Mosin throwing first shot out of the group

[andrew375]

I'm happy with the accuracy of my 91/30 Mosin Rifle except for one thing, it consistently throws the first shot of a string out side of where the following nine go. The only thing not consistent in this behaviour is where the first shot is thrown, the two targets shown were shot last night. I fired three ten shot strings over a period of an hour and half. The barrel wasn't cleaned between targets.

The first target shown was the second target shot (shots 10 - 20) as you can see the first shot is roughly two inches outside the main group. The black is four inches in diameter.

The second target shown was shot roughly twenty minutes later and the first shot went roughly ten inches to the right and four inches below the group!

The targets were shot at 50 yards. Load was 30 grains of VV N120 behind the Lee .312-185gc. All rounds were chambered singly and in identical fashion.

I've bedded the action properly, free floated the barrel, put a pressure pad between the barrel and fore-end and now has two wraps of felt under the front barel band to apply pressure on the barrel from both fore-end and hand guard. The bedding put an end to the vertical stringing I had before, but no matter what I do the damn thing still throws the first shot! It doesn't matter is the barrel is clean or not! The first round fired last night went only an inch above the main group but it was still clearly a flyer. So hot barrel, cold barrel, fouled barrel ,clean barrel, free floated, pressure point bedded, it doesn't make a difference.

So any suggestions for a cure?

[dmftoy1]

Hey, I thought you guys in the UK couldn't shoot anymore. (Where in the UK are you located? I get over to Newbury pretty regularly)

I"m just tagging this thread because I'm interested in the results. (I have two Mosins that I shoot pretty regularly). The only thing I can think of is some sort of strange "feeding" on the first round . .but if you're shooting 10 shot groups then I'd expect TWO flyers. (one for each reload)

Could it be that your doing settling into the bags better after the first shot or something strange like that?

Good luck!

Have a good one,
Dave

[JSnover]

Disassemble the bolt and take the action apart as far as you're able. Something may not be seating or locking consistently until after the first shot is fired.
Some autopistols are known to throw the first shot. After that the slide goes into battery consistenly until the magazine is empty. I know, it's apples-to-oranges but still.........

[andrew375]

I'm not loading from the magazine. Each round is loaded singly so firing one round cannot affect any other. Also, before loading I hold the round bullet up so that powder positioning is always the same.

I'm based in Nottingham which is in the midlands area.

[Calamity Jake]

I compete in mil bolt bench rest matches monthly at our gun club using many different guns(03A3, 1917, M96, M48 91/30, 91/39, K31, 303) and some others, out of a cold barrell NOT a single one will put the first shot in the group, most of the time the first 2 shots will not be in the group.

The match requires 2, 10 round strings for group size and 3, 10 round strings for score with 10-15 minutes between strings for a total of 50 rounds, I always shoot 2 rounds into the backstop before shooting the target, this has improved my groups and scores 10 fold.

These old mitilary guns were made for war not target shooting, that first shot just needed to hit the enemy not the 10 ring, but they are a lot of fun to try to make them shoot.

Even though you have worked the gun over to make it more accurate, shoot the first shot into the dirt, then shoot for group.

[andrew375]

Even though you have worked the gun over to make it more accurate, shoot the first shot into the dirt, then shoot for group.

Thanks I was hoping not do that, I will do though if all else fails. My Winchester 9422 does the same thing though a lot more consistently as to where the first shots go; it takes two shots to settle down.

[Larry Gibson]

This is very indicative of the lube fouling in the bore getting hard in the colder weather this time of year. The first shot of the string encounters the hardened lube fouling and is a flyer. The following shots are then fired with the lube fouling softened by the first shot. I've seen it many times with several different lubes. What is the lube you are using and what was the temperature?

It is also indicative of a first shot out of a cold clean bore. The cold clean bore is not yet fouled and the bullet creates different barrel harmonics (oh my God....am I agreeing with Bass!) causing that first bullet to go to a different point of impact. Only solution there is to fire a fouling shot or two before shooting for group. Sometimes fire lapping a milsurp barrel will tone this "cold bore syndrome" to the point where the first shot out of the clean bore will go to group at close range (out to 100 yards or so).

Larry Gibson

[Pathfinder1cav]

+1 on the need to foul the barrel with one or two shots, but try one or two Dry Fires & see if that does not bring the 1st rd. flyers in a little closer to the rest...
I have a couple M-39s & a 91/30 & that helps.. That bullet with 16.5 grs. of 2400 is near 1 Moa @ 100.

[Ricochet]

If I could get mine to quit throwing the LAST shot out of the group, I'd be happy!

[mike in co]

i'll admit that i check all my milsurplus rifles( heck all my rifles) for where the first shot goes, and note it. when shooting in a match i'll use kentucky windage to hold the shot as close to the x as possible.

the one gun that is the hardest to work with is one of my k-31's.....
it consistantly puts the first shot about 1/2" to the left..... ...at 200 yds.....it just sucks.....lol.

mike in co

[Three44s]

Qoute by Mike in Co:

"the one gun that is the hardest to work with is one of my k-31's.....
it consistantly puts the first shot about 1/2" to the left..... ...at 200 yds.....it just sucks.....lol."



I FEEL YOUR PAIN!

Send me that k-31 and I then will assume ALL of your pain!

LOL!!

Three 44s