RotoMetals2Reloading EverythingLoad DataLee Precision
MidSouth Shooters SupplyTitan ReloadingWidenersInline Fabrication
Repackbox
Page 2 of 3 FirstFirst 123 LastLast
Results 21 to 40 of 41

Thread: The Definitive Answer page for Lead and Alloys!

  1. #21
    Boolit Mold TangoDownPro's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2013
    Location
    Englewood, CO
    Posts
    20
    I really like that page, thank you for the link. Newb question here - what do most of you prefer casting with (ingots), Linotype, Monotype, etc. I notice you can pick up some Linotype lead from eBay for a fair price (often free shipping). From the link listed above, Linotype seems good-to-go as is. Thank you.
    A firearm is only an instrument. It contains no evil, no conscience, and no ability. It is strictly the intent, competence, and character of its user that decide the outcome of any and all actions taken with it.

  2. #22
    Boolit Bub
    Join Date
    Nov 2005
    Posts
    64
    I have always used WW for pistol bullets wit very good results. I just started trying .30 rifle bullets and find it very hard to keep wrinkles out. A few weeks ago an older gentleman gave about 100 pieces of strips that are 1/2" wide and about 12" long. He said they would help the WW pour better. These strips have national lead co. written on them with the number 111 stamped on. Anyone know what this is?

  3. #23
    Boolit Grand Master



    cbrick's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2005
    Location
    Kalifornia Escapee
    Posts
    8,034
    If you bend them do they make a crinkling sound (crying)?

    Rick
    "The people never give up their freedom . . . Except under some delusion." Edmund Burke

    "Let us remember that if we suffer tamely a lawless attack on our liberty, we encourage it." Samuel Adams

    NRA Benefactor Life Member
    CRPA Life Member

  4. #24
    Boolit Bub
    Join Date
    Nov 2005
    Posts
    64
    No they don't but they do feel light for pure lead.

  5. #25
    Boolit Master

    Rattlesnake Charlie's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2007
    Location
    Victor, CO
    Posts
    1,377
    A Google search on National Lead Co yielded the following, plus more not of a nature to help with clarification of what the gentleman gifted.



    http://archive.org/stream/NationalLe...o.47j_djvu.txt

    DUTCH BOY 111

    This is the highest grade solder sold under the
    Dutch Boy trademark. It is guaranteed to be made
    of new lead and new tin, carefully mixed in equal
    parts (50% tin and 50% lead). Its melting range is
    361 °F 421°F.

    Dutch Boy 1 1 1 is bright, strong and free from
    impurities. It flows easily, covers more area and
    has superior adhesion. It is widely used for new
    roofing work and is popular among tinsmiths,
    manufacturers and canners. Sold in bars weighing
    approximately \ x /i lbs.



    Some interesting history on the company itself.
    http://www.library.hbs.edu/hc/lehman...l_lead_company

  6. #26
    Boolit Bub
    Join Date
    Nov 2005
    Posts
    64
    What should I use for a mixing rate with Wheel weights, one pound of the 111 to 10 pounds WW? I'm new to usin anything other than WW.

  7. #27
    Boolit Grand Master



    cbrick's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2005
    Location
    Kalifornia Escapee
    Posts
    8,034
    I would use Charlie's info of 50/50, use your calculator to figure out Sn in your WW alloy at 2% of the total weight. In round numbers (I didn't do the math) it should be about 1/2 pound of your solder to 10 pounds WW. It will do you no good to go higher than 2% Sn so you can make it go further. This is assuming you separated the clip-on weights from the stick-on weights and are using the clip-ons.

    Rick
    "The people never give up their freedom . . . Except under some delusion." Edmund Burke

    "Let us remember that if we suffer tamely a lawless attack on our liberty, we encourage it." Samuel Adams

    NRA Benefactor Life Member
    CRPA Life Member

  8. #28
    Boolit Grand Master popper's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2011
    Posts
    10,572
    I'm not a metallurgist but I have been researching this a lot lately. I find that there is no 'alloy' of lead & antimony, just a mixture. Sb/Sn, Sb/Cu, Sn/Pb etc. No Pb/Sb. Sb will precipitate out of the mixture first, the pour cools from outside-in so the outside of the CB is high Sb/Pb, inside is lower Sb/Pb (read antimony wash in the bore). Secondly, Sb mobility in a solid is way low, so globs of Sb in the melt stay where they are in the solid. Sn, Cu & As move quite a bit in the solid, Sn tends to glob if allowed. Normal practice is to use Sn to lock up all the Sb for a harder, more homogeneous alloy (1/3 ratio). As is used to reduce the size of the Sb globs. As, S, Cu actually alloy (go into the Pb lattice) and strengthen the Pb. In the liquidus state, all the molecules are 'happy' they go where they want. As the melt cools, some become less happy. Rapid cooling make lots of really unhappy molecules, they're stuck. Given time, some will become more happy. Unhappy is what we want in our cast boolits. Makes for a stronger and homogeneous metal. Now when I start cooking the PC coated cast I find that 1/2 hr @ 400 then fast cooled gives me hard alloy. Unfortunately, 10 min @ 400F (H-T coating) then fast cooled gives me soft alloy. In fact heating to 200F gives a soft alloy. So I turned unhappy into happy very easily. I'm running more tests this week to see how I can easily make them unhappy. It isn't just the fast cooling or time at temp. Any ideas?

  9. #29
    Boolit Bub like it all's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2013
    Posts
    71
    This thread is why I really like this forum. This information is invaluable in making "Boolits". Thanks fellas!

  10. #30
    Boolit Grand Master popper's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2011
    Posts
    10,572
    Pretty good article on Pb alloys. Discusses a lot of the additives we use. Interesting that zinc in a small amount is actually a grain refiner like arsenic.
    http://www.artec-machine.com/wp-cont...nvironment.pdf
    Whatever!

  11. #31
    Boolit Man
    Join Date
    Feb 2010
    Posts
    97
    I've got a big hunk of pure lead, so if I want to shoot it, I need some hunks of pure antimony, and some hunks of pure tin or pewter, mix em all up and I'm good? I see antimony on ebay for $10/lb. Tin runs about $20/lb, pewter seems to be lucky finds in thrift stores and such. Am I on the right track? Been looking at this hunk of lead for years, ready to shoot it up. Also might start mining the berms at the range, would I be safe to assume it's also pure lead and mix the same hunks of metal into it to make it shootable? Thanks all.
    Last edited by ThaDoubleJ; 05-22-2017 at 12:37 AM.

  12. #32
    Boolit Bub
    Join Date
    Sep 2013
    Location
    Alaska
    Posts
    68
    doubleJ- That all depends on what is the intended use for your lead. Just plinking stuff, full out magnum, or rifle loads. Bumpo has a calculator spreadsheet found on this site for calculating alloys. As for mining the berms that depends on what was shot into them. Most jacketed lead core bullets will average about 3-5% Antimony, Cast would be a guess, Black powder shooters favor pure or near pure lead. Now the real question, do you know your stash is pure lead? Without that knowledge then everything else as far as alloying go's would be a WAG. If your looking to alloy, then I would recommend, lead free solder for tin and antimony addition, (95Sn/5Sb) instead of pure antimony or tin. Much easier to work with. If that will not get you to your desired percentages, then rotometals high Sb alloy (30% Sb) can be an option. Again you'll need bumpo's alloy calculator to figure out what percentage of Sb/Sn/Pb you're trying to achieve.bushman

  13. #33
    Boolit Man
    Join Date
    Feb 2010
    Posts
    97
    All pistol, all plinking. My .454 loads may see 1600fps, but I'll probably hi-tek everything anyway. The lead sheet I have is from an Xray room's wall at an old hospital, and I can scratch it with my fingernail, bends like butter, so I figure it's all lead. Just mix in plumber's solder? Sounds easier than cutting up hunks of antimony. I've mined the cast/coated/lubed boolits from the berms in the past with luck, but there seems to be 20:1 more jacketed stuff in there, so I figured I'd dig up a bucket of that and give it a shot. The cowboy guys tend to favor one set of berms, while the tacticool guys use the other side, so I could probably come up with more cast by switching up where I mine as well.

    Edit: I googled Rotometals, I think all my answers are there, pre alloyed everything.
    Double Edit: Not all my answers, that spreadsheet by Bumpo is a work of genius. I owe him a beer.
    Last edited by ThaDoubleJ; 05-22-2017 at 08:09 PM.

  14. #34
    Boolit Bub
    Join Date
    Dec 2017
    Location
    Marietta, GA
    Posts
    56
    Question about antimony. I've ordered almost pure lead and want (need?) to add some tin and antimony to it to harden it. I've used the Excel Calculator so I think I know about how much tin and antimony i need. Given that Antimony melts at such a high temperature, should I buy lead from Rotometals like "SuperHard" which is 30% antimony or should I just buy the antimony pellets and try to melt them in my pot with the pure lead and tin? Given the prices it would seem that buying the Antimony pellets would be a more effective solution but I don't think I've ever run my casting pot as hot as 1167 degrees.

    So do I buy SuperHard and Pewter to do the job or buy Tin and Antimony and do the mixing myself?

  15. #35
    Boolit Master
    Join Date
    Sep 2016
    Posts
    2,659
    Melting pure antimony takes more heat than most home operations can manage, And I've read of potential toxicity issues for the processor. It's true that lower temperatures can be used to dissolve antimony into lead (similar to dissolving table salt into warm water rather than trying to melt the solid crystals directly), and I've read of members here who have done it, but it still sounds take a technique that requires time and effort I'd rather not expend. Rotometals SuperHard is already mixed for casters as an easy way of increasing the antimony content of boolit casting alloys. Yes, it's not cheap, but it sure is easy to use.

  16. #36
    Boolit Bub
    Join Date
    Dec 2017
    Location
    Marietta, GA
    Posts
    56
    Thanks Kevin,
    I'll order some SuperHard and as I mentioned in the other thread do some thrifting for old pewter for the tin.

  17. #37
    Boolit Man
    Join Date
    Jul 2020
    Location
    Bowling Green Kentucky
    Posts
    91
    I'm new to bullet casting, and was very curious about how antimony can dissolve in lead and tin way below it's melting temperature. Guess what? It's really EASY. I get inch-size chunks bought from ebay. They dissolve without any problem - it just happens SLOWLY. If you keep the chunk submerged it goes faster. If it's hotter it's faster. And if you hold it with tongs and use it as a stirring stick - it's faster. Depending on these factors, it may take 10 to 40 minutes.

  18. #38
    Boolit Master
    Join Date
    Dec 2013
    Location
    South Texas Coastal Bend Area
    Posts
    525
    My general-purpose alloy for the last couple years has been COWWs + 2% pewter, as it gives me really good fill-out whether I'm casting solids, HPs or the thin-skirted HBWCs, but the expansion of the HPs is iffy and shatter-prone. I'm now running low on that alloy, and recently smelted some WWs, and in order to make the HPs and reversed HBs a bit more conducive to expansion, I'm trying to figure out the ratio of COWW to soft Pb to sufficient pewter to ensure a good fill-out, and I'm hoping to roughly equal the 20:1 hardness. I've started PCing most of my boolits and the ones with GC shanks will get GCs while post-PC sizing.
    What I have on hand is one-lb and half-lb ingots of COWW, one-lb ingots of pure Pb, and two-ounce-ish ingots of pewter. Anyone got a quick & dirty version of that math handy? I'm thinking 50-50 WW/Pb but unsure how much pewter to add. I can either put X ingots of each into the 20-lb dripomatic, pour ingots and then recombine remelt & repeat to equalize the batch, or put everything into my big pipe cap over the fish-fry burner and do it all in one batch.
    Any suggestions greatly appreciated.
    Ed <><

  19. #39
    Boolit Man larryw's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2013
    Location
    Arizona
    Posts
    90
    Quote Originally Posted by cbrick View Post
    If you bend them do they make a crinkling sound (crying)?

    Rick
    I've got a couple bars like this that make a "Crinkle" & crunchy sound when you bend
    Them. What is it ????

  20. #40
    Boolit Grand Master


    GregLaROCHE's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2018
    Location
    Southern France by way of Interior Bush Alaska
    Posts
    5,286
    It’s a great site. I’ve been going to it for several years now.

Page 2 of 3 FirstFirst 123 LastLast

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •  
Abbreviations used in Reloading

BP Bronze Point IMR Improved Military Rifle PTD Pointed
BR Bench Rest M Magnum RN Round Nose
BT Boat Tail PL Power-Lokt SP Soft Point
C Compressed Charge PR Primer SPCL Soft Point "Core-Lokt"
HP Hollow Point PSPCL Pointed Soft Point "Core Lokt" C.O.L. Cartridge Overall Length
PSP Pointed Soft Point Spz Spitzer Point SBT Spitzer Boat Tail
LRN Lead Round Nose LWC Lead Wad Cutter LSWC Lead Semi Wad Cutter
GC Gas Check