357 spl/ mag loads 140/200 grns loads

[barrabruce]

Just wet behind the ears still concerning blackpowder
I can shove a 1.3 cc Lee dipper of 3f Wano in a 38 or 357 case and seat a 200 grn slug
Or a 140 ish hollow base cast bullet and chamber in my rifle.
Using small rifle primers.

My concern is I haven’t found any load data.
160’s with less powder from the wano site is about it.

So; will pressure be about 1500 kpsi for all black loads?
Any idea or how much room I got for troubles.

All I hear is you can’t shove enough blackpowder in to worry.
Might be only for round balls thou.

Can you point me in the right direction of threads.
Tutorials. Etc.
This is in an older modern rifle. But would like to keep the pressures down to 38 spl target loads.
22lr std velocity area would be fine but be happy with what I can get

I also have some 2ff black to try out one day too.

I don’t want to have pucker twitch every time I squeeze the trigger or hurt the poor old girl either.

I guess it should be all just fine and dandy, but rather be able to clarify this in my mind as to what’s what

Thanks
Bruce

[greyhawk]

Just wet behind the ears still concerning blackpowder
I can shove a 1.3 cc Lee dipper of 3f Wano in a 38 or 357 case and seat a 200 grn slug
Or a 140 ish hollow base cast bullet and chamber in my rifle.
Using small rifle primers.

My concern is I haven’t found any load data.
160’s with less powder from the wano site is about it.

So; will pressure be about 1500 kpsi for all black loads?
Any idea or how much room I got for troubles.

All I hear is you can’t shove enough blackpowder in to worry.
Might be only for round balls thou.

Can you point me in the right direction of threads.
Tutorials. Etc.
This is in an older modern rifle. But would like to keep the pressures down to 38 spl target loads.
22lr std velocity area would be fine but be happy with what I can get

I also have some 2ff black to try out one day too.

I don’t want to have pucker twitch every time I squeeze the trigger or hurt the poor old girl either.

I guess it should be all just fine and dandy, but rather be able to clarify this in my mind as to what’s what

Thanks
Bruce

the 357 mag makes a nice little blackpowder round - you cant get enough proper blackpowder in there to do any harm - I consulted the scratches on my wall and it says 23 grains of FFFg under a 158 grain LEE boolit - you would have about 1/8" compression of the powder. and with Wano you proly clocking about 1050 FPS

the major concern will be lube - cant use a normal smokeless lube (well ya can but it will end with hard caked fouling in the barrel) 50/50 beeswax and neatsfoot oil works, or olive oil, or tallow (reduce the beeswax till you get a mix that is firm but soft) needs a boolit that carries a decent amount of grease to keep fouling soft (is why I like the LEE 158 - it shoots good and hauls enough lube to keep things running for a while)

If you have accuracy problems due to fouling you might try a duplex load - but that a story for another day .....................or offline

[barrabruce]

Got my lube sorted I think.
I started off with about 50/50 bees wax/ virgin olive oil.
Thought it was a bit hard to finger lube with so added some vasalene.
Thought it was a bit tacky so added more olive oil.
Now it’s slippery’er than a butcher’s dick.(company name of a knife steel)

Nice and soft finger lube for bullets,
I’ve been using it to finger lube bullets and size brass.
My dry and cracked hands have become soft.
Haven’t tested my new soft and swanky skin regime for anything but a few light bullseye loads.
The burning dirt residue is black and soft and smeary, takes 4 patches with Ed’s red to get it out of the barrel.
Maybe it’s the oil burning as it would clean up quicker with 50/50 bw/vas with some atf.
Accuracy has not been tested.

I found a thread on 38 spl loads with black.
I’ll look for some more.
I didn’t put a wad under the hollow base 135 grn bullet but did on the pb 200.
Should have plenty of lube on the bullets.

I may put some out in the sun on a some kitchen toilet paper to see if it all just oozes away .
Thanks
Bruce

[greyhawk]

Got my lube sorted I think.
I started off with about 50/50 bees wax/ virgin olive oil.
Thought it was a bit hard to finger lube with so added some vasalene.
Thought it was a bit tacky so added more olive oil.
Now it’s slippery’er than a butcher’s dick.(company name of a knife steel)

Nice and soft finger lube for bullets,
I’ve been using it to finger lube bullets and size brass.
My dry and cracked hands have become soft.
Haven’t tested my new soft and swanky skin regime for anything but a few light bullseye loads.
The burning dirt residue is black and soft and smeary, takes 4 patches with Ed’s red to get it out of the barrel.
Maybe it’s the oil burning as it would clean up quicker with 50/50 bw/vas with some atf.
Accuracy has not been tested.

I found a thread on 38 spl loads with black.
I’ll look for some more.
I didn’t put a wad under the hollow base 135 grn bullet but did on the pb 200.
Should have plenty of lube on the bullets.

I may put some out in the sun on a some kitchen toilet paper to see if it all just oozes away .
Thanks
Bruce

sounds like this not your first rodeo !

to clean things up we using one grain red dot under 16 gr FFFFg in a 32/20 - original 92 action - no issues (reloading these cases without resizing) - same load proly work in a 38sp - might do 1.5 grain in the 357
there more suitable powders for this (Duplexing) but got a large container of Red dot sitting there and I am careful .........................

disclaimer - this what I am doing NOT a recommendation to follow suit.

[2TM101]

My SASS Load, and probably the cheapest rounds anybody ever made:

.357 magnum Brass, 25 grains of my own BP, a card wad cut from a Ritz Crackers box.

Then the cart is used as a cookie cutter on my pan lube to put a 1/8" thick disc of pan lube in the case.

Put it back on the press and load a OOO Buckshot that my Lee mold makes 18 at a time.

A Rossi, Marlin or Winchester in .357 all require a minimum OAL of - 1.45" to cycle. And these are: 1.47". I do have my Dillon SDB put a good crimp on those.

They load & cycle just fine, and with the "Grease Cookie" in there, there is no leading. And the only thing that makes it different from what I put in my Navy revolver is the primer.

Loaded with White River factory second primers they work out to about a nickel a round. A whole box of ammo for less than $3, that brings back good memories.

[barrabruce]

Well I loaded up some 360 rook cases with the 135 grn huge hollow base.
I got a some 222 rimmed, and 32-20 wcf weirdly altered ammo off a retired from shooting person.
So I pulled the bullets and kept the powder and primers.
Must have a hundred or so.
May make some trade fodder with the 218 bee cases as well I ended up with.
Some primers are too loose in the primer pockets now 2nd time round. Mix of copper soft ones and silver ones.
Srp/spp who knows. Will find out thou.
I filled the case with black ,scraped off the powder and seated the bullet, about 0.150" in the mouth.
The load will chamber like that in my gun.
Will finger lube the outside as I go.
Got some 3f and got given some 2f wano.
I was thinking of a wad but thought it may make more issues on the hollow base.
Be better if the bullet falls out with a wad.
Maybe kapok may help or a piece of paper.
See if I need to protect the base from deformation.
Hopefully ping a few rounds off this week-end and then spend a bit of time dismantling the gun and cleaning the action out.
See how far the fouling goes if the cases don’t seal properly.
My brass is made from pick up and discarded 38 spl and mag cases from the range.
Primers are $20 a hundred last time I looked.
But I save heaps of money by casting with a single mold and scrounged lead,home made lube and homemade loading tools.

Sometime later this century I may start seeing a saving.

I found this to be an expensive way to save money.

My other hobby is turning pilchards in to fish.
Not as good as turning water into wine , but I do my best.
I keep telling myself it’s a Cheap way to have a fresh feed of fish.

He’ll the more I spend the more I save.
You’d think I’d be rich by now.

[Griff]

Hmmm... shoot a .357 when, by simply buying new guns, reloading equipment & supplies you could be shooting a .45! The C45S case from Starline, (yeah I know it's history... been there all the time), 160 grain RFN, ¾ case of 3F, and "...Bob's yer uncle!" WooHoo! You have new guns, reloading equipment & supplies and get to learn all NEW stuff! What could be better? Well... if you don't know the answer to that question, it's: "be a real man & shoot cap and ball!" Enough of those silly, gay suppository handguns.

[barrabruce]

Got no business with the devils right hand.
I’ll stick to long guns.
A proper 360 load is 14 grns 3f black and 135 grn bullet at 1035 fps
I think I put @20 in and just seated the base in the case as my single shot will allow that.
I think that is for rifle.
If you hear an earth shattering crack your side of pond it is probably only me lighting one off.
I think a 45 would be silly as a rabbit and rook calibre, and in any case, a 36 cal ought to lay them down without too much ado.

Mind you I have nothing to shoot with it only maybe the coke can cartel or my armour plated rabbit.

[barrabruce]

Don’t ask I dunno what happened now.
I shot a string with the 134gn hb bullet in the 360 with 13 grain 1cc and 1.3cc of warno black.
These were with reclaimed primers of different origin.
IMG_3641.jpg
IMG_3645.jpg
IMG_3646.jpg
After the blow out of the 1.3cc of powder I cleaned the rifle and the last 6 inches to the muzzle was gritty lead mess.
I believe I may have run out of lube.
The 13 grns (original load) with bullet seated on the powder deep in the case was a success. A couple of shots sounded strange and a bit off giving the high left flyers.
I’m pretty happy with those results.

The 2f Wano loads shot dismal of any configuration.
Seems like 3f may be the thing.

Will have to try again one day with same type of primers.
Not bad for me at 50 yrds with a red dot sight and a good introduction to the dark side.

[greyhawk]

Don’t ask I dunno what happened now.
I shot a string with the 134gn hb bullet in the 360 with 13 grain 1cc and 1.3cc of warno black.
These were with reclaimed primers of different origin.
IMG_3641.jpg
IMG_3645.jpg
IMG_3646.jpg
After the blow out of the 1.3cc of powder I cleaned the rifle and the last 6 inches to the muzzle was gritty lead mess.
I believe I may have run out of lube.
The 13 grns (original load) with bullet seated on the powder deep in the case was a success. A couple of shots sounded strange and a bit off giving the high left flyers.
I’m pretty happy with those results.

The 2f Wano loads shot dismal of any configuration.
Seems like 3f may be the thing.

Will have to try again one day with same type of primers.
Not bad for me at 50 yrds with a red dot sight and a good introduction to the dark side.

top two targets is dead rabbit for sure
next time you play try a few with the hollow base filled up with lube- might be interesting ----might be orrible-----might help with the fouling issue? might not