Bass
Well now isn't this profound! It leaves us with an excuse for just about everything and no need for an explanation for anything. No need for facts or even off the wall theories. We can just say; 'Hey, it was just one of those days!"
BTW, just out of curiosity, how many sporter '06 barrels have you actually shot out? Okay, let me be more general, how many sporter barrels of any cartridge have you shot out? I ask because your reasoning (or "just one of those days") for not testing seems pretty lame. I shoot a lot and have shot a lot in my lifetime. Other than rifles for high power competition and varmint shooting with jacketed bullets I've manage to shoot out only one sporter rifle barrel. It was, in fact, an '06 through which I shoveled large quantities of 4350 behind 180 gr jacketed bullets over the last 30 years. Hmmmm let me see now, one barrel (it still shoots 1 1/2 moa BTW but won't for long as the throat is quite washed) shot out in 30 years of shooting it and no other sporters shot out even after all the shooting I've done with them.
Consider also that the practical accuracy life of a competition HP '06 barrel is somewhere in the 6-8000 round range. We know that cast bullet loads can wear on a barrel but are not anywhere as intense as jacketed competition loads so the barrel life must be much longer. Last year when i was heavily testing with 3 different .308Ws I managed not quite 400 rounds through each of them and have put about 300 rounds through one of them since. So if I take the one rifle's barrel life for instance and figure on perhaps 10,000 rounds of accurate cast bullet shooting then with the original 400 rounds + 300 rounds per year the rifle should last 33 years. Yup, that sure is "only so much barrel life!
Then when we consider those cast bullet shooters who use 11-12 gr of Unique or maybe 20 gr of 2400 with cast bullets shooting several hundred rounds per year no doubt have little barrel life to waste on "needless testing". I do have say I'm somewhat pee'oed at you. You have, over the course of the last couple years asked me to conduct numerous tests with both my '06s and .308Ws. This was apparently without concern for the barrel life of my rifles! From your point of view that was very inconsiderate. From my point of view I conducted the tests because shooting out barrels (very rarely done with cast bullet loads) is just a minor concern, if a concern at all, of shooting cast bullets and learning.
However, I do not think you are inconsiderate at all. I think this is just another excuse for you not to test. I believe you have done 2 maybe 3 tests of which I have suggested. In all the out come was as I stated because my reasoning was based on proven facts, proven by testing. You didn't like the results of your own results because they did not verify your abstract concepts, theories and notions (synonymous with old wives tales). Can't say I blame you for coming up with such a lame excuse not to prove yourself wrong. But what the heck, it's just one of those days.
Larry Gibson
PS; this thread has denegrated into the usual so I'll back on out unless someone has anything germain (I include myself in that) to Joe's discussion. I found Joe's testing interesting and also agree with his summary and conclusions. I will say I have some questions concerning the applicability of those conclusions (the part about the amount of Lube not making a difference) to rifle barrel lengths of say 22+ inches. My testing has consistantly demonstrated that if you select an appropriate component for the load be it primers, GCs or lube that there will be little, if any, appreciable accuracy difference between them. Additionally I have found little evidence to suggest case neck tension, with GC'd bullets, or brand of case makes any appreciable or measureable difference.
What does make a difference in accuracy when using well cast bullets is alloy and BHN, type of powder used, controlling powder positioning (use of fillers with some types of powders), correct sizing of the bullet, seating depth. use of single cavity vs multiple cavity moulds and of course keeping the RPM under the RPM threshold if seeking the best accuracy.