Roll Crimping

[OBCoal]

New to the forum, and I find it very informative. I would like to ask which hull type to get for roll crimping. skived or unskived. These will be new fiocchi hulls. Also can the hulls be reused. I will be loading the lyman sabot slug in federal 12c1 wads.

[klcarroll]

Well, ......I can "sorta" answer that question:

I say "sorta", because I use roll crimps almost exclusively, .....but I have never bought a new hull in my life! (.....I'm a cheap SOB!)

All I do in the way of case preparation is trim about 1/8" off the end: ......So you can definately say that my cases are "unskived"!

For everything except the Foster Type Slugs, I use an over-shot card; .....and I get a good looking crimp every time. (...Well, ...except for the times when I screw up and get the shell into my fixture crooked! LOL)

Kent

[longbow]

I started with new Fiocchi hulls and a home made roll crimper. Worked fine. Many have been loaded several times and some have been roll crimped then fold crimped then roll crimped.

A few are getting tired but I can still get a decent crimp on them.

I have also roll crimped used hulls, old hulls and shortened hulls. Maybe not the best practices but it works for me.

Longbow

[diehard]

Some advice: if you haven't roll crimped before, practice on hulls you dont' mind throwing away afterward. I found that getting a good roll crimp took quite a bit of practice just to get the speed and tension just right. Too much of either will melt the plastic and you will get a melted "belt" around the case mouth instead of a good roll. Once you get the "feel" of it though, it becomes part of your muscle memory, and you will be more consistant with your crimps. I have found that only the hulls with good roll crimps are reusable....the melted ones get cracked and split when shot.

For some unknown reason I get best crimps from Remington Gun Club hulls (haven't) tried Fiocchi yet).

I haven't been doing this very long....but I have been doing it very often lately.

Good luck.

[cajun shooter]

I trim back my fired hulls before roll crimping and use both paper and plastic. I have a hull holder that is clamped onto my drill press and I have factory looking crimps. If using a drill press just use the lowest speed that you have. I had one guy look at my hulls and he told me that I was trying to pass off factory loads for reloads. Made me feel good even though he implied that i was lying.

[klcarroll]

I made perhaps a dozen different roll crimpers myself; ......and was never completely happy with the results.

....Finally, I "bit the boolit" and bought the Roll Crimper offered by Precision Reloading: ........It was the best money I have ever spent on a piece of reloading equipment!!

The unit features a "Ramp" design that requires a CNC mill with helical interpolation to produce; .....and it out-performs the "multiple bump" types by a couple orders of magnitude. (This is also why it MUST be rotated in the correct direction!)

If you are going to do a lot of roll crimping, ....spend the $24.95!!! You will NEVER regret it!!


Kent

[cajun shooter]

+1+1+1 on the roll crimper by Precision Reloading. The plastic one they sell is also great for the paper hulls. Later David

[tommygirlMT]

Another vote for the "Precision Reloading" roll crimpers --- buy one of them instead of the BPI roll crimpers. Better product for less money. The only roll crimper better than a PR roll crimper is one of the original Lyman roll crimpers but you have to be really lucky to get your hands on one of them.

As far as hulls are concerned --- unskived is best but you can roll crimp just about any hull at least once.

For best results, stick the end of the hull in your mouth and twist it slightly so that your lips leave the outside top 1/2" slightly damp then roll crimp. If you want to be more sanitery and less of a hick you could use a damp rag to do the same but it won't work as well --- don't know why but spit works better than water.

[OBCoal]

Thanks for the info. I will get the Precision Reloading roll crimper and practice on old hulls.

[Four Fingers of Death]

--- don't know why but spit works better than water.

It worked that way with polishing Army boots as well. I tried eating a choclate one afternoon while spit polishing my boots, bad mistake! Beer didn't seem to interfere with the process though, came out just fine.

[Y-man]

klcarrol: Hi there! Total noob here. Glad to be on this forum.Glad TommyGirlMT's here too: thanks for the encouragement.

Quick question: why do you not use over-shot cards with Foster-style slugs? Could they affect the smooth passing through of the slug through the bore? Could they actually obstruct things within the bore and could they just cause inaccuracy (slug emerges from muzzle: trajectory affected by over-shot card?

I'm asking because I'm working on something now, and it includes over-shot cards used with a Foster-type slug...Your responses could be enlightning!

[klcarroll]

@Y-man;

Well, .......it has nothing to do with possible "over-shot card effects": ....It's just that you don't need one.

With the Foster style slug, you can turn the roll crimp down until it is firmly in contact with the shoulder of the slug. Once you have done that, you have a solid retention that will encourage a nice, efficient, and consistent initial "burn". (In this respect, it's just like metalic cartridges; .....Where a solid bullet retention encourages an efficient powder burn during those first few micro-seconds.)

In order to accomplish the same thing with an over-shot card on top of a slug, you'd probably have to use one that was at least .125" thick!


Kent

[Y-man]

@klcarrol:
Thanks. I understand. As TommyGirlMT would know: I have been working on some "experimental" (SAFE!) casting in a location where Slugs and buckshot are impossible to find or buy. The slugs I have produced so far do not have a sharp shoulder (More rounded ends, really...), so I use locally improvised over-shot cards made out of plastic (You know the plastic that is used for the little handy Tic-Tac candy packs?) These hold unto the Roll crimps of my shells, and are water-proofed with a little nail varnish.
I hope to bring to you all the full story soon: my "experiment" with casting...Hoping to learn from your responses when I do!
Cheers.

[klcarroll]

@Y-man;

I'm looking forward to hearing about it!

I admire people who can "improvise, adapt, and overcome"!!


Kent

[Storydude]

I use a hand tool that's older than dirt. Works great on new Fiocchi skived, used Federals and Remington gameloads. Sometimes I end up cutting a used Gamehull because it didn;t melt/roll right, but it works great for me. You can find them on Evilbay sometimes for really cheap...or really Expensive.

I lke to use Roll crimps for 2 reasons. 1: it looks cool. 2: If I went a litttle overboard on the powder, I figure a roll crimp will reduce the pressures, keeping my face and hands intact.

[KCSO]

I roll crimp all my 2 1/2" shells and those are trimmed once fired cases. I have gotten good roll crimps with a number of different brands of cases but old cheap remington dove loads work about as well as anything. I roll crimp with either the drill press set up from Ballistic products or my Grandfathers old roll crimping tool that has been in use since 1910. With either I spin the tool on the case to warm it up and then press the handle to roll the crimp. I found that one of the most important things is to have enough room for a full roll and I leave at least 1/4" between the top wad and the top of the case to get the best crimps.

I don NOT reuse cases fired with Black Powder as the heat of firing seems to make the case mouth brittle with the Elephant powder I am using.

[Y-man]

@klcarrol;

Hi there! Could there ever be something like "Over-Retention" on a shell case? Imagine the over-shot card too thick, and too firmly fixed that pressures can't budge it, so pressures find the next weakest point: either a minute tear or weakness in the hull, or out back: blowing out the primer...
Just out of curiousity: just asking...

[KCSO]

I don't know about that but I have had steel shot loads that rusted and instead of firing like normal the whle front of the case went out the barrel like a big bullet. I have never had a roll crimp malfunction like this.

[klcarroll]

@KCSO;

Wow!! ......That sounds like the sort of failure that could easily take the barrel with it!! (....I just KNEW there were other reasons not to like steel shot!)

This is just my own subjective opinion; ....but I think that a good, tight roll crimp creates a more "weather-tight" closure than a fold crimp. (...At least if you're using a good, treated over-shot card.)

Kent

[Y-man]

@klcarrol;

Yay! I finally got it all done: not sure if maybe I should put this as a separate post. In my country: we are limited by law to Birdshot, and what our brains can produce in terms of providing for our own self defence.

I have been able to achieve some modification: and it all works! Check it out: this was what I promised...

http://www.thefirearmblog.com/blog/2...-self-defense/

Guys, tell me what you think?