Coyote hunting

[kir_kenix]

I got 3 coyotes last night with cast in .223.

19.0gr of H4895 (Hornady cases, WSR) behind a checked and powder coated RCBS 55. 16" 1:9 twist AR (suppressed, under night vision). First 2 were just oppertunity yotes that loped into the pasture while buttoning up fence. Turned on the fox pro and wiggler while we picked up tools...sure enough we had a little song dog come tearing accross the alfalfa field adjacent to us and i got to the rifle in time to pop him at ~125 yards.

I like the pc cast loads for my truck gun because they arent as loud (even with the sandman S installed) from the cab of my tractor or pickup. Work good on vermin out to a couple hundred yards (1.5-2 MOA). 53gr vmax's work better.

Cast .225's work fine on yotes. Getting a load that shoots accurately enough to take one at anything over 100 yards is the tough part. Got to judiciously cull the little bullets if you plan on shooting anything resembling a group.

[popper]

Got a yote last week, 110 vmax. Got a hog last year, 135 FTX, both from 300 BO & IR. Don't want to miss few opportunities for good kill. Yotes aren't as big as hogs but Gboy had to shoot medium hog 2x with 223 from 100 yds. Other Gboy's friend had same experience. Been casting a long time but I want a guarantee. Friend wants to put NV on his 22lr for hogs - yup, can be done - not by me.

[Hamish]

“ and end up with a bullet that is not as accurate and running 70% of the velocity.”- dverna

This is pure hockey and Don knows it, it’s been shown too many times for too many years on this forum. The first 5 shots of cast I ever put through an AR were an inch and an eighth at a 100Y using WC844 to match the jacketed 5.56 loading of the time, what, 12-13 years ago, using the 55gr NATO bullet that was being getting ready to run as a group buy back then.

I never felt the need to load faster than that, but others here have. A lot.

I shoot sub MOA with the 65gr NATO out of a Contender .223 rifle with 5744 nowadays in the 2.3K area, my shoulders are busted up and it’s comfortable.

There are TONS of posts on CB about shooting .22 caliber cast accurately and in excess of 2K, it’s all a matter of good alloy, good lube, (or PC), and being RUTHLESS culling your casts for defects.

[Joe_7910]

I would like to no if anybody has hunted coyotes with a 223 and cast bullets. If so what bullet and powder would you use?

I have a Lyman 225415 mold that I like for 223. I use the term like loosely, as I mostly didn’t want to spend the money to try 5 different molds. Stick with a bolt action and get your velocity up as best you can without losing all your accuracy. A Lyman M die is a must, but most essential is a proper fit of bullet to barrel. Do not expect a 223 with a cast bullet to excel in any way. There are a plethora of better options out there, but it is extremely satisfying killing with your own cast bullets. I have never used Trail Boss but I have heard good things. But you can’t go wrong with Unique

[wmitty]

This is directed to Shopdog’s question in post 20 which wasn’t answered back in May. I have only tried shooting cast (.22 Bator design) in a 788 REM .222 and was astonished at how accurate the boolit was at 100 yards. I have an accurate 788 .22-250 in which I would like to try a design with a higher sectional density along with a higher velocity but haven’t purchased a mould yet as I am still looking for a design that will stabilize with the 1/14” twist rate barrel. Would Shopdog be willing to show us his work with the high intensity cartridges he refers to in his post? Perhaps someone with experience in using cast in a Swift or a 22-243 will describe their achievements using those cartridges? Or maybe I have misunderstood the meaning of high intensity cartridges?

[Shopdog]

At last count there's 3, "250's" here. An Encore,R700 VSSF,and an old flat back Savage 110. For whatever reason? I only shoot a RCBS 60G (listed as 55,mine drops 60). Don't shoot the Encore much in that chambering because it's an absolute dreamboat with a 243 barrel.

That leaves the R700 and the S110. The former is a 26" fluted varmint brrl,the 110 is a super skinny 24". This particular mould is not one of RCBS's "better" examples. The design is fine... am referring to it's execution. Have another mould from them... a .30-165 sil mould that is the same. Both are spot on for nose *diameter.... if,you take an avg. Polite way of saying they're both out of round. Both have as cast body diameters that are @spec dimensions. The 60g drops barely @223/4 and the .30 is struggling to see .309. Both also... are pretty out of round.

This is important background.. as it illustrates some of the complexities. In the same way two rifles,say with consecutive serial numbers can be completely different in their loading tunes... so can moulds. Not disparaging these two moulds,just sayin I chose to put myself in this loading quandary. What grew out of this was a nose (re)forming tool. LG,or "little goober" is what we call them. It's a reamed piece of O1 that sees it's internal dimensions set to the bullet nose. In use,you can either do the nose loaded,or pre loaded. Actually easier to do after the round has been loaded.

I chuck the LG up in a drill motor and spin the tool on the bullet nose. Looking for "about" a 50% clean up... maybe a touch more.

It will show,and feel how out of round the bullet is. Obviously,it makes more sense to do this before loading... tossing obvious problems back into the reject pile. But,you get a feel for it,and can spot trouble makers ahead of time.

You should be able to hit a low node accuracy spot with 4759,or 4198 pretty easy. Next would be the medium burners,Varget and 4895. For the really big numbers(velocity/pressure) I use 4831.

If I said, "get good with your cleaning"... your response would be about "leading"? No,it's about fouling. As the powder burn rate slows down...and velocity/pressure goes up you're going to be faced with carbon fouling. And the other will be your lube being blasted past the bullet. Learn what these look,and act like by dry mopping. Trying to get a "read" on how many shots vs how much black shows up on.the patches. With the heavy 4831 loads around 20 shots is going to be close to what you can "get away with". Each brrl is an individual,but that's where you'll likely come to a fork in the road.

You're going to have to start annealing,just the way it is. And most likely you'll be on the ragged edge of "jam". Meaning,you've got to find the max,or sticking point on OAL. You also have to find exactly where your cases equilibrium is... low node= case gets shorter. High intensity loads,they get longer. But exactly where is it between? This area of pressure is probably best served with Varget or 4895. Savage firing pin protrusion is adjustable.... this is important in finding and seeing how it effects the cases movement during ignition. Jam is gonna change with your rig's ignition impulse.

Just some rambling,there's a metric ton more to it. Have you measured your chamber neck ID? It's the VERY first thing I do to ALL rifles that cone here. That # gets noted at the top of that rigs loading book. Watch the fouling patterns and behavior change when you test different total loaded neck clearance. Hugely important. Once you get to .001" (.0005 per side) total clearance... you're in the red zone. However,somewhere in the .002-.004 should be a spot in there where it all comes together. I don't turn necks unless absolutely necessary. Factory chamber necks being large enough that you'll have some latitude. Just be aware of your running clearance.

[Shopdog]

I don't... and will never powder coat. The reason being... I have been a paid professional "finisher". Translated,we spray a LOT of "paint". If I had to paint bullets... would quit casting.

That said, you'd be shocked at how little lube is required to get into JB velocity/pressure. On a jacked up 22-250 load,it only really takes the little line above GC.... maybe 25-50% fill on the next groove up. Without going into the weeds... too much.

I knurl the lube grooves on dang near every rifle bullet. It's part of a process that sizes the body section... don't really want to get into it. This is about lube. The knurling holds the lube in place... just a little longer at the launch vs slick grooves. Start studying 22 rimfire bullets. They're knurled. Anyway,too MUCH lube is going to cause more problems than too little. Think of a spray gun for paint. There's 3 or 4 gun adjustments that effect atomization. This is what you're going to be faced with on high intensity cast loadings. Just my observation,and viewpoint but.... until you can get your cold bore.. no foulers allowed.. shots to be "in the group" well,you have work to do. Using less lube to go faster may not be intuitive but you've got to test it. The more pressure there is(think spray gun) the more atomization "available". Low node,it don't matter because the lube isn't being blasted out. The knurling interrupts this process,retards it.

I use beeswax and this junk called vaselatum,or some such. Basically vaseline before companies slap their labels on it. Anyway I ran a pretty soft lube for about 30 years. Riverun was the person who told me to change the ratio. First time I tried JB velocity with a 30'06 running cast 170 Lyman 041's... the lube was running out of the barrel like water,haha. From there I went to...

Think crunchy peanut butter. To get a "thicker" lube... instead of making a new batch as Riverun suggested...I chopped up more BW and added it in. Pretty dumb idea right? Well no,it turned out that not only was it doable..heck,it works downright fantastic. I've barely moved on.. meaning,still running BW/Vaseline but it's a complete emulsion. Smooth vs chunky. But,that's mainly because of smaller diameter bullets. In 30-06 and larger,the "chunky" can help. Your dry mopping is a big dang help in this.