New Soft-Pointing Tool

[HollowPoint]

I finally did it!

I should say, I finally got the time to do it.

In one of my other "Special Projects" posts I started a thread called "Adjustable Hollow Point Re-Hash."
I won't bore you with the details of that post but, at the tail end of it I mentioned the following idea I was working on.

In my quest/obsession for finding a way to cast the perfect Soft-Pointed Hunting Hollow-Point Bullet, I believe I've come up with an idea that will allow me to cast Soft-Points at the same casting rate/speed as I now cast.

If it pans out for me, this same little gizmo will allow me to use it for most of the calibers I now cast. That is .30 cal, 44 cal, 45 cal. (maybe even my 22 caliber mold but, don't know for sure yet)

There are already ways of casting Soft-Points but, they take alot of time to cast just a few bullets. I've tried one of these casting techniques and I can attest to the fact that it really works. Again; it just takes alot of time for not alot of bullets.

I'd rather be shooting Soft-Points than casting Soft-Points.

Will my little invention actually work? I have no idea. I haven't even tried it out yet. I only recently finished putting it all together.
It looks like it might work.
I'm waiting for my order to pure lead to arrive. Hopefully it will get here before next weekend so I can give it a whirl.

I fully expect that if it actually works at all, it will need some tweeking here and there to get it to put out the type of Soft-Points I've been obsessing over.

I'll stop right here and let the images I've provided speak for themselves.

Let the Nay-Saying Begin.

[EMC45]

Very cool! How do you fill that rascal?

[HollowPoint]

You fill it by simply dipping it into your melting pot. One syringe goes into the soft alloy and one goes into the hard alloy.

Just let it heat up to the same temperature as your molten lead.

The molten lead of two different hardness levels fills the reservoirs and is held there till you place the syringes over your pre-heated mold and press the lever to dispense your Soft-Point alloy then immediatly after you do the same with the harder alloy.

It has to be done quickly or your alloy will solidify in the syringe reservoirs.

The one component I didn't include in these pictures is a separate smaller pot (in my case, a very small tin can set inside the melting pot) that holds the softer alloy for the tips of your bullets.

The same temperature that melts your hard alloy for the tail end of your bullets also melts your soft lead that makes up the points of your bullets. They are just kept separate from each other via the walls of the tin can.

It's not complicated. I'm afraid that it sounds more complicated than it really is.

Thanks for your compliment.

HollowPoint

[Charlie Sometimes]

I need to see pictures of it in action!
I followed your other thread, and now this one.
VERY interesting ideas- Great work, and thinking on both!

I think I like the adjustable HP better, though.
I am wondering if the separated alloys will bond okay, not come apart later during firing or impact, and not mix too much in a liquid state when injected into the mold.

I guess I'll see when you get that far, huh?

Good luck!

[HollowPoint]

I couldn't wait for my order of pure lead to arrive.
I had to try it out.
I just had to.

The first time I pulled my Soft-Pointing tool out of the melting pot, positioned it over my bullet mold and pushed the lever, I got exactly what I was hoping for. A smooth trickle of molten lead going right down into the mold.

I was so happy that I didn't realize that I had pushed the wrong lever and dumped the hard alloy into my mold first.

Oh well, it didn't matter cause it was just a test.

I set the tool back into the melting pot for the next trial run. This time I pushed the correct lever but got nothing. The lead had solidified before it even made it out of the spout.

Thought maybe it was just plugged up or something so I tried it again after confirming that it wasn't plugged. Still nothing.

The deeper Hard-Alloy Syringe was flowing real well but the shallower Soft-Alloy side would harden before it made it out of the tool.

After looking it over I decided to remove the adjustable slides from both syringes. The Slide on the Hard-Alloy side wasn't critical anyway and the Slide on the Soft-Alloy side appeared to be what was causing the problems.

I figured it wasn't allowing enough molten lead in the reservoir to maintain its molten state.

This time I got a slight trickle from the shallower Soft-Alloy syringe but, just enough to get my hopes up; not enough to actually work as intended.

It looked as though the tool itself, along with the molten lead in the reservoirs did not have enough mass to retain enough heat to keep the alloys liquid long enough to pour into my mold.

DAMN!

I guess I'll have to go to plan "B." Actually, my plan "B" was originally my plan "A" but, it would have been a little more involved so I went with this present plan instead. Trying to take the easy way out; so to speak.

Plan "B" involves the use of integral Heating-Elements.

After having witnessed the short comings of this present configuration, I believe plan "B" will definitely work. It's the same basic design except that the pins that plug the spouts are actually heated pins.

The next prototype will have to have a little more mass.

Back to the drawing board.

The Quest for the ideal Cast Lead Soft-Pointed Hollow Point Hunting Bullet continues.

HollowPoint

[RugerFan]

Very interesting. Keep us posted.

[Tom Myers]

I couldn't wait for my order of pure lead to arrive.
I had to try it out.
I just had to.

The first time I pulled my Soft-Pointing tool out of the melting pot, positioned it over my bullet mold and pushed the lever, I got exactly what I was hoping for. A smooth trickle of molten lead going right down into the mold.

I was so happy that I didn't realize that I had pushed the wrong lever and dumped the hard alloy into my mold first.

Oh well, it didn't matter cause it was just a test.

I set the tool back into the melting pot for the next trial run. This time I pushed the correct lever but got nothing. The lead had solidified before it even made it out of the spout.

Thought maybe it was just plugged up or something so I tried it again after confirming that it wasn't plugged. Still nothing.

The deeper Hard-Alloy Syringe was flowing real well but the shallower Soft-Alloy side would harden before it made it out of the tool.

HollowPoint

Just some thoughts.

How about just running your pot at a higher temperature.

Pure lead melts at a higher temperature than the alloys.

Once you get a partition in the pot, it should work better . I would imagine that the can sitting up high in the melt would be cooler.

Run it real hot and the alloy should cool enough while dumping the pure lead to be just right for good fill out.

By the way. In all sincerity, you must be a pretty smart feller to figure out something like that.

Tom Myers

[Buckshot]

............Disregarding everything else, I think you did a masterfull job in putting your idea into metal. It looks very proffessional to me, just as if it had been a production item instead of a prototype.

...............Buckshot

[Wayne Smith]

If the problem is a lack of heat retention would not changing your material to a brass/bronze solve the problem? Would there still not be enough heat retention? I'm guessing your alumunium is loosing heat quickly.

[HollowPoint]

Greetings Gentlemen:

And many thanks to Mr. Buckshot for the kind compliments. The points raised by Wayne Smith are the same points I've had to find out the hard way.

I am presently gathering materials for another go at this project. I'll be using all steel this time around. Not as much lathe and mill work I hope. I'll just have to fire up the welder.

I'm not that good of a welder so this should be interesting; especially since they'll have to be some real fine welds.

The questions raised by Mr. Myers about working with higher temperatures is a valid question. I did in fact have my melting pot turned all the way up as hot as I could get it.

It's not visible in my pictures but, the small tin can is sitting on the bottom of my pot and the level of soft-alloy in that can is at the same level as the alloy in the main melting pot.

I'm afraid that in its present configuration my little invention just wasn't able retain enough heat to do what I'd hoped it would. That is; give me dependable streams of molten lead in specific amounts before solidifying.

I have the heating elements already prepped and waiting to be mounted on my next prototype. As stated above, I'll be using steel this time. The syringes will be a little different with the reservoirs being a little larger and thicker-walled. (12L14 steel)

I don't want to get ahead of myself in my descriptions because these little projects always seem to need modifying as I go along.

If I try to describe what I have in mind now it may look completely different by the time I finally put it together.

Thanks everyone for your interest and encouragement.

HollowPoint

[clodhopper]

I was jut wondering if your heat element, or elements were from a soldering iron.
Really nice prototype.

[JIMinPHX]

Geeze,
now there's a neat little innovative contraption!
Kudos. I'm impressed.

[BCall]

Just seeing this for the first time, I am struck by the amazing thought needed to come up with the idea. Nice work.

A few thoughts though, if the only critical measure of lead needed is the soft lead for the nose, and if the dispenser could in fact be made to dispense on even amount of lead each shot, why make a dispenser for the hard base lead at all? I would think that the setup shown would work better if 2 separate pots were used.

Hopefully I can explain my thoughts well enough. If you are using a 2 cavity mold, make 2 dispensers that can each deliver tha same amount of soft lead. Leave them in a separate pot of soft lead. When the mold is ready, pull from soft lead pot, put nozzles(one over each cavity), and dump soft lead in cavities. Put dispenser back in soft lead pot quickly, then finish filling cavities from bottom fill main pot of hard lead.

The dispenser stays hot in the soft lead and is only out as long as it takes you to dump the predetermined amount of soft lead for the nose. You would probably have to work hot and fast, but as long as the dispenser can repeatedly dump the same amount of soft lead for the nose, I would think it might work better that way, given the small amounts fo lead needed for the nose. Just a thought, Billy

[JIMinPHX]

If you go to someone like Fast Heat or Wattlow or Omega, you may be able to get a small electric band heater to keep that thing at temperature. Alternately, you may be able to use a small standard cartridge heater & just wrap some fiberglass insulation around it.

Again, nice job. I am impressed.

2 at-a-boy's & a back slap for coming up with that one.

[HollowPoint]

It's been almost a month since I tried out the first prototype of my New Soft-Pointing tool.

I started making up the parts for my second prototype last weekend. It's starting to come together now.
It took two weeks to get the 12L14 Metal Round-Stock that I ordered. I more-or-less had the plans already laid out in my mind so I'm just following that mental diagram.

I welded up some of the components today and I'm hoping to have it up and running in a couple more weekends.
Things started picking up a little at work so I can only work on this project on Saturdays.

I meant to take some pictures but I was just to tired. I might do that tomorrow.
All I have left to make are a couple of levers, and a handle. I need to pick up a couple of expansion springs as well.

This prototype appears to have plenty of mass to retain plenty of heat to keep my alloy liquid. I'll also have the Heating Elements in place that may or may not be needed. Time will tell.

I'll try to post some pics of my progress sometime soon.

HollowPoint

[Buckshot]

................Be interesting to see the "New and Improved" version 2.0

..............Buckshot

[kevbo]

You have a high thermal conductivity heat leak path up from your lead to your handle/lever area.

Suggest stainless steel for the "syringe" barrels and valve rods instead of Al. Few things (only Ag and Cu come to mind) conduct heat better than Al or brass. Most SS is a poor heat conductor...like 15 times more thermal resistance than Al.

cite: http://www.engineeringtoolbox.com/th...ity-d_429.html

[HollowPoint]

I got the day off for Thanksgiving so while I was waiting for dinner to be prepared I thought I'd take the opportunity to do a little more work on my latest Soft-Pointing prototype tool.

With any luck I might have it up and running next weekend. No matter though. I'm starting to see the light at the end of the tunnel -so to speak- with this project.

The few suggestions and encouragement I've received from this "Special Projects" thread are really appreciated. Kevbo was kind enough to include a Link to some information about "heat conductivity" that was pretty interesting.

I'm afraid I'm kind of lacking the real technical smarts to fully understand what that Link was about but, from the little bit that I was able to gather it seems that using steel rather than aluminum is a step in the right direction.

There's a turkey leg on the stove with my name on it so I won't drag this latest update any further.

I've included a picture of my unfinished project just to give you some idea of what I was attempting to accomplish as far as my design of this tool.

I was kind of reluctant to post a picture of any kind until I was finished with this project cause it seems like there are always those who feel compelled to right the wrongs they see in my ideas.

I'm not an expert by any stretch of the imagination when it comes to tool making, metallurgy or electronics. I'm just a chronic tinkerer that had an idea about making a tool like this; nothing more.

Happy Thanksgiving everyone. I'm gonna go eat.

HollowPoint

[mold maker]

There have been a lot of important patents awarded to the results of a mistake. That's how many new product came to be.

[Catshooter]

Good on ya!

Regardless of your unltimate success or not, you're doing. It's so easy to sit back and do nothing.

Keep going and don't give up. You'll get it.


Cat