Originally Posted by
BoBSavage
Nickel Steel was not necessary for the 38-40 and 44-40 when using smokeless powder. Winchester used Dupont No. 2 Smokeless Rifle powder for the 38-40 smokeless loads. This powder produced less pressure than black powder.
It would appear that during the early smokeless powder transition years, there was some real fuss and confusion between the "low-powered" rifle shooters and the "high-powered" rifle shooters....very much the same as today. There was certainly talk about the powders, velocities and pressures to be used, as well as the use of the Special Steel Barrels.
During this time there was grandpa's black powder cartridges, the son's new smokeless powder replacements and the grandkids new fangled high-powered Winchester 30-30 and the Savage 303! In between the fuss of those two, were the "middle of the roaders"...black powder cartridges that were now offered with smokeless... and the confusion began!
Much talk about all of this in the old 1899 through 1920's magazines, books, articles...especially about burning out the bores...you know the spill! From what can be found, the two most popular mentioned cartridges for this argument were the 32-40 and 38-55 cartridges...and for good reason. Not only was the 38-55 loaded with black powder, it was also loaded with low-pressure smokeless and high-pressure smokeless powders....thus the confusion was real...even back then.
The 38-55 loaded with black powder could be used in any barrel. The Low-Pressure, "bulk for bulk" smokeless powder 38-55 loads could also be used in the black powder barrels. The reason was the "bulk for bulk" low-pressure powders burned cooler and the velocities slower than the high-pressured powders, thus safe (or at least "Safer") for the soft steel barrels. The problem began when folks tried to use the high-pressure "dense" powders (30 cal smokeless powders like WA30 or Dupont 30 cal). The heat generated would certainly burn the riffling over time.....or could blow the chamber or barrel of the softer steel types.. Some say 3,000 rounds is what it took to burn out the bore, but even then, diminishing only mere inches per groups. Nevertheless, eventually the hotter burning powders would certainly cause the rifling to wear away and even powders like Sharpshooter were still corrosive on the bores of the softer steel over time.
1899
Recreation Magazine, Vol 11
page 298 - Questions & Answers
page 458 - More About Smokeless Powder
One of the first examples of readers/shooters asking smokeless powder questions comes from this magazine.
Will the rifling of a Winchester .38-55 (common barrel) be injured by the use of a smokeless powder cartridge, with soft point jacketed bullet?
I referred this inquiry to the Winchester Repeating Arms Co, and they reply:
Our 38-55 rifle will not be injured when 38-55 smokeless cartridges of our make are used. The bullet will not harm the rifling. Smokeless powder is more difficult to clean than black. Where smokeless powder cartridges are made to take the place of black powder cartridges in guns which were intended for black powder, such smokeless powder is used as will give the same pressures and same velocities as were obtained with black powder in the black powder cartridges intended for the gun originally. We do the best we can to have the combination give the same velocity as before, which it would be difficult to get same accuracy.
The Winchester manufacturing company reassures the shooter that all is fine with shooting such appropriate low-pressure loads in black powder arms.
Moving on up into the year 1900, more questions and answers can be seen in articles. This next full-page “A Batch of Suggestions” article by H. A. Stillwell is a must read…
1900
Recreation Magazine, Vol 13
A BATCH OF SUGGESTIONS
Page 138
In this article, Stillwell speaks of the 30-30, 45-70, and the 38-55 on using such new smokeless powders. He also speaks of using high-pressure and splitting the barrels, rather than using the low-pressure smokeless powders.
He then states that “Everything considered, a black powder gun with low-pressure smokeless is good enough for me.”
It would appear that by 1902, the start of new terms and trying to understand the definitions for what they mean. If you recall, black powder was called gunpowder, but now with smokeless, the two were to be divide into black powder and smokeless powder.
To continue, this new smokeless powder is now getting separated, sliced and divided up for a better understanding of what is being used in what arms and why. By now the low-pressure, low-velocity shooters are becoming the new “peasants'', much the same today. If you shoot less than 2,000fps, you are the dirt of the earth.
1902
Western Field
The Sportsman’s Magazine of the West · Volume 1
This two-page article reveals more information about moving on up from the slow cartridges to the more high-powered cartridges.
“Anything in the way of a bullet moving less than 2,000 feet per second of time, must now, according to the dictum of these cal-low authorities, be considered not only obsolete but offensively objectionable.”
Then the author continues to explain.
“And yet, with high assurance notwithstanding, right here enters an element of danger to which I desire to call especially attention.” Shortly afterwards, he discusses the 32-40 and 38-55 high-pressure vs low-pressure smokeless loads and different arms manufactured for them, which covers a full-page explanation.
Not only was this nearly ten years after the introduction of smokeless powder, it was also the beginning of the new “High Velocity” fad that, as well as smokeless powder itself, many misunderstand even today.
The "Bulk for Bulk" powders, Dupont No. 2 in the photo...whiteish in color, was a low-pressure powder and could be used in the softer steel barrels, even when used in the 38-55. While all 94' 30-30's had smokeless barrels, not all 38-55's had the special steel barrels,. No 44-40 ever used special steel barrels, even the High Velocity loads due to their velocity being less than 1,700fps and pressures being less than at least 30,000 lbs.
Here are examples of misunderstanding what is safe, and what is not safe for your particular black powder firearm.
By 1905, Smokeless Powders were divided in two classes, low and high pressure. The first named being mostly used in old black powder cartridges, the latter for cartridges of the military and "high power" hunting types. Aside from black powder, most folks just getting over the fact that the new smokeless powder was also divided into two classes, “bulk for bulk” (Dupont No.2 types) and “dense” (Laflin & Rand .30-cal. types), both equaling the strength of a black powder charge but one being "bulk for bulk", and one being much less than bulk…. but yet both are safe for black powder firearms. Although both were safe for the soft steel barrels, the dense powders like Sharpshooter and Lightning were a bit corrosive.
Generally, for rifles, anything larger than .32 cal. was basically a bulk for bulk while anything smaller than a .32 cal. was a less bulk for bulk, or what was called “dense”. Aside from shooting jacketed bullets and large quantities of smokeless shots fired in the soft steel barrels, smokeless powder was plenty safe for use in black powder arms. The concerns below involve high pressure vs low pressure and the confusion thereof. Thus, by early 1900’s definitions, we must divide these pressures into at least two groups.
The division of smokeless powder could be divided into the following two classes.
Low Pressure – anything below, say…30,000cup
High Pressure – anything above, say…30,000cup
Just because a particular load may say “low pressure” doesn’t mean it is safe for the weaker barrels, weaker manufactured arms…but at the same time, smokeless powder itself is not unsafe to use in soft steel black powder barrels either.
Further down the pages we find this High Velocity/Low Pressure data while speaking about special sights…
“These cartridges are especially designed for use in rifles originally built to use black powder only.”
With that said, right there is why we need to understand what is meant between High-Pressure vs Low-Pressure, regardless of high velocity or low velocity….as well as…the reason for the switch from soft steel to special steel.
Also, keep in mind that even though the above 1902 information is nearly ten years into using smokeless powder era, the High-Velocity/Low-Pressure is another new Nomenclature!
1903
Western Field
The Sportsman's Magazine of the West · Volume 2
This 1903 article introduces the new High Velocity cartridges by Winchester for the Model 92’ and Model 86’. Noted is the part about…” A feature of all the high velocity cartridges is that they can be used by persons who dislike the high-power small caliber cartridges on account of their great range.”
1904
Western Field
The Sportsman’s Magazine of the West · Volume 4
“SOME NEW MARLIN DEPARTURES.
Interesting announcement comes from The Marlin Fire Arms Co., New Haven, Conn. concerning a new line of goods the company is marketing this season, which will attract wide attention among a large class of sportsmen and lovers of the rifle.
The company is now arranging a line of their famous repeating rifles, Model 1893, to be known among the trade Grade “B”. These rifles will be in every respect the same as the regular Model 1893 with the exception that the barrels will be made of the highest obtainable grade of soft gun barrel steel instead of their “Special Smokeless Steel”. The intention is to meet the large demand for a high-class, carefully made arm on the part of many shooters who are not sufficiently interested in the smokeless steel barrels to pay for the extra cost. The new line is, of course, not intended for high power smokeless ammunition and its use in this grade is not advised by the makers: only black powder ammunition and equivalent loads such as low power smokeless should be used. The 32-40 and 38-55 sizes only will be made in this grade.
The line will consist of the carbine with 15-inch round barrel weighing 6 1/4 pounds and carrying five shots, or with 20-inch round barrel weighing 6 3/4 pounds and carrying seven shots. With the regular round barrels in 26-inch to 32-inch lengths the rifle may be had weighing 7 to 7 3/4 pounds. Octagon barrels are furnished 26-inches to 32-inches long the rifles weighing 7 1/2 pounds to 8 1/2 pounds. These rifles can be furnished in short half or full magazine. They accommodate a wide range of cartridges and all the popular ammunition with the exception noted above regarding high power smokeless powder.”
By 1905, Smokeless Powders were divided in two classes, low and high pressure. The first named being mostly used in old black powder cartridges the latter for cartridges of the military type.
Black Powder - Low Pressure
Smokeless Powder - Low and High Pressures
a. Low Pressure - maybe less than 30,000 lbs. "Bulk for Bulk" powders and some "Bulky" dense powders
b. High Pressure - greater than at least 30,000 lbs. slower burning rifle powders, WA-30, Lightning, .30-Cal smokeless
Sporting Smokeless Powders were also divided into two general classes ~ "Nitrocellulose Industry" by Edward Chauncey Worden, 1911
Bulk - "Sharpshooter" (not bulk for bulk, and loaded by weight not volume) The Nitrocellulose has been produced in sufficiently light and porous loose granulars by mechanical means so that in equal volumes they possess about the same ballistics as black powder.
Condensed - Represents the maximum of propulsive force in the minimum of space...prepared in the same manor as the military flake powder. Condensed smokeless powders designed for the more modern rifles. [1911]
By 1918, Townsand Whelen noted some nomenclatures.
Small Bore - .35 cal. and smaller
Large Bore - larger than .35 cal.
Low Power - up to 1,750fps
High Power - greater than 1,750fps - Although not always stamped on the barrel, special steel barrels needed (bore wear issues, not strength issues), 30-30, .303 Savage and the high power loaded 32-40 and 38-55 loads.
High Intensity - Velocity greater than 2,400fps, - 30-40 Krag (30 Army), .30 cal. 1903, .30 cal. 1906, etc.
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