My homemade black powder

[indian joe]

The way I have been doing things - density of pucks from the press would be at best a W A G so I havent bothered with that measure.
Might be able to figure this out if I calculate the volume of my spacers and then measure the entire stack?

I'm not in disagreement with the general idea - one of the things that surprised me along the way was screened powder being at least as energetic per weight as corned - if you can cram the equal amount into a case it will do the job at least as good. (velocity wise anyway - havent tested enough to quote on ES numbers)

[Dieselhorses]

There’s all kind of ways. Ever since I shot my chrono I got away from the particulars but I just stick to what works for me. One day I will get the die from Woody but for now, homemade contraption works.


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[FrankJD]

I'm finally gonna give making BP a try, more out of curiosity and the need to be reasonably self sufficient should online shipping of BP become restricted. 'Til then, I'm enjoying my stash of Swiss 1-1/2F (for cartridge Sharps and rollers) and 3F (for flintlock muzzleloaders).

I have the chemicals ordered from Skylighter and will make my own charcoal. I do have a Harbor Freight ball mill and will use that to grind down the sulfur and charcoal.

I'll use the OP Atom's wet process for mixing the powders together, then screening the balled results.

Still unsure of what screen meshes to use for the grating but will try 12 and 16 and hope for dried granules in the 3F size, 2F is okay, 4F is useless for me.

Any constructive comments appreciated.

[LAGS]

@FrankJD.
When I screen the powder to granules.
I generally use a #12 mesh screen.
Then when it dries out.
I sift the powder thru the 12 screen again.
Then what passes thru the 12 gets sifted thru smaller screens like a 16, 20, 30 ,and 40.
The larger powder that will not pass thru or stay on the size screen you want can then be crushed into smaller grain powder.
What I use for #2F powder will pass thru #20 screen but will not pass thru a #30.
For #3 F powder.
It passes thru a #30 screen but will not pass thru a #40 screen

[FrankJD]

@FrankJD.
When I screen the powder to granules.
I generally use a #12 mesh screen.
Then when it dries out.
I sift the powder thru the 12 screen again.
Then what passes thru the 12 gets sifted thru smaller screens like a 16, 20, 30 ,and 40.
The larger powder that will not pass thru or stay on the size screen you want can then be crushed into smaller grain powder.
What I use for #2F powder will pass thru #20 screen but will not pass thru a #30.
For #3 F powder.
It passes thru a #30 screen but will not pass thru a #40 screen

Great scoop, thank you.

Okay - wet ball grating is done with 12 mesh, allow those granules to dry, then sift the dried granules through finer and finer mesh screens. Perfect.

[LAGS]

If you have a ceramic coffee grinder , you can use that to reduce the larger grains to smaller.
But if you don't have a grinder yet , you can just use a rolling pin on a cutting board to reduce the grain size if needed.
Just don't press too hard, the granuals break up pretty easily.

[FrankJD]

If you have a ceramic coffee grinder , you can use that to reduce the larger grains to smaller.
But if you don't have a grinder yet , you can just use a rolling pin on a cutting board to reduce the grain size if needed.
Just don't press too hard, the granuals break up pretty easily.

I do have a ceramic coffee grinder, but I'd be a bit leery of doing any manner of grinding on live, dry powder.

[LAGS]

The ceramic grinder works good and is Safe.
Just start your grinding very loose.
Grind the powder , then screen it.
Let the stuff fall thru the screen.
What sits on the screen gets reground if you want it to be smaller.
BUT , do not adjust the grinder tighter untill you run that larger granules thru the un adjusted grinder three times.
That helps prevent you ending up with too much fine powder or dust.
If what you have needs more refining , I adjust the grinder by spinning the adjuster down no more than one turn.
Then again , run that larger powder thru the grinder at that setting three more times.
I start off with my ground Pucks and pouring them thru a #10 screen.
I keep grinding that powder that won't pass thru the #10 untill it all passes thru the #10.
Then I sift the powder thru a #20.
What stays on the #20 is then 1F powder.
I mostly grind the #1f down to where it sits on a #30 screen.
That is my 2f.
The remaining powder is then just sifted to #3f that won't pass thru a #40 screen.
What sits on a #60 screen is used for my 4f.
Anything that passes thru the #60 is IMO just dust.
I either ball it up and regrind it in the screen and make stuff to grind again to the size I want or Re Press it back into pucks.
In fact,
Today I am going to be regrinding dust from 3 lb of powder I made last week and re pressed it into pucks again.

[FrankJD]

Reballing means wetting, correct?

[indian joe]

The ceramic grinder works good and is Safe.
Just start your grinding very loose.
Grind the powder , then screen it.
Let the stuff fall thru the screen.
What sits on the screen gets reground if you want it to be smaller.
BUT , do not adjust the grinder tighter untill you run that larger granules thru the un adjusted grinder three times.
That helps prevent you ending up with too much fine powder or dust.
If what you have needs more refining , I adjust the grinder by spinning the adjuster down no more than one turn.
Then again , run that larger powder thru the grinder at that setting three more times.
I start off with my ground Pucks and pouring them thru a #10 screen.
I keep grinding that powder that won't pass thru the #10 untill it all passes thru the #10.
Then I sift the powder thru a #20.
What stays on the #20 is then 1F powder.
I mostly grind the #1f down to where it sits on a #30 screen.
That is my 2f.
The remaining powder is then just sifted to #3f that won't pass thru a #40 screen.
What sits on a #60 screen is used for my 4f.
Anything that passes thru the #60 is IMO just dust.
I either ball it up and regrind it in the screen and make stuff to grind again to the size I want or Re Press it back into pucks.
In fact,
Today I am going to be regrinding dust from 3 lb of powder I made last week and re pressed it into pucks again.

Plus one for all this
only place I am different is screen sizes - my stuff would be about half a grade coarser than Lags
12-16 = Fg
16-22= FFg
22-40 = FFFg

compared to commercial, Lags is more correct than me I think. I 100% agree with his screening technique screen the stuff every time you look at it .

[FrankJD]

Thanx for yer input and help, Lags and Indian Joe.

I'm still gun shy for grinding mixed powder in any kinda dry manner.

I'm thinking that perhaps 12, 16, 20, and 30 mesh screens might be best for starters, for me. I do want 3F only.

[LAGS]

To do 3f you should get a #40 screen too.
What passes thru a #30 but won't pass thru a #40 or #50 is pretty much 3f.
If it passes thru a #20 but not thru a #30 is basically 2f.
But you can start off with whatever you want , and upgrade your tools as you see fit along the way.
But not having a finer screen like a #40 means that your 3f will still have lots of Dust or 4f in it.
But it will work.

[FrankJD]

To do 3f you should get a #40 screen too.
What passes thru a #30 but won't pass thru a #40 or #50 is pretty much 3f.
If it passes thru a #20 but not thru a #30 is basically 2f.
But you can start off with whatever you want , and upgrade your tools as you see fit along the way.
But not having a finer screen like a #40 means that your 3f will still have lots of Dust or 4f in it.
But it will work.

Gotcha, thanx.

So, the wet/moist initial ball of powder gets grated through 12 mesh and allowed to thoroughly and completely dry.

Then the sifting begins, with 16 mesh through 40 mesh. That implies that the 12 mesh grating will produce varying grain sizes, correct?

Whatever sifted grains are left over - anything coarser or finer than 3F - gets wetted, balled, grated again?

[DoubleBuck]

FrankJD;
At some point if you are pressing pucks, you are going to have to grind your powder. Either manually, or with a tool of some sort.
After doing it manually for years, someone posted the brilliant idea of using a ceramic blade coffee grinder. One of the great inventions for making our job easier and faster. They are safe, and they are fast and efficient. And, they are inexpensive.
If you are only interested in 3F powder, you only need two screens. #20 and #50. All your powder will be ground to pass the #20 and will hold on the #50.
I 100% agree with LAGS, and Joe on the screening.

[FrankJD]

FrankJD;
At some point if you are pressing pucks, you are going to have to grind your powder. Either manually, or with a tool of some sort.
After doing it manually for years, someone posted the brilliant idea of using a ceramic blade coffee grinder. One of the great inventions for making our job easier and faster. They are safe, and they are fast and efficient. And, they are inexpensive.
If you are only interested in 3F powder, you only need two screens. #20 and #50. All your powder will be ground to pass the #20 and will hold on the #50.
I 100% agree with LAGS, and Joe on the screening.

Thank you for your help.

Not pressing pucks, at least for now, just following OP Atom's wet process and getting my feet wet in BP making.

I have a manual ceramic burr coffee grinder - or are you referring to a motorized version? In either case, this grinding is for completed dry powder, similar to a ball mill?

Great, just two screens and not 4 or 5 or 6.

[DoubleBuck]

Sorry about the double post. Don't know exactly what happened. When I posted, others had answered before I did and so I deleted the second post.
I use a manual grinder, but some guys use a cordless drill on the drive shaft of the grinder. I'm not in that much of a hurry, myself, but imagine it would greatly speed things up. If your grinder jar is sealed to the grinder, a drill would be safe to use.
I didn't realize you were not going to puck your powder. Sorry about that.
The middle screens will hold more of your useable powder and cut down substantially on your fines.

[FrankJD]

No problem DB, I'm grateful for any valid assistance.

[HWooldridge]

No problem DB, I'm grateful for any valid assistance.

I started with the wet method, and although it does work and make usable powder, the dry milling methods don't lose any chemicals during processing. The wet process has some inefficiencies with retaining all of the KNO3, i.e., you always lose some because the alcohol doesn't set 100% of the nitrate.

I've been experimenting with using the wet method initially then grinding the result, which seems to make a pretty fast powder. I have made some pucks and am going to run a comparison against Goex over the chronograph.

[FrankJD]

Thank you for your input, HWooldridge.

So you'll start off with the wet method, grate it (what mesh screen size?), allow to thoroughly dry, then grind it?

[HWooldridge]

Thank you for your input, HWooldridge.

So you'll start off with the wet method, grate it (what mesh screen size?), allow to thoroughly dry, then grind it?

I wrote this in post #6511: “Just for grins (and trying to cut down on air float), I poured about 8 oz of 99% rubbing alcohol in an old blender then ran my charcoal and sulfur through it on the highest speed, for about 90 seconds. The alcohol prevented dust and allowed the particles to move freely so I created a nice, black smoothie. I melted the KNO3 in a very small amount of water then dumped that into the blender and ran it a few seconds longer (basically a modified CIA method). I poured the slush onto a cookie pan to dry and the alcohol/water was gone within 24 hours. At this point, I'm going to ball mill the solids for 10-12 hours to further grind it down to fines. Results remain to be seen.”

The above was a total of 200 grams of dry material at the standard 75/15/10 ratio.

After straining the remaining liquid from the black mud (and an old t-shirt works fine - don’t spend money on cheesecloth), the ball will set up and get semi-hard, which is when I push the ball thru a regular strainer. That makes a bunch of large, soft grains that will dry pretty quickly, generally within 24 hours in normal weather. You can then grind those coarse grains in the tumbler to refine the molecular structure before making pucks and corning the powder.

I’m like you in that I only shoot cartridge BP, so dense 2F and 3F is my goal. I’m also a rank amateur compared to some of the other guys who post here. The biggest variable I’ve observed is the charcoal, because the other two ingredients are relatively consistent, and I’m trying to use only local wood types to be self-reliant. My next improvement will be to utilize an old kiln to better control burn temperatures.