Obscure published 410 load data

[Barry54]

I’m on the hunt for published or pressure tested 410 load data with faster than the usual burn rate powders for 410.

What have you encountered with burning rates FASTER than the usual H110/W296, 2400, 4100, Lil’Gun, etc?

I understand why these are the accepted powders and I’m not looking for explanations of why faster powders aren’t used. I don’t care if it’s a 3/8 oz or even a 1/4 oz load. I’m only after loads using faster powders here in this thread. Please!

I found a thread about Longshot in 410 started in 2022 which appears to have an image of BPI buckshot data for four 00 pellets. The far left and right columns are cut off in the posted image. If you know which manual that’s in I’d appreciate you sharing it with us.

And if you have any other data, please inform us about it here.

Thanks in advance!

[DDriller]

Screen Shot 2025-05-28 at 5.54.55 PM.jpg
From Small Bore Manual

[Minerat]

The BPI advantages has 2 loads using Longshot in a 410 is for 9.5 gr in a Fiochi 3" with 150 gr of steel #7 shot

And 9.0 gr in a 3" Cheddite for 150 gr of steel #7's

[mf79]

RCBS Handbook of Shotshell Reloading, The - Kenneth W Couger - 2007 296-299_Page_1.jpgRCBS Handbook of Shotshell Reloading, The - Kenneth W Couger - 2007 296-299_Page_1.jpgRCBS Handbook of Shotshell Reloading, The - Kenneth W Couger - 2007 296-299_Page_2.jpgRCBS Handbook of Shotshell Reloading, The - Kenneth W Couger - 2007 296-299_Page_3.jpgRCBS Handbook of Shotshell Reloading, The - Kenneth W Couger - 2007 296-299_Page_4.jpg

[Barry54]

RCBS Handbook of Shotshell Reloading, The - Kenneth W Couger - 2007 296-299_Page_1.jpgRCBS Handbook of Shotshell Reloading, The - Kenneth W Couger - 2007 296-299_Page_1.jpgRCBS Handbook of Shotshell Reloading, The - Kenneth W Couger - 2007 296-299_Page_2.jpgRCBS Handbook of Shotshell Reloading, The - Kenneth W Couger - 2007 296-299_Page_3.jpgRCBS Handbook of Shotshell Reloading, The - Kenneth W Couger - 2007 296-299_Page_4.jpg

Thanks for replying. Maybe I missed it. Those all look like typical 410 powder choices. Where was the data with faster than typical powder??

[savage308]

Thanks for replying. Maybe I missed it. Those all look like typical 410 powder choices. Where was the data with faster than typical powder??

Not much available for Fast powder . You might look for judge pistol loads. I have a carpenter bee load that is 2 1/2 cheddite hull win 209 , 3 gr. Promo or reddot, fill with dried rice and pack well. No over powder wads or cards. Then I do use an finish card and roll crimp. Knocks their wings off at 6 feet but doesn't leave a mark on the wood.

[Barry54]

Bump for another look.

Anyone else have any?

[poppy42]

For those who use the BPI Small bore manual be very careful. it has been confirmed that BPI loads are basically computed generated and not all have been tested. Don’t take my word for it. Do a little research not saying they’re all bad or dangerous or anything like that but it’s well known that not all of their loads have been tested

[rbuck351]

I did a bit of experimenting with a couple of powders like Universal and 1/2 oz loads in brass cases. Pressure got too high before #9 shot would go through a cardboard box at 20 yds. I don't remember the powder charge but I think it was around 7 or 8 grs. I went back to 2400 as cases were starting to stick and velocity was very low. I don't think there is a faster powder load that will work in a 410.

[W.R.Buchanan]

I have to ask ??? What exactly are you trying to accomplish ????

The reason why you aren't finding any Data for "Faster Burning Powders in .410 Hulls" is because nobody uses them . They burn up the crimp area of the Hulls prematurely and limit the number of reloads you get out of an expensive hull to 1-3 times.

And the other reason why nobody uses them is because the common loads for .410 hulls have been in use for a long time. They work perfectly. If there was any good reason for using Faster Burning Powders it would have been done already and Data would be readily available in many Manuals..

I have been loading .410's for about 20 years, and I have used the same load since day one. 16 gr of H110/W296 with a Claybuster or Winchester Wad, 1/2 oz. of #9 shot in an AA or AA/HS Hull. I got this one out of an old Lyman Shot Shell Loading Manual from 1969.

The reason why I use this load is because it works perfectly every time I pull the Trigger on the Skeet Field and I shoot between 100 and 200 rounds per week. I'm shooting 100 of them tomorrow.

Sorry for my Curt reply, but I am not into "Chasing Loads" when I already have one that works perfectly and is easy to duplicate.

This is my Philosophy across all of my Reloading. Find something that works,,, and then go shoot something with it !!!

YMMV?

Randy

[Barry54]

rbuck351 Thank you for taking the time and adding useful real world experience here in this thread with your experience in brass hulls.

Thank you to DDriller and Minerat for the published load using Longshot.

Thank you savage308 for your carpenter bee recipe. It is helpful information to learn from too. Reminds me of loads using fiber wads before plastic gas seals came along.

Looking at all shotgun loads, wads holding the payload, are seated against the powder.

220 grains seated tight against 14-16 grains of Winchester 296 or Hodgdon H110 sounds just like a magnum load recipe now doesn’t it?

I’m after the “special” non magnum load. Attributes of special vs magnum are not as noisy and lower pressure and velocity. Sometimes special loads give up some projectile weight as a tradeoff to regain some velocity but remain in the lower “special” pressure territory.

1) That’s usually done with a faster, non-magnum powder.

2) Airspace between the powder and payload. This is the tricky part to pull off in a 410. BPI seems to be the only importer of 410 plastic wads with a cushion section which is designed in air-space.

3) A lighter payload which will be dictated by the cushion section length of the wad vs the length of the hull.
Or as rbuck351 reported, a low velocity with the standard payload.

[Barry54]

Randy, no need to apologize for being curt. We are all adults here. I’m not interested in common in this thread though. Thanks anyway for trying.

I remember the ladies sitting in the bowling alley every night on base in Okinawa. They stuck a nickel in the slot machine and pulled the handle for hours and hours.

I’m ready to look around the bowling alley and find the door. Go outside and explore the island and maybe check out the beach and go snorkeling in the ocean. I was just hoping not to encounter a Habu snake or any jellyfish on my journey.

I’d like to leave my bucket of nickels with you.

[Mk42gunner]

I don't know if it was pressure tested, in fact I would bet on not, but the Lee Loader for 3" .410 used to recommend Herco. No idea of the charge weight, it was one level dipper of powder per shell.

I got my loader around 1976, and loaded and shot about a jillion of them. They worked, but my twelve year old shoulder recoil calculator said they weren't nearly as powerful as Win/Rem/Fed factory shells.

Unfortunately I can't verify that, because one of my illustrious renter stole my .410 Lee Loader while I was in the Navy.

Robert

[W.R.Buchanan]

Barry: I'll take the nickels !!! I need all the help I can get !!!

As far as 16 gr of H110 being a "Magnum Load" ? That's a little light. My standard .44 Magnum Pistol Load is 22gr. of H110 with a 240 gr Gas Checked Boolit. My Standard Rifle Load for the .44 Magnum is 24 gr of H110 with the same boolit. I also have "Mid Range" Loads for both .44 Special and Magnum cases using 240 Keith 429421 boolits with 5.0 gr of W231 and 8 gr for the Magnum cases. Getting 680-700 Fps from the 5 gr load out of my S&W 696 with a 3" bbl.

Back in the day I did 14.5 gr of H110 in Special Cases with Lee 240 gr SWCGC Boolits for my M29 with 8 3/8" barrel.

You might look into W231, Unique or Bullseye loads for .44 Spec/Mag as something possible in the .410. There isn't many powders Faster than Bullseye and I load many 12 ga. slug Loads with Unique. These powders have been around since the beginning of Smokeless powder and have been used in many different applications. One of the most common .44 Special Loads is called teh Skeeter Load form Skeeter Skelton 7.5 gr of Unique wit a 240 gr 429421 Boolit.

Look in old manuals as they are going to be the ones where the more common powders were used in many different applications.

Randy

[rbuck351]

Keep in mind the 410 only runs at 11,000 to 12,000 psi and most loads are in the 1100 fps range. To get that kind of velocity you are probably going to be quite a bit over the normal pressure of the 410. I could see herco as a possibility but something like blue dot or AA9 being a better choice and even then I think they would be a bit fast and still require around 12 to 15 grs to get the velocity.

Keep in mind, I am just guessing and as I have plenty of H110, 296, 2400 and Lilgun, my messing with faster powders was just me trying some out of the box ideas. It didn't work and I'm not surprised. If you decide to mess with faster powders, be very careful as pressures with these goes nuts very fast.

[GBertolet]

Ballistic Products has data using Blue Dot for 1/2oz loadings.

[poppy42]

Saami spec’s for a 2 1/2 inch 410 shell-maximum pressure 12,500psi
Maximum pressure for a 3 inch shell is 13,500psi 410 shells actually run at a higher pressure than do 12 gauge shells, maximum allowable pressure according to SAMMI for a 12 gauge 2 3/4 inch shell inch shell is 11,500. Psi The problem with playing around with different powders and trying to make different loads for a shotshell is that shotgun shells don’t necessarily kshow signs of over pressure.! And by changing things around on your own, you can drastically increase pressure. All the Shotshell Reloading manuals warn against making variations to a recipe. If you do change things you should send them off and have them pressure tested. Shotshell’s operate at pressures much lower than what we deal with in metallic cartridge Reloading. We shoot pistols with higher pressure than 12,500 psi. Just look at the thickness of a shotgun barrel as compared to even a 22 long rifle. I’m certainly not the one that’s gonna play around with i’m tested loads and put a pipe bomb up to my face and pull the trigger ! If someone was messing around with unpublished data and loading shells,5 and trying them out, I would certainly hope that they’re trying them out from some type of lead sled, device and remotely pulling a trigger like with a string or something. I would also hope that no one is trying things like this out on an open range with other people around. Shotshells loaded way past maximum allowable pressure don’t necessarily show signs of over pressure. Things like not ejecting or easy removal of the shells from the gun, looking at the primers , etc. can’t be used to determine whether or not a shot shell is loaded way over the pressure. I’ve heard stories of guys turning their shotgun into Elmer Fudd. Guns with the barrel splade open like a banana. This is all Just my two cents y’all do what you want. Not me I’ve got enough broken body parts. Lol