We need a Farm/House gun?

[Adam Helmer]

I think you heard my message.
At a family barbeque is not the time to be asking to see peoples fishing licenses.
If you were not an invited guest and showed up on an official capacity would be other matter, as a guest, it would be pretty tacky.
Save it for working hours, unless it is a gross infringement.
I doubt if little Tommy catching a 3-inch Bluegill without a license is going to make the world stop.
It is no wonder people have little respect for authority.
What ever happened to Officer Friendly?

elm,

Thanks for the help determining your message. For your example about "little Tommy catching fish without a license." In my state, he would NOT Need a fishing license if under age 16. On the other hand, his dad, if over age 16, would be in violation. If dad was fishing without a valid license, he is in violation. Family barbeque, or not, a Violation is a violation. Comprende? Are you an LEO? Do you comply with Game Laws?

I made arrests for law violations at many alleged violators' family gatherings. Tacky or not, I did not write the laws and cannot grant amnesty, that is up to the judge. You would KNOW that if you are a lawman.

Be well, and buy a license if you are going fishing. LOL!

Adam

[Barry54]

Tacky.

Lacking couth.

“You catch more flies with honey than vinegar.”

The game warden missed the opportunity to befriend the neighbors. He may have been thrown a bigger bone later if a relationship had been cultivated...

[W.R.Buchanan]

Barry: the actual statement was ,,"You can catch more Flies with Sweetness than you can with Sour Puss." From Popeye cartoons Mid 1950's.

Randy

[dverna]

I'm sorry but a Single Shot 12 ga. is not going to cut it when you really are facing some serious danger. Like when the Cities empty out when there's no food left in the stores. Where do you think they are going to go?

A house on some Back Water Country Road will be a prime target. Depending on the cover around your house a Tactical 12 ga Shotgun, and/or a Semi Auto Rifle and the training to go with it would be my best suggestion.

Here's the reason why I say this

I shot with a guy at an indoor Range last Wednesday. He told me that he was a pretty good pistol shot so I figured he would be safe enough to be around at an indoor range?

Boy was I wrong!!!.

This guy showed up with a .38 Special Revolver that he didn't even know how to open the cylinder on, and a Californized AR style 12 ga. Shotgun. (Rock Island Arsenal)

This guy didn't even know which end of the bullet the gun came out of!!!!!!!!! Luckily he had brought a friend with him that did have some training and he helped getting this guy to be somewhat safe.

We started with the Shotgun and it became very obvious that the gun was a complete abomination. He loaded the 6 round mag and put it in the gun, then fired 6 rounds and the Magazine wouldn't come out. Turned out you had to pull the Rear Takedown Pin out to open the action then the Mag Release Button would work.. He had a lot of problems with the safety which was set up ambi and he kept trying to operate it with his thumb on the right side of the gun instead of normal AR operation. Also was not getting the operation of the gun at all. Point being this guy had no gun training whatsoever, but the real point was he had bought something that he didn't know anything about. But he actually "thought" he knew about guns and shooting?.

Then came the Pistol,,, He insisted on having his finger up around the junction between the Cylinder and Barrel. Finally got him clued in why this was a bad idea, showed him how to properly grip the gun and then fired a few rounds. he did ok with that.

When I left I advised him to get hooked up with one of the Fire Arms Instructors that work out of this Indoor Range. I also told the guys at the Cash Register to make sure he got hooked up with one of the instructors before he left. I also told him to sell that Shotgun because in a real firefight it would just get him killed. Any Pump Action Shotgun would be far superior,,, Hell a single shot gun would be superior to that abomination... !!!

Here's my recommendation for the guns and training you should have if you are going to live 'Out of Town."

A Pump Action Shotgun in 12 or 20 ga. for EVERY MEMBER OF THE FAMILY over 12 years old. And an AR Rifle unless you live in CA or other state that restricts those guns in which case a Mini 14 for everyone.

Then everyone goes to school for at least 3 classes on each Weapon. And if you are going to live far off the beaten path maybe a pistol for everyone to be carried daily and the training to go with it.

It is pointless to have these guns and not have the Training to know how to operate them effectively!

And if you are Not Willing to Kill someone in order to survive, then maybe staying in town is the best idea.

The simple fact here, and I have seen this first hand while Jeeping in the Desert. The farther away from Civilization you get, the stoopider people get.

Civilization Controls Bad Behavior, Wilderness Encourages It.

My .02

Randy

I wish we had a "like" feature.

Randy, I not only have the guns you suggested, but extras for each person who will be here if the SHTF. We lean more to AR's in 5.56 and pistol carbines as we live in the middle of nowhere.

I also have three .308's for long range work. If the SHTF, addressing potential threats from long range is a game changer. Most people think they are safe at 400 yards, and popping a threat at twice that range might make the rest of raiders think about finding an easier victim.

[Mk42gunner]

In my opinion, there is a big difference between a "farm and ranch gun" where a single shot can serve admirably, and a "End of the world/ Repel boarders gun" where I want some thing with lots of magazine capacity and spare box mags.

Robert

[jonp]

Tacky.

Lacking couth.

“You catch more flies with honey than vinegar.”

The game warden missed the opportunity to befriend the neighbors. He may have been thrown a bigger bone later if a relationship had been cultivated...

I was at my pond well out in the woods fishing for perch and throwing them back. Game Warden showed up, caught me fishing without a license and wrote me a $50 fine. I paid it. The law was the law even if I thought it was a little much.

[Barry54]

I was at my pond well out in the woods fishing for perch and throwing them back. Game Warden showed up, caught me fishing without a license and wrote me a $50 fine. I paid it. The law was the law even if I thought it was a little much.

I buy a license every year although many years I don’t need it. Landowners don’t need one. I appreciate wildlife conservation efforts and hope the money is put to good use.

Here recently when I needed a game warden due to someone baiting on an adjacent property, I was s o l.

Apparently the TWRA had been overstepping their authority for many years and due to a lawsuit, they are very cautious now.

I had verbal permission to hunt the property from the new owners agent. The local game warden needed someone to report a violation and get a warrant before they went on the property.

I didn’t “report anything” since I didn’t have written permission to be there. Mr green jeans and I had a nice conversation and let it be. The bait pile is placed in a way that it can’t be seen from my property and they have game cameras all over the place.

Sometimes you’re the windshield, and sometimes you’re the bug...

[MrWolf]

Out here landowners are not required to buy a license to hunt, fish, etc their own property but it must be in season and in accordance with regulations. No idea what the rules were for the game warden but for the small stuff, a warning would have sufficed and everyone would have been better served. Guarantee if that guy needs help one day, the list of folks that would help got reduced. That may or may not matter to the die hard power players but they typically have the discretion to issue warnings.

[Adam Helmer]

Out here landowners are not required to buy a license to hunt, fish, etc their own property but it must be in season and in accordance with regulations. No idea what the rules were for the game warden but for the small stuff, a warning would have sufficed and everyone would have been better served. Guarantee if that guy needs help one day, the list of folks that would help got reduced. That may or may not matter to the die hard power players but they typically have the discretion to issue warnings.

Mr. Wolf,

I totally agree; all officers have wide discretion when handling a case. We do not know if the alleged violators were cooperative or confrontational. Cooperative folks get Warnings in most cases, and "Hard Cases" get what is their due.

We do not know who was in violation in the mentioned case, or were they cooperative. Maybe they ended a long career of fishing without a license. Let us hope. As for helpful citizen input to wardens, I am not sure career law violators would be a good source. LOL.

Adam

[Barry54]

Seems like certain people are jumping to conclusions that there were “violators” at the family bbq.

I guess when the only tool you use is a hammer, everything starts to look like a nail.

[rbuck351]

After retirement, we moved a couple of miles outside Eureka Mt from 32 years in AK. Four new houses have been built in my neighborhood which is now ten houses on about 140 acres. My closest neighbor died recently and her daughter and husband moved up from California. Five of us have shooting ranges. All have guns including two California, two Colorado and one Georgia transplant. All are good neighbors.

No longer having kids at home I have plenty of guns around the house. I keep a 454 Puma by the deck door as well as a Iver Johnson single shot loaded with 3" 15 ball 00 Buck and a 44 long shot single shot gun, a 22H 220 Savage over the door and a 22 cal PCP pellet gun. Never know what will show up in the front yard. Entry door has a Savage 24 22/410. Back door has an 20" 870 with 00 Buck in chamber and mag tube and two each slug and 00 Buck in side saddle. 45acp, 22 KH and 20ga 870 in upstairs bedroom. 9mm and 38 spl in
kitchen and office. Can't remember what all is in the gun room or the garage gun safe. I even keep a Daisy Red Rider ready to shoot unwanted dogs out of my skunk bait station. I probably need to put at least a rifle, pistol and shot gun at the walk out basement door. Other than that I think I'm well covered.

For new country non shooters I would recommend a short barreled 12 or 20ga pump with side saddle and some tactical training dealing heavily with keeping the gun loaded and in the fight. Also training on the different loads and how effective they are on different types of targets.

[elmacgyver0]

elm,

Thanks for the help determining your message. For your example about "little Tommy catching fish without a license." In my state, he would NOT Need a fishing license if under age 16. On the other hand, his dad, if over age 16, would be in violation. If dad was fishing without a valid license, he is in violation. Family barbeque, or not, a Violation is a violation. Comprende? Are you an LEO? Do you comply with Game Laws?

I made arrests for law violations at many alleged violators' family gatherings. Tacky or not, I did not write the laws and cannot grant amnesty, that is up to the judge. You would KNOW that if you are a lawman.

Be well, and buy a license if you are going fishing. LOL!

Adam

No, I am not a LEO but have had friends that were.
I have a lifetime hunting and fishing license, so I guess I comply with game laws, although I rarely go hunting or fishing.
When I was a teen, I repeatedly got stopped by one of the towns "Finest", just to hassle me.
Once he stopped me to look at my eyeglasses, to make sure I was complying with the regulation of being restricted to corrective lenses.
Another time he stopped me and asked where my motorcycle helmet was, I said to him that I didn't think we had a helmet law, he said "we don't".
Then he asked me if I had a helmet, I said, yes, then he said, "what color is it?" I said "white", he then said, "ok you can go".
I asked him what it was all about, and he said, "police business".
A couple years later he was caught going 120 mph driving thru a nearby city and not long after that he was kicked off the force.
I still remember his name; it made my day to find out what happened to him.
I also knew a cop some people called "Wally the Rat", I really liked him, he used to come and go pheasant hunting with me when I was a teen, he never asked to see my hunting license, although I did have one.

I have the feeling you are not quite the hard nose you are making out to be and didn't write citations without probable cause.
If it makes you feel better, I will take a photo of my license and post it. LOL
I wish you well.
Roger

[Barry54]

I was invited to dove hunt with a neighbor on the sheriff’s department. There was an impressive meal cooked on the Blackstone grill. His son in law said the blessing before we ate.
After the meal, and before we went out to hunt, He asked “does everyone have a license?” “Does everybody have a plug in their gun?” Someone shouted “what’s that?” And everyone laughed...
We had a safe and successful hunt. No licenses were checked, and I highly doubt anyone was doing anything illegal. A good time was had by all. Looking forward to opening day next year!

[Adam Helmer]

Roger,

You made me laugh. I am not "hard nosed", but was paid to enforce the law. On day 2 as a town cop, I saw a car run through a stop sign. I pulled the car over and found out it was a member of my church. She had a toddler unrestrained in the front seat. "Linda" said, "Oh, I am glad you stopped me." I said, "License and registration, please."

I ran her data, and gave her a ticket. She was dumbfounded and hostile. I told her to READ the ticket, it was a WARNING, but if she preferred, I was able to write a money ticket. She shut up, put her kid in a child seat and stopped for stop signs thereafter.

Officers have wide discretion. If they let their friends go, then why not everyone? I got chewed out by my captain at roll call a few days later because I wrote 7 Warning tickets on my prior shift. The captain said, "do you know how much money the town lost?" I said, "I got the desired correction and the taxpayers were educated, gently." Also, Warning tickets do not require an officer to appear in court on their day off!

Try the job on for size for a year or two and check back. LOL.

Be well.

Adam

[Tracy]

Now how about everyone else hijack the thread to talk about their chosen profession that has nothing to do with the subject matter at hand, and suggest that everyone should try their profession for a year so they may show proper respect to the hijacker. How about it; any truck drivers want to tell everyone how to properly respect a truck driver? How about pharmacists? Now there are some folks who deserve the utmost respect.

At my farmhouse, I have found a single shot shotgun, a .22 LR rifle, a .38 or .357 revolver and a .22 pump air rifle to be a good basic battery.

[elmacgyver0]

Now how about everyone else hijack the thread to talk about their chosen profession that has nothing to do with the subject matter at hand, and suggest that everyone should try their profession for a year so they may show proper respect to the hijacker. How about it; any truck drivers want to tell everyone how to properly respect a truck driver? How about pharmacists? Now there are some folks who deserve the utmost respect.

At my farmhouse, I have found a single shot shotgun, a .22 LR rifle, a .38 or .357 revolver and a .22 pump air rifle to be a good basic battery.

Adam, my friend, I think he is talking about us!

[Barry54]

Getting back to the topic of the thread of a farm/house gun, it’s not a bad choice to pick a shotgun. New shooters and those less practiced might be able to hit the target easier with a shotgun than a handgun.

Tennessee has recently created a nighttime coyote/bobcat season and it’s shotgun only. I guess the law makers were concerned about rifle bullets traveling off to who knows where in the dark...

And one other thing to add. My friend sent me a news link a few years back. Someone was shooting their 9mm on their property in the county, which was legal. I don’t recall if they had a backstop, or most likely just a tree line. Anyway, one of the stray bullets traveled around 400 yards and struck a woman. The woman was my friends mother.

It hit her “in the stomach” his words. She survived.

I tinkered around with a ballistics calculator and determined the energy was similar to a shot from 380 by the time it hit her. Assuming it wasn’t a ricochet and hadn’t slowed down from contact with another object on the way there.