloading thousands a of rounds, 32 years in law enforcement, 16 years on the street, tons of fights-always finished 2nd, nobody finished first in those things-, being shot at, stabbed-ain't true body armor won't stop a knife, firing 5 shots at a guy who was shooting at me-glad now I missed- I am always willing to share my experiences and seek out and listen to those who know more than me.