Who shoots a 40-50 Sharps Bottleneck

[wcp4570]

I'm looking for information about the caliber and possibly reloading dies. Today at a local gun show I added a new caliber to my growing list of older single shot rifles. I bought another Sporter model No 1 rolling block rifle in supposed 40-50 Sharps Bottleneck. The bore is mirror bright with sharp rifling but the barrel has been shortened from the breech end leaving the barrel at 22". The shorter length barrel leaves the gun well balanced and handy. The forearm is in nice shape but the butt stock is not as good shape and is a pistol grip design and not straight. The receiver still has original case Harding, the underside of the barrel is stamped .413 .40-50 R. N. The gun was bought from a man that said his father use to shoot it in matches.

I guess my first step is to do a chamber casting to confirm the caliber. I have plenty 45-70 brass but will need reloading dies.

Any information you can offer will be appreciated. Thanks

wcp

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[nuclearcricket]

Accuracy wise, the 40-50 is a very accurate cartridge with the right bullet. I have a friend that has one and it shoots very well. As to dies, I would suggest considering Redding dies. They are expensive but are good dies. I have a set is 40-50 and am planning on building a rifle in that caliber. There had been some discussion a while back about brass not fitting a chamber and the brass had been made with CH dies. I had made up a couple of dummy rounds with my dies and the rounds dripped right into my friends chamber.
You will also what to check the twist rate on the barrel that will determine how heavy of a bullet you can use. Out to about 400 yards an 18 twist will work good with 400 grain bullets but they do fall apart a bit after that.
Hope this helps.
Sam

[wcp4570]

Sam
Thanks for the reply. I have been searching for dies and have not had any luck. I knew that the dies were going to be hard to find. I did search Redding web sight with nothing found so I dropped them a message request. I own and shoot 2 other 40 cal rifles beside this new to me rifle along with 45-70's and 38-55's. I may try to chamber cast this rifle this afternoon to confirm the caliber and do a twist check of the barrel as well.

wcp

[nuclearcricket]

Probably the best way would be to call Redding. Those dies fall under the "Custom" category and may be a special order item. Plan on spending about $300 for a set of dies. My Redding dies are my first from that company and there were a few things not right with the set but some correspondence with them and they sent me the correct parts at no charge. They seem like a good company to deal with. Other than that the cases are not hard to make. I use a good lube, I like the lube made with lanolin and alcohol, spray a good coat on the case and I also coat the inside of the die after its well cleaned. I work the full length case in with a few pumps till the die bottoms out on the shell holder. Trim, debur, expand and load.
Down side, unless you have a harbor freight chop saw to shorten the cases that is a very long way to trim a case. Once formed and fired, should be a pretty simple loading process, same as any other bottle neck case.

[nuclearcricket]

As far as loads go, my friend is shooting a 400+ grain bullet and around 52 grains of 3F black. Yea its stopped on pretty hard but seems to shoot well.
Sam
This is at 300 meters.
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[Jeff Michel]

Great caliber, your going to love it. You might check with CH4D, I haven't had any problems with their dies but there is a poster that had issues with his 40-50 BN dies. He did finally got things sorted out, perhaps he will weigh in with some guidance.

[marlinman93]

Having many sets of C&H4D dies for obsolete cartridges I would highly recommend C&H4D dies. I just got a set for my .40-50SS and turn around was about 6-7 weeks.

[gc45]

My custom dies from ch4d are perfect in 45-60, the brass fits my 76 winchester just right after turning the rim thickness down.

[steveu]

I’ve had a Shiloh 40–50 SBN since the early 90s. The first thing you need to figure out once you find a set of dies, most likely from 4D die company, is what the barrel twist is. Mine was a 18 twist, a 380 grain bullet is the Max for that twist. It will knock over Rams at 500 m. As for brass, Winchester works well if you can find it that’s all one lot. Star line would be my choice, their brass is very consistent right now. As for powder, 3F Swiss, and a large pistol primer which suits you well. The brass is easy to make, but you do have to anneal it first and you’ll be trimming a lot of brass so you will need a good trimmer. As far as bullet recommendations go, the Saeco 640 shot the best out of my rifle. The RCBS CSA bullet molds did not hold enough lube for black powder. Also, if you have a borescope that will make it easier to see what the actual length of your brass needs to be for the final length. If not a chamber cast is best.
Cheers,
Steve

[wcp4570]

Thanks a lot guys for the inputs, all were good suggestions. I tried to contact CH4D by sending a message to them but I could not get past the verification code thing they require to submit, kept getting invalid code. I may try calling to see if i can get thru that way. I would really like to buy a set of used dies to help with the cost but may have to relent and buy new.

wcp

[marlinman93]

Thanks a lot guys for the inputs, all were good suggestions. I tried to contact CH4D by sending a message to them but I could not get past the verification code thing they require to submit, kept getting invalid code. I may try calling to see if i can get thru that way. I would really like to buy a set of used dies to help with the cost but may have to relent and buy new.

wcp

I always call them. They answer their phones and can put you on a list or tell you if they have the dies in stock. Never got anywhere emailing them.

[nuclearcricket]

Depending on the wait time from Ch, you may want to contact Reading Reloading never know what they may have on a shelf. I have had conversations with them by email and the response was within a day or so. Seem to be nice people to deal with.
Sam