1891 arg mauser project

[txpete]

I have a 1891 argie that has been cut down some time in its past.thinking of a re-barrel project on this action.any ideas cal? ect
thanks
pete

[KCSO]

I had one that had a Douglas barrel in 7 mm mauser. No changes needed for the bolt face and it fed perfect. You might shop Gun Parts for a small ring bbl or try Midway for an Adams and Bennet. I think that 257 roberts would be another good choice. I would not go with a 308 just on the off chance that someone might slip in a high pressure round. I haven't tried it yet, but 35 Remington comes to mind as a super cast bullet round for that action.

[45 2.1]

There is absolutely nothing wrong with the 7.65 mauser as it is. That rifle would make a nice carbine or sporter. Try it out, that cartridge is VERY cast friendly.

[txpete]

who makes a reciever sight for the 91 action.I think thats where I am going to start.is it the same as a 98 action??kind of ready to get a start on this
pete

[Frank46]

Pete, both lyman and williams make the rear sight. If lyman you want a 57sme. Springfield,mauser,enfield thats what the sme stands for. Or if you want a real classy rear sight try to locate the same sight by lyman made in steel. They look way better than the current lyman junk. You can rebarrel to 35 rem, 300 savage, 7mm mauser and a few others.
I also second the motion about the 308 ctg in the argie. Way too hot for that action. Frank

[txpete]

thanks guys where would I start to find barrel if I decide to go that way with this project??
the 300 sav/35 rem would be interesting.
thanks
pete

[ammohead]

Pete,

If you are doing it yourself then look at www.midwayusa.com. If you want someone else to do it, then do a search on E R Shaw. They do a good job for a great price.

ammohead

[KCSO]

I have had a 300 Savage in a Jap rifle and although they can be made to shoot they are not really an ideal cast bullet rifle. The short neck means for most bullets you are seating down into the powder, which requires a hard lube and some carefull reloading. The magazine needs to be blocked to get the best feeding and that is extra work, if you can devise a good block for the straight line magazine. The closer you stay to the original ctg leangth the better. I would have suggested the 7.65 but I haven't seen any cheap barrels for that round in a long time, whereas GPC has 8 mm barrels for 20 bucks and new 257 roberts bls for $113.00. I know De Hass recommended the 257 as an alternate caliber for the 91.

[Urny]

For some years I shot a '91 with a Flaig's Ace heavy barrel in .308, cast loads only. The rifle went to a friend, and he had it rebarreled with a GPC .45 ACP 20" heavy barrel. Makes a much better plinker in .45 ACP than in .308, quiet and little recoil. The gunsmith who removed the old barrel cut a relief groove ahead of the threads to ease his path and so friend David returned the old barrel to me. There's enough meat left to make 7.62x39 or .300 Savage if anyone is interested in doing so. I'm not; I like my '91's in the original caliber. If you like to fire military loads in 7.65mm Mauser, it's not all that low pressure a round.

For fans of the Argentine Mausers, Colin Websters' book Argentine Mauser Rifles 1871-1959 is a worthwhile investment.

[StarMetal]

It's a gunsmith trick to cut a relief cut like that, but I'd say he was lazy or not a great gunsmith. Being that old military rifle had already been rebarreled and not long ago, that Flaig barrel should have come out alot easier then the original military barrel. He ruined it in my opinion and had it been my rifle I'd said something about it.

Joe

[Larry Gibson]

I have a 1891 argie that has been cut down some time in its past.thinking of a re-barrel project on this action.any ideas cal? ect
thanks
pete

I rebarreled one to .35 Rem using the prethreaded/short chambered 26" Shilen barrel from Brownells before I got wrapped up in my last excursion to the Middle East. It has a Lyman 57SME on it and an M14 front sight. It is still short chambered as I hadn't found a finish reamer (anyone got one I can borrow/rent?) when I put it together. So I shortened a FL die about .01" and formed 20 cases to fit the "short" chamber to test fire. It works and shoots fine. Feeding was fine with the longer nosed rifle bullets but with short pistol bullets I had to epoxy a thin cartridge guide on each side of the magazine well to hold the cartridges to the rear of the magazine. It wasn't hard to do and now the short OAL SWC loaded cartridges feed fine also. The barrels come prethreaded for M93/M95 Mausers and it is the correct thread for the M91s. You have to turn some off the barrel shoulder to lengthen the barrel shank for a correct fit. Not hard to do at all.

The barrels are a little spendy but the quality is there. Maybe too spendy for some considering it's a M91 but I have one other option. If it doesn't work out in .35 Rem I will shorten a .35 Whelen die to use 8x57 cases and basically make a .35x57 (very close to the 9x57). I can then run a .35 Whelen finish reamer into the barrel to chamber and headspace it on the formed cases. Loading this larger volume .35x57 case to .358 Win velocity will in essence keep the pressure down into the M91s limitations. It should make a dandy hunting riflewith either cast or jacketed bullets. It should still be an excellent cast bullet plinking/small game rifle also. Besides that, with the cut down military stock, the longer 26" barrel and reciever soghts it looks like an old classic rifle. I expect to have a lot of fun shooting with mine.

Larry Gibson

[txpete]

thanks guys for all the info.got my argie dies ordered and should be in mon.I am going to try the orginal barrel first.if it shoots good I will stick with it for now.if not I will look into a new barrel.this will be my first mauser project so all the info above has been a big help and can't thank y'all enough for taking the time to help out.
best
pete

[floodgate]

Larry:

Glad you're back home safe! Thanks from us "stay-at-homes"!

"a .35x57 (very close to the 9x57)." Reminds me of something I spotted in some industrial specs. a while back. Something - I think it was lead/acid battery plate filler material - specified in "grams per cubic inch"

floodgate

[txpete]

I also want to say welcome back.I got a letter a few months back from DA asking about going back on active duty...and how they needed certain mos. no way to old and beat up this time.
pete

[Frank46]

Txpete, been looking for a decent argie for quite some time. If the origional bbl is good try lyman #314299. Should work great in that long throat. Been buying parts when able and am the owner of two actions,three stocks and handful of parts. Lotsa luck. Frank

[Bret4207]

I'm sure you thought of this but I'll toss it in anyway. A bunch of the old military barrels have had decades of neglect. Copper fouling, corrosive primer residue and plain ol' dirt play havoc with the barrel. I plug my barrels and fill from the breech with a solvent and soak it a while before I start cleaning. ATF, Ed's Red, Butchs, WD-40, diesel, Marvel Mystery Oil, whatever- just soak it good. Then I run an old bore brush wrapped with 4/0 steel wool though the barrel a number of times. Keep the steel wool soaked in your solvent. If I'm getting a lot of copper I then soak the barrel with STRONG AMMONIA found at better than average hardwares. This stuff will remove the copper, but it will also allegedly eat steel, so I only soak for 1/2 -3/4 hour and then scrub with the steel wool, followed by a lot of rinsing with mineral spirits or diesel. By this time you should be seeing what rifling there is. Now start with your standard cleaning solvents like Gun Scrubber and Hoppes. In fact- bathe yourself in Hoppes just 'cuz it smells so darn good! A bit of JB paste on a patch will help shine things up inside. I'm told auto body rubbing compound is about the same and costs about 1% of what the JB sells for. One can should last several generations of shooters. Check your muzzle for gouges, tears, chips and wear. Recrown or even recess the muzzle to get to good rifling if needed. The throat you can work around by seating a long boolit a long way out. Once shes clean comes the shooting.

I bought a M-95 Steyr a few years back, mainly 'cuz I was intrigued by the straight pull action. (Plus it's even handier than a 92 or 94 Winchester in the woods, already has a nice thumb saftey, and shoots a 245 gr boolit at 2000 fps) The Sterys barrels was rust coated and I thought it was ruined. It looked like a wood rasp in there. I soaked it and scrubbed it and repeated the job 2 or 3 times. Lo and behold there was nice deep rifling under the rust. Pits? Yup, them too. Some work with the 4/0 wool and some JB paste smoothed things out. I ran a patch soaked in Lee Liquid Frog Snot through the bore prior to shooting. After I let it dry I pushed a clean patch through. The Frog Snot seemed to fill the pits. Shooting the NEI 331-245 resulted in nice round 2" groups with the factory sights and a half blind shooter.

All that was to say- Don't resolve yourself to a rebarrel until you work the present one over a bit. If you have access to a Fat 30 Group buy mould try 13.0 Red Dot with the boolit seated to the rifling. My '91 Argie likes that fine and makes 1 1/4" groups at 75 yards. It's the only load I've tried so far but it works fine. Also see if you can find Ken Waters Handloader article on the 7.65 Mauser. Like the 8mm it's completely underloaded and untested by American shooters.

[Larry Gibson]

floodgate and txpete

Thanks for the welcome homes, it is really good to be back home. I keep telling the Army I'm too old for this crap, got 15 months left then I'll be a shooter full time!

"a .35x57 (very close to the 9x57)." Reminds me of something I spotted in some industrial specs. a while back. Something - I think it was lead/acid battery plate filler material - specified in "grams per cubic inch"

Guess that's the nifty thing about wild cats - you can come up with some pretty nonsensical names. However, the .35x57 (short chambered .35 Whelen) is a very good cartridge for these SR Mausers. It feeds as slick as the original cartridges for these actions. It is a good hunting cartridge with both cast and jacketed bullets. A standard set of .35 Whelen dies is is all that's required to load (ne expensive custom dies needed) as they just need to be shortened. Brass is easly formed out of 8x57 brass with one pass through the FL die. Or '06 brass can be used if you don't mind the trimming. Loading data is easy, just use .358 Winchester data and pressures will be ok because of the larger case capacity of the .35x57. The one I made for a friend some years ago is quite accurate. It was built on a M95 action and he loves it.

As mentioned though, if that 7.65 Argie barrel is not pitted it makes a fine cast bullet cartridge also. I have three of them to feed.

Larry Gibson

[txpete]

larry I hope your 15 months go by fast.I retired in 94 and still can't wipe the smile off my face.
I am waiting on the brown truck for the 7.65X53 dies as I am typing this.I have a bag of once fired 270 and 30-06 brass to convert for the argie.I have some 185 gr lee's sized .314.after cleaning the barrel I think it might be alright for cast.
I am missing the slider for the rear sight..anyone have a extra???.this is going to be a fun project and give a break from shooting those mosin nagants .
I have alot of brass different cals to trade for a rear sight slider if someone has one.
thanks
pete

[StarMetal]

txpete,

Springfield Sporters has the rear sight part. Here's the website page of that part.

http://ssporters.com/parts/91%20ARGENTINE%20MAUSER.htm

Joe

[txpete]

well damn guys need some help..
ran the 30-06 dies thru the new rcbs 7.65X53 dies trimmed to proper lenth and the brass won't chamber when I made up a dummy round.any idea's??
pete