Pedersoli Rolling Block Shooters?

[piwo]

In reading comments on numerous threads , there seems to be two distinct camps when deciding whether to use cast boolits that are equal to the “land to land” measurement, or “groove to groove”, and frequently someone will mention that the “Italian” reproductions have historically long leads that may influence this decision.

My intention is to paper patch boolits for my Pedersoli Long range Creedmoor 30 and I would be ever so interested in hearing from Shooters of the Pedersoli Rolling Block on your practices, experiences and results. After slugging your barrels, are you patching to groove or lands measurements, or over or just under one of those measurements? I’ve read where the grove measurement is .458, and they PP to .459 or .460. Since I have never done Cast Cartridge reloading this is all foreign to me.

[Remmy4477]

Honestly I could not tell you anything about paper patching.

I would suggest trying a dummy round to find out how far out you can seat the bullet before it touches the lands. Just use a case fired in the rifle, slip fit a .458 cast boolit in the case neck just so it slips in about an 1/8 inch or so into the case. Then place the dummy round into the chamber, you might need to push it a bit to chamber, and close the breech then remove it and see how far the boolit sets down in the case. That should give you an idea as to any lead length from the case mouth to the lands.

At least that way you can determine if you should paper patch or just seat the boolit out a bit.

Good luck with it!

[Kraschenbirn]

Never tried paper-patch in my Pedersoli RB but it definitely prefers 'fat' boolits. Favorite is a 480 gr. RNFP from an old NEI mold, loaded 'as-cast' (.461) and seated to contact rifling. If I'm having a good day, easily shoots under 2 MOA to 300 M...longest distance on our club range. Groups, maybe, a little better with a 515 grainer from Accurate but, for punching paper or whacking steel at 300, I don't really need the extra boolit weight.

Bill

[piwo]

Thanks Remmy

[piwo]

Never tried paper-patch in my Pedersoli RB but it definitely prefers 'fat' boolits. Favorite is a 480 gr. RNFP from an old NEI mold, loaded 'as-cast' (.461) and seated to contact rifling. If I'm having a good day, easily shoots under 2 MOA to 300 M...longest distance on our club range. Groups, maybe, a little better with a 515 grainer from Accurate but, for punching paper or whacking steel at 300, I don't really need the extra boolit weight.

Bill

Thanks Bill. One thing I find interesting is the loading “over groove” measurement. So a bore of .450, grooves to .458, folks use boolits larger than .458? That sounds counterintuitive, but obviously a standard practice. Can you tell me the mechanics behind that?

I ordered a book this evening (The Black Powder Cartridge, 9th edition) to hopefully explain the science of black powder cartridge reloading in a way I understand. All new to me….

BTW, I see your join date was a month after mine. Did you join those “AOL” or whatever it was back in the day. Bunch used to get online in a large chat group after dinner, shoot the breeze and talk shop. Your handle seemed familiar.

[Bad Ass Wallace]

I have been working with Pedersolis for over 40 years, both 1874 Sharps and rolling blocks and lately the Highwall target rifle. To fully understand the complexities of shooting these rifles, you must comprehend their barrel making process. The bores are finished with a taper of 0.0015" to 0.002" to the rifling. That is to say, the bores measure 0.450/0.458" at the muzzle but 0.4515/0.458" at the chamber throat. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eOo-muzMRp0

This explains why an oversized boolit is necessary to gain top accuracy in most of their rifles; target grade barrels with progressive depth rifling. For me, top accuracy has always been a boolit of 0.460" diameter seated to engrave into the rifling. I shot a Paul Jones 545gn boolit at my last World Creedmore shoot and the combination got me a place on the podium.

Given these facts, the rolling blocks have no camming power from the action (other than hand pressure) to properly seat the boolit into the rifling. A Sharps and Highwall actions do have approx. 1mm of camming power to engage the rifling at loading.

My Pedersoli Sharps 1874's; 45/70, 45/90, 50/70, 50/90 & 40/65



10 shots at 100yds with a Pedersoli Sharps (Paul Jones boolit).

[gc45]

Mine likes 400 gr .459 lubed boolits; shoots very, very accurate at 200yds. Never tried it farther out.

[piwo]

I have been working with Pedersolis for over 40 years, both 1874 Sharps and rolling blocks and lately the Highwall target rifle. To fully understand the complexities of shooting these rifles, you must comprehend their barrel making process. The bores are finished with a taper of 0.0015" to 0.002" to the rifling. That is to say, the bores measure 0.450/0.458" at the muzzle but 0.4515/0.458" at the chamber throat. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eOo-muzMRp0

This explains why an oversized boolit is necessary to gain top accuracy in most of their rifles; target grade barrels with progressive depth rifling. For me, top accuracy has always been a boolit of 0.460" diameter seated to engrave into the rifling. I shot a Paul Jones 545gn boolit at my last World Creedmore shoot and the combination got me a place on the podium.

Given these facts, the rolling blocks have no camming power from the action (other than hand pressure) to properly seat the boolit into the rifling. A Sharps and Highwall actions do have approx. 1mm of camming power to engage the rifling at loading.

My Pedersoli Sharps 1874's; 45/70, 45/90, 50/70, 50/90 & 40/65



10 shots at 100yds with a Pedersoli Sharps (Paul Jones boolit).

Many thanks for the detailed explanation; that makes sense to me now. That is one impressive collection of fine rifles as well.
Cheers!

[Kraschenbirn]

BTW, I see your join date was a month after mine. Did you join those “AOL” or whatever it was back in the day. Bunch used to get online in a large chat group after dinner, shoot the breeze and talk shop. Your handle seemed familiar.

Could have been. Was an early AOL user and participated in several chat rooms (not all shooting related) up through the early 2000s when we finally got cable internet...started with an Apple 2c. Was writing an online column (not shooting relate) for a regional newletter and seriously into astronomy back then so you might have seen 'Kraschenbirn' any one of several places.

Looking at your location, we aren't that far apart. Have you ever shot on the PASA range at Barry, Illinois (right across the Mississippi from Hannibal)? Shot there for many years during the old 'S&W Masters' tournaments.

Bill

[Bad Ass Wallace]

I bought one of the Pedersoli 1886 sporting rifles in 45/70 when I retired 8 yrs ago, and even it has the Typical Pedersoli tapered target barrel.