44-40 1875 Remington clone

[Driver man]

I've acquired an Uberti made 1875 Remington Army revolver in 44-40. I intend to use Black Powder loads pushing a 200 grain FRN boolit. The bore is 431 as is the cylinder throats. I've had no luck using heavy loads of 3f with poor grouping and about 8 inch low left groups. As I reduce the powder charges the impact point climbs but is still a poor group. Im hoping that someone can point me in the right direction for a good accurate load at 25 yards. I have found the best load so far to be 17 grains of 3f with 10 grains of semolina filler. Continual testing is sure using up mu primers which in this country are in short supply and outrageously priced. I'm hoping someone has trod this path before me and can enlighten me.

[veeman]

With a bore at .431, which is way to big for 44-40 or ever 44 spl/mag, you'd have to be using bullets at .432 minimum. What are your cylinder throats? Likely too small for that size of bore. What size bullets are you using?

[Don McDowell]

My new winchester 73 and 3rd generation colt both shoot the Lyman 205 grain bullet at .431 diameter cast from 16-1 over 37 grains of 3f in winchester cases real well.

[BoBSavage]

You need adequate pressure and soft lead, nearly pure lead, or with sizing harder cast bullets to .430 or larger. The "higher" pressures will expand the soft lead into the grooves and improve accuracy. Adequate pressures can only result from full 40gr compressed black powder loads.

[Rockindaddy]

I opened up a 200 gr 429 mould to drop a .433 dia boolit. Sized and lubed em to .432" Had a couple of the Uberti 1875 Remingtons. I shot 7grs of Unique with great accuracy. Never bothered to waste good 3F black on my Remingtons. Do not like cleaning my empties and gun with all the black powder residue. You will need an oversize mould to get any accuracy at all. Why the Italians rifled the barrels out to .432 instead of .429" is unknown.

[BoBSavage]

Yes, same applies to smokeless loads,

near max or max charge pressures expand soft lead...or use the correct (+.001") sized soft wheel weight bullets...or (-.001) size hard cast lead bullets.

For bore size .431",

.423 to .432 - pure lead
.429 to .432 - soft lead (wheel weights)
.430 - hard lead

[Randy Bohannon]

Modern 44-40 barrels are nothing more or less than a 44 Magnum barrel in both pistol or rifle.

[Driver man]

Modern 44-40 barrels are nothing more or less than a 44 Magnum barrel in both pistol or rifle.

I had heard that was the case. Ive taken some advice on board and will try a few loads this Wednesday using a fatter boolit. The bottleneck case and thin walls make loading a bit of a challenge.

[BoBSavage]

Modern 44-40 barrels are nothing more or less than a 44 Magnum barrel in both pistol or rifle.

except twist rate

[nuclearcricket]

This thread got me a bit curious. When you said your "bore" is .431, I do hope you mean the groove diameter, if the actual bore is that big you need to send it back and get a new barrel put on as that one is way over size. If the bore is actually .431 that would make the groove diameter at about . 439 and the bullets would kind of rattle down the barrel. Pretty sure lead bullets would make quite a mess.
Anyway I was curious as to what my groove diameters were. I have an internal micrometer that I used to measure them so it does take come of the guess work out of things and is a lot less messy and time consuming.
S&W M 29--.4285
Carger arms bull dog, 3" SS--- .430
Uberti Cattelman 44-40---.427
I was a bit surprised the actual bore diameter on the Charter was a bit bigger that the others, I didn't measure it but I have a .44 cal wad cutter mold. The nose will slip into the charter barrel but not any of the others.
Hope this is of some help to someone.
Sam

[junkbug]

Greetings Driver man.
You have made no mention of the lube you are using. Are the commercial cast slugs? If so, they will probably have a hard wax lube suitable for smokeless powder reloading, but the poorly suited to black powder. What kind of lube are you using with these loads?

[Castaway]

The original 44-40 bullet was pure lead. You might try that to bump up to fill your barrel with happiness. With a 0.432 groove diameter, a larger bullet may also be called for.

[Tall]

I had heard that was the case. Ive taken some advice on board and will try a few loads this Wednesday using a fatter boolit. The bottleneck case and thin walls make loading a bit of a challenge.

I heard that was the case too so I bought .430" bullets for my Uberti 44 WCF revolver. Then I loaded up 50 of them - and they would not fit. Turns out the internet is dead wrong about this. 44 WCF bullets need to be .427" in order to fit in .425" barrels. I pulled a lot of bullets to find this out. Don't believe that guy - he is full of poo.

[veeman]

I use .429 bullets, and thats a tight squeeze for the cylinder throats in my 2 Remington 75's, with Starline brass.

[Driver man]

Im using fatter boolits of nearly pure lead now. They are a tight fit but with a hefty BP charge Im getting a reasonable group at 25 yards. The lube I use is beeswax and tallow.