Registered Guns

[jcwit]

Simple question here, I keep hearing about the Marine being held in Mexico for mistakenly crossing the boarder with 3 "I believe" long guns, all of them registered.

When did we start registering firearms in the U.S.

This is being reported on most networks, FOX included.

[beagle]

it may mean that he has them registered on the military post to which he is assigned. The military required that all firearms brought on a post be registered. If he lives in the troop billets, he is required to store them in the unit arms room./beagle

[Bullshop Junior]

They get registered in your name when you do the "yellow" forms.

[Idz]

remember he was in the police state of California

[jcwit]

They get registered in your name when you do the "yellow" forms.

That "Yellow" form is held by the retailer, no info regarding the firearm is transferred to the gov. at time of purchase, now after the retailer dies, goes out of business the forms are to be turned in, but that may be years later.

[starmac]

Aren't all guns registered in Cali.

[Bullshop Junior]

That "Yellow" form is held by the retailer, no info regarding the firearm is transferred to the gov. at time of purchase, now after the retailer dies, goes out of business the forms are to be turned in, but that may be years later.

When the dealer calls in the form the ATF gets all the info on the forum as well as the info on the gun. I grew up in a gun store. I've seen a thousand and more of those calls made. And I think the forums get mailed in yearly.

[shooterg]

I believe the dealer is 'sposed to hang onto Federal forms for 20 years. Lots of states(VA is one) have you fill out an almost identical form for the State Police. And ATF has twisted many dealers arms into providing information("forward trace") they weren't legally entitled to. Plus many folks assume the 4473 is de facto registration, though it isn't 'sposed to be.
In Mexico he'd go to jail just for having ammo in his vehicle. Few years back a Texas dealer(Bean?) got convicted of a Mexican felony for that, US took away his FFL and right to own a gun.

[lonewelder]

I thought it was like jcwit said.I had no idea filling out the form registered it to you.on a side note if he is still active duty isn't he govt. Property.and shouldn't they try to get him out.?

[Bullshop Junior]

I may be wrong but that is the way I understood it.

[FISH4BUGS]

I like my guns like Obama likes his voters - undocumented.

[DCP]

When the dealer calls in the form the ATF gets all the info on the forum as well as the info on the gun. I grew up in a gun store. I've seen a thousand and more of those calls made. And I think the forums get mailed in yearly.

Are you referring to a form 4473

The Form 4473 contains name, address, date of birth, government-issued photo ID, National Instant Criminal Background Check System (NICS) background check transaction number, make/model/serial number of the firearm, and a short federal affidavit stating that the purchaser is eligible to purchase firearms under federal law. Lying on this form is a felony and can be punished by up to five years in prison in addition to fines, even if the transaction is simply denied by the NICS, although prosecutions are rare in the absence of another felony committed with the gun purchased.

The dealer also records all information from the Form 4473 into their "bound-book". A dealer must keep this on file at least 20 years and is required to surrender the log to the Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms and Explosives (ATF) upon retirement from the firearms business. The ATF is allowed to inspect, as well as request a copy of the Form 4473 from the dealer during the course of a criminal investigation. In addition, the sale of two or more handguns to a person in a five-day period must be reported to ATF on Form 3310.4.

If a person purchases a firearm from a private individual who is not a licensed dealer, the purchaser is not required in most states to complete a Form 4473, though some states require individual sellers to sell through dealers.

These forms are given the same status as a tax return under the Privacy Act of 1974 and cannot be disclosed by the government to private parties or other government officials except in accordance with the Privacy Act. Individual dealers possessing a copy of the form are not subject to the Privacy Act's restrictions on disclosure. Dealers are required to maintain completed forms for 20 years in the case of completed sales and 5 years where the sale was denied by the NICS check coming back disapproved or other disqualifying information.

[dragon813gt]

What "yellow" forms? I've never filled one out that's any color except white. We have an illegal handgun registration here in PA. But long arms are not.

[MBTcustom]

When the dealer calls in the form the ATF gets all the info on the forum as well as the info on the gun. I grew up in a gun store. I've seen a thousand and more of those calls made. And I think the forums get mailed in yearly.

You are greatly mistaken. I am a dealer and I do transfers all the time. I explain to uninformed people that at no time do I communicate any part of the serial number, make or model of my clients firearm to the BATFE. I still have every "little yellow paper" (it's a 4473 form FYI) that I ever filled out on a client.
All they know is your name, address, SSN (only if you provided it), height, weight, eye color, gender,...........and weather I am transferring a long gun or a hand gun.
That's all they've got. They know who you are, where you live, and that you bought some pistols and rifles/shotguns. They don't know what kind they are, what brand they are, where they came from, how much you paid for them, what the serial numbers are, or how many round they hold. They are woefully behind the information curve, and the NRA is part of the reason you still have privacy.

So quit calling the little yellow paper "registration" it is'nt. Or if it is, its the most ridiculously backwards and busted form of gun registration ever devised by man.
The little yellow paper is so that the BATFE can keep an eye on the dealers not the buyers.

[jcwit]

What "yellow" forms? I've never filled one out that's any color except white. We have an illegal handgun registration here in PA. But long arms are not.

Used to be yellow a few years ago, they are white now.

[schutzen]

The Form 4473 is held by the dealer until his FFL is closed out. Then the forms are forwarded to the ATF in Martinsburg WVA were they are stored. The only information the FBI NICS check asks for the buyers name, SSN (optional, but approvals are quicker with the SSN), the buyers place of birth, the buyers state of residence, the buyers nationality (US Citizen), and the type of firearm (long gun, hand gun, or other). No other information about the firearm is transmitted to the FBI NICS.

[dragon813gt]

Never seen these yellow papers you speak of. I've only been buying firearms for fifteen years so I guess they were before my time. I can't tell you the last time I even filled one out by hand. Even the small guys that only do transfers are using computer programs that print everything out.

[lonewelder]

Yellow or white its the same form.sometimes they make small changes.I remember when there were no forms to fill out.and I don't think we are any better off since the forms.criminals by definition do not obay the law.most firearms used in crimes are stolen.

[ktw]

Michigan has had handgun registration for as long as I can remember. As in, you need to get a form from your local sheriff (often referred to as a 'permit to purchase') before the transaction. The dealer/seller needs to fill out the firearms details on that form. You need to return that form, completed and notarized, to the local sheriff after the purchase. For most of my life, you also had to present the firearm at the sheriff's office for a 'safety inspection' during which they confirmed the info on the form was correct and recorded several other details.

The process has eased up a bit over the last decade or so.
- Possession of a concealed weapons permit meant you could skip the permit to purchase.
- More recently, the licensed dealers have the purchase permit in stock, making it unnecessary to obtain one from the sheriff prior to the transaction if buying from a licensed dealer.
- It is no longer necessary to present the firearm at the Sheriff's office after the transaction. You still need to return the registration card, regardless of who you bought it from.

-ktw

[jcwit]

Thanks guys.

Bet the state of Cali. is the whole issue. Didn't even think of that as I'm in fly over country.