Imman Meffert Suhl single shot target rifle

[JiriK]

I bought this old single shot rifle from local gunstore. Action is Martini-Henry style.
Caliber of this rifle is unknown as it doesn´t have clear markings, only "172/28" that says -something-
I ordered Cerrosafe-metal. It should arrive tomorrow so I can make casting of chamber and bit of barrel.

Found a website and drawing of 8.15x46R cartridge (that I heard was common in these guns)
https://www.handloadermagazine.com/cartridge-board-25
So I 3D printed it and it fits in the chamber. Also found two other dimensional drawings of that cartridge but those are longer and don´t fit.
So 8.15x46R is possibly the correct cartridge for this gun, but what else could it be?

Also, do you know what type of front aperture sight was used in these rifles? Currently rifle has aperture sight and notch sight in rear and just bead at the muzzle end. Aperture rear sight and bead.. not optimal combo.

[Rockingkj]

Can’t help, but that’s a great looking old rifle!

Although I would have thought a globe type front sight or a pin head type would have been the best for target work. The present front looks to be windage adjustable? Or could a different front sight used the same slot? That different sight lost to the sands of time.

[45workhorse]

Mighty fine looking single shot!
Hope it shoots as good as it looks.

[Barry54]

Not to be argumentative, but I would be pleased to use the rifle with the front blade sight pictured. The rear aperture and the long span between the two should work quite well!

[Tatume]

That is a really nice looking, windage-adjustable blade front sight. If you decide to take it off, please consider selling it to me.

[Tatume]

I'm not an expert on these guns, but the "172/28" might be 172 gr bullet and 28 gr black powder.

[Ajohns]

I thought that cartridge was very similar in performance to the 32/40 WCF. Even data being about the same,
Very nice looking rifle

[JiriK]

I found a couple of online sources saying that the "172/28" means gauge of barrel.
"172.28 - .300 very common on 8mms" (https://www.thefirearmsforum.com/thr...-marks.179225/ )

Front bead is secured in place with small slotted screw (on top or left side of barrel in picture) Square head screw moves whole assembly sideways.

Rim recess on chamber end is approx. 12.55mm in dia. So it is too small to fit 32-40WCF cartridge.

Cerrosafe should arrive tomorrow, maybe I get to make the casting and then know more.

edit: I forced a couple of .354" lead RB´s to barrel from chamber end. One bit deeper than other.
Groove diameter seems to be .314" Land diameter .304". Very thin riflings there.

[Rockingkj]

I found a couple of online sources saying that the "172/28" means gauge of barrel.
"172.28 - .300 very common on 8mms" (https://www.thefirearmsforum.com/thr...-marks.179225/ )

Front bead is secured in place with small slotted screw (on top or left side of barrel in picture) Square head screw moves whole assembly sideways.

Rim recess on chamber end is approx. 12.55mm in dia. So it is too small to fit 32-40WCF cartridge.

Cerrosafe should arrive tomorrow, maybe I get to make the casting and then know more.

edit: I forced a couple of .354" lead RB´s to barrel from chamber end. One bit deeper than other.
Groove diameter seems to be .314" Land diameter .304". Very thin riflings there.

If I have understood your description of the front sight, the front blade could be removed by loosing the left side screw. Conceivably a different front sight could be installed if it had the same base. Is that right?

[JiriK]

If I have understood your description of the front sight, the front blade could be removed by loosing the left side screw. Conceivably a different front sight could be installed if it had the same base. Is that right?

That is correct. I took a closer look at the left side screw. Slot is very shallow, maybe for decoration or indicating something.
Screw has square head. So I turned it and front sight fell off.

[Rockingkj]

My thoughts is that originally there may have been an assortment of front “blades” or apertures which could have easily been changed depending on the needs of the shooter. In a way no different from the variety of inserts in a Lyman 17 front sight.

[JiriK]

About the sights - found this: https://forums.sassnet.com/index.php...-rifle-sights/
(Someone looking for sights for Schuetzen rifle)
Rear sight is identical to what I have here.
My front sight base is more basic than any seen on that picture, but I think that that "Ringkorn mit Tunnel" is what was intended to be used with aperture rear sight.

[JiriK]

Chamber casting done. I´m pretty confident that this rifle is chambered for 8.15x46R.

[Barry54]

How difficult will it be for you to get brass and dies to reload?

[JiriK]

How difficult will it be for you to get brass and dies to reload?

I´d be surprised if 8.15x46R brass could be found here in Finland.
Dies and RWS brass can be ordered from Germany.

30-30Win brass (/cartridges) is available locally but I need to get the dies first.
What other options for "raw material brass" there is to form 8.15x46R?

[JRD]

The cartridge is quite similar to the American 32-40 blackpowder target cartridge in case head, but the cartridge differs in taper and length. Reportedly you can form 8.15 from 32-40, 30-30, or 32 Win Special brass by running it into a 8.15 sizing die.

A quirk on vintage German guns is they don't always clearly say what they are chambered in. They will list the bore size they were proofed at, but may not mention the chambering at all, or may list the chamber depth depending on the era it was proofed in. I recently examined a single shot from the late 30's that was marked as 7.6mm/46... which actually translates to 8.15x46R.

That's a beautiful rifle. Enjoy it and good luck.

[Tom Trevor]

The square on the sights will match the key for your key wind pocket watch that everyone carried. So no need for an additional sight tool.

[Wayne Smith]

The square on the sights will match the key for your key wind pocket watch that everyone carried. So no need for an additional sight tool.

Not necessary, Tom. There are multiple sizes of key wind watch keys.

[JiriK]

I have one mechanical clock. It´s winding key doesn´t fit any of the screws in that rifle.

Front sight adjustment screw has 3.4mm square head. Rear sight elevation screw has 5.5mm square head.
Those size keys are available, I´ll order them sometime. Now need to get the loading dies and brass.

[JiriK]

Received RCBS loading dies and .32-170-FN bullet mould today from local seller.
Package included box of 25-35Win brass so I annealed them, resized and trimmed. Then FL sizing again.

Now need to cast bullets. What do you think, how hard should these bullets be?
Half linotype, half range scrap lead?