Slotted casting spoon

[ssnow]

Perhaps the article was referring to lead compounds in the primers being used at that time.

Regardless, elemental lead will not be absorbed through the skin. Gloves are not a bad idea though, they certainly help guard against skin abrasion, and can help as an additional protection against accidental ingestion, as lead cannot be transferred from the hands to the mouth if it never touches the hands.

In that light, I would never fault wearing gloves. However, let's not say that lead is absorbed through the skin, as we want to provide the best information possible to the newbies who may be reading along with us.

[zuke]

I read an article, some years ago, in American Rifleman saying lead WAS a skin absorber, and since the potential bad effects are SO bad, and the remedy is so easy (ie, gloves) I'll go with the "extra' precaution.

If it bother's you so much maybe you should take up a "safer" sport.

[ssnow]

Bannor is right to suggest what he believes to be the best procedure, and lets face it, much misinformation abounds on the subject, and sometimes finds its way into print. His posts were made in a helpful spirit, and isn't that what we are supposed to be about? Although he was in error, the resulting conversation can be a positive, provided that we the members make it so.

There are many old-timers who have done this for years, without ever having high blood lead. Some of them, with that being the case, totally disregard any warnings about lead, and dismiss them as inconsequential or false. They never had an issue, so the issue must not exist.

But there is a reason they never had an issue. It is because the things they do to produce good bullets, along with common sense hygiene, is all that really needs to be done to avoid lead problems.

They may not have kept the smelting temperatures below the point where lead releases fumes for the purpose of avoiding fumes, but they did avoid fumes anyway. They did it to produce good bullets. They did it because it would have been wasteful and counterproductive to use more heat than they needed. Plain ole common sense dictates avoiding all the smoke.

They may not have washed before eating to avoid lead contamination specifically, they did it as a matter of good hygiene and common sense.

The fact that they avoided the hazards does not mean that the hazards don't exist. The danger is real, but it is also very easy to avoid, with just a little understanding of the issues involved, and good hygiene.

[NavyVet1959]

That is why zinc wheel weights get sorted out carefully - I still have a couple of hundred pounds of sorted lead wheel weights from 30 years ago. Temperature of the pot does not get over 620F according to the thermocouple thermometer I use to melt the lead. in theory the lead wheel weights melts and runs out the bottom the zinc does not get hot enough to melt ( so long as I keep temperatures under 700F and stays in the pot as a solid wheel weight

If you're absolutely positive that you will not have a zinc wheel weight in your pot, great. I'm not so confident that one won't slip in. It takes a lot more control to keep something of low mass and low surface contact at temperature below the melting point of zinc than it would to keep a molten pool at that temperature. I prefer to just dump the wheel weights in the pool and scoop out any that have not melted. I tried sorting them once, but it got boring rather quickly.

[dikman]

They may not have kept the smelting temperatures below the point where lead releases fumes for the purpose of avoiding fumes, but they did avoid fumes anyway. They did it to produce good bullets. They did it because it would have been wasteful and counterproductive to use more heat than they needed.

Actually, I would say the reason they didn't inhale any lead fumes is more due to the fact that they couldn't get the lead to the necessary temperature (3000 *F) - just as your average caster here, using propane, won't do it. Even if they over-heated the lead somewhat above that needed for a good pour it's still an awfully long way short of creating lead fumes.

[NavyVet1959]

Actually, I would say the reason they didn't inhale any lead fumes is more due to the fact that they couldn't get the lead to the necessary temperature (3000 *F) - just as your average caster here, using propane, won't do it. Even if they over-heated the lead somewhat above that needed for a good pour it's still an awfully long way short of creating lead fumes.

Interestingly, zinc (MP:787.2F) has a higher melting point than lead (MP:621.5F), but a significantly lower boiling point (i.e. 1665F vs 3182F).

[ssnow]

Actually, I would say the reason they didn't inhale any lead fumes is more due to the fact that they couldn't get the lead to the necessary temperature (3000 *F) - just as your average caster here, using propane, won't do it. Even if they over-heated the lead somewhat above that needed for a good pour it's still an awfully long way short of creating lead fumes.

Yes, of course. You are referring to the boiling point of lead, 3180. Violent decomposition and fume generation. I agree that it's not an issue for us, as we can not get there even if we wanted while using the typical smelting set-up.

However, the lead we place is the pot is often oxidized, and we constantly generate oxidization of the lead and other metals present, during the smelting process. We create the potential for particulates, dusts, and smoke to become airborne during the process. We cannot avoid the generation of these hazards and still get the lead melted. But, a little common sense goes a long ways towards avoiding them.

[dakotashooter2]

My spoon had a round shaft with a plastic handle. I busted off the plastic handle, cut a 18" (or whatever your desired length is) broom handle and drilled a hole in the end and inserted the shaft of the spoon. Then drilled holes in the spoon.

[dikman]

But, a little common sense goes a long ways towards avoiding them.

Quite right, Mr. Snow, and the dust and particulates do indeed have the potential to be a minor issue, but I suspect most (certainly those on this forum) will use sensible practices as regards ventilation.

Unfortunately, my experience, by the way, is that so-called common sense is somewhat uncommon in many people. I'm sure you have noticed the same thing?


Dakota, I did the same thing with my el-cheapo spoon. Works well.

[ssnow]

Yes, we should probably start referring to it as "uncommon sense"

I work in Hazardous Waste Remediation, mostly dealing with lead contamination. Every project is set up differently, but usually you have "Emergency Response" properties, where a resident has high blood lead, and these are given first priority, as they are identified. Those aside, the high access areas are usually scheduled first, schools, daycares, parks/play grounds, public housing, etc.....

Then properties with small children, and expectant mothers. Then you take care of the rest of the properties. Vacant lots and lots with empty building are usually saved for last.

I mention that to get to this; Of all the Emergency Response properties on which I have worked, the highest levels of contamination that I seen on the project was at the home of a caster. He made sinkers, and used an old plumbers pot for both smelting and casting.

He worked in a carport, built into what would have been the corner of his house. So he had a roof, two enclosed walls, and two open walls. A situation in which, if the wind was blowing the right direction he had at least some ventilation, but none when the wind was not cooperating.

Someone walking to front door would be passing his work area, and the side door was actually in this carport. His hygiene was very poor, and the whole area was a mess. (and that's being very nice about it ) Lead and dross splatters all over the place, lead dusts covering everything.

And Grandchildren living in the house with high blood lead. A sad situation really, when it would not have required much effort to prevent it.

Sorry OP, I guess we are guilty of a hi-jack Slotted casting spoon. Yes indeed, get one. And let's not forget, I do have a special on the RayinNH skimmer

[Lead Bandit]

+1 on the rowel ladle. CHEAP CHEAP quality ladles!

[mjwcaster]

Thanks for all the great help.
I took a thrift shop trip over the weekend and found a decent shop or two (most in the area are clothing resale stores).
Managed to find thrift store mall (booths for different vendors).
Right by the front door was a booth with kitchen ware, all marked 75% off. Got several slotted spoons, 1 regular and 2 ladles for ~$2.
Also in the back of the store was a 4 quart cast iron dutch oven marked $10.
I have a brand new one still in the box at home so I didn't need it.
Walked away, came back for a second look and to make sure that it wasn't marked down, but walked away again.
Went to check out but the pot was calling me, went back for a third time and finally saw hidden sign saying half off for that booth.
So the pot came home with me, now I just need a turkey fryer. Sold mine off years ago and lost access to the one I was planning on borrowing.

Did my first smelt today and the spoons and ladle worked fine, may look for a smaller ladle for actually casting, not sure yet.

I do need to upgrade my pot, reinforce the grate on my coleman stove (stove help thread here), an find something better to place under my muffin tins (the plywood I used isn't going to last without catching fire I fear).

Thanks to all the great folks and their help here at CastBoolits. I have wanted to cast bullets since I was a kid, but never got around to it. If it hadn't been for CB forum I still wouldn't have started.

Thanks,

Matt