Apologies - not a comment for a muzzleloader. Meant for the talk of caseless ammunition.Originally Posted by Bmi48219
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Apologies - not a comment for a muzzleloader. Meant for the talk of caseless ammunition.
Sent from my Pixel 5 using Tapatalk
If $300 primers are a steal, what does a box of 38 special or 9x21 mm cost?300$ primers here it's a steal,
but tesla guns...they're not exactly what I dreamed of
CVA Electra for sale on Gun Broker if anyone wants to own one
I’m sure case-less ammo will eventually become the norm, not looking forward to it since it probably won’t be adaptable to reloaders. Electronic ignition intrigues me since it could be made to work with a standard cartridge case.
In a way, the inline muzzleloader crowd already has caseless ammunition in the form of pellets and the bullets they use. Glue the two together and you're there.
So if you're inventing electric ignition because caps are going to be too expensive in the future, wouldn't it be easier to buy a lifetimes worth of caps now and not worry about it? I have 8k percussion caps on hand that I bought in the 80s and 90s. They were $36 ,per 1000. I don't believe I'll ever run out.
Yeah, the muzzleloader does not need a fast cycle time, but semi or full auto would need a higher recycle time. To increase the cycle time, you need a bigger higher voltage battery with low impedance and bigger wires. I don't think it would add much weight or cost and probably should be rechargeable. You can make as big a spark as you want all the way to like arc welding sparks. Actually, with a semi or full auto you could eliminate the battery and use a magneto connected to the operating rod for all but the first shot.
Tim
Words are weapons sharper than knives - INXS
The pen is mightier than the sword - Edward Bulwer-Lytton
The tongue is mightier than the blade - Euripides
People who experiment and develop new things are often thinking about the future, not necessarily their own future but other people maybe even some people who are not yet born. Everything is not about us today but maybe a legacy or making things better for those who will come later. Some of us are just born experimenters and it is not the end product the interests us it is the process, the journey that stimulates us. Why are you trying to discourage experimentation? By the way that 80's or 90's dollars are worth more than twice the dollar today, so those $36/k caps actually cost more than $72/k in today's dollars plus you had to store them with the attendant risk of loss or degradation.
Tim
Words are weapons sharper than knives - INXS
The pen is mightier than the sword - Edward Bulwer-Lytton
The tongue is mightier than the blade - Euripides
Yes, you could even use loose powder and a nitrated paper or linen envelope. An action like the Sharps or Hall with electronic ignition and you could have a breachloading caseless rifle that does not need a cap.
Tim
Words are weapons sharper than knives - INXS
The pen is mightier than the sword - Edward Bulwer-Lytton
The tongue is mightier than the blade - Euripides
In guns that use a cartridge that are firing at a high rate of fire the brass case traps a lot of the heat of combustion and removes that heat when the brass is ejected keeping the gun cooler. Heat build up in the gun is an issue for rapid fire. It is also one of the reasons that a lot of fully automatic guns fire from an open bolt so that a round does not spend time in a hot barrel that could possibly cause it to "cook off".
Tim
Words are weapons sharper than knives - INXS
The pen is mightier than the sword - Edward Bulwer-Lytton
The tongue is mightier than the blade - Euripides
if I don't go wrong, I remember around one year ago 240€ asked for 1000CCI BRLR brick_ next I never verified their Wall Street LGS up or down_ and they were OldStock from before the pandemic, not freshly imported, btw_
I think 9x21 or 9x19 so-so quality today are around 15€ maybe the .38s something more, at the shooting range_
really since my first and last 65€ - 20pc.box of .444FTX, before the pandemic, I never bought store ammo, nor I will_
Last edited by wilecoyote; 01-27-2024 at 12:10 PM.
Food is overrated. A nice rifle is way more important.
Rob
The point is, many states have primitive hunting seasons where cartridge guns are not legal.
Heck, if you really wanted to be creative it would be possible to build a man portable firearm using compressed gas for propellant and electronic ignition. No need for gunpowder at all. Think of a more advanced spud gun.
IIRC, THE Remington attempt at electronic ignition used several capacitors. Not sure if they were wired in series, I don’t know that much about them.
If you remove an old style condenser from a distributor without grounding it and trick someone into picking it up, the electrical discharge is eye watering, I found that out.
The magneto idea occurred to me too. I had an old BSA that had an ET (energy transfer) ignition system. Two cylinders, with a large coil and small coil for each. Somehow when the spark went to one plug part of the current went to the smaller coil to recharge the large coil for the next spark.
My thought is to load the powder and projectile as we do now, just replace the primer with something like flash powder and seal it into the cartridge base with a primer-size adhesive foil disc. Mount the spark electrode on the breech / bolt face where the firing pin went. Maybe a replaceable tapered ceramic / brass cone around it that will fit the bottom of the primer pocket to seal the gas.
When the bolt closes the electrode punctures the foil, pulling the trigger / switch releases the stored electric charge.
Obviously all this is just whimsical musings now. Intriguing none the less. Someone a long time ago went through a similar mental exercise to invent the percussive cap.
From what I’ve read about caseless ammo, the durability, consistency and susceptibility to moisture put it way beyond my abilities. Nor do I see how a regular guy could fine tune his caseless loads like we can now. We wouldn’t be ‘reloading’ caseless ammo, there’s nothing to reload,just assembling components.
Back when I played with using a Capacitor to fire a gun.
It would ignite Smokeless Powder or Flash Powder fine.
But it wouldn't always ignite Black Powder.
The 20mm Vulcan (Phalanx) cannon round uses an electric primer. These high firing rate guns required more precise primer ignition and reliability than a mechanical primer could provide.
wilecoyote,
Is that 15 eu including the VAT (or whatever they call it now)? If it includes tax that’s not too bad, 15 eu is about $16.25 US and cheap 9x19 ammo is between $12 and $14 a box (50) around here plus 6.5 % sales tax.
Or closer to 10% for some of us.
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