Barrel as a Case Gauge?

[Gohon]

I can almost guarantee that the LFCD, the 4th die, is the culprit

I forgot all about Stainless saying he had the 4 die Lee set. Yes the LFCD will swage down cast bullets. I ran into that problem with the 45 Colt and 357 Magnum. Casts were being swaged down .0015-.0020 below what I wanted to shoot. My solution was to remove the carbide ring and the problem was solved.

So far from what I have read, you have seated a .4015 sized bullet after using the sizing and expander die on the case, then pulled the bullet and got a reading of .401-.4015. But, when you follow up with crimping the bullet with the LFCD and then pull the bullet, you get readings of .398-.399.

I think fredj338 may have hit on your problem. However, as geargnasher has said, take it one step at a time or you'll never figure out the real problem. You're getting a lot of good advise on here but it can be confusing. I thought the problem might be the expander die but now I'm leaning towards the LFCD.

[thx997303]

To see whether it is the LFCD's carbide ring, here's a trick.

Take the internals out of your expander die, and your FCD.

Swap the internals from the FCD into the expander die body.

Seat and crimp a boolit in a flared case.

Pull boolit and re measure.

[geargnasher]

I forgot about that *()&^(*&^% Lee FCD (that stands for Foul Cussing Device in certain calibers like this one, in others with the collet-type crimper it is extremely handy) since I threw the one from my .40 set in the trash some time ago, it will cause a world of problems swaging the brass and boolit together, it's like going through the resizing die all over again, but with the boolit installed. Don't use that ***, or if you do, follow the advice that has been given and punch out the carbide ring. You can "crimp'" just fine using the seating die, and in fact can seat and crimp in one operation if you set it up correctly. Since you should just be using the crimp shoulder to straighten out the bell and not actually turn the case mouth inward, you can seat/crimp together. If you were roll crimping in a crimp groove as in .357 Magnum often it is best to seat in one step and crimp in another with the seater plug removed.

I'll prep some brass tonight and send it out to you to try, but you have to promise not to use the FCD on it! Just seat the boolits where you want them, and make sure the bell is gone. If you feel more comfortable seat and crimp in two steps to make sure you don't overdo the crimp: Seat all the boolits in the batch, then pull the seater plug out and adjust the die down until you get your crimp right, then crimp them all. I set my crimp die up with a micrometer, checking the case mouth after each adjustment until it meausures the same as it does 1/8"-1/4" below the mouth. Your calipers will work just fine for this.

Gear

[stainless1911]

Does anybody know the diameter of the expander that's in the M die?

[geargnasher]

I pulled the primer feed and seater die out of the progressive last night and cranked out a few unprimed, sized, and expanded cases, they're on the way.

Gear

[stainless1911]

Thanks. I'll let you know what happens when I shoot them. Im probably going to have one of our posters here make a new expander for me, we have been discussing it. It all depends on the money.

[stainless1911]

This thread has been very helpful. I dont know how people got along without the internet.

[Charlie Two Tracks]

I had a real problem with leading on my .357 revolver. The guys here said it was the Lee seating die. sizing die and crimp die.. I knocked the carbide sizer out of the crimping die and still had the problem of leading. I turns out that the Lee seating die was reducing the size of my cast boolit. I bought a Lyman"M" exanding die and an RCBS seating die and that was the end of my problems. Have you pulled of boolit from a finished round? That told the tale for me. I am using a cast boolit at .360

[stainless1911]

Should the expander be made to .400 or to .401?

[stainless1911]

I took the carbide thing out of the FCD.

[geargnasher]

Should the expander be made to .400 or to .401?

Load some and shoot them with the brass I'm sending you and I'll answer that for you.

One thing I forgot to bring up here is copper fouling. Many shooters fail to clean ALL the copper fouling from their barrels before attempting to shoot cast and get bad lead fouling because of it. Lead adheres to copper and is sloughed off the boolit if it is fired in a copper-fouled barrel, then lead adheres to the lead fouling creating a snowball effect even if everything else is done right.

Gear

[stainless1911]

Thanks for the tip. I'll have the barrel shining like a new penny. er, um, no that isn't quite right... lol

[stainless1911]

Brass received, thanks much. I'll post the results as soon as I can get them out to the range.

[stainless1911]

I was thinking about having Accurate Molds do a brass custom mold for me, I was wondering what diameter to have it made to. I use a lee push through sizer they come out .4015 to .402, but I could always increase that dia. a wee bit if needed.

[geargnasher]

I'd go with .402" as-cast with WW metal, but my gun has a .401" groove, some are .400" I'm perfectly happy with the Lee mould, the TC design is accurate, proven (by others) to be quite deadly, and is very easy to cast with and load due to the bevel base. Personally, I would spend the money on your reloading dies first, then go on to a custom mould if you think you really need one for that gun.

PS PLEASE don't over-crimp those cases, it will make the whole experiment moot. Seat you boolits to the depth you want them without letting the cases touch the crimp restriction in the seating die (that means screw the seater plug all the way down and unscrew [raise] the die body until you get the seating depth you want), then remove the seater plug altogether and carefully lower (screw down) the die body until it just barely begins to crimp the case mouth, progress until it straightens the mouth but DOES NOT turn it inward or make it smaller than the rest of the case where the boolit is seated. Check it with your calipers, go slow, then make certain it will chamber after being straightened. Some chambers taper more than others toward the front, and remember that most chambers are made for J-word bullets and loaded cases are .001-002" or more smaller in diameter when loaded with copper bullets.

Gear

[stainless1911]

Thanks. I'll go slow.

[stainless1911]

My as cast "Lyman" bullets are not round. .404 to .409 in the same round.

[stainless1911]

If it's legal, I can send you a barrel slug, a round or two that I cast and sized, and a couple rounds that I loaded from the brass you sent me.

[thx997303]

It's legal to do so, so long as you follow ORM-D guidelines.

Here's a good link.

http://www.adazonusa.com/howtoshipam...ammo-a-45.html

[geargnasher]

If it's legal, I can send you a barrel slug, a round or two that I cast and sized, and a couple rounds that I loaded from the brass you sent me.

No need, you seem to have a pretty good handle on what you're doing, just make sure the rounds will chamber.

If your Lyman mould is dropping boolits that far out of round and that large, you have a problem with the mould. Check for little bits of lead "flashing" stuck to the faces of the blocks, it is common to get a little speck of lead in there and squish it to the blocks when closing, thus holding them open just a few thousandths when you're casting. Do a "daylight" test of the blocks, they should go together with zero light coming between the blocks. Open the sprue plate, close the blocks tight with the handles, and peer into the cavities with a flashlight shining on the underside of the mould. If no light is visible inside the cavity I'd say the mould is bad, but I'd put money on a bet that you have trash between the blocks, a burr, or the alignment pins stick out too far.

Gear