.45 AR loads in ACP cases?

[StarMetal]

There is a tiny amount of metal relieved from the star on my cylinder. Doesn't hurt anything. I know of two other cylinders that have been done, and they were relieved at the star a tiny bit.

That clears it up. Nice idea. Thanks for the picture.

Joe

[Bullshop Junior]

Why buy the 45 AR's when you can shorten cracked 45 colts? Then you don't have to pay to modify the cylinder.

[Dale53]

Softpoint;
That's a nice picture that fully illustrates the conversion.

Bullshop Junior;
My Ruger .45ACP cylinder will not permit shortened Colt cases to chamber (the revolver doesn't have sufficient headspace for the rims). If you mean to shorten the Colt cases to ACP length to use in your Colt cylinder, that'll work. However, it TOO presents a potential problem. Some shortened Colt cases might have reduced capacity compared to same length .45 ACP cases. It needs to be checked before you start using them without measuring case capacity.

The "other" solution (albeit more expensive) is to simply use .45 Cowboy Special cases. They have the same capacity as .45 Auto Rim and .45 ACP cases but have the .45 Colt rim. This is for use in the .45 Colt cylinder (there is insufficient headspace in the .45 ACP cylinder to use these cases).

FWIW, a bit confusing, but fun to explore...
Dale53

[Bullshop Junior]

Softpoint;
That's a nice picture that fully illustrates the conversion.

Bullshop Junior;
My Ruger .45ACP cylinder will not permit shortened Colt cases to chamber (the revolver doesn't have sufficient headspace for the rims). If you mean to shorten the Colt cases to ACP length to use in your Colt cylinder, that'll work. However, it TOO presents a potential problem. Some shortened Colt cases might have reduced capacity compared to same length .45 ACP cases. It needs to be checked before you start using them without measuring case capacity.

The "other" solution (albeit more expensive) is to simply use .45 Cowboy Special cases. They have the same capacity as .45 Auto Rim and .45 ACP cases but have the .45 Colt rim. This is for use in the .45 Colt cylinder (there is insufficient headspace in the .45 ACP cylinder to use these cases).

FWIW, a bit confusing, but fun to explore...
Dale53

I have no problem cambering 45 short colts in my ACP cylinder.

I did a side by side comparison and Star-line, and R-P (The two brands I have the most of) have more capacity then ACP cases, and I could load them up with 2gr more of the same powder then I could the ACP brass.

[softpoint]

Why buy the 45 AR's when you can shorten cracked 45 colts? Then you don't have to pay to modify the cylinder.

True, except the shortened .45 colt won't work in my Smith & Wessons. And interchangeability is the reason I had my Blackhawk cylinder countersunk. I keep my revolver loads separate from my 1911 loads that way. I sometimes load the Lyman 452424 (Ithink?) in loads for both revolver and auto pistol, only I sometimes use 14 gr. of 2400 inthe revolver loads. And, the Auto Rim cases are much easier to deal with in the Smith & Wessons for field loads than having to use the moon clips.

[StarMetal]

I have no problem cambering 45 short colts in my ACP cylinder.

I did a side by side comparison and Star-line, and R-P (The two brands I have the most of) have more capacity then ACP cases, and I could load them up with 2gr more of the same powder then I could the ACP brass.

Junior,

Is your Ruger the new or old model? Mine is the old model and on the 45 Colt the cylinders are counterbored and the Colt rims fit entirely inside them and the cylinder is just a hair shy of being up against the recoil shield. I too doubt a 45 Colt case shortened to 45acp length would fit either because of the tight clearance between the cylinder and recoil shield...where as that countersunk idea would.

Joe

[NHlever]

Well, I got my answer, and Bullshop Jr seems to have the right answer on capacities. I got Quickload for Christmas, and it showed up today. Using their default seating depths for the Lee 255 grain boolit, the ACP case shows much higher pressure than the AR case does. The program is nice to let you just switch between cases, and leave the load data the same.

[Bullshop Junior]

Mine is a 1990 NM. It was sent back to the factory about 2 years ago and had a new barrel, and two new cylinders fit.

[StarMetal]

Bullshop Junior,

This evening I found a split 45 Colt case, a Remington. So I trimmed it down to fit my 45acp cylinder. I thought well I'll load it and shoot just one tomorrow to see how it does. I sized the case, trimmed, then expanded it for the bullet. Primer, powder, seated the bullet. That's when the problem began. Even going into the seater it got sized down some. Even with that little sizing seating the bullet there is no way in Tarnation that cartridge was going to fit my acp cylinder. So then I looked among my dies that would size it a little further. I found something, sized it, and it fit. I'm positive the bullet is undersized now. I may just pull it apart to verify that. I'm at the conclusion that either your acp cylinder has really exaggerated chambers or that you're sizing the things down much as I have and shooting, I'll bet, an undersized bullet. I didn't think there was any free ticket with cutting down and using 45 Colt cases in the acp cylinder and I'm still thinking that. The only way I see to do that correctly is to inside ream the case or outside neck trim it.

Joe

[Bullshop Junior]

Bullshop Junior,

This evening I found a split 45 Colt case, a Remington. So I trimmed it down to fit my 45acp cylinder. I thought well I'll load it and shoot just one tomorrow to see how it does. I sized the case, trimmed, then expanded it for the bullet. Primer, powder, seated the bullet. That's when the problem began. Even going into the seater it got sized down some. Even with that little sizing seating the bullet there is no way in Tarnation that cartridge was going to fit my acp cylinder. So then I looked among my dies that would size it a little further. I found something, sized it, and it fit. I'm positive the bullet is undersized now. I may just pull it apart to verify that. I'm at the conclusion that either your acp cylinder has really exaggerated chambers or that you're sizing the things down much as I have and shooting, I'll bet, an undersized bullet. I didn't think there was any free ticket with cutting down and using 45 Colt cases in the acp cylinder and I'm still thinking that. The only way I see to do that correctly is to inside ream the case or outside neck trim it.

Joe

Joe,
I am just loading them in 45 ACP dies, and they drop right in, but I did find that my ACP cylinder is messed up.

What is the outside diameter where the boolit is on your round? Mine is .471" in a R-P 45 Colt case

[StarMetal]

Joe,
I am just loading them in 45 ACP dies, and they drop right in, but I did find that my ACP cylinder is messed up.

What is the outside diameter where the boolit is on your round? Mine is .471" in a R-P 45 Colt case

I too used the 45acp dies. I'll go measure mine and let you know.

Joe

[StarMetal]

Daniel,

Mine measures where the bullet is at .4756. I size my 45's at .452.

That's the largest that chamber will take too.

Joe

[Bullshop Junior]

Ok I am sizing my boolits .451".
Still it should not make that much difference......
My trimmer pilot might be taking out some metal.....

Also, I tried sizing some fired ones in a 45 colt die, and they still fit in the ACP cylinder.

[StarMetal]

Ok I am sizing my boolits .451".
Still it should not make that much difference......
My trimmer pilot might be taking out some metal.....

Also, I tried sizing some fired ones in a 45 colt die, and they still fit in the ACP cylinder.

I don't think that it. I made a mistake that case is a Starline not a Remington. Do you get the same size/fit no matter what brand brass?

Joe

[StarMetal]

Bullshop Junior and others,

If you've been following along you know I cut down a split 45 Colt Starline case to fit my 45 acp then loaded it. I had to size the case down a little more with the bullet in it. Okay...today I took that bullet out and by that I mean I didn't change it's diameter in doing so. It miked at .449. That's way under acceptable size for use in the 45 Ruger. Daniel we're not getting the whole story from you. Something is different about your 45acp cylinder.

Joe

[Bullshop Junior]

OK,
I did some more testing today.
I took and loaded some up in 45 Colt dies, and the cases where WAY bulged. where the boolit is it was .478", and would not chamber. So I ran it in my ACP seater die, and did note some "Sizing" marks on the case. It chambered tight. Pulled the boolit and it was
.449". I ran it in my Lee crimp die (I was doing this), and then pulled the boolit and it miked at .444".

So Joe was right and I was wrong.
Sorry for trying to prove you wrong Joe.

[StarMetal]

OK,
I did some more testing today.
I took and loaded some up in 45 Colt dies, and the cases where WAY bulged. where the boolit is it was .478", and would not chamber. So I ran it in my ACP seater die, and did note some "Sizing" marks on the case. It chambered tight. Pulled the boolit and it was
.449". I ran it in my Lee crimp die (I was doing this), and then pulled the boolit and it miked at .444".

So Joe was right and I was wrong.
Sorry for trying to prove you wrong Joe.

Daniel,

You posted this. I was interested. Nobody proved anyone wrong. Sure would be nice if it worked. You know the make these real short Cowboy cases. I have the website. I'm wondering too if the Schoefield cases may be thinner. I'll still save my split neck cases and maybe neck turn them. I think it's a cool idea.

Joe

[Bullshop Junior]

I was thinking that I might try to get a .452" inside neck turner.

[StarMetal]

I was thinking that I might try to get a .452" inside neck turner.

Part of the problem Daniel is the 45 acp case is tapered and although some say not much, it's very apparent in my 45 acp cylinder. That round I loaded would go in easy about halfway and get tight fast. I think I'll go with outside neck turning as then I won't have a limiting ledge inside the case to prevent seating a longer bullet.

Joe

[Bullshop Junior]

Part of the problem Daniel is the 45 acp case is tapered and although some say not much, it's very apparent in my 45 acp cylinder. That round I loaded would go in easy about halfway and get tight fast. I think I'll go with outside neck turning as then I won't have a limiting ledge inside the case to prevent seating a longer bullet.

Joe

I have a forester out side turner, I might try that.