Having $2500+++ of charge controller, batteries, inverters at the panels is not practical... MPPT charge controllers can accept up to 150 volts for the one I use, some go as high as 600! They down convert to match your battery bank voltage and can gain 20% more charge than a PWM charge controller. I am running 4 panels in series for 90 volts DC I run to the house. This keeps copper losses/expense down by being able to run smaller copper wire. But larger than I normally would for only 3% voltage drop.
My system is unusual because it is primarily backup power I use to reduce my electric bill buy having zones with their own smaller inverter. Yes I ran 24 volt DC around the house for lighting, wire needed was cheap with under a 1 amp load per light.
Grid tie is plug and play... heck go micro inverter at each panel and a 240 volt line to the panels form your main breaker box and done. The inverter plugs into the panel via a fool proof connector, 240 volts goes to each micro inverter(they are wired in parallel). Each inverter is 295 watts and needs a 300+ watt panel(most use a 360 watt, it is extra on time before sunset with the extra overhead) https://www.altestore.com/store/inve...erters-p40450/. $149 each so a 3kw system is $1500 for inverters, add 10 of these mid range solar panels(good brand, budget minded) at a cost of $1900. Add in $1000 for racking and wire... $500 for the gateway monitoring system.. call it $5k for a 3kw+ system that will produce 15kw a day or 450+kwh a month... that is 3/4 of my electric bill most months... 4 year payback... at MN rates, each state is different for grid tie so research before jumping!
I went with separate switches and lights. Switches have to be DC rated in case of a short. LED lights draw 1-2 amps MAX at 24 volts and that is a very bright light. I bought 250 feet of 14 gauge power cord with ground. With such low current draw it is plenty and the jacket is tough for puling in walls and ceilings. Plus it won't be mistaken for 120 volt AC wiring! Everything is labeled 24 volts so anyone coming after me knows what it is. I lose power I have lights without candles, flashlights etc. And no generator to start up when it is -20f with windchill hitting -50f... My pellet stove is 12 volts as is all my amateur radio equipment so I use a 24 to 12 volt convertor for them. I can run 3 days off battery, heat 2 freezers, fridge, furnace when it kicks in to make up heat(about 4 times a day).
what shuts your power going out off when theres an outage? Is there an automatic switch you have to buy too. You sure dont want to be pumping power into a downed line someone is working on. Is there actually electrical code for dc wiring and protection in your home. Dc power is much more dangerous then AC.
The grid tie inverters won't run if the utility is down, there has to be utility voltage present. Beyond that the utilities ground both ends of lines being worked on. Not like the old days when they worked a lot of jobs hot.
Grid tie inverters Have to time their output to the utility AC Cycle to begin with, fail safe is fairly easy.
Last edited by Mal Paso; 07-25-2021 at 06:39 PM.
Mal
Mal Paso means Bad Pass, just so you know.
Yes I did the labor. You have plus and minus from the solar stuff, didn't do any drywall damage(I made sure to leave access conduits for low voltage add ons like speakers etc when I remodeled). It isn't hard to use a fish tape to get thru a ceiling joist space either, done plenty of that helping my dad wire houses and at the casino pulling slot machine wires.
Come on, I can melt lead in my attic this time of the year,The solar will have to wait until November.
MaryB. Sounds like a extremally doable set up, If one is good with their hands then why not?
yup Mary, your in a pretty unique group that knows this stuff and is sharp enough to work through the problems and get it done without hiring a tech. Im sure that about cuts the cost of your system in half. Makes recouping the costs much more doable. I was a lineman for 30 years. I do know electricity but im FAR from an expert in electronics. matter of fact i still have my old flip phone. Dont much know a resistor from a computer chip and its a bit to late to teach this old dog new tricks. I have to applaud you. This may sound like a slap to women but your one in a million. I dont even personaly know a women that has even heard of ohms law let alone could set up a working solar system.
If you can swap a battery in a car you can setup a solar power system(simple one, not as complex as mine, I do some voltage dependent switching and have transfer switches to drop loads back on grid if needed). As I said, you have a positive and negative coming from the soar panels, goes to the +- on the charge controller after connecting your solar battery +- to it. Inverter +- connects to battery. You now have a functional power backup system.
I am sure its as easy as P=IE. ( Had to get that in before someone else beat me to it!!)
Young lady, there is maybe 5% of the population under 40 that can correctly identify a screwdriver, hammer and pliers. Forget about changing a battery, only 2% can identify and find the battery.
Solar systems that are being sold today come installed and are entirely sold based on selling the power generated back to the grid.
But you've intrigued me. I do need to research what you are doing more. I'm out in the woods 7 miles from town and would be a while getting power back on if major outage like ice storm. Need a better backup than just a generator.
Ha, an aside, generac now has a solar battery backup system. about $20 to 30k installed for medium to large system. 10 yr warranty on It. ..
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I have several sayings I remember to try and remind myself to remain humble. One is "Everyone has something they can teach me". Some people obviously are experts on certain things and easier to spot. It's the not-so-obvious ones that always surprise me.
"Is all this REALLY necessary?"
I have been following this and just re-read it to see if anybody answered:
Do electric cars have air conditioning?
Will batteries run the A/C for two hours stuck on the Jersey Pike at 90F?
(I once spent the afternoon waiting for the carnage to clear.)
Do electric cars have heaters?
My 20yo Tacoma has 160hp, downhill at redline... towed the boat just fine... but at -40F in Fairbanks, I put cardboard on the radiator to defrost the windshield. I don't see how a battery car can live there.
In my grandfather's day the Stanley Steamers had no windshield wipers. Who would ever want to drive in the rain? The Stanley Steamers are museum pieces now, but we'll need them after the EMP attack.
First i would like to preface this on saying i am not an expert, but the topic fascinates me.
History:
I used to be an avid R/C pilot before i joined the army and you couldn't budge me off the nitromethanol/caster oil engines to go electric. fast forward 15 years. wanted to get my son one to fly together. cannot find nitro engines because brushless electric is both more powerful and efficient. Difference? batteries and better brushless motors. Tried one and I am impressed. i can fly just as long if not more and a quick battery swap and im back to flying while the other one charges.
I drive a truck and don't plan on doing electric until one thing changes:
bringing this thread back towards the original posters topic, EVs have along way to go before they become viable for long distance. And someone already somewhat covered this. The power density of lithium based batteries far exceeds older rechargeable tech such as lead acid, nickle cadmium(NiCD) and nickle metal hydride NiMH. It has brought us to the 300ish mile range under ideal conditions. The batteries still degrade over time though. This is due to the formations of dendrites. They have to be charged/discharged slowly(well some are quite fast but they cannot exceed a certain rate) to prevent the formations of these which could cause the battery to explode (and I can vouch that they explode quite violently we use them in military radios and we have to dispose of them carefully and not in the burn pit. Did that. Thought we were in contact for about 5 minutes!!! fun times.). And before someone goes on about that I would like to remind everyone that gasoline in fact explodes under the right circumstances such as inside internal combustion engines. You are dealing with two very high energy dense substances! I could go into more depth on this but the jist is the current battery technology is not efficient enough to allow for long distance trips.
Solution: more efficient(Power dense and quicker recharging) batteries. There are several companies that are working on just this problem. They are moving towards electrical storage that more closely resembles a capacitor than a battery. For those of you who don't know what a capacitor is it stores energy as electrostatic energy. like getting shocked with static. it builds up and then zap. batteries store electricity in a chemical reaction. There are several batteries being developed that behave much like a capacitor able to charge and discharge extremely rapidly. And several more that are trying to eliminate heavy metals and they are the most costly part of modern batteries. Either direction would work. Batteries than can charge in minutes instead of hours would bring EV to the point it could be viable for long distance. or batteries that are cheaper would make them more efficient on the pocketbook and potentially allow for easily swapping them.
I really find the idea fascinating. Is it really viable right now for my lifestyle? Possibly, I am boring and drive to work and home most days. I do drive 120 miles to catch redfish in the gulf and twice a year I drive home to see the folks. my hunting area is within the range of most EV. and the range is literally a mile from where i work on base. I can and have rode my bicycle to work(4-8 miles) many days when i don't have to take all my military gear with me. Its good PT.
Make it so i can charge my vehicle in 5 minutes with stations close enough that its not a pain in my a$$. I will buy in at that point. If i could charge it off solar at my house that would just be a bonus. and running my house off my car in a hurricane sounds great(thank you Laura and Delta which both passed over my house for my brand new 7KW generator).
Until then i agree forcing electric on people is wrong
[SIZE=4][B]Selling Hi Quality Powdercoating Powder
I carry a Nuke50 because cleaning up the mess is Silly !!
http://www.bing.com/search?q=nuke50&...7ADE&FORM=QBLH
I am not crazy my mom had me tested
Theres a fine line between genius and crazy .. I'm that line
and depending on the day I might just step over that line !!!
Has this been addressed: driving down a waterway (flooded street etc.) with an electric vehicle during monsoon season for a half mile or more?
West of Beaver Dick's Ferry.
Solar is great......if you have 360+ days of sun like we do here in PHX! I run my ENTIRE 3200 sqft 2 story house (totally electric) off of an 8K solar panel array. That is 2 big heat pumps, VFD for the pool, high efficiency dishwasher, high efficiency dryer and clothes washer, all the LED electric lights, computers, TV's, etc. Any extra 220V ac power is sold back into the grid automatically. At night I buy power from the grid. Very efficient. My bill went form almost $300/mo to around $73/mo (yearly average plan).
Solar in cars/trucks is totally another idea that I think is stupid. Would mabe work here in AZ, but most places there is not enough sun to keep the massive batteries required charged.
And FORD totally battery trucks? OMG. Fix Or Repair Daily cars are total carp. FORD trucks are great............with gasoline engines!!!!!!! And the power that comes with them. Why spoil a good thing, just for some lame woke stooges.
Well, this will be the decider for some people:
Ford Has Created A Fragrance Designed To Smell Like Gasoline
"A claimed 70 percent of electric car buyers said they would miss the smell of gas when switching to a plug-in vehicle. This is according to Ford, which to promote its upcoming Mach-E GT has created a fragrance intended to smell like petroleum."
https://www.forbes.com/sites/alistai...m_content=link
Cognitive Dissident
BP | Bronze Point | IMR | Improved Military Rifle | PTD | Pointed |
BR | Bench Rest | M | Magnum | RN | Round Nose |
BT | Boat Tail | PL | Power-Lokt | SP | Soft Point |
C | Compressed Charge | PR | Primer | SPCL | Soft Point "Core-Lokt" |
HP | Hollow Point | PSPCL | Pointed Soft Point "Core Lokt" | C.O.L. | Cartridge Overall Length |
PSP | Pointed Soft Point | Spz | Spitzer Point | SBT | Spitzer Boat Tail |
LRN | Lead Round Nose | LWC | Lead Wad Cutter | LSWC | Lead Semi Wad Cutter |
GC | Gas Check |