.300 Sherwood or .300 Extra Long?

[richhodg66]

The cartridge the Rook Rifles were chambered for. I don't know much about it, a quick look says there's custom brass available, but can it be formed from anything else?

[Outpost75]

The best practical solution for these antique British rook rifles is simply to reline them and chamber for .32 S&W Long or the .38 S&W so you can use common and plentiful brass and bullets. If the original bore is in nice shape, just rechamber to .32 S&W Long or .32 Long Colt and load bullets to fit the origin of rifling. I would cast your chamber and the bore just ahead of the origin of rifling to determine its original dimensions before doing anything else. Many of the .295/.297/.300 rook rifles were .300" groove diameter and shoot OK with .32 Long Colt as-is. The .310 Greener was .320 groove diameter and uses a heeled bullet.

Attachment 287300Attachment 287301Attachment 287303Attachment 287304

[richhodg66]

Interesting. I'm intrigued with the whole "Rook Rifle" concept. Just got to wondering how hard it would be to keep one shooting if original.

[Outpost75]

A .360 No.5 or .380 Rook with good bore will shoot .38 Special HBWCs accurately with simple rechambering. The .295/.297/.300 Rook rifles will work with .32 Long Colt, but "jump" or excess free bullet travel is caused by the longer .300 Sherwood chamber, and bores of many of the black powder era rifles are in poor condition, so relining is more viable. The antique black powder actions should not be used with loads exceeding about 16,000 psi.

[richhodg66]

A .360 No.5 or .380 Rook with good bore will shoot .38 Special HBWCs accurately with simple rechambering. The .295/.297/.300 Rook rifles will work with .32 Long Colt, but "jump" or excess free bullet travel is caused by the longer .300 Sherwood chamber, and bores of many of the black powder era rifles are in poor condition, so relining is more viable. The antique black powder actions should not be used with loads exceeding about 16,000 psi.

Would one of the longer .32s, H&R Mag or .327 Federal cases not fix this?

[Bent Ramrod]

You might be able to use .25-20 Single Shot cases for this by blowing them out straight. If you are lucky, you might be able to find a stash of Jamison .25-20 Basic cases, which were straight-walled and could be necked down to the .25-20 or the .22 wildcats based on the case.

I had a friend who glommed onto a bunch of .32 Long Rifle cases I’d made from .25-20 SS for his rook rifle in .300 Rook. (It was some kind of weird British bolt action single shot; I forget the name.) I never saw him shoot the loaded rounds but he never complained that they didn’t work, either.

I use the neck-cracked .25-20s by cutting them to .32 Long chamber length (eliminating the split necks in the process) but the .300 Rook chamber should handle the full-length shell, and the case mouth is the right diameter for the .299” diameter hollow-base inside lubed boolit.

[Outpost75]

Would one of the longer .32s, H&R Mag or .327 Federal cases not fix this?

.32 H&R Magnum case is 1.075" with .375 rim diameter and .337 base diameter. The .327 is 1.20" long with same rim and base diameters.

.32 Long Colt is 0.92" with .374 rim and .318 base diameter.

.300 Rook Rifle, Place of origin United Kingdom
Specifications, Case type Rimmed, straight-walled
Bullet diameter .300 in (7.6 mm)
Neck diameter .317 in (8.1 mm)
Base diameter .319 in (8.1 mm)
Rim diameter .369 in (9.4 mm)
Case length 1.17 in (30 mm)
Overall length 1.38 in (35 mm)
Ballistic performance
Bullet mass/type Velocity Energy
80 gr (5 g) Lead 1,100 ft/s (340 m/s) 215 ft⋅lbf (292 J)

.300 Sherwood Rifle, Place of origin, United Kingdom
Westley Richards Designed 1901
Specifications, Case type Rimmed, straight
Bullet diameter .300 in (7.6 mm)
Neck diameter .318 in (8.1 mm)
Base diameter .320 in (8.1 mm)
Rim diameter .370 in (9.4 mm)
Case length 1.54 in (39 mm)
Overall length 2.02 in (51 mm)
Ballistic performance
Bullet mass/type Velocity Energy
140 gr (9 g) 1,400 ft/s (430 m/s) 610 ft⋅lbf (830 J)

[richhodg66]

Interesting. Probably right, relining or a new barrel would be easier than getting one in the original caliber shooting.

[kootne]

If they are close enough to the .32 LC you can probably get a good start with these, the brass is about .93", 32 XL is probably a better OAL for your project but you would have to do the work yourself from .327 parent brass or track down some 25/20SS as suggested. A lot of work done in the last 10 years has been posted elsewhere on this site to make .32RF cartridges that will give insights into generating brass, bullets, and loads.

I, for one will stand up and say don't use 32 S&W reamers in old guns if they have anything more than minimal value. You can make them shoot just fine, some tinkering required.

.299 hollowbase https://www.gunbroker.com/item/904217684
.315 heel bullets https://www.gunbroker.com/item/907781816
.32 Long Colt Brass https://www.gunbroker.com/item/906673770

[barrabruce]

I think Bertram still make the cases.
If you load it like a shutzen rifle with a plugged case or even a stick and breach seat you will not be working the brass and they should last you years.
You could just carry a few bullets in a tin and loaded cases when out shooting.
Not that hard to load or take up much time when shooting wabbits n things.
Gotta keep those precious cases in good nick.

If shooting fixed and want to blast away well….probably better off with a more common case.

What ever rocks your boat.

Just a thought.

[cwtebay]

"Reloading - The .300 Sherwood (.300 Extra Long) Cartridge" https://www.300sherwood.net/reloading.html

"Bertram Brass 300 Sherwood Basic Unprimed Box of 20 - Graf & Sons" https://www.grafs.com/catalog/product/productId/1129

Here is some brass available - and as another poster mentioned, should last a long time! And the website is dated, but still has great information!!!
It would be a shame if all of these " obsolete" cartridges die off completely!!

Sent from my Pixel 5 using Tapatalk

[85lc]

Outpost75 and others,

The best practice is not to ruin a vintage gun by reboring or rechambering but toeither buy a gun you can easily reload the ammo or take the time to reload the cartridge for which the gun was initially chambered.

The rook caliber rifles are fairly easy to reload ammunition for them. Yes, the brass is costly and the bullets may need to be cast or existing bullets swaged.

The only time that it makes sense to rebore a vintage rifle is if the bore is completely ruined and cannot be saved by lapping.
If you are not concerned about damaging a nice, vintage rifle, remember that the rebored rook rifle has a relatively low market value, compared to an unmolestered rifle.

However, if that is too difficult, a Contender rifle in 32 H&R or 357 Mag would be a great alternative. They are fun to shoot and ammo as well as reloading components are available. They are also easy to scope.

[quack1]

Interesting. I'm intrigued with the whole "Rook Rifle" concept. Just got to wondering how hard it would be to keep one shooting if original.

I was intrigued with rook rifles too, always liked the look of them, particularly the ones made by the better makers like H&H, Purdy, Rigby, etc., but have never seen one other than in pictures.
I ended up making a version of one out of a Savage model 219 hornet. The 219 is not as slim and lightweight as an original rook, since the action is also used for 12ga shotgun, but it is one of the very few single shot frames that is hammerless. The hornet is an unconventional rook cartridge, but since there aren't any rooks around, I figured the hornet will work well on crows, groundhogs and maybe coyote. I spent a good part of last winter remodeling the stock and forend, drilling and tapping for scope bases, re-contouring some parts and making some others, then rust bluing the metal. Oddly, one of the hardest parts was figuring out how to make a cutter to do the mullered borders on the checkering. The spring clip holding the original forend on didn't seem like the best thing for accuracy, so I removed the barrel stud and replaced it with a steel block drilled for a single screw to hold the forend on. That block is the only place the forend touches the barrel. I also replaced the aluminum trigger guard with a guard from a double barrel and polished the trigger to lighten it some. Not a real rook gun, but it at least looks like one, and is accurate with jacketed and cast.

[Mk42gunner]

quack1, from another Butler resident (alas from a different state) that is quite possibly the best looking Model 219 I have ever seen. It certainly puts mine to shame in the looks department.

Robert

[ulav8r]

i was intrigued with rook rifles too, always liked the look of them, particularly the ones made by the better makers like h&h, purdy, rigby, etc., but have never seen one other than in pictures.
I ended up making a version of one out of a savage model 219 hornet.

nice!

[85lc]

quack1
Your rifle is very nice and certainly "in the spirit" of a rook rifle.
Well done