Why Knock Lee Equipment??

[zuke]

I picked up a Loadmaster and after watching all the vid's I could find in tweaking this,filing that watch for this and don't do that I'm up and running.
It's the REALLY S****Y instruction's included with it that cause problem's.
I decap,size,prime,flare,charge,seat and use the factory crimp die.
All this for 45Win Mag, a caliber I bought this press for exclusively.
I've had some boo boo's but took it slow, ran it without anything in it at all to see how it work's and generally got familiar with it.
When it came time to load up I did one case at a time for awhile till I got familiar with it.
When i put the case feeder on it same thing,look-learn-listen.
I've picked up spare part's,just in case and have crunched a primer slider/feeder.
It's a learning curve with this press, a LOT happen's with EVERY up and downstroke.
Run it empty and LOOK. Wear it in a bit DRY, high spot's show themselve's and can then be taken care of.
You wouldn't drive in a big city the first day you learned to drive a Standard would you?

[dogtrainer12]

I thought I had lost my 1.0 cc powder scoop from my Powder Measure Kit so I called Lee and they mailed me another one for free. Later, I discovered (found) the lost scoop.

I have used the Powder Measure Kit extensively to work up loads for newly acquired cartridge calibers and have had great success with Lee's Powder Measure Kit; it is fast, effective, and repeatable. I almost have no use for a powder scale.

[Cowboy T]

Yep, true. Lee Precision actually has good customer service. Gotta agree there. They have replaced a few parts for me with no fuss, no muss. And their service folks are here in the USA, not offshored to India or China or Wherever Else. I like that.

I've got Lee's Powder Measure Kit, too. For my lightweight .357 Magnum load w/ Bullseye, the 0.5cc scoop nails it perfectly. Once the load's developed, I bang out the rounds with a Pro Auto-Disk Powder Measure sitting on a Pro 1000. However, I do use a traditional beam powder scale to confirm things, both with the dippers and the Auto-Disk (the first five or so). For me, the peace of mind is worth it.

Their $30 "Lee Reloader Press" single stage is now being used to teach the g/f how to reload. What an amazing value that little press is. Does the job just great.

Richard and John Lee, I gotta hand it to ya. Again.

[Greenhorn44]

It is very intersting everyones views about Lee. It seems that this information is very helpful in the final persuation on purchasing Lee equipment. I feel more confident in my lee equipment, thats for sure. I will post some pics of my bench now that im all healed up.

Lets make this a sticky.....Please

[johnlaw484]

My Lee Loadmaster works, it works poorly but it works. Parts kept wearing out, the primer seater is a joke. Once I started hand priming the other problems went away. No more suprises with detonated primers in the press and dirty underwear.

[copdills]

To me its all a matter of what your wanting to get out of your tools. If you making persion long range rifle rounds thats harder to get over and over using cheaper products. If you making pistol rounds for plinking and dont need to mass produce lee may be your answer. I have 4 brands of presses most are lees. I use the hand press and the little table press and the o press for seating primmers thats all they got to do they work fine and were cheap. I use the turret presses for my pistols not looking for much out of them most are shot by my kids and we know how most kids shoot. For my hunting rounds rifle I use a RCBS single. Now as far as cost I got most of my press used and in trades all 12 of them cost me less than a dillon press. Maybe that will help you out on your thoughts. Kind of like you need a 6 sided boxed in wrench or hey these channel locks will work too.

+1 on what Ricky P said , sounds like we have the same setup

[EMC45]

I will relay my experiences with the group here as I have before.............The first time I pulled the handle on a reloader was in 1998. It was a Rockchucker. I have wanted to reload for as long as I can remember. I have been shooting since 1982. I had a buddy that is a dyed in the wool tried and true Dillon man. If it aint blue it is cr@p! I loaded on his 550 as well and I know it is a good press. As far as he was concerned the Lee products are a novelty and no good........His opinion and advice kept me out of reloading for a long time. I thought I HAD to have Dillon...I knew I could not afford it as a young E-3 so I didn't bother getting anything. I asked him "what about RCBS"? "Well they are ok I guess" he would say, "but you really need a progressive like my Dillon 550".....Jump forward to about 2002-3..I was looking at getting the Supreme Kit from RCBS, which I ended up getting. I liked it and was satisfied that I got "what I needed". I continued to look down my nose at Lee the whole while. I linked up with a local reloader that advised that Lee was far from junk. I laughed....He has been reloading longer than I have been alive and he continued to "school" me on the benefits of Lee equipment......Well I had been bashing Lee even long before I started reloading and could not stomach the thought of anything Red on my bench......I bought a set of Lee .308 dies second hand online and loaded some ammo for a sniper on the local PD. He shot a .416 5 shot group or there abouts at 100 yards with the ammo....My mind started to change...I started to get into casting and Lee was the cheapest way to get started. I bought a couple molds and push through kits and pan lubed and shot up a pile of Lee bullets. I started after all this to load up my bench with all that "red junk" and I haven't looked back at all! I have several Lee dies sets, all my molds except 3 are Lee, I have a Lee C frame press, a Classic Cast I got for 30 bucks new!!!!, PPM (which is super accurate), and a bunch of other stuff. I just got a set of Lee .32 L/MAG dies from Miidway that were on clearance. They were about half the price of RCBS. I like Lee. I will continue to like them.

[Cowboy T]

Dillon is good gear, no doubt. But too many folks who buy Dillon gear are like the Apple Mac fanboys. They spent all this money, so they've got to somehow justify that expenditure in their minds. That means (to them) that anything "other than what I bought" is obviously inferior. You also see a similar phenomenon in the audiophile arena (just Google for "magic cables" and "audiophile" and you'll see what I mean).

Why knock Lee equipment? Because the one knocking it owns something else.

[1hole]

"Their $30 "Lee Reloader Press" single stage is now being used to teach the g/f how to reload. What an amazing value that little press is. Does the job just great."


True and it brings up a personal test you may be interested in reading about. Bottom line, those who slime Lee's alum presses in knee jerk reaction don't know what they are talking about.

As a reloader of some 45 years who has owned a lot of tools in many brands and used many that I haven't owned. I drink no one's Kool-Aid. I have learned that all brands have strengths and weaknesses and color or price is a very poor guide for what's "best" of anything, it all works fine if the user knows what he's doing! (Not much works well if the user is a mechanical klutz tho.)

I have long used a Rock Chucker, bought some 25 years ago largely because of all the hype. Also have two of the small "cheap, flimsy Lee alum alloy/pot metal" "C" frame Reloader presses for using a universal decapper and a Lee Auto Prime II. (Love that system for high volume priming work.)

A few years ago I bought a mechinest type dial indicator and magetic base and immediately went to measuring a lot of stuff in my shop. Soon decided to test the flex/spring on the RC while FL sizing .30-06 brass. Found it was a fairly consistant 3 thou, not a lot but much more than I had assumed. Okay, so why not do the same test (same die, same box of cases) on both Reloaders just to see how poor they are. Nada. Nothing my .001" reading dial gage could actually measure, they were nearly totally rigid! On a LEE PRESS, and a little one at that... now EVERYONE KNOWS THAT CAN'T BE TRUE, LESS FLEX ON A LEE THAN AN RC? NO WAY! But, it's true. And press rigidity IS an asset in making precision hand loads, is it not?

Now let me make this clear...understand that I am NOT saying the little presses are stronger than the massive O framed iron press, only saying that within the yield limits Lee's hard alum. alloys ARE more rigid than cast iron.


For dies, I've found as much average difference between dies of the same brand as between brands; why not, they're all made to the same SAMMI tolerances. Those tolerances are a range and anything within that range is fully in tolerance. Tolerances are not spot-on dimensions they can aim for and hopefully, if we pay more, we might get a "closer, more precise" fit. That just isn't the way the tolerance range idea works. So, Lee's dies fit and work as well as any of their type but paying more gets prettier dies!

Forster and Redding BR/Comp dies are tied for first place because of their design, (not better tolerances, as such). All others are tied for second place, including Lee and RCBS. And that includes the very expensive green box "gold metal/competition" die sets; their side loading bullet windows are cute and easy to use but don't do a thing for concentricity. Nor does anyone's nice micrometer seating die stems make for better accuracy.

[Cowboy T]

+1 to make this a sticky. This thread has grown impressively, what with 9 pages and all.

[mold maker]

I've always said ya pay for what ya get, not the other way around. If polish and color of paint is most important, in the tool you use, to make the exact same product, than get the prettiest and most costly available and brag away.
I on the other hand am only interested in the end product quality, and the ammount there of. LEE equipment leaves me a bunch of money to buy primers and powder.
The way I see it, a $2500. setup is worthless with no money left for supplies.
Don't get me wrong, I've got some of all of them, but by far the most NEW stuff is always LEE. I'm about to order yet another set of LEE dies, for a new, to me, caliber. Part of the price of a new gun came from savings on LEE equipment.

[Crash_Corrigan]

I agree with johnlaw484 as above. I had a Lee Loadmaster and when properly set up and run at a reasonable speed there was a lot going on and you could get really decent reloads done fast.

The hangup with primer system was something I never could get fixed. I ended up decapping all my brass by hand by running them thru a Lee Challenger Press with the proper sizing die. Then I would prime them by hand with a Lee Auto Prime. Then with a clean, primed and sized size I could run them through the Loadmaster and make a buncha boolts fast by closing down the priming station totally.

Since then I have gone Dillon. It has the most trouble free priming system I have ever worked with. If you keep the tubes clean and the slide device clean it seems to work almost 100 % of the time. When it does not you can feel the change of resistance in the press handle and you can remove the primerless case from the shelplate and motor on. The square deal is even better. It nevers seems to miss but the speed is the limiting factor there.

If I could afford it I would have a Squre Deal Dillon for every pistol calibre I shoot but alas I do not have the disposable income. I leave the Square Deal for my .45 ACP's, the 550B for most everything else including .223's and 30-30's, a Lee Classic Turret Press for my 30-06, 6.5 Sweede, 303 and 8 MM's. The single stage press trio are used for decapping and for precision target work on rifle rounds for competition.

I have all colors of the rainbow on my bench and I use them all. Lee provides good value for the money and if I did not start with them I never would have started this addiction. I like Dillon's products but they also have some issues from time to time. You really need to lubricate the 550B properly and regularly. Keeping them clean is also an requirement.

The Lee dies are a real bargain however sometimes the Dillon Pistol dies do a better job in a progressive.

When I need something I go to the Midway website and I find a choice of many different brands for what I want. I do not always buy the cheapest item. I have some Redding and Hornaday dies. They are the Cadillac of dies and are pieces of art in metal. Are they worth the extra 50 to 100% more than a comprable Lee product? Maybe not but if I am feeling flush and good about myself I spring for the more expensive item.

I drive a 25 year old truck because it works. I drive a 2 year old Triumph Motorcycle because it works wonderfully, is well made and the parts ain't fall offa the bike and leave me stranded. I used to ride HD's but the costs and the lousy performance put me off and I went to Triumph.

I prefer to buy something made here in the USA but if the difference in performance, quality, value and price is too much I will buy it from overseas.

Example, New Balance sneakers. I bought those and used them from the early 60's and they were made in Mass. For the last few years they have been made overseas. They became uncompetitive when made by US workers in the USA because of the higher costs of labor here. The competing shoes made overseas were cheaper and of comparable quality and were a much better value. New Balance had to stay alive and moved their manufacturing overseas to keep on making shoes.

Some of the stuff that RCBS is now having made overseas is not of similiar quality and the prices are not much cheaper so they have lost my business. Lyman molds quality has gone down badly in the last few years and I no longer buy their products in the molds area. Sweede's NOE out of neighborhing Utah puts out a great product in a reasonable period of time. Mihec and his operation in Europe is also making a wonderful product and doing well. I have 3 of his molds. Lee's miserable performance in the group buy field over the last 6 years has been insane. Now I am told that the demand is down for Lee group buys and thier productions are a lot faster and better. Too bad, so sad....they have lost my business in that area.

I love having the freedom of choice in spending my bucks on whatever suits me. I will not knock Lee for their products but I have the final say on who gets my business as we all do.

[Lee]

This doesn't belong in a "sticky". It belongs in the Humor & Off Topic section, right along with Fords/Chevys/Beemers/Volvos/Dimocraps/Republiturds.
Everyone, no matter how ignorant, misguided, misinformed, is entitled to an opinion. Whether or not it is worth spit, is up to the listener.

[jcwit]

1. They look like they are made from pot metal. I will have no pot metal anything in my house.

Thats a joke, you need to look a little closer at what you have in your house. Also take a look at your vehicle.

[deerslayer]

4. And all my presses (Dillon, Hollywood, C-H, Herters, and Lyman) were made in the U.S. Can Lee say that?



Aren't Lee made in US?

[jonk]

Why don't I use Lee equipment?

1. They look like they are made from pot metal. I will have no pot metal anything in my house.
2. At this point in my life I don't want what everyone else has. I want equipment that is "off the beaten" path and can show them off to fellow reloaders. That's why many of my presses are no longer made.
3. I want equipment that is well made and will outlast me. Several of my presses are almost as old as I am (55) but don't look it and operate as good as when they were new.
4. And all my presses (Dillon, Hollywood, C-H, Herters, and Lyman) were made in the U.S. Can Lee say that?

1. The only pot metal parts I'm aware of (actually compressed aluminum powder) are the toggle link on the old style Challenger press, handle on the O frame and progressive presses, and the primer ram on some auto prime 2 tools. And yes, I agree with you, those are chinsy parts (glad to say some of them are now steel on the new production).
2. That's cool. I respect that even if I don't do it myself with regards to reloading stuff.
3. A Lee classic cast press or any of their dies will outlast you, your kids, your grandkids, and their kids to boot, unless abused in some fashion.
4. Yes indeed they can say that. Made right here in the USA.

[cheese1566]

Thats a joke, you need to look a little closer at what you have in your house. Also take a look at your vehicle.

And your kitchen small appliances...blenders, mixers...

[20nickels]

Lee makes good stuff and some of it is very innovative and you can't get anywhere else (FCD). They also make some cheap entry level stuff that should not be used for high stress, high volume loading. Just do your research on what you buy. Funny, nobody bashes other companies for being overpriced.
SFLiberal, there is a difference in cables. Unfortunately there are also ripoff artists out there.

[Kevin Rohrer]

I stand corrected. The information I had was wrong and I deleted my post.

[zuke]

I think the priming tool linkage is one of the worst culpert's.
A friend with "big hand's" snapped 3 of'em and was going on about junk tool's. I pointed out to hom I've had mine for close to 20 year's with no problem's.
I then asked him if he greased the pivot/contact point's and thing's got real quiet.
Use a little common sense people, and a little lube here and there.