Can anyone tell me a good case from which to make .401 Win brass?

[koger]

I was thinking 400 legend might work, all replies appreciated.

[M-Tecs]

https://castboolits.gunloads.com/sho...ster-ammo-from

[Tracy]

Looks like 7.62x39 would work as well as anything.
Handloader's Manual of Cartridge Conversions says 9.3x72R is a good one to make them from, but I would try x39 first.

[Kai]

I make .401 brass from 7.62x39 and it is the way to go. Shooting in a Win. 11910SL the cases bind slightly just above the rim. Only an issue if trying to eject a cartridge that has not been fired. I chuck the cases by the neck in a drill press and use a file to thin the lower head portion of the brass. After this they function fine. Best thing is 7.62x39 cases are cheap and easy to come by.

[Bazoo]

On page 311 of Donnelly's Handloaders Manual of Cartridge Conversions, it gives this info.

Make from: 9.3x72R. Turn rim to .457" dia. and back
chamfer. Cut case to 1.55" and taper expand to .410" dia.
Trim to length and size in .401 die With exapander removed.
I.D. neck ream. Chamfer and F/L size. Fireform in chamber.

I wonder why he didn't suggest 7.62x39? I'd think it would have been plenty common even back then.

[Battis]

I cut 414 Super Mag brass to length (1.495"). I do not cut an extractor groove.
Reduce the head diameter (.460") with a drill press and file
I use Accurate Mold #41-208L (206 gr bullets) .408” diameter
Or Western Bullets 250-gr. lead plain base #410426
IMR 4227: 22 grs minimum
UNIQUE – 10, 11, & 12 grs all worked. 12 grs felt like IMR4227.

[Mk42gunner]

...

I wonder why he didn't suggest 7.62x39? I'd think it would have been plenty common even back then.

Most of the cartridge conversion books were written in the 1960's or before. The 7.62x39 didn't become widely accessible in the U.S. until the late 1980'ss IIRC.

I do remember reading Bob Milek stating that he and Steve Herrett would never have made the .30 Herrett if the 7.62x39 was readily available at the time.

It is also why you get recommendations to use such weird to us now cartridges like the .30 Remington as a parent case. These days people that have working .30 Remington rifles are converting .30-30 brass to feed their guns.

Robert

[lar45]

I think Starline has Grendel basic brass.

[2152hq]

I make them from commercial 7.62x39mm brass.

No trimming to length unless you really want to, no turning the base dia down, just expand to 40cal w/a home-made expander die and then use 41Mag reloading dies to form and load from there.

Here's my posting /explanation from a while ago on the subject on another thread of the same topic.......

I make 401SL from 7.62x39mm. It's the easiest & cheapest parent brass to use that I've found.
No trimming for length, no rim alteration, no extractor groove alteration.
I use 41Magnum reloading dies and LEAD 41magnum pistol bullets (.410)

I've used 35Rem in the past and it was far from as easy as sizing and trimming to length. They need the base dia turned to size after the initial forming. The 35Rem is .458/460 at the base, the .401 is .430 IIRC.
35Rem is not easy to find anymore anyway.
30-30 works OK,,just a little undersize at the base, but there's still lathe work to remove the rim and cut a new extractor groove plus trimming.

I use primarily 7.62x39 Winchester brass. Some other brands may be too thick at the mouth . I found that w/ PPU (PrviPartizan?) brass.

I've seen a few long drawn out methods to expand the Soviet caliber case from 30cal to 40cal on the net using complicated configured and shaped expander mandrils along with several steps. Warnings of not trying to do the expanding in one step or brass failure is a given.
I simply took an unused RCBS 45acp expander die and removed the expander plug. I tapered that 45 plug from just under 30cal to 40cal at the upper end.

I did it on my small lathe, but it can be done w/ files in a drill press. The plug is (was) soft and the dimensions are not critical. Being smooth and polished is most important.

The Shell Holder for the brass is a common 38sp/357. I did anneal the brass at the neck and shoulders before expanding. Simple cadence of a 1 to 5 count while rolling the case in the propane flame holding it w/ my fingers by the head and dropping it into a pan of water.
Lots of ways to anneal the brass.

I heavily lubed the inside of the necks of the dry brass and then run them into the altered expander die. That opens the mouth to .40 and leaves the rest of the case rather wasp-waist looking as the tapered expander and the tapered inner walls of the brass decide how far to a full cylinder they will be,
The case does not need trimming to length,,it is fine as is. It is right at the 401WSL case length.
The round headspaces on a semi-rim on the original and the 7.62x39 affords a semi-rim for headspacing also,,though a VERY small one of a only a few .000 dia over case head size. I have never has a problem with this nor seen anyone else mention any.
You can roll crimp the bullet.

Next, I run the cases into a FL 41Magnum sizer die. This forms the case up better and will deprime it if you want it to.
It'll still have the thin waist look,, that'll be with it till the first firing when it'll disappear as it is completely fireformed.

Prime the case.

Expand the mouth and flare in the 41Mag expander.

Charge the case. I use 4227 and that is the go-to powder for the 401. I won't recommend any loads but will note that the heavier 7.62 rifle caliber brass will NOT take the recommended charge weights that you find in print using 401 commercial brass.
Also note that 4227 works best when a case full or very lightly compressed charge is used.

Next seat the .410d LEAD bullet using the 41MAg seater die. I lightly crimp the bullets in place for the recoil and you don't want to eject a loaded round and leave the bullet stuck in the bbl dumping powder into the action.

This last step generally leaves you with a round that looks kinda 'off',,, the taped thin waist of the yet to be fire formed case,, and sometimes the seated .410 slug will slightly bulge the mouth of the case.
The former will take care of itself very nicely when you fire them. The cases will come out of the rifle nice and cylindrical,,and about 15 ft from you
The other issue of the bulged case from the seated bullet I take care of simply by lightly lubing the outside of the case at the mouth and running the loaded round back up into the F/L sizer but just enough to size that case bulge away. It's an educated push but easily done.
Some makes of brass won't need that done, others will just because of the differences in thickness at the mouth.
The 41Mag die is a little larger at the mouth than the 401SL but this works out with the difference in brass thickness.

I do not load jacketed .410d bullets into the 401SL. Here I would only use .407/408d bullets
A Lee bullet sizer die would be the ticket for that and actually the cure for the last step in the above.
They can make one for you on order. I have a spare .400 die handy that I think I'll just lap out to .407 and make use of it.

Brass lasts for 5 or 6 loads before they become so mangled that I just scrap them. Only a couple suffered cracked necks. The Winchester really roughs them up during ejection.
But 5 reloads isn't bad for a semiauto and I'd rather replenish w/newer brass instead of trying to wring the last possible load out of them. Especially in a 100 y/old blowback op rifle.

[Battis]

I finally remembered where I got the idea to use 414 Super Mag brass to make the .401 WSL. It was from the late GRUMPA.
Here's one of his posts:

GRUMPA's AvatarJoin Date
Nov 2010
Location
Concho Az
Posts
2,092
The 414 is the best option, requires very little to make work and for the price of the parent case it's almost a perfect marriage. I make those all the time, last time I ordered 3K of them, down to almost 1K now. I sell a lot of those but I wish they sold quicker, kinda an easy conversion but I have a lathe....

[Kai]

I make them from commercial 7.62x39mm brass.

No trimming to length unless you really want to, no turning the base dia down, just expand to 40cal w/a home-made expander die and then use 41Mag reloading dies to form and load from there.

Here's my posting /explanation from a while ago on the subject on another thread of the same topic.......

I make 401SL from 7.62x39mm. It's the easiest & cheapest parent brass to use that I've found.
No trimming for length, no rim alteration, no extractor groove alteration.
I use 41Magnum reloading dies and LEAD 41magnum pistol bullets (.410)

I've used 35Rem in the past and it was far from as easy as sizing and trimming to length. They need the base dia turned to size after the initial forming. The 35Rem is .458/460 at the base, the .401 is .430 IIRC.
35Rem is not easy to find anymore anyway.
30-30 works OK,,just a little undersize at the base, but there's still lathe work to remove the rim and cut a new extractor groove plus trimming.

I use primarily 7.62x39 Winchester brass. Some other brands may be too thick at the mouth . I found that w/ PPU (PrviPartizan?) brass.

I've seen a few long drawn out methods to expand the Soviet caliber case from 30cal to 40cal on the net using complicated configured and shaped expander mandrils along with several steps. Warnings of not trying to do the expanding in one step or brass failure is a given.
I simply took an unused RCBS 45acp expander die and removed the expander plug. I tapered that 45 plug from just under 30cal to 40cal at the upper end.

I did it on my small lathe, but it can be done w/ files in a drill press. The plug is (was) soft and the dimensions are not critical. Being smooth and polished is most important.

The Shell Holder for the brass is a common 38sp/357. I did anneal the brass at the neck and shoulders before expanding. Simple cadence of a 1 to 5 count while rolling the case in the propane flame holding it w/ my fingers by the head and dropping it into a pan of water.
Lots of ways to anneal the brass.

I heavily lubed the inside of the necks of the dry brass and then run them into the altered expander die. That opens the mouth to .40 and leaves the rest of the case rather wasp-waist looking as the tapered expander and the tapered inner walls of the brass decide how far to a full cylinder they will be,
The case does not need trimming to length,,it is fine as is. It is right at the 401WSL case length.
The round headspaces on a semi-rim on the original and the 7.62x39 affords a semi-rim for headspacing also,,though a VERY small one of a only a few .000 dia over case head size. I have never has a problem with this nor seen anyone else mention any.
You can roll crimp the bullet.

Next, I run the cases into a FL 41Magnum sizer die. This forms the case up better and will deprime it if you want it to.
It'll still have the thin waist look,, that'll be with it till the first firing when it'll disappear as it is completely fireformed.

Prime the case.

Expand the mouth and flare in the 41Mag expander.

Charge the case. I use 4227 and that is the go-to powder for the 401. I won't recommend any loads but will note that the heavier 7.62 rifle caliber brass will NOT take the recommended charge weights that you find in print using 401 commercial brass.
Also note that 4227 works best when a case full or very lightly compressed charge is used.

Next seat the .410d LEAD bullet using the 41MAg seater die. I lightly crimp the bullets in place for the recoil and you don't want to eject a loaded round and leave the bullet stuck in the bbl dumping powder into the action.

This last step generally leaves you with a round that looks kinda 'off',,, the taped thin waist of the yet to be fire formed case,, and sometimes the seated .410 slug will slightly bulge the mouth of the case.
The former will take care of itself very nicely when you fire them. The cases will come out of the rifle nice and cylindrical,,and about 15 ft from you
The other issue of the bulged case from the seated bullet I take care of simply by lightly lubing the outside of the case at the mouth and running the loaded round back up into the F/L sizer but just enough to size that case bulge away. It's an educated push but easily done.
Some makes of brass won't need that done, others will just because of the differences in thickness at the mouth.
The 41Mag die is a little larger at the mouth than the 401SL but this works out with the difference in brass thickness.

I do not load jacketed .410d bullets into the 401SL. Here I would only use .407/408d bullets
A Lee bullet sizer die would be the ticket for that and actually the cure for the last step in the above.
They can make one for you on order. I have a spare .400 die handy that I think I'll just lap out to .407 and make use of it.

Brass lasts for 5 or 6 loads before they become so mangled that I just scrap them. Only a couple suffered cracked necks. The Winchester really roughs them up during ejection.
But 5 reloads isn't bad for a semiauto and I'd rather replenish w/newer brass instead of trying to wring the last possible load out of them. Especially in a 100 y/old blowback op rifle.

I use the same method as you however, in my Win. 1910 SL the lower portion of the case just above the rim stick in the chamber. As I mentioned in my previous comment the rounds will chamber but are very difficult to extract if the round is not fired. I need to chuck cases in a drill and file the outside of the case slightly to get cases to fit without sticking. Do you have any sticking in the chamber issues with unfired rounds?

[koger]

Thanks for all the great info guys, I have got him on the right road.