Lead pot care.

[Cane_man]

so you can just leave your pot 1/2 full of lead and let it cool until next time?

[detox]

My new RCBS Pro Melt furnace instructions say to never run pot below two inches from bottom.

My Wheelweight aloy is very dirty. I am getting verygood fill except where impurities are (this causes a small void at dirt partical it seems). It is more difficult for me to cast small bullets with bottom pour pot and dirty lead. I find it lots easier using my cleaner 20/1 lead tin mix.

[454PB]

I've done it both ways. Like 44Man said, I change alloys a lot, so I usually dump the bottom of the pot into an ingot mould using the method he described. If I plan to use the same alloy next time, I leave an inch or so in the bottom.

Leaving some alloy in the pot does reduce melt time, but emptying it does no harm. My oldest Lee pot (I have 3) is going on 40 years old. My pots get "cleaned" about every 2 years, and that is mainly focused on cleaning the metering rod and valve seat.

[popper]

Don't know who started that rumor about everything but lead floats to the top. Doesn't work for me. I dump the pot as I don't know exactly what alloy I will be using next.

[Case Stuffer]

Perhaps I should have posted everything but lead floats to the top if..............

First off casting and smeltering are two different operations. Noting should go into a bottom pour poy but clean well fluxed alloy.

Back 30 plus years ago I did my own smeltering using CoWW ,berm range lead, indoor rang lead and Lino and Momo type. I used a custom made bottom pour pot fired with a gas water heater burner propane fueled from my 250 gallon propan tank.
My ingots were super clean and my casting pot needed very little fluxing. Now I do very little casting , I use 2-6-92 from a commerical bullet caster and recently have been adding 1/3 by weight CCWW ingots purhased from a member here.

Tin ends up on the very top and a few have been known to skim it offand discard it. many flux with wax, parifin , bees wax ,bullet lube while smelting and while casting. If that works for them fine but I belong to the wax is not flux camp. I will turn 68 in a couple of months and this is old dog is not going to relearn how to cast. What worked for me years ago is still working fine now and my guess I will not be casting all that many more years anyway.

To empty or not to empty.

Price a RCBS Pro Melt and then read the directions for adding alloy to it for the first time. IMO if you empty it you need to follow first start instructions.

[Cane_man]

^^^ does that mean you are in the camp for leaving the lead in the pot to cool?

[detox]

Case Stuffer, What do you use to flux?

[jdam169]

My pot is a very old lee probably from the 80's that I got from a friends dad who wasn't using it anymore. It leaked like crazy so I emptied it out to see what was going on. Rust and crud was all on the bottom and sides. I decided to put it in the blast cabinet and it cleaned up like new. I then polished the end of the rod with 600 grit sandpaper that goes in the bottom of the pot. No leaks anymore.

[geargnasher]

Anybody notice, way back in the thread, that Case Stuffer said the only cleaning he did was to scrape the SIDES of the pot with a stick and to "flux"? The important part to note here is he uses CLEAN ingots only in the casting pot, and doesn't scrape the BOTTOM of the pot with his stick. If you do both of those things, you will not have dust/dirt/junk/oxides building up under your melt.

It probably doesn't matter a whole lot if you leave lead in there or not, although I tend to think that the liner takes more of a beating over time if you start with it packed full of ingots and air vs. leaving some lead up to at least the level of the heating elements. The other thing about starting empty each time is there's a bett er likelyhood of oxide skin from the ingots getting trapped under the melt. Once stuff is trapped under the surface tension and weight of the metal it's a bear to get it back to the top. Stuff above the surface on the bottom, in the melt, will rise to the top eventually if it's lighter than the alloy.

Gear

[detox]

From Mr. Fryxell's ebook:

Cleaning the Lead Pot - I’ve heard of just about every method imaginable for cleaning lead pots -- wire-brushes, electric drills, cold chisels, scrapers, even sand-blasting. By far the easiest and best way to clean out the residues that eventually accumulate is with hot water. Take a cup of near boiling water, pour it into the room temperature pot (it should be obvious that you DON’T do this with a hot pot!), let it stand for a minute or two (stirring occasionally), then drain it out. Your pot (and pour spout) will come out remarkably clean. A word of caution: don’t try to heat the water by putting a cup of cold water in a cold pot and then turning the pot on. It takes a while to heat the water to its boiling point, and by the time the water approaches boiling, the heating element has gotten MUCH hotter. The water will go from warm and steaming slightly, to Mt. St. Helens in a matter of seconds. Bad idea…..

[detox]

Case Stuffer, What do you use to flux?

I think i found answer

Tried something different fluxing yesterday.

I was walking thru my woods yesterday and due to a lot of recent high winds there were a great many small pine twigs on the ground. I picked up a few that were about pencil size ,chopped of the ends (neddles) and used these to stir / flux the pot. Upon inserting their ends to near the bottom of the molten lead I could hear and feel the outgassing and there was a nice light yellow smoke from the surface. Worked great and this was the easiest I have flux a casting pot ever.

[Dumasron]

Re: cleaning the bottom spout.
I take a piece of bailing wire about 3 inches long and bend it into a horseshoe shape. Holding one side of the shoe I poke the other side into the spout from the bottom. This normally clears out the trash and allows it to float up into the melt.

[Case Stuffer]

Thanks Gear for explaining my finding in very plain language.

detox I have used pine rosin as a fluxing agent for years but yes just tried the fresh pine twigs recently and they work great and are free. Really prime rosin flux goes for like $8 for two fluid ounces.

When I was younger and cut and heated with wood I used pine lighter as a flux but then it was free except for the fact that others were willing to pay a fair amount of money for it.

Does anyone who cast perhaps also do any electrical soldering?

[JWFilips]

Anybody notice, way back in the thread, that Case Stuffer said the only cleaning he did was to scrape the SIDES of the pot with a stick and to "flux"? The important part to note here is he uses CLEAN ingots only in the casting pot, and doesn't scrape the BOTTOM of the pot with his stick. If you do both of those things, you will not have dust/dirt/junk/oxides building up under your melt.

It probably doesn't matter a whole lot if you leave lead in there or not, although I tend to think that the liner takes more of a beating over time if you start with it packed full of ingots and air vs. leaving some lead up to at least the level of the heating elements. The other thing about starting empty each time is there's a bett er likelyhood of oxide skin from the ingots getting trapped under the melt. Once stuff is trapped under the surface tension and weight of the metal it's a bear to get it back to the top. Stuff above the surface on the bottom, in the melt, will rise to the top eventually if it's lighter than the alloy.

Gear

So Gear, If I get my pot clean ( once again ) and start out with hopefully clean alloy ( I may just smelt all my stuff again for the 3rd time during this week) ...clean alloy in a clean pot...... melt comes up to temp flux ( beewax) & stir ( But don't touch or scrape the bottom of my pot ( & I have switched to metal spoons exclusively not charred sticks) I may have a good chance of getting clean bullets out of my bottom pour pot? I'm trying to stick to the stuff you told me.

However for a new caster...... man all you guys have the greatest information but many times it sure sounds contradictory to a nubee. Use a stick / don't use a stick , Use sawdust/ don't use saw dust This is really like boot camp & I'm sure you guys are training me well because in the past month & a half I think I've used everyones suggestions ( Some more then once)
I do know one thing out of all this I'm coming up with my own style that seems to be working well. I do get about 45% good out of a casting session ( If I only can keep the crud out of the boolits) What I have cast good shoot really well so I'm not giving up

[cbrick]

So Gear, If I get my pot clean (once again) and start out with hopefully clean alloy (I may just smelt all my stuff again for the 3rd time during this week) ...clean alloy in a clean pot...... melt comes up to temp flux (beewax) & stir (But don't touch or scrape the bottom of my pot (& I have switched to metal spoons exclusively not charred sticks) I may have a good chance of getting clean bullets out of my bottom pour pot? I'm trying to stick to the stuff you told me.

The wax WILL NOT flux, use sawdust. Save beeswax for bullet lube.

Use a stick/ don't use a stick, Use sawdust/ don't use saw dust.

This really isn't rocket science. Use sawdust, it is a flux, it will do everything you need a boolit alloy flux to do. I know many here swear by using a wood stick to stir but I never do because it adds charred wood under the surface of the alloy.

Rick

[41 mag fan]

The wax WILL NOT flux, use sawdust. Save beeswax for bullet lube.

At first i used sawdust, from my mitersaw. Just wasn't real happy with how it was fluxing. Goodsteel posted about using pine pet bedding in a different thread. I myself, found this to work much better.



This really isn't rocket science. Use sawdust, it is a flux, it will do everything you need a boolit alloy flux to do. I know many here swear by using a wood stick to stir but I never do because it adds charred wood under the surface of the alloy.

Rick

Almost sounds contradictory there Rick. If you use sawdust you're going to get it below the surface of the melt, and it'll be charred wood same as a wooden stick. Except the wooden stick will be whole, whereas the sawdust is free particles floating around. Only thing is if the wooden stick breaks from being charred, but then it's still whole in part so it'll float to the top quicker the particles of sawdust will.

Last few days I've been experimenting with flux, wooden spoon, and metal tablespoon. Just wasn't happy with my findings, went back to candle wax, and was not happy at all with it. Finally I found what works really good for me. Using pine pet bedding from Walmart, and a ladle style spoon that has holes in it, I push the bedding down into the melt, stirring, repeat, stir, repeat. Finally my melt came out how I wanted it, skimmed off the dirt and gunk, and used the spoon to help any trapped sediments come to the top. Worked good and I came up with a routine now that works for me.

[cbrick]

No contradiction at all. Sawdust is actually a bit difficult to get under the surface and I do nothing to attempt to get it under the surface. I stir the melt with a slotted stainless spoon from the bottom up to bring as much alloy as practical up to the surface and in contact with the charred sawdust.

Rick

[geargnasher]

Yup, you aren't going to get sawdust below the surface unless you force it down there, such as trapping it on the end of an ingot that you poke through it to the bottom, or taking a dirty spoon with sticky wax on it, and poke it through a layer of sawdust and carry it to the bottom with the spoon. That's a good way to cause a steam explosion, by the way, if your sawdust is the least bit damp.

Now, I scrape the sides of my pot with a stick. I don't always cast with the cleanest alloy I can make, and with near-pure lead I get yellow powder on the sides of the pot from the lead oxidizing like bathtub rings as I cast. A pine stick, being made of solid flux, is an excellent tool to rub against the sides of the pot. As the stick begins to char from being in contact with the hot metal, it reverts the oxides back to clean lead and cleans all the "Klingons" of dross off the sides of the pot when the level goes down.

Stirring through the melt with a stick actually fluxes below the surface, and the resulting crud floats to the top as long as you don't scratch around on the bottom.

This really is very simple: Use wood to flux and reduce oxides, how you do this is a matter of preference and happenstance. Don't put dirty stuff in the pot, and don't force dirty stuff under the melt at the bottom. That's it.

Gear