Opinions on this article. Rossi 92 in .45 loaded to 50,000 psi

[jmort]

Makes sense

[Schreck5]

I just got off the phone with Rossi to ask about rate of twist in their 45 colt model 92's. They said 1in 10 twist. Whaaat? They repeated, 1 in 10 twist. Does anyone have a new Rossi? That just seems awfully fast. 1 in 16 appeers to be about right.

[jmort]

The new Rossi .45 Colt 92s I see for sale are 1 in 30
Item Number: 640414
Caliber: .45 Colt
Action: Lever
Capacity: 8+1
Barrel length: 16"
Barrel style: Stainless steel round
Barrel twist: 1:30"
Stock: Hardwood
Length of pull: 12.5"
Trigger: Single stage
Safety: Manual thumb
Sights: Adjustable buckhorn
Overall length: 34"
Overall weight: 4.8 lbs.
Mfg. Number: R9257018
UPC: 662205982781
https://www.sportsmansguide.com/prod...unds?a=1805118

[Schreck5]

jmort, thats what i have always thought too. I thinl maybe the guy i spoke to was misimformed.

Ok. Just called them back and talked to a different guy. He said 1-30 twist.

[john.k]

Made with modern heat treated alloy steel ,the 92 is a very strong action...........the original Winchesters were made of soft steel and case hardened,for the very important reason of the imperative to sell and make a profit in difficult times....Great advances in alloy steel production ,and production methods with CNC machines mean it is now economical to manufacture with much stronger steels.

[Naphtali]

Well first I would like to know if anyone knows what the bursting pressure would be for a Rossi 92 in .45 colt. This gentleman says he is running 50,000 psi loads in his Rossi 92 .45. He also says he is running 65,000 psi loads in his Rossi .454 Casul. Again this seems quite high to me. But I am here to learn. Thanks http://www.gunblast.com/Paco_Legacy_454.htm

Your query has kind've garbled the gist of this article. Rossi did offer - don't know whether Braz-Tech still offers - their 92 chambered for 454 Casull. Heat treat on this rifle's action was different from their 92s chambered for 45 Colt. There have been more than one "test" to verify or disprove that a 92 chambered for 454 Casull hving a useful life of 10,000 rounds. Even as this was verified, the shooters doing the verifying had difficulty accepting that verification.

To furnish possibly useful information - I own a Rossi Model 92 454 Casull. Its purpose was to be a companion piece with my Freedom Arms Model 97 45 Colt. The ammunition I load is a 300-grain Saeco SWC-GC to deliver velocity and performance somewhat superior to standard 44 Magnum factory ammunition. I wanted to create a package whose purpose was similar to our frontier West Single Action Army/Winchester 1873 44-40 package - but be satisfactory to harvest elk to [more than??] 125 yards. My hunting area has something like a checker board feel, very dense "vertical forest" being interrupted on regular schedule with clear cut meadows. I prefer to invest my time with these fringe areas. I'm too old and decrepit to go too deeply into vertical woods/cross-canyon hunting. I bought barrel and parts necessary to convert the stronger action to a 24-inch barreled 45 Colt that was capable of using the same ammunition that I load for my FA 97. Will Rossi's [Braz-Tech] Model 92 factory chambered for 45 Colt handle such FA 97/old model Ruger Blackhawk ammunition? Rossi claims it will. I'm more comfortable with my "downward" conversion.

Hope something in this mishmash is helpful.

[Watcher]

I expressed no opinion in that post. It was an excerpt from Paco's article.

My mistake sorry.

[Watcher]

Well what I learned is don't go cukoo and blow stuff up. I think I am safe enough with Corbon or Buffalo Bore loads. Pricey but haven't seen any sales on new fingers and hands and eyeballs lately. Thanks Gentlemen.

[Tackleberry41]

I run 454 cut down to 45 colt length, running at Ruger level in my Rossi 92. That's not 50k, but ruger level, never had a problem.

Have a Rossi single shot, barrel stubbed it to 45 colt, run those same loads thru it. I bought it as a 44mag/20ga, 35k Ruger 45 colt loads are under the 44mag limit.

Way Rossi is, its probably cheaper for them to make a single receiver for their 92s all the same.

[Watcher]

I run 454 cut down to 45 colt length, running at Ruger level in my Rossi 92. That's not 50k, but ruger level, never had a problem.

Have a Rossi single shot, barrel stubbed it to 45 colt, run those same loads thru it. I bought it as a 44mag/20ga, 35k Ruger 45 colt loads are under the 44mag limit.

Way Rossi is, its probably cheaper for them to make a single receiver for their 92s all the same.

So I should be good with Corbon and Buffalo Bore. Thanks

[gundownunder]

I don't know the maximum pressure the 92 is capable of holding and I don't know how many times it will hold it before letting go. I know a gent at my local club who accidentally loaded too much pistol powder into his 357 and it left the imprint of the bolt face on the cartridge. I told him that in my opinion if he had made that mistake with anything other than a 92 he would have been picking pieces of his rifle out of his face for a week. The 92 is a pistol caliber rifle, if you need rifle caliber performance go buy a 30-30, it's cheaper than blowing up your gun and blowing half your face off.

[35 Whelen]

It appears no one here as heard of Paco Kelly.....? Don't hear much from/about him lately. This is his website- Paco Kelly's Leverguns.com Read his articles and you'll see, he's not one to throw caution to the wind and will tell you the limitations of the various types of lever guns.

Prior to the advent of commercially produced lever action .44 Magnums, it was a common practice to convert the old original '92 Winchesters to .44 Magnum. I read an article by Ken Water's on loading the 38-40 in a '92 and the problem wasn't that the action was weak, but with heavy loads the bolt work spring, leading to stretched cases head separations.

One thing about this site and the people therein I've always enjoyed is that fact that you rarely read the nail-biting, hand-wringing, your-going-to-blow-your-fingers-off-if-you-use-heavy-loads drama. I hope that attitude doesn't start creeping in here like it has so many other forums. Shooters here are naturally inquisitive and try new things. While I personally see no need in loading a 45 Colt to those levels, obviously it's OK or the guy probably would've trashed the rifle during his chronographing.

35W

[indian joe]

[QUOTE=35 Whelen;4586915]It appears no one here as heard of Paco Kelly.....? Don't hear much from/about him lately. This is his website- Paco Kelly's Leverguns.com Read his articles and you'll see, he's not one to throw caution to the wind and will tell you the limitations of the various types of lever guns.

Prior to the advent of commercially produced lever action .44 Magnums, it was a common practice to convert the old original '92 Winchesters to .44 Magnum. I read an article by Ken Water's on loading the 38-40 in a '92 and the problem wasn't that the action was weak, but with heavy loads the bolt work spring, leading to stretched cases head separations.

That is an interesting interpretation - the action was not weak but with heavy loads the bolt would spring leading to case head separations???????????

[35 Whelen]

What interpretation? I referred to what Mr. Waters said in his article, I didn't interpret anything.





If you look at the design of a '92, you'll see they're very similar to a falling block action (Ruger #1 and #3) which are universally known for their strength. The "weak link" however is the bolt, at least in the old original models.

35W

[northmn]

These over loads are not recommended mainly because of the real danger of the cartridge getting used by someone with something like and old Colt Peace maker. What is the case life of these loads? I have an old Speer manual that had hot loads for the 45 Colt and dropped them in later issues. Some still print loads but up to about 30000 or so. If you want 45-70 performance get a 45-70 as it will also handle proper bullets in the 400 grain range. Guns today are proof loaded and proof loads are designed to give some protection for accidents like over loading not a steady diet. Mostly what happens is damage to the firearms. The loading data for a 454 doe not go up to 60000 that I looked up. And has been stated the Rossi 454 was a special design.



I don't know what the fascination is for some to overload cartridges. Its kind of like souping up a Yugo. Get a rifle in 454, or 45-70 or now the 45 Bushmaster is getting popular and have the tool for the job. The 45-70 still has data for levers vs the old trap doors tested in laboratories. The pressures you see are average pressures not an every shot pressure. Also some powders can get touchy in very hot temps.


DEP

[40-82 hiker]

I have always had just as much fun as one can have shoot guns by keeping cartridge pressures within normally accepted design limits for such. I leave the question as to firearm strength outside of those cartridge limits alone.

With the velocity gain of a rifle over a revolver in .45 Colt, I would think a 250 - 255 grain boolit launched at 30,000 psi would be quite acceptable for me. If not, I'd go for a rifle that will do the different job. For target use, the "standard" pressure loads of something under 20,000 psi would be great in my book. For hunting, I'd still stick with the stated max pressures and limit distance and/or game animal. Pick the firearm to the job?

All is JMHO. YMMV.

[SvenLindquist]

Okay --- dumb question time.

Why does anyone want to hotrod a 45 Colt lever gun ? What can't you kill with a 300 gr hard cast boolit loafing along @1100 fps ?

I have a 99R in 300 Savage ---- never have thought about trying to make it a 300 WSM.

[T_McD]

a smidge of paranoia seems a wise precaution, knowing Murphy is on the loose

Yep. I also agree one should choose caliber based on desired performance.

[NorthMoccasin]

Sven, are you introducing logic and reason onto this discussion?

[indian joe]

What interpretation? I referred to what Mr. Waters said in his article, I didn't interpret anything.





If you look at the design of a '92, you'll see they're very similar to a falling block action (Ruger #1 and #3) which are universally known for their strength. The "weak link" however is the bolt, at least in the old original models.

35W

I am kind of familiar with the 92 design - bought my first one in 1964 - have shot, loaded for, dismantled, rebuilt, converted calibres, ran a couple with hot loads, separated cases in a worn out one on a regular basis, ....... yes the design is strong in that you will not blow the bolt out of it but loaded hard those old actions can spring enough to cause problems and when they do that they dont always return to their original dimension .

Most of the old 92's I have had have had sloppy chambers and more headspace than they needed to function - pull the barrel, recut the chamber, set the headspace back to minimum tolerance - new lease of life (for a while)

I really dont get the comparison to the falling block Rugers - the 92 has the lockup three times farther to the rear than the ruger - apples to pomegranites I think?