Lyman 1861 Enfield Musketoon Questions

[PBSmith]

Saw one of these today at the gun shop, 58 caliber barrel length, about 24". It's appears to be very well made and in great condition. Somewhere on the web I believe I saw these were made in Brazil The gun had a beautiful walnut stock, varnish finish.

Several questions for those of you who might be familiar with the item.

What is the twist likely to be? I don't know the age of this musket but have read that some makers of reproduction muzzleloaders changed the twist on their models from one year to the next. If the twist is 1:48 (as the shop owner suggested it might be), what kind of groups might I expect at 50 and 100 yards with round ball driven by real blackpowder?

In my limited experience with muzzleloading guns, I've always been in the habit of removing the barrel for hot-water flush cleaning. Having a tang screw and two brass barrel bands, I could understand that removing the barrel on this Lyman musketoon might involve complications with returning the barrel and bands to the same tension as before cleaning. What's the most sensible procedure here for cleaning?

Look forward to your responses. Feel free to address any issues I might not have mentioned here.

[Bad Ass Wallace]

My 1861 is a genuine Parker Hale with a 1:48" twist. I shoot mostly Lyman minnies with it and accuracy at 100m is around 4 MOA.

[Outpost75]

I no longer have it, but for years had an original single-band musketoon by W.J. Jeffery which had a twist of one turn in six feet. Best results were with a lightly oiled cotton ball loaded under a .580 round ball started into the muzzle with a mallet and short starter charged with 60 grains of Curtis & Harvey single Fg. Clay target accurate at 50 yards and good deer killer.

[dave951]

Why shoot PRB when the gun was designed for minies?

100yd group from my Parker Hale musketoon

[Tatume]

In my limited experience with muzzleloading guns, I've always been in the habit of removing the barrel for hot-water flush cleaning. Having a tang screw and two brass barrel bands, I could understand that removing the barrel on this Lyman musketoon might involve complications with returning the barrel and bands to the same tension as before cleaning. What's the most sensible procedure here for cleaning?

A flush kit might be useful. I use one with my Parker-Hale Volunteer. You'll need to know your nipple size and thread pitch. Here are examples:

https://www.dixiegunworks.com/index/...stems?view_all

[Outpost75]

I shot ball because recoil with Minies was brutal with charge heavy enough to expand skirt and stabilize.

[PBSmith]

A flush kit might be useful. I use one with my Parker-Hale Volunteer. You'll need to know your nipple size and thread pitch. Here are examples:

https://www.dixiegunworks.com/index/...stems?view_all

Thanks Tatume. I watched a couple of videos on You Tube. Apparently few if any remove the barrel of a musket for cleaning. Now that you mention the kit, I believe I've seen round-ballers with a home-fashioned apparatus like the Dixie kit.

[PBSmith]

I shot ball because recoil with Minies was brutal with charge heavy enough to expand skirt and stabilize.

At four score plus and 145 lbs, I guess there's no need for me to invite brutality. Thank you, Outpost. i believe I might drop back to my .54 RB carbine. It makes big holes and is easy carrying in the woods,

[junkbug]

N-SSA competitors commonly use 1861 Enfield Musketoon replicas, including the Lyman. They can hit 6” hanging tiles at 100 yards.
They do not use heavy loads. 35 to 45 grains of 2f or 3f and a lighter weight Minnie projectile. You can even use the LEE .58 cal REAL conical.
These loads might be a little light for hunting.
Best wishes, and hope you enjoy it if you buy it.

[greyhawk]

Why shoot PRB when the gun was designed for minies?

100yd group from my Parker Hale musketoon

six foot twist is likely why - thats a round ball twist - takes some tricky loading to make minies work

your Parker Hale is 48" twist, shoot either easy in that twist. (so long as you dont push the RB too hard)

[greyhawk]

N-SSA competitors commonly use 1861 Enfield Musketoon replicas, including the Lyman. They can hit 6” hanging tiles at 100 yards.
They do not use heavy loads. 35 to 45 grains of 2f or 3f and a lighter weight Minnie projectile. You can even use the LEE .58 cal REAL conical.
These loads might be a little light for hunting.
Best wishes, and hope you enjoy it if you buy it.

thats a 48" twist barrel, try the same loads in a 72" twist REPLICA and you be lucky to hit a 50 gallon barrel at 100yards with a cartwheeling minie
The re enactor boys keep tellin us tjhese stories, and most times when you investigate deep enough you find they shooting originals or Parker Hales with the correct vintage progressive depth rifling and the proper vintage design minie, or they rebarrelled with a custom barrel, or they got reeal lucky and hit the ONE ONLY combo load that works in their gun --- we solved our problem easily, sold the 72" twist three bander and bought a 48" twist two bander (both Euroams) - it shoots minies OR patch ball without a hitch - with a 500 grain minie and 80 grains of FFg it shoots right on its sight settings out to 600yards