Overpressure factory Federal 327 FM in LCR and Blackhawk

[Fergie]

Good morning all,

I need some advice and wisdom on an issue I had yesterday. Was out shooting with my son(first foray into skeet and he is a natural at it!) and I brought along a new to me Ruger LCR in 327FM and my Blackhawk in the same. Having shot a friends 357 LCR several years ago, I decided to try the full-house loads first, and used 6 rounds from a new box of Federal American Eagle 100gr JSP. Definitely some kick, but nothing unexpected. Went to empty the cases from the cylinder and they wouldn't budge. Had to tap all 6 out w a brass cleaning rod and some force.

Thought maybe it was an issue w the LCR, so loaded up 8 rounds from the same box in the BH, and couldn't get the cases out either, so pulled the cylinder and tapped them out. Shot some of my 32 H&R handholds without issue in both pistols.

In looking at the case, it appears to me that all the primers are flat, what is your assessment from the pics?




And in looking at the cases, the portion nearest the primer is definitely bulged out.



This is the factory round:


I pulled the bullets on several rounds and all weighed in at about 100.5gr, give or take a tenth.

This is the powder, weighing in a 5.5gr each, almost no deviation:


When I bought the LCR, I got several boxes of this Federal American Eagle included, as well as some Buffalo Bore and other brands, all new boxes from the same store I bought the gun from, no reloads(the LGS won't resell reloads, obviously).

Is it possible that the factory ammo is over-pressure for the round, or could this be more of a case issue? I also inspected every shot case and none had splits.

I'd appreciate any insight y'all have.

Thanks
Gavin

[HumptyDumpty]

Hmm. I have shots a couple boxes of that same ammo over the years, and did not experience this. I'd recommend contacting Larry Gibson on this board. He does a great deal of pressure testing, and may be able to help you.

[Delkal]

The 327 FM is a high pressure cartridge so I am not sure what you can tell by the primers. But having them jam up in two different revolvers is definitely a problem. Contact Federal with the lot numbers.

Also try the other brands to see if they stick.

[Fergie]

The 327 FM is a high pressure cartridge so I am not sure what you can tell by the primers. But having them jam up in two different revolvers is definitely a problem. Contact Federal with the lot numbers.

Also try the other brands to see if they stick.

Good call on getting ahold of Federal directly; I'll give that a try this week.

This was the first time shooting the LCR, but w the BH, I've had every brand and bullet weight I can find through it, and 9 total different handload combos through it as well, with no issues whatsoever.

I grabbed a box of handload 327 brass and the primers all looked good. Load was 4.0gr of BE w a 100gr LRNFP.

I just realized that the thread from Green Frog was addressing inconsistencies in Federal American Eagle brass, right below this thread.

[Ramjet-SS]

After shooting 32 H&R do you clean the cylinder chambers to remove the burn ring? You should before shooting 327. Secondly many chambers these days are really rough and grab brass so get a chamber polishing kit try it again. Plus contact Federal see what they say. But it has been my experience most factory ammo is loaded lighter than spec. Not loaded to its potential. I run a LCR and run some top loaded (hot) reloads but my chambers are really smooth and I do not run anything but 327 in that gun they all eject fine. As far the “flat primers” some will flatten out because they are softer than others cratering or pierced primers is a different story. I have 432 UC for 32 H&R.

[Soundguy]

ive shot plenty of ae 327fm..no probs in a sp101.. but that was 5 yrs ago. so way different batches.

[K43]

If you think it is bad the correct action is to contact manufacturer.

[35remington]

As mentioned above, how crudded up the chamber is and if any shorter rounds like the Long or H and R were used will definitely hinder extraction.

If you haven’t thoroughly scrubbed the chamber, taking care to remove any lead rings or carbon fouling, make sure you do so and try again. I find I have to use bronze wool around a brush to truly strip all the fouling out. Don’t assume your chamber is clean enough. Look at it closely to be sure.

[Fergie]

I'm typically meticulous about the carbon rings and extraction issues with long vs short cases. Lots of 38/357 and 44spl/44mag, as well as my 32 rounds, and this is definitely not a carbon ring extraction issue. Vastly different feel between a "sticking" case and a "stuck" case...these case were bulged and beyond a gentle extractor tap.

I emailed Federal and they've sent me a prepaid shipping label to send the ammo back and are compensating me for the cost of the ammo as well; couldn't have asked for a better resolution as far as I'm concerned.

I'll take the other box of the same ammo out soon, and try it in several of my 327s; different lot numbers, and so hopefully no issues.

Delkal, Ramjet and K43, the direction to contact the mfg is much appreciated.

35Remington - I've followed suggestions from this site for the copper scrubbers and using those to get lead fouling out; do you have a source on the bronze wool at all? I'll use a dental pick and drag it lightly across the wall of the cylinder to make sure the fouling has been removed.

Soundguy - The SP101 in 327 I had, as well as an early run of the the Lipsey Single Sevens were the only two 327 pistols I've gotten rid of. They are just too small for my hands, even with aftermarket grips and I always felt like I'd lose the hold on the gun. I suppose I could have shot the shorter rounds in them. The one grip on the SS was the short cylinder too...OAL was really close on some reloads.

[Noah Zark]

I'm not 35Remington, but I've bought bronze wool from both Brownells and Amazon. Sizes bought were 0, 00, 000, and 0000.

Noah

[gilgsn]

Hello.
From what I can see... The indentation created by the firing pin has not been pushed up and the primer's edges did not flow to fill the space around it. So I'd say it's up there but not excessive. In a Blackhawk I wouldn't worry one bit. The LCR, I'd look for a little bit less pressure.
Look at all the cases, see if the primers all look the same. If it's consistent, that's better. If some look more flattened, I would not put them in an LCR. The issue is that the more the pressure rises, the higher it can go for a small difference of powder charge or even crimping. Manufacturers who reach maximum pressures in already high pressure rounds better make sure of the consistency of their reloading process...
The sticky extraction is also a good indication that shooting them in an LCR is probably not a good idea.

I once saw a guy pounding .357 brass from his S&W 686 with a brass rod and a mallet. He was right next to me, only separated by a thin sheet of plexiglass... I told him to stop, he didn't... I called the range officer. When he saw what the guy was doing and the primers, he told him to stop immediately! The guy's answer: "But it's factory .357 Magnum..." Yeah, so what!? Manufacturers can make mistakes too.

Gil.