44 mag and 44-40

[GregLaROCHE]

I am considering buying a mould to cast for two different lever action 44 magnums and a 44 Magnum Smith & Wesson handgun. None of these have been slugged. I keep thinking about buying a 44-40 and it would be nice to be able to cast for it as well, if that day ever comes. Lee has moulds that are at .429 and others at .430. The weight and shape of the .429 seems like the boolit that I would want. MP’s start at 430 and go up. What diameter should I be considering buying? I know it would always be best to slug the barrels, but for at the moment that’s not a real possibility. Should I be thinking big and size down?

MP moulds are looking a lot more expensive for a two cavity than Lee. I found it hard to find a description of the material that a mould is made out of. Are they all brass these days? if so that’s understandable. If its aluminium, I’ll go with Lee.

Thanks for all your help.

[foesgth]

A big consideration is what 44-40 you are going to get. If you get a modern reproduction they almost all use the same barrels as 44 mag. If you get an original they will need bullets much smaller than .429.
I load for 2 Marlins, a Lightning, and 2 SAA clones. They all are happy with .429.
When I load BP I use 20:1 and size those .430.

[Balrog006]

MP’s typical mold is brass, they do have the occasional open for Cast Iron, etc. but in general their standard cost/material is brass.

[G W Wade]

The biggest problem I ran into when changing from 44 Mag to 44/40 was all of my 44 cal mold have too much nose. I shoot a Uberti 1873 with a carrier length of 1.590. Even the Lee 44-200rnfp (which they recommend for 44/40} Crimped in crimp groove the exceed 1.620 overall length. Molds for the 44/40 generally have a short nose for a reason. GW

[Tall]

I bought a new Uberti / Cimarron replica of a Colt Flattop target in 44 WCF caliber because that is the only caliber Cimarron listed. I read on the internet that every Cimarron in 44 WCF had a 44 Magnum barrel. So I loaded a box of 50 and I never checked to see if those rounds would actually fit my gun.

It turns out the geniuses on the internet were very mistaken. I tried the rounds in my flattop target revolver and they did not fit. It turns out 44 WCF bullets are .427" diameter. I pulled all 50 rounds and reloaded them with .427" bullets. They worked fine after that.


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[Thundermaker]

I bought a new Uberti / Cimarron replica of a Colt Flattop target in 44 WCF caliber because that is the only caliber Cimarron listed. I read on the internet that every Cimarron in 44 WCF had a 44 Magnum barrel. So I loaded a box of 50 and I never checked to see if those rounds would actually fit my gun.

It turns out the geniuses on the internet were very mistaken. I tried the rounds in my flattop target revolver and they did not fit. It turns out 44 WCF bullets are .427" diameter. I pulled all 50 rounds and reloaded them with .427" bullets. They worked fine after that.


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Well, as has been said, it depends. My miroku made Winchester 1892 has a .429 groove diameter. Your cimmarron may have a .429 barrel but .428 throats. Not unheard of. If it works for you, it works for you. I have found that the Italians have a habit of cutting chambers below groove diameter. It's especially egregious on their cap and ball guns.

[john.k]

My original Winny in 44-40 has a very tight neck ...it wont chanber 429 bullets .....Its my opinion these guns were meant so you could reload fired cases without any sizing at all.....a 427 bullet fits a fired case quite tight enough to work through the magazine with a compressed BP load .....every original gun Ive owned had this same tight neck

[Froogal]

The biggest problem I ran into when changing from 44 Mag to 44/40 was all of my 44 cal mold have too much nose. I shoot a Uberti 1873 with a carrier length of 1.590. Even the Lee 44-200rnfp (which they recommend for 44/40} Crimped in crimp groove the exceed 1.620 overall length. Molds for the 44/40 generally have a short nose for a reason. GW

The LEE 429-200 RNFP is what I use for my 44-40. No problems.

[Larry Gibson]

I have 44 magnum and 44-40 handguns and rifles. The handguns [Hawes, Ruger, Colt] all have .428 - .429 groove diameter barrels as did all the S&Ws I have checked in the past. The Chiappa/Cimerron 44-40 Carbine does too. My CVI 44 Magnum has a .430 groove diameter as did the several other M94 and M92s have. My current I use Lee mould cast bullets in both with complete satisfaction.

For top end performance, velocity and accuracy in the 44 magnum and HV 44-40 for the rifle, I've found a GC'd bullet is best. I've found the Lee C429-240-SWC to be an excellent performer for such loads. This Lee bullet comes in a 6 cavity mould which is what I have. The bullets drop at .430 - .431 when cast of COWW + 2% tin or a 16-1 alloy. Yes, GC's are a bit expensive and add another bullet prep step but a thousand of them go a long way and I don't shoot that many top end loads anymore anyway.

Most of my mid level 44 Magnum and regular 44-40 loads are shot with the Lee TL430-240-SWC cast bullet. I load these to run 850 - 900 fps, mostly with Bullseye, 700X or Unique, out of the handguns and 1050-100 fps out of the rifles. Accuracy is always better than I can shoot. I also use the Lee 429-200-RF loaded over Bullseye or 700X in both cartridges to 900+ in the handguns and 1150 - 1200 fps out of the rifles. Again, accuracy is all I can use. Both these bullets are also available in 6 Cavity moulds.

I size and lube all of the bullets in a .430 H&I die in a Lyman 450. Lube is most often 2500+ these days. Sometimes I do just TL the 240 TL bullets when cast of a very soft alloy. I load these in the 700+ 44 SPL cases I have for use in the 44 magnum handguns. These are loaded to standard 44 SPL velocity with Bullseye or 700X.

[Rockindaddy]

I have a pair of 1860 Henry Uberti rifles in 44-40 WCF They are .427 and like .428" dia boolits 200 grain. The brass frame Henrys are tender and will stretch if loaded heavy. I know as I have knocked a brass frame out of wack and had to use wood blocks and a 30 ton press to put it back in dimension. The steel frame Henry is much more stronger. The 1873 Winchester DeLux Uberti likes .428" dia cast boolits too. However my original 1873 Winchester has deep grooves and shot well with .432" dia 200 gr boolits.

[fordwannabe]

If either of the leverguns is a Marlin most will need a 430 or larger bullet. I have a half dozen MP molds and have never had a bad word to say about them. My opinion, which you did ask for...buy the MP 44 with the interchangeable pins and if needed you can size the 430 down to .427 -.428 for a gun that won't chamber a 430. I typically shoot 432 cast as my standard diameter, HOWEVER I loaded 50 rounds last night for my recently acquired new model Ruger flat top and they wouldn't even think about falling in the cylinders. Dagnabbit, I pulled those and resized to 430 re-reloaded the cases and will try them out here in about an hour to see if they are accurate.

[Lance Boyle]

Well, as has been said, it depends. My miroku made Winchester 1892 has a .429 groove diameter. Your cimmarron may have a .429 barrel but .428 throats. Not unheard of. If it works for you, it works for you. I have found that the Italians have a habit of cutting chambers below groove diameter. It's especially egregious on their cap and ball guns.

My Miroku 92 .44-40 short rifle has grooves at about 0.4285”. I size to 0.429” now but have tried 0.428-0.430”.

[Jhon]

I have in 44-40 a mismatched pair of Uberti Cattleman 1873 Revolvers, a Uberti 1873 Rifle, a Rossi Puma 92 and a Rossi Puma 92 in 44mag

The two Rossi have the same barrel bore from factory. They chamber and shoot .430 200gn and 240gn cast PC FP bullets no issues.

The 1873 Rifle shoots the 200gn bullet at .430 seated just right or it is tight closing the lever. 240s are problematic.

The Blue & Walnut 1973 Cattleman has super tight chambers. Any bullet must be .427 and correct C.O.L. or they will not completely seat. The silver different year Cattleman has a lot looser chamber and will easily seat rounds that will not chamber in the former.

I ran a bunch of .430 sized commercial PC truncated cone bullets through a Lee .427 sizer and they were ok with about 1 in 40 jamming the cylinder with the round not quite seating in the blued revolver. I now cast and PC my own from a RCBS mold sized to .427 after Powder Coating and they shoot perfect in everything

[Kai]

I load for original Winchester 1892s and 1873s in 44-40. Bullets are sized .429 for all with good results. As mentioned some bullets have to much nose to function in an 1873 however, bullets that work in the 73 also work just fine in the 92s as well as Colt 44-40, Winchester 1894 in 44mag, and S&W revolvers in 44mag. Lyman 42798 works in all. I also cast Lyman 427666 which is to long to work in the 73.

[Bryan Austin]

I am considering buying a mould to cast for two different lever action 44 magnums and a 44 Magnum Smith & Wesson handgun. None of these have been slugged. I keep thinking about buying a 44-40 and it would be nice to be able to cast for it as well, if that day ever comes. Lee has moulds that are at .429 and others at .430. The weight and shape of the .429 seems like the boolit that I would want. MP’s start at 430 and go up. What diameter should I be considering buying? I know it would always be best to slug the barrels, but for at the moment that’s not a real possibility. Should I be thinking big and size down?

MP moulds are looking a lot more expensive for a two cavity than Lee. I found it hard to find a description of the material that a mould is made out of. Are they all brass these days? if so that’s understandable. If its aluminium, I’ll go with Lee.

Thanks for all your help.

If you have yet to get a 44-40, you may want to wait until you can slug the bore before buying anything "44-40".