I Am Guilty...

[BCB]

Of doing most everything that some people “parrot” as being the biggest “no-no’s” ever know to reloaders just because they read it somewhere…

The picture is of a can of Brasso and a 30-30 Winchester case…

The case was soaked for 48 hours in a commercially available ammonia cleaner and then loaded with a 2.5 cc scoop of IMR-4831 (33-34 grains) and a 311041 was seated. CCI-200 primers were used and the boolit was heavily crimped into the case…

I fired this case 5 times and after each firing, I cleaned it with Brasso—just to add an extra dose of ammonia…

Nothing happened to the case…

SO, I soaked it for another 48 hours in the same ammonia cleaner and fired it 5 more times. And I used Brasso to clean again…

Still, no problems noted to the case. No cracks, bulges, and whatever’s. The case was full-lengthed sized each time. Plus, this case had been previously reloaded before the ammonia test…

This case has been reloaded and fired at least 15 times I would guess…

And it can be reloaded more times…

Now the ammonia test may not be proof that ammonia may only affect brass minimally as the total effect may be a slow chemical reaction and the brass may fail as time goes by—this I don’t know. But, I am planning on marking this piece of brass and putting it in my 30-30 die box and reload it sometime down the road of time—that might be more representative of the effects of ammonia…
(Never did know when to us “affect” or “effect”)

I have used Brasso in my cleaning media since I learned the “requirements” of Brasso during some time with Sam, and of the benefits of Brasso in cleaning my casings…

By the way:

I interchange primers other than listed in published data…

I use magnum primers sometimes when it calls for standard primers and visa-a-versa (is that a word?)…

I worked with powders of similar burning rates, other than listed in the data, working from the low charges upward…

I use bullet/boolits of similar weight when testing loading data from published data…

I have never used powder as fertilizers—never had any go bad…

I have mixed the same powder—an old canister that was almost done with a new canister…

I just hate it when people state things are wrong when they have never done them—only heard someone else say it or post it…

And finally, I ride an old Harley that has antique license plates, and I DO run with SCISSORS…

Good-luck…BCB

[dondiego]

You had better be careful with those scissors!

[Jaak]

I like you.

[EMC45]

I'm with you in a lot of what you've done and do. I have old powders that run just fine. I also have swapped data for given bullet weights to powder ratio and am still here to tell about it.

[snuffy]

There's theorys , then there's facts. Fact is that ammonia leaches zinc from brass, no doubt about it! Myself, I'm not willing to take the chance that the case might fail is I use a polish that affects the strength of brass.

Your load of IMR-4831 in a 30-30 is most likely a VERY low pressure load. Substitute using IMR-3031 or some other much faster powder, see what happens!?

Common sense is getting much less common now-a-days. A lot of the so-called cautions that get repeated on internet forums are not fact, not true, just myths. Repeat something often enough, it takes on believability, then becomes accepted fact. Question but verify.

[mdi]

Even an actual test, reported in all honesty won't convince some folks. Your test will be viewed as a "one in a million success", and they'll pick apart the test. I believe there a bunch of "facts" running around that in theory may be true, but in real life don't matter much....

BTW, thanks!

[BCB]

There's theorys , then there's facts. Fact is that ammonia leaches zinc from brass, no doubt about it! Myself, I'm not willing to take the chance that the case might fail is I use a polish that affects the strength of brass.

Your load of IMR-4831 in a 30-30 is most likely a VERY low pressure load. Substitute using IMR-3031 or some other much faster powder, see what happens!?

Common sense is getting much less common now-a-days. A lot of the so-called cautions that get repeated on internet forums are not fact, not true, just myths. Repeat something often enough, it takes on believability, then becomes accepted fact. Question but verify.

You may be correct with the pressure thing...

But, I have used Brasso with 270 Winchester, 6mm, and 7mm-08 and have had no problems...

But again, I never shot them 15 times either...

[ku4hx]

You sound like me. There are basically two types of "gun people": the readers and talkers who have read a lot and know a lot of high sounding words, and the doers who have done a lot and lived the true meaning of all the reader's high sounding words.

[finstr]

I've often heard and also subscribe to the theory of "it's not what you know, it's what you can get away with"!
As a thinking man I'm always wondering "what if ". It seems that if someone doesn't follow the rules then they're labeled wreckless or unsafe by others. Kudos to BCB for busting myths.
Btw, scissors are only fun to run with when they're open and your shoelaces are untied, jus' sayin'.....

[BCB]

I've often heard and also subscribe to the theory of "it's not what you know, it's what you can get away with"!
As a thinking man I'm always wondering "what if ". It seems that if someone doesn't follow the rules then they're labeled wreckless or unsafe by others. Kudos to BCB for busting myths.
Btw, scissors are only fun to run with when they're open and your shoelaces are untied, jus' sayin'.....

Interesting...Don't tempt me with the open scissors and untied shoelaces!!! I never gave that a thought...

[Mud Eagle]

You need to add reloading steel cases to your list.

[remy3424]

How about aluminum cases? Those steel cases do have a certain "tough" or "industrial" look to them. Does polish in the tumbler keep them from rusting?

[Char-Gar]

You dare not to follow conventional wisdom and dicta? Heretic!!!

PS: A very large slice of conventional wisdom is old wives tales, myths and other forms of krap.

[sparky45]

Char-Gar; I like the way you pontificate.

[375RUGER]

So let's see a pic of the Harley.

[fredj338]

Your assumption & test is flawed. Do the same thing, let the case sit for a year or two, then load it & get back to me. I have proven it to myself, ammonia & brass are not a good combo, never have been. It won't give you a catastrophic failure, just leads to premature neck or shoulder splits.
By all means though, continue to do things as you like. I have survived a car crash w/o a seat belt to, but don't recommend it.

[BCB]

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[BCB]

Your assumption & test is flawed. Do the same thing, let the case sit for a year or two, then load it & get back to me. I have proven it to myself, ammonia & brass are not a good combo, never have been. It won't give you a catastrophic failure, just leads to premature neck or shoulder splits.
By all means though, continue to do things as you like. I have survived a car crash w/o a seat belt to, but don't recommend it.

Indeed, and so have I...

Sometime last summer I shot some 270 Winchester loaded with 140 Hornady BTSP, 57 grains of H-4831, a CCI-250 primer that were originally loaded in 1990. That was some of the last rounds I loaded for my 270's using jacketed bullets...

That brass would have been cleaned in media using Brasso as I have done that since 1973. Didn't have a tumbler before then...

Guess each has their own experience...

BCB

[snuffy]

You need to add reloading steel cases to your list.

Indeed! I too raised an eyebrow at those nancyboys saying you CAN'T load steel cases. Apparently, some don't even want to shoot them as factory loads, that was all that was in the display case at wally-world a couple of months back. (In this case it was 45 ACP. 230 fmj). I bought a box, proceeded to empty them. Lousy accuracy! Dirty bore too. Tulla ammo.

I proceeded to load them with my standard load , 200gr. #68 H&G, 5.5 W-231. They loaded up just fine, the accuracy was as good as my brass loads. All 50 shells survived the entire process. That reminds me, time for reload #2!

quote;I interchange primers other than listed in published data…---Yeah, so who doesn't? As long as you start at the bottom charge, no problem.

quote;I use magnum primers sometimes when it calls for standard primers.---Yup me too, again start low and work up. In fact standard primers often work better in some magnum pistol/revolver loads.

quote;I worked with powders of similar burning rates, other than listed in the data, working from the low charges upward…---I did that a few times, most of the times I got acceptable loads. Once though, in a 7X30 Waters load for my 14" contender. I figured if IMR 4895 worked, why wouldn't IMR 4198? There was a good reason it was NOT in any manual, vertical stringing!!! Not unsafe, just not a useable load.

As for the rest, me too!

Now the main reason your brasso use in a tumbler did NOT cause problems, the ammonia evaporates almost as soon as you turn it on . Or as soon as it drys out. Brasso contains the right type and grit of abrasive for brass,,,--- DUH! Once the ammonia evaporates it's just a polishing agent.

[1Shirt]

Good thread! The last time I used brasso, it was to polish a Marine belt buckle-worked great! When my brass comes out of the tumbler it is clean and bright enough for me, but think I am inclined to agree with the ammonia evaporating etc. Old and new canister of the same powder mix=Guilty. Mag primer substitute if I run out of regular primers=Guilty. And most of the other stuff listed! T'aint all book learnin Magee!!!!
1Shirt!